Does Anybody Love Willard? The CNN Nevada Western Republican Debate – Perry Versus Cain Versus Romney

There can be no doubt that Willard Mitt Romney has run a masterful campaign. Willard has been very good, if not excellent, at the debates. Willard has a big and powerful campaign organization. Willard has raised tons of money. Willard has the Republican establishment working on his behalf. We still don’t think he will be the Republican nominee.

If not Romney, is it Perry? If it is Perry he’d better get better:

“Although Texas Gov. Rick Perry survived last week’s debate at Dartmouth College, he must do better than simply surviving in the upcoming debates, starting with Tuesday night’s in Las Vegas.

Perry’s reported third-quarter haul of $17 million is impressive, but his poll numbers are in free fall and his organization isn’t even remotely comparable to that of the GOP front-runner, former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney. Such poll hemorrhaging can only hinder future fundraising and organizational efforts in key early states. Enticing local activists or new donors to climb aboard what appears to be a sinking ship is a pretty tough sell. If Perry doesn’t step up his game and quell growing reservations about him, his days as a real contender—if any still remain—may soon be over.”

Charlie Cook thinks Perry still has a small chance but time is quickly running out:

“That leaves two scenarios. In the first, without transforming into a world-class debater, Perry recoups enough to stabilize his candidacy, placate at least his Texas donors (after all, he remains governor of the Lone Star State regardless), and become the Romney alternative—albeit one with clipped wings who is unlikely to ultimately prevail. Perry could repair some self-inflicted damage, though with the Iowa caucuses scheduled for Jan. 3 and the New Hampshire primary potentially coming as early as December, there isn’t much time for a dramatic turnaround of his fortunes. Holding out for later victories is an option, though former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani’s 2008 debacle suggests that strategy has shortcomings.

Or, Perry proves unable to stanch the bleeding and former Godfather’s Pizza CEO Herman Cain solidifies his position as the anti-Romney, even though Cain has no discernible campaign strategy and questionable ability to raise serious money. Cain’s poll numbers soar as doubts about other contenders on the most conservative end of this field mount. Clearly, conservative Republicans like what Cain says and his plainspoken way of saying it. The question is whether they really see Cain as a possible nominee and president, or just as a place to park after pulling their support from the previous flavors of the month.

One wonders if Cain’s campaign has any idea what it’s doing. This past weekend, Cain took a bus trip through Tennessee (a March 6 Super Tuesday primary state, really?) from Memphis, his birthplace, in the west all the way to Cookeville in the east. Such counterintuitive campaigning suggests Cain’s schedule is determined as much by random chance as by political strategy (though opportunities to sell autographed copies of his book at $100 a pop seem to make it onto the schedule). This is not the way to win a Republican nomination, particularly one that seems to have growing value by the day.

If Perry wants to continue he better stop listening to advisors and columnists and be who he is. He was doing well when he started the race but then Big Media demanded Perry stop being “so Texas” and Perry took that advice. Now Perry looks like the small little kid in the new classroom afraid of the other kids with their hands deep in the fingerpainting. Perry still has time but not if he acts scared. Our advice is: Let Perry Be Perry. Rick Perry still has a chance and a case to make for himself: “Rick Perry, still America’s jobs governor.”

Romney is the frontrunner in name only and even that epithet is dubious:

“Two things are becoming clear: Romney is emerging as the clear front-runner, but an “anybody but Romney” resistance will coalesce behind either Cain or Perry. What is no longer clear is whether Perry will be the last guy standing against Romney. [snip]

This brings us back to the adage that Republicans wind up nominating the guy who’s next in line, like McCain, who was runner-up to George W. Bush in 2000. The GOP could be in the middle of continuing that habit in 2012, as Romney is the only top-tier retread from 2008.”

So it is Willard Mitt Romney, right? Maybe not:

“LAS VEGAS — He has consistently outperformed the rest of the Republican presidential field in debates. He has built a powerful fund-raising machine. He has rolled out one big-name endorsement after another. He has avoided being drawn into distracting sideshows or becoming rattled by his opponents.

But a word of caution about calling Mitt Romney the inevitable nominee. He is now going to be tested in a more serious way.

With the start of the primary season a little more than two months away, Mr. Romney’s Republican rivals are planning more aggressive tactics, including waves of attack ads, in an effort to define him and determine just how strong — or brittle — his support is.

As Republican candidates gather here on Tuesday night for the eighth debate of the campaign, a CNN poll has found that two-thirds of Republican voters say that their minds are not made up about whom the party should nominate to challenge President Obama, a sign the race could still have another unpredictable turn.”

That sentence “He is now going to be tested in a more serious way” is a sentence entirely not applicable thus far to Barack Obama. Obama was not vetted in 2008. Obama is not held responsible in 2012, especially not by Occupy Wall Street.

Willard “rarely garners more than 25 percent in national polls” of Republicans. Evangelicals in Iowa and South Carolina, early primary states, give Willard the skunk eye. It’s not just evangelicals who smell a rat. Does anyone believe anything Romney says at any particular time – even if he says what he says convincingly at the moment he convincingly says whatever he says he says?

Willard has never really faced a barrage of attacks. Only when Ted Kennedy ran a stealth attack in South Boston reminding Southies that Willard is a Mormon has Willard been tested. Willard failed that test. In 2007/2008 McCain never attacked Romney with ads because the money was not there. Up to now, Romney has not been the target either.

Herman Cain is now the target and he knows it:

“Herman Cain said Tuesday he could feel the pressure from his fellow 2012 candidates ahead of the CNN Western Leadership Conference Debate in Las Vegas.

“The way it feels is that you got this big bull’s-eye on your back, and it keeps getting bigger,” Cain told CNN’s Wolf Blitzer on “The Situation Room.”

Today, Herman Cain painted a big target on himself when he said ‘Sure I can see myself releasing everyone at gitmo in exchange for one U.S. POW.‘ Yikes!

At tonight’s 8:00 ET debate in Las Vegas Nevada Cain needs to demonstrate he is more than a curiosity and is growing as a candidate (and do a lot of ‘splaining). Perry needs to show he is in command not by bluster but by genuine control of himself and the stage. Romney needs to continue his brilliant performances but somehow convince the viewers that it is not just a performance he is engaged in.

The rest of the candidates should be happy to have something to do on a Tuesday night. Hey, be happy, you’re on time and on stage at the Las Vegas Nevada CNN Western Republican debate! Ron Paul and his army can righteously grouse that Big Media is shutting them out and that the game is rigged against them and that no matter how well they do, they will be ignored.

Our advice for every American and Republicans: Don’t let Big Media select your president or your nominee.


213 thoughts on “Does Anybody Love Willard? The CNN Nevada Western Republican Debate – Perry Versus Cain Versus Romney

  1. The debate is on CNN. The coverage has begun with lovely vistas of western landscapes.

    Huntsman will not appear tonight.

  2. CNN running the lead up like it’s some kind of sports competition!! ABC and ESPN used to do this type of stuff leading up to Olympic sports competitions, figure skating grand prix and etc. I hope Cain does well.

  3. Intros from the candidates. Santorum’s girl had an operation today. Paul is defender of liberty. Problem solving for a living Cain. Romney I was a businessman, then governor and I saved the Olympics. Texas governor Rick Perry an authentic conservative not a conservative of convenience. Gingrich replace class warfare with cooperation and get Americans off food stamps only paychecks. Bachman – what happens tonight in Vegas should not stay in Vegas.

  4. at first my husband thought the intro was a perry campaign add, said if he appeared on a horse he would vote for him, everybody loves a cowboy..

  5. Question: Replace income tax with sales tax?

    Bachmann: This is a brand new tax and congress will expand it. (Bachmann looks sharp in a white military suit with gold buttons.)

    Question: Conservatives are attacking your 9-9-9 plan?

    Cain: Read the plan it is a jobs plan and revenue neutral. My plan is attacked because lobbyists and politicians don’t want to throw out the tax code mess. Liberate American businesses.

    Question: Will it raise taxes?

    Santorum: No standard deduction and has a value added tax will raise taxes. A single man would pay same taxes as a man and a woman couple. It is bold but it is not good for families.

    Cain: That is simply not true. Read our analysis. Bachmann, it is not a value added tax. We do provide “opportunity zone” to address those making the least.

    Bachmann: How can you avoid a value added tax? It is a hidden tax. The government will dial up the rate.

    Perry: Go to NH where there is no sales tax. What they want is flatter and fairer. I don’t think the citizens of Nevada want this.

    Cain: This is mixing apples and oranges. It is not a value added tax. A loaf of bread has 5 hidden taxes now. We replace it with one tax.

    Paul: It is dangerous. It raises revenues. It is a regressive tax. To answer the first question we should not replace the income tax with anything. We need to cut $1 trillion.

    Cain: Unfortunately none of my colleagues understands the plan. It is not a value added tax.

  6. Question: What about your 59 point plan?

    Romney: Asks questions of Cain.

    Cain: You’re comparing apples and oranges.

    Romney: And I’ll be paying apples and oranges. We need to get jobs and reduce taxes. The analysis I did of 999 is that more will pay more taxes. We need to get our economy growing.

    Question: You’ve said 999 will be a hard sell.

    Gingrich: Cain deserves a lot of credit with a big idea. He got us talking about something that matters. I favor narrow focus such as lower capital gains tax.

    Question: Would you raise taxes on the 47% of Americans who don’t pay taxes?

    Bachmann: Yes, everyone should pay something.

  7. Has somebody finally got Perry up to debate standard, vast vast improvement, its like he’s had a hundred expresso’s

  8. whoa!!! Health care fight!!! Romney can’t “make it very clear” Massachusetts plan is for a state, ObamaCare is BAD NEWS. Romney will repeal it,the mitts are OFF

  9. Perry: We need to get Americans back to work. That’s why I proposed my energy plan this week. We don’t have to wait on OPEC. America has the energy – let’s have energy independence.

    Romney: We are an energy rich nation that acts like an energy poor nation. But we also need jobs in other sectors such as manufacturing. We need better tax policy and balancing the budget and repealing the Obama health plan.

    Santorum: We need to help those at the lower income scale to be able to move up the economic ladder. Cut the corporate manufacturing tax to zero. Remove excise taxes. And Mitt, you have no credibility on repealing Obamacare. Your advisers helped write the plan.

    Romney: I’ve made it very clear I will repeal the plan. I said four years ago that my health plan was only for one state not for the nation. I will repeal Obamacare.

    Santorum: You created a government plan and blew a hole in the budget in Massachusetts.

    Romney: The people of Massachusetts love my plan. I know how to bring the cost of healthcare down.

    Gingrich: The Boston Herald reported today that a small business is being sued because their plan is inadequate. This is top down running of businesses. Your plan Mitt is a big government plan.

    Romney: We got the idea of an individual mandate from you.

    Gingrich: What you said is not true.

    Romney: You supported the mandate right?

    Gingrich: yes.

    Romney: What we do is rely on private insurers. What we did was right for our state.

    Bachmann: Obamacare is so unpopular that even the Obama administration threw out the CLASS act.


  10. MoonOnPluto, it’s as if they all had “a hundred espressos”. Perry is doing much better even though he seemed to get lost in his words for a few seconds. They all seem to be pumped up but Cain is not so cheerful tonight.

  11. Biden strikes again….jumping the shark fully………….

    Biden: ‘I Wish’ Jobs Bill Critics Knew What It Feels Like to be Raped, Robbed

    Vice President Joe Biden said that he wished opponents of President Barack Obama’s jobs act knew what it felt like to be robbed or raped, indicating that if they did, they would not oppose government spending on public jobs such as police officers.

    “I wish these guys who thought it was temporary, I wish they had some notion of what it was like to be on the other side of a gun, or [to have] a 200-pound man standing over you, telling you to submit,” Biden told a crowd at the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia on Tuesday, adding, “Folks, it matter, it matters.”

    Biden attacked critics of Obama’s American Jobs Act who call the federal spending temporary, saying it does not matter if the spending is temporary if it funds public safety jobs that could prevent rape and murder.

  12. Romney’s first major debate error: “I didn’t get costs down in Massachusetts”; That quote will come back

    gonna bite him on the ass that one.

  13. “Mitt, you lose all standing because you hired illegals and had them working in your home for a year.”

  14. Question: What is your alternative to Obamacare? Pre-existing conditions?

    Paul: Get rid of all of it. Too much government. You should allow the American people to opt-out of American government health care. Let the people control their money. Insurance premiums under Obamacare are going up.

    Cain: ObamaCare must be repealed because it is a disaster. Market driven reforms are needed. Start with HR 3400.

    Question: Texas is tops in uninsured kids?

    Perry: We have some of the finest health care in the world. But in Texas we have a lot of illegals. Mitt hired illegals in his home.

    Romney: I don’t think I ever hired illegals.

    Perry: Time for you to tell the truth.

    Romney: This has been a tough couple of debates for Rick and you get testy. I have in my state empowered police to stop illegals. You put in place a “magnet” to get illegals into this country. Texas has had 60% increase in illegals.

    Perry: You stood here in front of the American people and said you did not have illegals working on your property. I have always been against amnesty. You are for amnesty. We hired a company to do our lawn and they had illegals and we got rid of them. Let me tell you it is hard to know if companies hire illegals. I am for e-verify.

  15. moononpluto
    October 18th, 2011 at 8:25 pm
    Has somebody finally got Perry up to debate standard, vast vast improvement, its like he’s had a hundred expresso’s
    You’re not listening to what Perry is saying – he said we would pay sales tax on social security. Huh? And interrupting the other speaker constantly is not good debating.

  16. Question: Fence on border. Cain – electrified fence? You then said it was a joke but then said it was under consideration.

    Cain: We need to have a fence, boots on the ground and technology. We have to shut the back door to make people walk in the front door. Empower the states to do what the federal government is not doing.

    Question: Is it possible to build a complete fence?

    Perry: Cost $8 billion and years to build. But the best way is a virtual wall. Put boots on the ground. Predator drones to provide information. That is the way to secure that border. Iranians are using the drug cartels.

    Bachmann: Obama’s aunt and uncle are illegal aliens. I will build a security fence. This is also a jobs issue. It costs hundreds of billions in illegal alien costs. English as the official language.

    Perry: You can build that fence but there is a better way. I’ve been dealing with this border for 10 years. The federal government has failed miserably. We’ve had to deal with this issue in Texas. Texas money has been spent.

    Romney: We respect legal immigration. There are 4 million people who want to come here legally. Turn off the magnets with e-verify and tuition breaks. Perry you say you have the experience but your experience is like a losing coach.

    Perry; The bottom line is the federal government won’t stop illegal immigration. The problem is people who give illegals jobs – people like you.

    Question: What is your message to Latinos?

    Newt: Most Latinos in the U.S. are not immigrants. We will provide jobs.

  17. oh they are all interrupting each other. its a free for all, some people need to be challenged, Romney hates being challenged and is very pompous.

  18. The bottom line is that the caucuses (which were filled with illegals on the border) are critical in Texas to re electing. We mustn’t hurt the opportunity to re elect Barack.

  19. Question: Some Latinos believe anti illegal immigration laws are just anti Latino?

    Paul: I don’t think the idea of a fence is good. We need a healthy economy. We need to see people as individuals not groups. There is a lot of discrimination in our courts.

    Cain: My message is that we need to boost our economy. That’s why I have a bold plan and I will sell it. People should be able to pursue their American dream.

    Question: Repeal the 14th Amendment?

    Perry: I’ll answer the question I want. The administration we have is killing jobs. The secretary of energy wants to see gas prices rise to European levels. Obama says electricity prices have to rise.

    Perry: No to repeal.

    Bachmann: Anchor babies are a problem. We need to consider it.

  20. Santorum: Family, faith, marriage. Latinos understand the importance of these 3 things. I’m for jobs but we need to stand up for the family.

    Paul: Rights don’t come in bunches. Each individual has rights. We worry more about the border of Afghanistan than our border.

    Question: Yucca mountain?

    Gingrich: We need to find a safe way to store nuclear waste. Let the scientists decide.

    Paul: I oppose this. What right do 49 states have to put our garbage in Nevada?

    Romney: Paul is right.

    Perry: On this one I agree. Let the states compete. The 10th Amendment has been eroded. Allow the states to make the decision.

  21. Question: Real estate bubble solutions?

    Santorum: Perry, Romney, Cain, supported TARP. The government injected itself and bailed out the wrong ones and others suffered.

    Perry: No I didn’t. I wanted them to act. I meant cut regulation.

    Santorum: He wrote a letter that said pass an economic plan on the day of the vote.

    Perry: I know what we sent and what the intention was. I was not for TARP.

    Romney: Washington thinks it knows better than the markets – that’s the problem. Let the markets work. We need to get the economy going.

    Cain: We were in a crisis at the end of 2008. I supported the concept of TARP but the administration did not do it right. We need to get government out of the way. Let the market do it.

    Bachmann: Many American women and moms are suffering because they are losing their homes. Obama has failed you on the issue of housing and foreclosures.

  22. Question: OWS

    Cain: I stand by what I said. They might be frustrated with Wall Street but the problem is at the White House. They should be at the White House taking out their frustrations.

    Paul: Cain is blaming the victim. The bailouts were supported by both parties. The middle class got stuck when the banks were bailed out.

    Cain: Paul is partly right but he is mixing problems. The banks and businesses of Wall Street were wrong. But what does OWS want. I say go to the source of the problem.

    Paul: Government is not really capable of running anything.

    Question: You first were friendly to OWS.

    Romney: The president is responsible for the economy and he has failed us. The president is out campaigning. We need someone who understands the economy. I know how to do it.


  23. I still cannot get past how plastic Romney is, he’s like a Ken doll with a string hanging out the back ready for soundbites.

  24. Romney looked very uncomfortable when Perry said that about hiring illegals, he immediately went beetroot red and thats a good sign of guilt.

  25. @Moon .. lovely description of Romney! LOL so true though. In looking at them all (including all of the 2008 crooked ass Bambi) .. Hillary outshone them all and has more command of all the issues. Damn,makes me mourn even more

  26. Willard did NOT expect Perry to announce to the world that he is one of those that hires others (and looks the other way) to do his lawn. If we went to Willard’s house, would we find Consuelo in the kitchen, Paco in the garden, Juana in the nursery or Jesus in the garage?

  27. Question: Should voters pay attention to a candidates religion?

    Santorum: Pay attention to a candidate’s values. I’m a Catholic. How do you live your life is the question.

    Gingrich: Absolutely. None of us should judge how others approach God. But the central part of your faith is important.

    Question: Do you repudiate the pastor?

    Perry: Are we individuals who stand by our faith? That individual is free to express his opinion.

    Romney: What was troubling was that we should choose our president based on religion. Perry should have told the pastor that he was wrong.

    Perry: I said I did not agree with the pastor’s remarks.

    Question: Cut defense spending by $500 billion?

    Bachmann: This week Iran showed it disrespects America by pushing an assassination plot. Obama sent troops into another state. Iraq disrespects us. Iran wants to get a nuclear weapon. The world disrespects us. Defense spending is on the table but Obama is putting forces in Libya and Africa. We are stretched too thin and $500 billion is too much.

    Gingrich: The current elite of both parties is bankrupt. We need to add up what our needs are. I am a hawk but I am a cheap hawk.

  28. Question: Paul, you proposed many cuts in defense and removal of several departments?

    Paul: We’re broke. Why do we have troops in South Korea? This has to be on the table. The debt bubble is imploding. To cut military spending is a wise thing. We can’t afford our empire. It’s time to come home.

    Question: Negotiate for hostages? Cain, you said yes… explain?

    Cain: You have to consider the entire situation. I would not negotiate with terrorists. In this particular situation Netanyahu had to look at all the factors. I did not recall it as Al Quada related.

    Santorum: The first duty of the president is to protect us. All the resources should be in place.

    Paul: We are on economic suicide if we do not consider this.

  29. Question: Why is broke America giving foreign aid?

    Perry: We need a real debate on foreign aid. We need to discuss defunding the United Nations. The Palestinians violated the Oslo Accords and that is a travesty. We need to have this debate. Why are we funding that organization?

    Romney: There are several elements to foreign aid. Part of it is humanitarian aid. We should not use Chinese money to give to others. We are spending more on foreign aid than we need to.

    Paul: Foreign aid should be the easiest thing to cut. It is taking money from poor Americans to give to rich foreigners.

    Question: Israel?

    Paul: It does not help Israel. We have money to Egypt and now there is a hostile government in Egypt.

    Bachmann: Israel is our greatest ally. We should not cut money to Israel. Obama is the cause of the current problems Israel has because he put light between us and Israel. As to hostages it is naive to negotiate for hostages.

    Cain: We don’t negotiate for hostages. My approach on foreign aid is peace through strength.

    Paul: Are you all willing to condemn Ronald Reagan for trading guns for hostages?

    Santorum: There is a difference between negotiating with a sovereign state and prisoners in Gitmo.

    Gingrich: Reagan thought the guns for hostages deal was a big mistake.


  30. Question: Who can beat Obama? Our poll says Romney. Santorum gets 1%.

    Santorum: Very few know who we are. I am the only one that has won Pennsylvania twice.

    Romney: Someone whose life has only been spent on politics won’t beat Obama.

    Perry: If you want to know how someone acts in the future look how someone acted in the past. In Massachusetts you did not create as many jobs as I did.

    Romney: You supported Al Gore. I created jobs. 40% of the jobs in Texas was for illegal immigrants.

    Perry: That is incorrect. Ebay, facebook and Caterpillar came to Texas because it is a good place for business.

    Romney: Unemployment in Massachusetts was lower during my years than in Texas.

  31. Willard is ass kissing which means that he will take a VP slot to Cain if he can beg hard enough to get it.

  32. Yeah, Santorum reminds me of this jerk in our office that keeps running for political office and losing. Absolute gold brick.

  33. Question: You’re tied with Romney?

    Cain: I should be president. Romney has a distinguished career. My business career is more main street, Romney’s experience is on Wall Street. I am a problem solver who fixes stuff versus a president who has fixed nothing.

    Romney: I have several business jobs.

    Bachmann: The cake is baked. Obama will be a one term president.

    Gingrich: Maximizing bickering is not the way to the White House. I would challenge Obama to Lincoln/Douglas style debates.

    IT’S OVER.

  34. CNN did a post debate interview with Herman Cain who admitted he misspoke about negotiating with terrorists. He explained a little more about his 9-9-9 tax plan.

  35. BCL, I despise Donna. I hold her accountable for what happened to HRC. She should never have voted, but she did. She is a lying cheat.

  36. Clinton arrives in Oman for talks with Sultan

    (AFP) – 36 minutes ago

    MUSCAT — US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton arrived early Wednesday in Oman for talks with Sultan Qaboos about his reform efforts and TO share US concerns over neighboring Iran, a US official said.

    Clinton will first thank Qaboos for helping to arrange for Iran’s release last month of US hikers Josh Fattal and Shane Bauer, who had been held in Iran after being arrested near the Iraq-Iran border in 2009, the official said.

    The pair had been arrested along with fellow US hiker Sarah Shourd, who left Iran in September last year after being granted bail on humanitarian and medical grounds.

    As with her two jailed friends, Shourd’s bail had also been set at $500,000 and was paid through Oman, a US Gulf ally that maintains friendly relations with Iran, their lawyer said.

    The State Department official, speaking to reporters on the flight to Muscat, said Clinton will also follow up on talks she had with Qaboos here in January about social and economic reforms as well as development and education.

    Omanis voted on Saturday to elect their purely consultative Majlis Al-Shura council, which Sultan Qaboos has pledged to vest with new authorities in response to unprecedented social unrest.

    The official said Clinton will also sound out the sultan on the bloody violence in fellow Arab countries Syria and Yemen where authoritarian rulers have used deadly force against pro-democracy movements. Yemen neighbors Oman.

    He said Clinton will also want to share with him US concerns about Iran’s behavior, particularly the alleged Iranian plot — unveiled by US officials last week — to murder the Saudi ambassador in Washington.

    “We would expect that the Omanis would use their relationship with Iran, as they have in the past, to help the Iranians understand the implications of what they’re doing,” the US official told reporters.

    Clinton arrived in Oman after paying brief visits to Malta as well as Libya, where she sought to promote the democratic transition pledged by the opposition who overthrew Moamer Kadhafi in August.

  37. October 18, 2011

    Obama’s bus tour costing taxpayers thousands

    By Mark Knoller

    If Mitt Romney, Rick Perry, Herman Cain or any of the other presidential challengers were to embark on a three-day bus trip like the one now underway by President Obama, it would cost their campaigns tens of thousands of dollars. Perhaps more.

    They would have to pay a variety of expenses, including:

    air travel to their first destination

    leasing of one or more buses appropriate to the journey

    rental for halls or meeting rooms for their candidates’ appearances

    the cost of lodging and meals for their candidate and staff

    But not the Obama campaign. The White House declared that Mr. Obama’s three-day trip through North Carolina and Virginia are official events and not campaign appearances, even though the two states are known to be political objectives of his re-election bid.

    So Mr. Obama’s expenses are borne by taxpayers, including:

    the pro-rated costs of his flights aboard Marine One and Air Force One that brought him to his first stop yesterday in Asheville, NC

    the two buses used by him and his staff, owned and operated by the United States Secret Service

    costs associated with setting up speech sites including microphones, speakers, amplifiers, teleprompters and TV lights
    lodging and meals for the president and his political staff

    It’s an advantage enjoyed by every incumbent president seeking re-election — and a disadvantage endured by his challengers. And though the White House has said the trip is not political, Mr. Obama has repeatedly used his speeches to take Republicans to task for opposing the provisions of his jobs bill.

    “They said no to putting teachers and construction workers back on the job,” the president said yesterday in Asheville. “They said no to rebuilding our roads and our bridges and our airports. They said no to cutting taxes for middle-class families and small businesses when all they’ve been doing is cutting taxes for the wealthiest Americans.”

    He continued: “They want to gut regulations; they want to let Wall Street do whatever it wants. They want to drill more. And they want to repeal health care reform. That’s their jobs plan.”

    On the Senate floor Monday, Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., raised concerns about the partisan rhetoric from his 2008 presidential rival.

    “In fact, I was somewhat taken aback, since the president and his spokesperson had billed his trip as a taxpayer-paid visit,” said McCain.

    He said Mr. Obama has the right to express his views about GOP policies but wondered, “is that appropriate on the taxpayers’ dime? Since it is clearly campaigning.”

    A day before the trip begin, White House officials held a conference call with reporters and repeatedly made the case that the president’s trip was about the jobs bill, not his re-election, even though he was traveling in states he won in 2008 and wants to keep in his column next year as well.

    Some of Mr. Obama’s bus trip events had the sound and feel of campaign rallies. As he arrived in Asheville for his first event, his audience on the tarmac chanted, “Four more years!”

    And Mr. Obama himself would shift into the higher-decibel, campaign-style cadence that served him so well as a candidate for president three years ago.

    If this bus trip was billed as a political journey, his campaign and/or the Democratic party would be paying the costs, but not as much as his presidential challengers might. He could still ride the 747s that serve as Air Force One, and pay only a small pro-rated portion of the expense, as per Federal Election Commission rules.

    To date, the White House has refused repeated requests from CBS News to disclose its calculations of how much the Obama campaign or DNC must reimburse the government for Mr. Obama’s political travel expenses.

  38. Well, that makes 3 debates I have missed in a row…in a normal world I wouldn’t even care about watching them, but I fear the Repubs will end up staying home like they did for McPalin…

    Wilber has no chance because of his healthcare bill and he is a Mormon.

    Perry has little chance because he is another toad from TX like Georgie and he has a problem with immigration.

    Paul has no chance because folks worry he just missed the Halebopp comet.

    Bachman has no chance because she is a woman’s…we know how that goes.

    Santorum has no chance because only thee people like him outside of his family.


    Newt has no chance no matter how smart he is, he is a has been.

    Cain, 999 will only take him so far and the GOP isn’t ready for an outsider.

    Anyone else? They won’t have a chance because they are already forgotten.

  39. I did watch most of it, here’s my take just from a semi-objective debating standpoint:

    Cain made some stumbles in this debate. I like him as a person, but he puts his foot in it sometimes and then has no idea how to walk it back.

    Perry, hate to say it, did much better this time around. He still looked caught flat-footed and clueless a couple of times, but he at least perked up and went after Mittens and had him back on his heels some. It wasn’t like the last zombie Perry debate. He may be too far gone to save himself, though.

    Bachman, alas, comes across as so knowledgeable at times, then veers off into the silliness.

    Mittens did okay, but his main claim to frontrunner is “Mr. Smooth”, and he got really flustered tonight a couple of times. When you have to plead “Anderson! Anderson!” to intervene while Perry is up in your grille, you look a lot less smooth. He still did okay, though.

    Ron Paul is SO freaking correct on a few things, and SO freaking batshit on others. There is no middle ground, and you can’t get the little bit of good stuff without also accepting the insane zealot from anti-Fed Pluto where there are no Joooooooos.

    Santorum is a whiny douche. He is sometimes right on a few things. But he’s still a huge petty douchewanker. One surprise tonight from him: for the Scary Evangelical up there, he gave the best answer of the whole R crew on the pastor Jeffers anti-Mormon remarks. The rest sucked pandering evangelical ass or were a big nothing evasion, especially Perry’s. Santorum’s answer, surprisingly, was somewhat thoughtful.

    Newt is probably the calmest most intelligent guy up there. And no one is going to let him within 10 feet of power, because… just would not be good. Like feeding a Gremlin after midnight. Even conservatives feel it, though they cannot verbalize it.

    No clear winner. Cain took some hits. Romney possibly did too, or stayed even. Perry might have helped himself a bit, but not a lot.

  40. Oh, and Shadowfax? Republicans and conservatives are going to crawl across broken glass with a bleeding spleen and two amputated legs to oust Obama, no matter who the nominee is, and no matter how bitterly they complain about who it is. I have no fears of a repeat of 2008 as far as R turnout. It’s going to break records.

  41. Hope that makes you feel less depressed, anyway, Shadowfax. 😀 What’s there are the choices, and none of them are good. But I still think any of them can take Obama down.

  42. Tony Stark
    October 18th, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    Try going to Settings/General/Keyboard and turning off Auto-Correction. You’ll be much happier.
    Tony, you are my new hero, THANK YOU mucho.
    I should have known this, but being a PC person I sometimes forget how to control all things MAC.

  43. HillaryforTexas

    Republicans and conservatives are going to crawl across broken glass with a bleeding spleen and two amputated legs to oust Obama, no matter who the nominee is, and no matter how bitterly they complain about who it is. I have no fears of a repeat of 2008 as far as R turnout. It’s going to break records.

    I hope to God you are right, and at least we will all be suffering with our vote together.

    I once took an online political test and came out a Libertarian. I had to look it up to see what it was generally about…guess that’s why I don’ t totally hate Paul’s ideas. When I hear folks on Fox explain what he means, it sounds like someone from Mars…but when Paul is given a few minutes to explain —for example on Natl. Security, he brings up things like why does America think they should be the police of the planet when we don’t take care of our own country?I do want a border fence, so I really differ with him on that, and defending Israel and making all drugs legal assumes humans are responsible for their actions….
    So some things may give stupid humans too much freedom?

  44. I have no fears of a repeat of 2008 as far as R turnout.


    Why should they bother, when Obama is doing what they want anyway?

  45. Palin thinks Newt:

    Former Alaska governor Palin discussed the latest GOP debate, the candidates and momentum and more on FOX News’ “On the Record With Greta Van Susteren.”

    “I think we (Republicans) are more interested in substance and that’s why like tonight Newt Gingrich again I think did the best because he seems to be above a lot of the bickering that goes on,” Sarah Palin told FOX News after tonight’s CNN debate in Las Vegas.

    Everybody could learn from Newt Gingrich and the way his calm, cool, collected manner. He’s kind of seen it all before in this political game, if you will,” Palin said about Gingrich’s debate skills.

    “Newt Gingrich would — he would clobber Barack Obama in any debate, any forum that had to do with substance when it comes to policy and solutions for the challenges that America faces. Newt Gingrich would clobber Barack Obama. I don’t know if he’s going to be the one that surfaces as the fortunate candidate who gets to face Barack Obama because unfortunately, in this day and age, sometimes conventional wisdom would dictate that he who has the most money, the campaign dollars, wins. I don’t want to believe that this is going to be the case this go-around,” Palin said about a debate between Gingrich and Obama.

  46. Why OWS is not the Tea Party in any way:

    On Monday night Rachel Maddow explained how the Occupy Wall Street movement defied some traditional party lines, or in her words, protesters “aren’t exactly delighted with Democrats either.” She then introduced Rep. Barney Frank, who shared some frustrations with the protesters, saying “I’m unhappy when people didn’t vote last time blame me for the consequences of their not voting.” Frank echoed the thoughts made last week by former Gov. Ed Rendell who basically asked where were these folks during the last mid-term elections?

    Frank has been himself a lightning rod for harsh criticism regarding the loosening of regulations surrounding mortgages, which some feel led to the very mortgage-backed security problems that led to a crashing of the U.S. economy back in fall of 2008. Many on the right have efforted to make him the poster-boy for Democratic ineptitude.

    For his part, Frank has always maintained that his position hasn’t changed, that his efforts were to fight the very deregulated policies that led to the crash. So for him to feel ire from Occupy Wall Street protesters — most of whom appear to be of the progressive stripe — combined with two years of conservative attacks…well, it put Rep. Frank in no mood!

    Maddow asked if Rep. Frank believed if he thought that the Occupy Wall Street movement has “lit a fire under the Democrats at all?” Frank answered:

    Well, first, I have to say that I wish there was some of that energy two years ago when I was fighting against the people who wanted to protect derivatives from regulation and were trying to weaken the consumer bureau. Rachel, I do have to say, some of us have been trying to do this for a while, and I have to be honest and say in 2009, I wish some of these people had been energized then and were helping us fight back against this effort. Because we got a strong bill, but it should have been stronger.

    After then talking about the importance of presidential politics, and how it specifically affects the very laws and regulations vis a vis Supreme Court justices appointed by elected presidents, Frank went back to the protesters (rough transcript provide by TVEyes):

    Yes, I hope there will be pressure to do even more, but I, again, want to be honest, simply being in a public place and voicing your opinion in and of itself doesn’t do anything politically. It is the prerequisite, I hope, for people getting together and voting and engaging things. and I understand some of the people on occupy wall street are kind of critical of that. They think that’s conventional politics. Well, you know, the most successful organization in America in getting its views adopted is the national rifle association. they are in many cases a minority. But in addition to everything else they do, they very effectively identify who the members of the congress are, the legislatures and vote for them.

    So as I said, I welcome the Wall Street energy. I don’t agree with everything some of the people say. I agree with the general thrust of it. it’s not self-executing. It has to be translated into political activity if it’s going to have the impact. you know, I would just say, the last thing, we had an election last year in which people who disagree with them, and disagree with me and with you, got elected. I want to be honest again here. I don’t know what the voting behavior is of all these people, but I’m a little bit unhappy when people didn’t vote last time blame me for the consequences of their not voting.

    Frank’s candid criticism of OWS protesters sounds eerily similar, if not much more nuanced, than what many, more conservative pundits have said. The groundswell of populism is a powerful and impressive thing. But this energy does not translate to a motivated voting block, then it may be all for naught.

  47. Newt
    Is that short for Newton?
    Anyhow i am really liking the guy
    I despise Romney and Perry. Who are these 25% of republicans that support him? i do not no one person who thinks he is the answer. Not one.
    i do a lot of hiring and in the past I utilized one of those firms that administers a test evaluating potential employees. They suck and the results are stupid. Wasted a lot of money hiring people that my gut said no to but the scores said yes.
    can’t help but look at the republican field the same way. Romney and Perry come out as best bets but the applicants in this case are for the highest job in the land and both give me pause.

  48. admin

    Fabulous job transcribing- thanks!

    October 18th, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    Good analysis- I agree with your assessment of the candidates!

    Perry improved from the last debate- but still hasn’t settled into a rythum

  49. Ulsterman: Report- and a warning to anyone talking to protest groups… “They will hurt you!” If you try talking sense to them. i.e. Anti-Obama talk..

    WALL STREET INSIDER: The Obama White House Wants Us Gone. All of Us.

    Our latest interview with a longtime Wall Street Insider reveals details of a troubling Obama White House stance against Wall Street executives voicing concern over the now daily violence permeating the Occupy Wall Street movement – and a belief the Obama administration may be actively engaged in helping create that conflict.

    Ulsterman: This is the first time you contacted me instead of me contacting you to speak – why the change?

    WSI: Things have become much more…serious. This occupy thing…it’s getting…I have never considered myself one for conspiracy, but what I am being told is happening with these protests has left me quite stunned and quite concerned. Even more than just a week prior.

    Ulsterman: And what is that? What have you heard?

    WSI: A number of calls were made. Direct to the White House. People with considerable influence…people who supported the president in 2008. People who don’t wish to see events spiral out of control here.
    Read more in News
    « Barack Obama’s Disgracing of Martin Luther King Jr.
    It’s Official – Wall Street Abandons Obama »

    Ulsterman: Did they speak to the Obama? President Obama?

    WSI: I don’t believe so – not directly. I am told the president no longer engages in direct communication with most of us anymore. His advisers have declared war on Wall Street. Open war. That is what much of what you see going on down there represents. And the Obama White House…sadly…they are behind much of it. They and their union associates.

    Ulsterman: Who did they speak to? At the White House?

    WSI: I don’t know. What I do know is the message that came back to them was…unfavorable. Certainly very inconsiderate to the concerns of these events unfolding into something terribly violent and increasingly dangerous to a lot of people working and living in this city. And it could very well spread across the country. It’s already started in other parts of the world of course – the violence. The instability to the system. The Obama White House wants us gone. All of us. Anyone of us not fully supportive of his policies.

    Ulsterman: What do you mean “gone”?

    WSI: Just what I stated. Gone. Out of the way. Our ability to make a living eliminated. The system as we know it…the foundational freedoms of the free market…they consider it a burden. A problem. Something that needs to be redefined where government controls every critical component of the system. In essence, they want the end of capitalism. I know that has been said before, and I was among those who would roll their eyes at such an accusation against President Obama. Call me a believer now. What is being told to me…to others whose livelihood had been working within the current system – the situation is growing very dire. Very dangerous. I am not saying I fear for my life necessarily…it’s not that. It’s that I fear for this country’s way of life. I have never felt it to have been in so much danger as I do so right now. And it’s moving quickly – very quickly in a direction I think very few wish to comprehend.

    Ulsterman: When we spoke last time you sounded so confident. You said you were going to pick up a broom – I believe that’s how you put it. Pick up a broom and sweep the protesters out of the park. Why the change in tone? And so quickly.

    WSI: To my credit, that is exactly what was about to happen within days of my telling you that, correct? The protesters were given notice. The park was in fact scheduled to be cleaned. I knew of that intention. Then…the cleaning was delayed. That was followed by an immediate response from protesters toward more violent actions. Do you know there was an employee – a person working for one of the firms, injured by a group of protesters a short time ago? They were accosted. Made the mistake of trying to intellectually challenge the protesters – ask them why they were doing what they were doing. They were pushed, shoved down, scraped up. The firm…the firm decided to not make the altercation public for fear of reprisal by the mob. No charges. No media reporting on the incident. No consequences to those who attacked the individual. The space between that event and all out chaos is a very-very narrow one indeed. The message is going out to these people – these so called protesters…go ahead and attack. There will be no consequence. Attack.

    Ulsterman: Who is giving them those – not sure what you would call it…those orders?

    WSI: Officially it starts at the administration, who in turn have been told by the union leadership to not only stand down, but to lend support to the protests. That to not lend support to the movement would prove politically…uncomfortable to them. To the Obama White House.

    Ulsterman: You still believe the unions are the primary force behind this Occupy Wall Street thing?

    WSI: Absolutely. There are other groups…fringe groups, who have attached themselves to it of course, but in the end, it is Big Labor who are calling the shots, funding, providing pressure to the media, to the administration, to law enforcement…they are the ones pulling the strings on these events.

    Ulsterman: You really believe unions have become that powerful?

    WSI: When you have the full backing of the Executive Branch of the United States government…yes I do. And I don’t believe it – I know it to be so. We spoke of what happened with the auto industry. The bailout that went to the unions at the expense of the bond holders. A long history of financial precedence simply turned away by this administration. We have spoken of – you have reported on, the fraud inherent in the stimulus funding. Billions upon billions that went to organized labor. Unions are holding a gun to the head of America’s free market system and they appear increasingly willing to pull the trigger. These protests are an extension of that willingness. When Wall Street – some of us, began to indicate we would not be supporting the president’s re-election in 2012…some in the White House took that as an act of war against them. This started well over a year ago you know. What you see happening down there…those silly people being used as pawns…it is a form of punishment and intimidation against Wall Street for speaking to concerns surrounding the administration. But I now fear the punishment initially intended has grown far beyond the borders of that intent. The monster is overcoming its master, as is so often the case. And this White House is ok with that. They have been told…this is my own speculation here…they have been told to let it happen.

    Ulsterman: What? Let what happen?

    WSI: The violence that is coming. What some want to see happen. As I told you, the tone that came back from those calls made to the White House – it was…oddly indifferent. That indifference tells me they have decided to push these protests to the brink. I don’t entirely understand why…why they would be willing to do so – and that frightens me.

    Ulsterman: You are saying the Obama White House wants violence to break out in New York? Throughout the country?

    WSI: I am saying that such violence is going to likely happen – the foundation has now been laid out for that kind of thing, and the administration appears…disinterested in the preventions of that violence. If anything, they are promoting it to some degree. They are being clever about it of course – but there has been absolutely no denouncement from the White House of what is going on down there. Nothing. Only support. Only encouragement. Even as they are receiving word of the dangers, of the altercations, of the potential for greater violence – the Obama White House only offers its support of these events. Why is that? What is their purpose? ZuccottiPark should have been cleared last week. To have backed down only lent more courage to these protesters. It made them increasingly volatile. Now if there is a move by law enforcement against the protesters, the dangers will be greatly increased than just a week ago. The violence will be much-much worse. Police will be harmed. Citizens will be harmed. Businesses harmed. Why would the White House appear intent on seeing that happen?

    Ulsterman: You were rattled when the order to clean the park was delayed. Some powerful people were ignored on that, weren’t they? You discovered Wall Street was no longer in control here. Isn’t that right?

    WSI: (Long pause) I suppose that is part of it, yes. We were told this thing was going to be resolved. Local figures…people whose livelihood requires at least in part our support and approval…they indicated it would be cleaned up soon.

    Ulsterman: But that didn’t happen. Somebody with more authority, more influence than you intervened…

    WSI: It would appear so, yes.

    Ulsterman: The White House?

    WSI: Quite possible – perhaps likely… though I am more certain they received their orders from union leadership figures. And the concern now is beyond just here. Beyond Wall Street. I have associates in London – the situation there has the potential to prove even more unstable. I was, until very recently, unaware things had gone so far wrong.

    Ulsterman: So what now? How do you fight back?

    WSI: I don’t. Not directly. Not now. What I spoke of before will happen. Perhaps even more so. Perhaps not. People are frightened. Increasingly so. The Obama administration is burning bridges. They are willing to do so. That is the situation. They appear to believe they don’t need some who supported them in 2008. That the unions and some in the media will be enough to overcome the GOP opponent.

    Ulsterman: Do you agree with that? Can they win re-election?

    WSI: Certainly there is that possibility. As to probability – I don’t know. The actual politics of it all – that is not my world. Our acquaintance would have much more to tell you on that. You asked me what I plan to do now? I’m leaving the city. I am getting out until whatever is going to happen – and I believe it will take place soon…I don’t wish to be here when it does. And I’m not the only one. People need to wait and see – and then regroup.

    Ulsterman: You’re running away?

    WSI: Sure – feel free to call it that if you wish. I am removing myself from the immediate threat that is this situation down there. I am removing my family from it. Those I care for. That is the responsible thing to do. And I would suggest you not return here as well – not until this thing…however it intends to resolve itself. Stay away from it for now.

    Ulsterman: What do you fear is going to happen down there? What is coming?

    WSI: I don’t wish to be overly dramatic here…but violence. Injury. Perhaps death. Most certainly destruction of property. It’s getting dangerous. I can sense it. It’s palpable. And you feel it too, don’t you?

    Ulsterman: It reminds me of growing up in Northern Ireland, yes. It does remind me of that…uneasy feeling that something terrible could happen just around the turn…

    WSI: That’s it exactly. Just around the turn. Something terrible is coming just around the turn. So for now, I’m getting out. I’m blessed to have the means to do so. I fear for those who do not.

    Ulsterman: If violence does break out down there – what then? Where does all of this go?

    WSI: If that happens – and I pray it does not…but if that happens, my instinct tells me it’s just the start. It’s the fuse meant to light the fire. And I don’t wish to be anywhere near this place when that happens. We can continue to communicate, but not in person. There are things I may wish to share with you at some point. This is not yet that time. For now let’s simply hope violence does not break out. That these protests resolve themselves peacefully. Perhaps the colder weather will send them home. That is my hope – but my instincts tell me that will not be the reality down there. Far from it.

    I’ll leave you with this…the mayor – Mayor Bloomberg, must now decide whose bidding he will do regarding this situation. Will he comply with the demands of the Obama White House and the labor unions, or the needs of the people of New York? I am confident we are to know the answer to that in short order. To this point, Mayor Bloomberg has been less than adequate – and I say that as one who has long admired him. I very much hope he redeems himself and proves his worth to this city. So watch Bloomberg closely. He is likely to show his true inclination in this matter one way or the other very soon now.

    I believe the WSI has an accurate take on the malevolence of this protest. The Boston Protest, not at the hub of the financial Mecca, is the Lady in Waiting to the Wall St protest not showing it’s teeth yet, hiding behind the good will of protest participants. When the signal is given, they will all rise in a cacophony of chaos throughout the country. It is then Obama will come in bloviating this is not what America is about declaring Martial Law and stating we are under the authority of the US Government/Martial Law until further notice. Stating, BTW- All Elections Are Cancelled until stability returns to our country… This is when he will make his move for putting us under the jurisdiction of another entity- The One World Order by signing an Executive Order for the “good and welfare” of it’s citizens!

    He has to be removed for reasons apparent to all who are aware of the building tsunami of scandals… Removed for his ‘own’ safety while under investigation. (we can play that game too-) He has to go NOW before the radicals interspersed in the nationwide protests trigger a nationwide revolution that will devastate this country for years to come. Time is of the essence- The move to REMOVE has to be made NOW!

  50. Hillary4Texas
    Think I read that you are going to give Chantrix a try.
    I smoked for thirty years and tried everything to quit, Gum, patches, hypnosis pehenol barbitol, escape spas, anti-depressants. nothing worked,
    Thought I had no chance of kicking the habit. Then one day i decided to give it a go on my own. First thre days are torture. baby toenail is screaming for a fix. I got through it by taking damp paper towels and nuking them. i’d then clutch the very hot paper. Think it was like what cutters do. i had this systemic discomfort as a result of withdrawal and I localized it. Anyhow three years later and smoke free.

  51. Amazing. U.S. Senate not only knows about Fast & Furious, but has acted upon it:

    Senate Unanimously Passes Amendment Banning Funds For Fast And Furious-Style Programs
    The U.S. Senate unanimously voted in favor of an amendment Wednesday that guarantees zero funding for programs that include the transfer of firearms to drug cartels unless law enforcement continuously monitors the weapons “at all times.” The amendment stemmed directly from Operation Fast and Furious, the controversial botched weapons program, and was introduced by Sen. John Cornyn, R-Texas.
    The amendment passed 99-0, with only Sen. Kent Conrad, D-N.D., missing the vote. During floor debate on Tuesday, Commerce, Justice, Science Appropriations Subcommittee Chairwoman Barbara Mikulski, D-Md., jumped on board and praised Cornyn’s effort to prevent any more programs like the botched “gun-walking” effort that enabled U.S.-purchased weapons to end up in the hands of Mexican drug cartels. In a rare show of bipartisanship, Mikulski not only commended the Texas Republican, but said she would join with him in getting answers from the Justice Department about what officials at the top knew about the program and when.

  52. After watching a little of the GOP debate and its parade of hacks I am convinced that Hillary can hold her head up high and be the best candidate this country will ever see for many years to come.We need to begin a draft Hillary movement now if we are to save our democracy and restore us to world respect and leadership.She is wanted and needed by world leaders to repair the damage that obama has devised to become another two-bit dictator. A true oreo.Coming up is an example of her respect world wide.Just signup for the STATE
    DEPT mail and a daily schedule for her and her staff
    Areal treat with video and speeches. It is a treasure trove that MSM and several channels continue to deny the public for fear of her pRemarks
    Hillary Rodham Clinton
    Secretary of StateTripoli, Libya

    October 18, 2011

    PRIME MINISTER JIBRIL: (Via interpreter) In the name of God, most compassionate, most merciful, it is with great delight that we are honored to meet the U.S. Secretary of State, Secretary Clinton, and the high-level U.S. delegation accompanying her. This is the first visit for Secretary Clinton after the fall of the previous regime. We appreciate it a lot. We appreciate what the U.S. has provided during all this time, during all the time of our blessed revolution of February 17th, where the U.S. has offered also support for advocating for (inaudibleopularity.


  53. holdthemaccountable
    October 19th, 2011 at 9:22 am

    Amazing. U.S. Senate not only knows about Fast & Furious, but has acted upon it:

    Good News! Now to address the F&F Scandal with some teeth. It’s hard to believe none of the people involved have turned against their leader- How can they not realize the precariousness of this country’s stability with Obama at the helm? We are in deep sh*t. Obama about to hijack our country’s sovereignty lumping us in to The Socialist portfolio of George Soros and prosecutors don’t have a clue how to appeal to Americans having the guts to call on their patriotism to SAVE the country by volunteering to testify against the SOB? Sweet Jesus, Mary and Joseph!

  54. I have a question.

    A few days back, bambi gave a gag performance at the unveiling of the MLK statue. He had the disgusting nerve to compare the road he is traveling to that of Martin Luther King.

    I am wondering if the reason he and the dimwit party are applauding OWS and their protests is twofold?

    Is he trying to get back at Wall Street for not backing his campaign this time around?

    Is he trying to encourage the OWS movement to go balistic so he can pretend that he is their savior ala MLK and the freedom marching of the sixties?

  55. henry, I just finished my first week of Chantix, am starting on second (higher dose) pack today. You are supposed to quit after letting it get in your system for about two weeks, so I have another week to go before I bite the bullet.

    The family is already warned not to piss me off for a couple of weeks, as I’ll be looking something like this:

  56. Leading Democrat Calls For Obama Voting Fraud Investigation

    by Ulsterman on October 18, 2011 with 21 Comments in News

    As President Obama travels the country seeking re-election votes for 2012, a growing scandal emerges regarding how his campaign went about collecting votes back in 2008. An ongoing investigation into potentially hundreds of forged signatures used to get Barack Obama on the primary ballot in Indiana during the 2008 election has now prompted calls for a federal investigation into the matter.

    “Fake signatures may mean Obama didn’t actually qualify in Indiana.”

    So says the headline of an Indiana based newspaper this past week – a story that is now gaining national attention and causing considerable heartburn for the Democratic Party as it prepares for a tough 2012 election cycle. The allegations being leveled against Barack Obama’s 2008 election are significant, and potentially far-reaching should a federal investigation actually be launched.

    While forged signatures were found on both Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton petitions, it appears the forgings were far more considerable in securing Obama’s qualification to be on the primary ballot in Indiana at the time. If word of the forgings had become public knowledge back in 2008, it would have likely been such a significant scandal it might very well have prevented Barack Obama from eventually securing the Democratic Party nomination for President of the United States.

    Now the former Indiana Democratic Party Chair Ann DeLaney is calling for a federal investigation into the voting fraud allegations:

    “There’s supposed to be a system of checks and balances in this,” she said on Indiana Week in Review, “and they need to be observed. And they’re observed for a reason: so that people have confidence in the integrity of the system. And if something’s wrong up there, it needs to be fixed.”

    As of yet, there has been no official comment from the Obama administration regarding the allegations, despite repeated requests from Indiana and national media.
    Indiana was also one of the flashpoints for a national ACORN voter fraud case back in 2008 when investigators uncovered over 2000 fraudulent voter registration forms in the Gary Indiana ACORN office.

    ACORN was the far-left voter registration community activist operation that received nearly a million dollars from the Obama 2008 campaign to register voters for Barack Obama’s presidential bid.

  57. Obama, Clinton hail Shalit’s release

    By: Tim Mak
    October 18, 2011

    President Barack Obama and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton welcomed Israeli soldier Gilad Shalit’s release after five years of being held captive by Hamas, saying he was imprisoned for “far too long.”

    “We are pleased that a long ordeal… has ended for Gilad Shalit,” Clinton said in remarks during an unannounced visit to the Libyan capital of Tripoli, according to the BBC.

    White House spokesperson Jay Carney said that he knew the president was personally pleased about the release of Shalit, but couldn’t say how it would affect the peace process. “We are pleased that Mr. Shalit is being reunited with his family – as regards [the] overall process, for us it’s always about each side taking steps that make it easier to return to negotiations instead of harder,” Carney said.

    The Israeli government and Hamas, acting through intermediaries, agreed to a deal that would see more than 1,000 Palestinians released in exchange for the Israeli soldier, who was 19 when he was captured in 2006 near Israel’s border with Gaza.

    Upon inspection by doctors, Shalit showed signs of malnutrition and lack of exposure to the sun, the AP reports.

    “I hope this deal will promote peace between Israel and the Palestinians,” said Shalit in an interview on Egyptian TV.

    But his message was marred by the nature of the interview, which stirred controversy as it was conducted before he had a chance to talk to his family or return to Israel.”We are all shocked that a so-called interview was forced on [Shalit] before he could even talk to his family or set foot on Israeli soil,” an Israel official told the AP.

    As per the deal arranged for the release of prisoners, 477 Palestinian prisoners were released at the same time as Shalit’s release. Another 550 will be released in two months.

    Both Israelis and Palestinians celebrated the prisoner exchange deal. Reports indicate that Gilad Shalit is being welcomed back in his home town by crowds waving the Israeli flag. Meanwhile, BBC reports that over 100,000 people are waving the Hamas flag in Gaza to welcome the prisoners back. Hamas militants are lining the road as the prisoners travel to the rally.

    Tony Blair, the former British Prime Minister and the envoy for the Middle East Quartet, said that the prisoner exchange deal should used to restart the peace process.

    “I hope it also offers us a moment of opportunity, and not simply in respect of Gaza where Hamas are presently in charge, but also for a… revival of credibility in a peace process we really need to prioritize,” he told the BBC.

  58. checks in:

    Media spokesmen for the Occupy Wall Street demonstrations claimed that their operation is totally transparent, with everything subject to democratic discussion in a general assembly of all comers. But eyewitness reports from experienced observers on the ground in lower Manhattan indicate a much different reality behind these bland assurances. Forces appeared to be at work behind the scenes to manipulate the protest movement into a posture of supporting the presidential candidacy of former Wall Street puppet Obama.

    Eyewitness observers suggest that the deliberations of the general assembly are largely a diversion, and that real power is being increasingly concentrated in the hands of about 20 mysterious and anonymous individuals who appear to make up a kind of covert steering committee that pulls the strings on the general assembly, or else goes around it completely. The members of this cadre of mysterious operatives are not as young as the average demonstrator. The secret leadership is made up of people ranging in age from 25 to over 40, with the older ones occupying the key posts. Many of them appear to be active duty or recently retired military.

    A Covert Steering Committee Behind the Scenes?

    Attempts to ascertain the names of the behind-the-scenes leaders are met with stonewalling. When pressed to reveal her identity, one female leader gave her name as “Mary MIA.” Another gave his name as “Tony POW.”

    If the leaders of OWS want to be transparent, let them make public at least the full names of the people who are actually running the show. No one wants to join a movement with anonymous leaders.

    Observers have noticed that almost all of the likely members of the secret steering committee disappear from view between 4 and 6 p.m. each afternoon, right before the opening of the general assembly, for which they then re-appear. It is assumed that they are attending a closed-door meeting, but the general assembly is not officially informed of this fact.

    Strange Bedfellows

    Two individuals who appear to belong to the higher levels of the pecking order in Zuccotti Park are pictured above. The one on the left calls himself “Brendan.” When newspaper correspondents and other media representatives arrive, he is often the one who handles relations with them. “Brendan” looks old enough to be the father of many of the demonstrators.

    The person pictured above on the right is a frequent speaker in the general assembly. He also has a role in relations with the press. According to one protester, he may have connections to the US military, but this has not been confirmed. Is his do-rag or bandana a fashion statement, or something else?

    Who are these people? Who appointed them? To whom are they accountable? Continue reading Occupy Wall Street: Who Wants to Hijack the Movement? ( Obama via the Labor Unions!)

  59. RNC: Decry ‘Occupy’ anti-Semitism

    By: Mackenzie Weinger
    October 19, 2011

    The Republican National Committee attacked Democrats on Wednesday for staying silent about “extreme anti-Semitic, anti-Israel comments” reported at the Occupy Wall Street protests.

    RNC communications director Sean Spicer blasted top Democrats for voicing their support for the demonstrations even as some of the protesters make “anti-Semitic, anti-Israel comments,” according to a memo first reported in “Morning Score” on Wednesday.

    Spicer pointed to President Barack Obama, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, Democratic National Committee chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz and Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee Chair Steve Israel for turning a “blind eye” to the language used by some individuals at Occupy Wall Street.

    “Where’s the outrage?” Spicer wrote.

    “Is Steve Israel standing with those calling for the killing of Jews? Does Debbie Wasserman Schultz agree with the various calls for Jews to be ‘run out of this country’ and to oppose and ‘destroy’ the state of Israel?” he added in the memo.

    In the memo, Spicer linked to three different videos documenting the comments he referred to. In one from the conservative group Emergency Committee for Israel called “Hate at Occupy Wall Street,” several demonstrators are shown making comments such as “Jews control Wall Street” and “You can’t even speak English? You Israeli? Go back to Israel.” A sign saying “Hitler’s Bankers Wall Street” also appears in the clip.

    In another clip from ReasonTV in Los Angeles, a woman says: “I think the Zionist Jews who are running these big banks and our Federal Reserve… need to be run out of this country.”

    The last clip referenced by the RNC was filmed in Chicago and is called “Occupy Chicago Joins Destroy Israel Anti-war Peace March.” It features a man saying, “Israel is beginning to be seen as the criminal pariah state that it is.”

    Spicer said Democratic leaders supporting the Occupy Wall Street demonstrations is hypocritical in light of how they’ve previously spoken about the tea party movement.

    “Democrats were quick to single out any instances of perceived extremism among Tea Party supporters, but with Occupy Wall Street, they turn a blind eye,” he wrote.

    The Anti-Defamation League released a statement on Monday responding to the various videos and images that have shown anti-Semitic rhetoric, saying, “There is no evidence that these incidents are widespread.

    The ADL noted that thus far “anti-Semitism has not gained traction more broadly with the protestors, nor is it representative of the larger movement at this time.”

    “As the focus of the demonstrations continue to develop and evolve, ensuring that the movement does not get hijacked by extremists or anti-Semitic elements is critical,” the group added.

  60. I tuned in to the debate last night and my husband actually watched it with me, normally he would get up and move to another room, he hates politicians says their all liars and thieves. He asked if I liked Ron Paul and I told him I agree with him on some things and other times I think he is bat shit crazy. When it was over he said he liked Newt, he seemed to be the only adult. I have not forgotten the Speaker of the House who I hated at the time but times have changed and for me he does seem to be the only adult in the room. I would love to see an Obama and Newt debate. Newt would tear the man a new asshole and probably make him cry.

  61. I am not a fan, but I like what he said here…

    Bill O’Reilly: President Obama and ‘Occupy Wall Street’ Protesters

    October 17, 2011 | O’Reilly Factor

    By Bill O’Reilly

    Let’s take this step by step. First of all, the people behind the protests are smart. They have designed a plan that deflects the bad economy away from President Obama onto greedy Wall Street people and by extension the Republican Party.

    It works this way: The protesters scream that Wall Street greed is why the worldwide economy is so bad. And who supports big business? Why, the Republicans do.

    Simple, effective and some in the media have latched onto the theme. The economic disaster in America is not the president’s fault; it’s the fault of corrupt Wall Street greed-heads.

    Whether he knows it or not, President Obama lit the fuse for this plan by openly stating that corporations and the wealthy are not paying their fair share in taxes. “Talking Points” doesn’t know whether Mr. Obama knew his class warfare rhetoric would ignite public protest, but it has, and surely the president understands the power of his words. On Sunday at the Martin Luther King Memorial he said this:

    BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Dr. King understood that peace without justice was no peace at all, that aligning our reality with our ideals often requires the speaking of uncomfortable truths and the creative tension of nonviolent protests.

    If he were alive today, I believe he would remind us that the unemployed worker can rightly challenge the excesses of Wall Street without demonizing all who work there.”

    The president’s use of the word “justice” is interesting. What’s the definition of justice?

    Some folks believe that justice is making sure everybody has the same amount of money. That’s the income equality group. They want governments around the world to take money away from the affluent and business and give it to the “people.” And spurred on by the demonstrations in the USA, protesters all over the world are now demanding social justice.

    What people have to understand is that these demonstrators come from a variety of places. Some are hardcore communists; some are socialists; some are just confused and/or looking for some action. Most of these people don’t know the big picture. They’re just out there protesting whatever beef they may have. The commonality here is that the protesters despise capitalism, believing it unfair. And sometimes it is, just like every system can be unfair.

    The greedy business people who invented the giant mortgage con absolutely damaged the worldwide economy. They are villains. There’s no question about it.

    But you don’t see these protesters screaming about countries like Greece, Spain, Portugal and other social justice nations going bankrupt because of excessive spending on entitlements. That bankruptcy spectrum is hurting the worldwide economy far more than any mortgage scheme ever did.

    You also don’t see the protesters angry with the Democratic Party here in America for spending this country into near bankruptcy, badly damaging the currency and retirement accounts.

    No, none of that is on display. It’s all about social justice.

    The truth is that many protesters in America simply don’t like their country. They don’t want to compete in the free marketplace. They want to do their own thing and be guaranteed financial security while doing it. Again, they don’t want to compete; they want to be supported.

    Meantime, the demonstrations are costing working taxpayers millions of dollars. Money down the drain.

    On another front, it is instructive to see how the left-wing media in America are supporting the demonstrators. Think back a year ago when the Tea Party was demonstrating for smaller government and responsible spending. Did the media support that effort? Of course not. It demonized the Tea Party as racist and insensitive to the needs of the poor.

    So what happens now? Well, my pal Glenn Beck says this is just the beginning of worldwide rioting and revolt designed to tear down the capitalistic system. “Talking Points” believes the protesters will in the short run ramp it up. They are now emboldened, and the powerful people behind President Obama certainly see this as an opportunity. If Wall Street becomes the economic issue, Mr. Obama will be much better off. The president’s campaign chief, David Axelrod, gave us a preview on Sunday:


    “I don’t think any American is impressed when they see Governor Romney and all the Republican candidates say the first thing they would do is roll back Wall Street reforms and go back to where we were before the crisis and let Wall Street write its own rules. I think that will be an issue.”

    Interesting, right? The Democrats know they can’t defend President Obama’s economic record, so they will deflect it into another arena and the media will buy it.

    But “Talking Points” is not buying it. Capitalism gives the most amount of people the most opportunity to succeed on their own. Europe is collapsing economically because of rampant social justice spending. The Soviet Union collapsed. Cuba and Venezuela are disasters. Socialism never works.

    But worldwide there are millions of people who want stuff without working for it, and they are capable of using force trying to get that stuff. Not a nice picture.

    And that’s “The Memo.”

  62. I agree with those who say we should not go along with the targeted nit picking by the lackeys in the MSM.

    I would like to hear and read about all the ways each candidate’s thoughts and convictions would add interest and stimulate discussion. Think if Ron Paul was president. What if Gingrich was? Cain or Bachmann? We are so used to candidates saying what needs to be said to get elected then quietly settling down to do the bidding of, who?, the bidders, I guess. It would be refreshing to get a KOOK or a FIGHTER in the WH.

    I remember my utter amazement during the Bailout discussions, when the “crazy lady” (label thanks to the MN DFL Party) Michele Bachmann stood up and yelled out for all to hear: “Who is looking out for the American people in this?”

    I thought the democrats that we Minnesotans had elected to “GO TO WASHINGTON TO GIT THINGS DONE”, to “FIGHT FOR US” were not really silent they were just being ignored by the media, imagine my surprise.

    So who are the most likely to continue fighting for the American people while in office? I think Paul and Bachmann, maybe Gingrich (maybe not). I worry Cain is really in the back pocket of the Fed. Mitt can’t make the cut and I am half and half about Perry.

    There is no question Hillary would have, Palin would have, Trump – maybe.

  63. If martial law is Obama’s plan it will fail and in the end bring him down. The military 3/4 of them do not trust or support him, they will go in and clean up the streets of the protesters if they become a threat, but after that if he doesn’t lift it they will come and remove him. Ask any military person who they will stand with their family, neighbors or Obama?. The east and west coast will lay down and put up with this, middle America and the south will fight this tooth and nail and the military will stand behind them. If Obama and friends could hear the chatter of the military the would shit there pants and run for the hills. They will remove Obama as the threat.

  64. lisaque
    October 19th, 2011 at 12:28 pm

    I also believe that we can count on Hillary, Panetta, and Biden to stop him if it goes that far.

  65. lisaque
    October 19th, 2011 at 12:28 pm

    If martial law is Obama’s plan it will fail and in the end bring him down.
    Yup, I agree. There are too many folks in this country with guns, that do not like him and will not be caged in without a major fight.

  66. Opposition to martial law would be broad based, and include all areas of the country, not just the south and middle America. There are patriots EVERYWHERE.

  67. The east and west coast will lay down and put up with this
    Nope. East and West don’t like to be pinned in either, the majority of folks would fight if they were put under martial law. We want our American freedom as much as the rest of the country.

  68. No one with a brain ever wants to push it to martial law and total chaos. Because in that case, they would lose the whole banana. Many many more conservatives and libertarians are armed in this country than leftists are, and it’s not entirely certain that the military wouldn’t revolt as well.

  69. Shadowfax- that video DID make me cry. For what was. And for what could have been. And for what SHOULD BE!

  70. HillaryforTexas
    October 19th, 2011 at 1:00 pm

    No one with a brain ever wants to push it to martial law and total chaos. Because in that case, they would lose the whole banana. Many many more conservatives and libertarians are armed in this country than leftists are, and it’s not entirely certain that the military wouldn’t revolt as well.
    And even some of us under-the-bus liberals that have never wanted nor owned a gun in our lives would make a bee line for the store that sells them to join in the fight. I would have no hesitation, and I wouldn’t get some cute ladies pistol either.

    I have only competed with a bb gun against two males with lots of experience, and I won hands down, over and over with a dead-on aim. 😉

  71. I doubt this will be in the corporate media, so I’ll make it available here.

    Putin Cites FDR Precedent
    October 19, 2011

    Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin gave his first extensive interview since the announcement at the United Russia party conference last month that he would be running for President next year. In the interview, with three Russian television networks, Putin explained his decision to seek another term as President by citing the case of U.S. President Franklin Roosevelt.

    “He led the country in the toughest times of economic depression and during World War Two — and he was elected four times, because he acted effectively. When a country is experiencing difficult, hard conditions, when it is emerging from crisis and getting back to its feet, these elements of stability — including in the political sphere — are extremely important,” Putin explained.

    Putin also made clear that, while Russia was not seeking any superpower status, that it would agressively defend its vital interests.

    “It would be a big mistake,” he told the interviewers, “for us to put on the mantle of some superpower and try to dictate our demands to somebody when it does not concern us. As for what does concern us, here we will, of course, defend to the end all that interests us and all that enters our sphere of interests.”

    Putin sharply criticized unnamed Western circles for interfering in Russian affairs: “Mind your own business: fight against rising inflation, against growing government debt, against obesity — get to work.”

    There will likely to be more to report when the transcript is made available in Russian or English.


  72. HillaryforTexas
    October 19th, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    Oakland protestors are now threatening local TV reporters, saying they will take and destroy their equipment if they try to go into the plaza to film them.

    I watched the video and am shocked that the protest is so peaceful. Oakland on a normal day has huge crime rate, very high unemployment especially for the majority of AA’s that live there.

    There are probably more guns in Oakland that most cities in America…martial law would not be possible. The fact that they are trying to be responsible and not violent is a big deal…at least so far. It is a tinderbox.

  73. Washington DC. Wealthiest metropolitan area in the entire country.

    I believe it, all the folks that work for the government with good paychecks paid with our taxes.

  74. The movement is beginning to lose its innocent appearance:
    The Chicago Teachers Union (CTU) trained under radical street organizer, and leader of the anti-capitalist #occupy movement, Lisa Fithian, to stage a protest march in Chicago on 10/10/11. By eagfoundation – not familiar with this group.

  75. Hillary Clinton: America’s Pacific Century

    We all know that fears and misperceptions linger on both sides of the Pacific. Some in our country see China’s progress as a threat to the United States; some in China worry that America seeks to constrain China’s growth. We reject both those views. The fact is that a thriving America is good for China and a thriving China is good for America. We both have much more to gain from cooperation than from conflict. But you cannot build a relationship on aspirations alone. It is up to both of us to more consistently translate positive words into effective cooperation — and, crucially, to meet our respective global responsibilities and obligations. These are the things that will determine whether our relationship delivers on its potential in the years to come. We also have to be honest about our differences. We will address them firmly and decisively as we pursue the urgent work we have to do together. And we have to avoid unrealistic expectations.

    Read the entire article here:
    Read the entire article here.

    Read the entire article here.

  76. HillaryforTexas
    October 19th, 2011 at 1:00 pm
    No one with a brain ever wants to push it to martial law and total chaos. Because in that case, they would lose the whole banana. Many many more conservatives and libertarians are armed in this country than leftists are, and it’s not entirely certain that the military wouldn’t revolt as well.

    Agree with what your saying here but something is wrong, the protest are slowly getting more out of hand and they are starting to threaten violence. The MSM and Obama gangs are supporting the protesters. I do believe that some of protester are well meaning, I believe in protesting when you fell there something wrong. Before I moved here I would get on Amtrak with my mom from Hanford to San Francisco to march in the anti war marches. Carried anti Bush signs and chanted away with code Pink. There just seems to be something wrong here what do they want and why are they being used by the MSM and Obama gang. What is there end game to all of this. I know its past time to fit me with the tin foil hat. It just fells like something bad is coming. How far is Obama and gang willing to push things? my guess is all the way.

  77. Good for the ADL — defending OWS from defamation too!


    The Anti-Defamation League released a statement on Monday responding to the various videos and images that have shown anti-Semitic rhetoric, saying, “There is no evidence that these incidents are widespread.

    The ADL noted that thus far “anti-Semitism has not gained traction more broadly with the protestors, nor is it representative of the larger movement at this time.”

  78. Well, avoiding the subject of you know what, here’s a somewhat informative article about illegal immigrant labor.

    In Alabama, where a new state law is aimed at cracking down on illegal immigrants, the construction, agriculture and poultry industries all report huge shortages of labor.

    A study by the University of Georgia this year found that the state had a shortage of 5,244 workers in the fields.

    In California, farmers have complained of too few workers to pick the avocados.

    In Texas, growers have appealed for more employees to help pick their organic crops and vegetables, with little luck.

  79. Hillary4Texas
    Best of luck to you. Not an easy thing to do.
    I found that moving my coffee pot and buying a new chair for my computer helped tremendously(association)
    Also when I drank I opted for something different. Seems silly but it was easier to not smoke with a glass of wine as opposed to a beer.
    talked to a couple of the campers in Pittsburgh and I got the distinct feeling that they want things to escalate. they have only been there since Saturday and the boredom is obvious. No one is paying much attention.

  80. H4T – Good luck. Whatever you do, DO NOT PICK UP ANOTHER CIG AFTER YOU’VE QUIT.

    I quit two times within the last 4 years. After the first couple – three weeks, the cravings sort of went out of my mind for the most part. At one point I’d gone over 4 months but *just wanted to try one*. So, here I am still smoking.

    Quitting initially is not as hard as staying quit.

    BUT, here is something I found: when the urge to smoke strikes you, it really only lasts 2-3 minutes at most. If you can get up and go walk around the block, by the time you get back, the itch to light one up will have subsided.

  81. lisaque
    I spoke at length with a a protester today. Asked him what the end game was. fair tax was his reply. asked what that would be and he went off on bankers. Asked him if he felt the same way about athletes/actors/musicians/silicon valley moguls. he had no issue with Heinz Ward, Oprah or the Facebook kid because and I quote “they help people”. Guy was early twenties and I asked him what it was he wanted out of life. Answer was something about not being held down by the man. Prodded him more and asked him if he could be anything in the world with no restrictions what would it be, finally said he just wanted to play guitar on a beach. I asked why he doesn’t do it. i mean if you can camp in an urban environment seems you’d have the fortitude to hop on Greyhound and move to Florida. Live outside. make some cash doing the odd job and strum away on the beach. problem with that is he does not play the guitar. Told me it was unfair that he had never been given the opportunity. WTF? Really dude you are camping out because your mother was more concerned with food and shelter than music lessons. i said well why not go to the library or hit up youtube for free basic lessons. Well of course he doesn’t actually own a guitar. Conversation went on forever. And i have to say my 5 year old is better at articulating her case when she thinks it is “unfair” that i switch off NickJr for Jeopardy. She at lest makes a point and will back it up.

  82. This is not worth the effort needed to paste a link, but want you to know there is a video at the hill where Harry Reid is supposed to be making the case for this: Republicans are keeping the economy weak to defeat obama.

  83. blowmeObama
    I swear by very hot paper towels when the urge is extreme. All kinds of chemicals are released when you feel some pain negating the withdrawal. i did it all and had no success. Spent thousands. i couldn’t get beyond that frustration. Somehow clenching a very hot towel did the trick. Think it works for two reasons– the first being that the body responds to the pain of the hot towels and releases chemicals which smother the nic fit messages. Secondly you are doing something to beat the beast. Pro active. Know that eventually the need will fade but when you are submerged in the agony of withdrawal it is almost impossible to think of anything else. taking action puts you in the drivers seat. I smoked from age 12 to 41. never thought i could stop.

  84. Henry, I’ll give that a try next time I quit.

    I really was able to get past the cravings. It was well after the cravings went away that the idiotic idea of “see what one used to taste like” came upon me.

  85. JanH, the silence from our so -called Jewish representatives in Congress is nothing new…they will pounce on the Tea Party at every opportunity, but are meek when it comes to defending Israel. As far as the Schalit release, a very high price to pay for one soldier, but Israel values human life unlike the animals they rleased.

  86. blowmeObama
    i think i was finally able to quit because it made me furious that i was paying tax on tax. Ten dollars for smokes? I can agree with a sin tax if it funds directly something associated with the vice, but taxing booze and tobacco to balance out of control spending is wrong. i don’t even see how it is legal to charge tax on tax.

  87. The guy just wants to strum his guitar on the beach but is pist because his mama didn’t pay for lessons or he hasn’t gotten his shit together to even buy the instrument.

    Dude, just stay stoned and begging your way though life. Yea, that’s the ticket. 😡

  88. I quit smoking twice.

    My first mistake was to give into a ‘friend’ that said I should have control enough to smoke ONE on New Years Eve1999 and bring in the new century.

    I finally quit again on my son’s 21st Birthday…and have not smoked since.

    My second mistake……………was to fall in love with the gum. 😉

  89. Shadowfax
    i have zero problem with a tone deaf untalented person choosing to sit on a beach playing bad music. Rock on.
    But do not scream that life is unfair when you need to spend hundreds of dollars per month to keep your herpes from flaring up.
    One of my bartenders took to facebook to lament that she has no health care. Really she works Tuesday, Wednesday and Saturday from 7 til 3am,. I pay her 8 an hour and believe she makes close to a grand a week in tips. More than I make. I can watch everything she does as i have cameras and computer system mirrors what she rings in on my laptop. i don’t care that her boyfriend shows up at midnight and drinks for free for two hours. I let it slide as the price of doing business. She makes more than 30/hr and has only a high school education. Yet somehow I am the bad guy????

  90. Yet somehow I am the bad guy????

    First of all, you are only the bad guy if you buy into her drama.

    Second, if she voted for Obama and if he kept his promise, (:lol:) for the tax credit he was going to give everyone with no insurance of $2500/year she could buy herself some health insurance…easily. AND IT WOULD BE INSURANCE JUST LIKE OBAMA HAD AS A SENATOR.

    The fact that she either didn’t vote (no excuse for that in my book) or she voted for an inexperienced liar, that is her mistake.

    For $30/hr and all the free drinks for her boyfriend, she can buy her own health insurance, easily.

  91. henry
    October 19th, 2011 at 4:18 pm
    i think i was finally able to quit because it made me furious that i was paying tax on tax. Ten dollars for smokes? I can agree with a sin tax if it funds directly something associated with the vice, but taxing booze and tobacco to balance out of control spending is wrong. i don’t even see how it is legal to charge tax on tax.

    Yeah, well I got that beat now. Apparently, where I live, there is not a jacked up tax on “pipe tobacco”. What has developed is tobacco being labeled as pipe tabacco, premade cigarette tubes with attached filters, and rolling machines for said tubes and tabacco. I’m rolling my own now at between 89-92 cents / pack, depending upon where I buy the tobacco / tubes.

    Now, if I could just get gas down to 1980 prices ….

  92. GREECE hits the fan –

    Greece approves austerity bill on first reading

    athens protest

    A protest by more than 100,000 striking workers did not deter Greek lawmakers on Wednesday evening from approving the country’s latest austerity package at its first reading, by 154 votes to 141.

    The result, which followed a day when clouds of smoke billowed over the Athens skyline after angry rioters set fire to piles of rotting rubbish and clashed with police in one of the biggest demonstrations seen in the Greek capital for decades, was a success for prime minister George Papandreou, improving the odds that Greece will be able to draw down the next €8bn tranche of its bailout loan from international lenders.

    But Mr Papandreou will face pressure to make changes to the legislation on Thursday during a clause-by-clause discussion and second vote in the 300-member parliament.

    Earlier on Wednesday, masked youths threw hundreds of petrol bombs, burning a sentry box outside parliament, and pelting police officers with chunks of marble paving slabs. Riot police responded by firing teargas, while a bank branch had to be evacuated after the ground floor caught fire.

    Popular protests have mounted since Greece agreed last month to another €7.1bn of spending cuts and tax increases in next year’s budget, to be achieved through deep cuts in public sector wages and additional taxes.

    Groups of protesters tossed some of their petrol bombs into mounds of rubbish festering in the streets around central Constitution Square after a two-week strike by municipal workers. Clouds of acrid smoke drove the strikers out of the square.

    The 48-hour strike called by unions representing about half the country’s workforce attracted much higher participation than previous walkouts staged mostly by public sector workers.

    “The workers were angry but stayed calm – some extremists hijacked our protest,” said Anastasios Simopoulos, an unemployed factory worker.

    Private banks, shops, cafés and supermarkets, which normally stay open for business during strikes, were closed along with government offices, schools, museums, ancient sites, and passenger shipping services.

    “This is the most serious strike in years because private businesses are taking part,” said Nikos Tsios, a newspaper-seller as he slammed down the metal shutters of his kiosk. “My situation is getting desperate, people aren’t even buying cigarettes like they used to,” he added.

    Air traffic controllers at Athens international airport staged a 12-hour walkout, causing more than 150 flight cancellations and delays.

    Riot police blocked access to the parliament building overlooking Constitution Square, the scene of violent protests last June when the previous austerity package was narrowly approved after a threatened rebellion by socialist deputies.

    Mr Papandreou called the government’s 18-month effort to push through fiscal and structural reforms a “war that has to be won.”

    He pledged the government would stand firm against street protests. “Those responsible for this blackmail of bringing the country to a halt – occupying buildings, filling the city with rubbish, shutting down port operations, even the Parthenon – have to explain how this helps us get back on our feet.”

    The latest round of structural measures, seen as an unprecedented undermining of job security, have prompted strong reaction with 30,000 public sector workers due to lose their jobs by December.

    The decision to suspend sectoral wage agreements for the private sector, which has seen more than 250,000 jobs cut in the past two years, has triggered fears of large-scale sackings as companies struggle to survive a fourth straight year of recession.

  93. Yes He Can: Obama Spoke Without Teleprompter
    Prez goes ‘prompter-free’ at bus tour appearance in Virginia

    Now it makes headlines when President Obama doesn’t use his trademark Teleprompter.

  94. We like to think Obama will fail if revolutionary insurrection befalls the country, but what if like everything else, we have underestimated Obama’s Master Plan for the takeover of the country.

    If Obama is able to declare Martial Law, it will be neigh impossible to roll it back immediately with any degree of certainty. There will be much damage and destruction done to the country before people who didn’t see it coming can process what is happening. They will be in a state of paralysis not knowing ‘who’ is behind the power grab or why- Total Chaos!

    Think you can run to the gun store to buy a gun? It could be months before your application is approved by your state and a moratorium put on taking new gun applications by the governor until further notice.

    The longer you wait thinking someone is standing in the wings coming to save us, the lesser your chances are to at least having some form of personal protection for yourself, your loved ones, and all you hold dear-

    Personally, I don’t own a gun, but if Obama decides to send his riff-raff my way, I am not a woosy, rose colored glasses type thinker. I’m an American with the utmost respect for the Constitution and The Bill Of Rights- nobody, not the president or anyone has the authority to take our Divine Rights away from us.

    “Forewarned, forearmed; to be prepared, is half the victory.” Miguel de Cervantes

  95. Mrs. Smith,

    I bought a rifle just after BO’s (s)election. I then took a pistol training course but never applied for a permit. I don’t need one for the rifle. I just need to learn how to shoot it.


  96. BASIL99
    October 19th, 2011 at 6:39 pm


    thinking like a ‘damsel in distress’ waiting for someone to drop everything appearing like a knight in shining armor to help and save us is pure fantasy. And isn’t going to relevant when you see an armed flash mob coming down your street and all you can do is reach for your cell and dial 911-

    You want to be alive and unhurt to get past the first phase of protecting yourself, getting to phase two for help that may not be coming for several hours or days..

    All my sons have purchased rifles.. and a good idea for instant protection. I’ve fired a rifle and am not enthused by the kickback to the shoulder. Within the next few weeks, the contractor doing work here is making himself available helping me get through the application process and he and his wife have invited me to their gun club’s gun range… Self-protection is becoming a poplar woman’s thing especially for the single Moms and women living alone.. I’m all in for this like never before. I gave up my SS protection long ago… and need an equalizer for the off chance the nasties come looking for easy prey. 😆

  97. ROTFL!

    Cain in the middle of rousing speech in NV, and his phone kept going off in his pocket. He shuts it off and yells backstage: “Tell Obama I’M BUSY!!!!”

    LMAO! I have to say, a candidate with an actual sense of humor is refreshing.

  98. 999 confuses me. If I own a coffee shop am i going to be paying 9% on every product(milk,sugar,lids. cups etc) I buy and then charging 9% for final product. what about new businesses which under current law can lose money while getting started. It takes time and a considerable investment to make money. Would his plan destroy the upstart? Even a doctor hanging out a shingle is not going to be making money on a new place. if renting do you pay 9% on the rent. If you buy is it exempt because it is a “used” property.

  99. Also if I have an LLC will I be paying 9% twice? Job killer if that is the case. A drink tax was added in my county to fund the public transportation system and it was a nightmare. State law is bizarre in PA as tax can be included in the price of the drink when purchased at the bar. Ten dollar martini is ten dollars if purchased from the bat but is 10.80 if you order it from a table. 6% bus fee applied to the total so a 10 martini became 11.45. Crazy. With 999 it’ll be 12

  100. Would 999 apply to my water/gas/trash? i want to like Cain(my last name as well) but everything i read about 999 just raises more questions. One place i own does close to 50k a month. My take is usually between 500 and 1500. If i were to just pay 9% on 50k I’d be paying 4500. I’d close and eleven people would be out of work. Savings from payroll taxes would not cover it. Might make sense to a mega corporation but small guy no way.

  101. gonzotx
    halve it 5 dollars become 6 and change. national sales tax sounds great on paper but you have to remember that the limes for a gin and tonic increase by close to ten percent along with the straws and the beverage napkin. So the price goes up and they almost never come back down. I calculate prices every day. I don’t carry Belvedere and Grey Goose in some shops because i know I cannot make money on them. I like the concept of 999 but unless I am missing something i don’t see how it can work.maybe its just me and my business model is outdated but i just see getting smacked with 9% at every turn.

  102. About the Wall St Journal article posted here that claimed to have interviewed OWS people. Here’s a reply, saying that the actual poll questions and answers did not support the author’s conclusions. [More details and links at the site.]

    Azi Paybayrah obtained the internals of the poll from Schoen[the WSJ author], and it contains these radical findings: Only six percent say “income inequality” is what frustrates them most about the political process. Only four percent of protestors want the movement to achieve “radical redistribution of wealth,” while 35 percent want it to emulate the Tea Party by exerting more influence on the Democratic Party. It finds that a huge majority wants tax hikes on the rich, but so do other polls. It finds strong support for more regulation, but Wall Street reform is also supported by majorities. The poll finds that less than a third would be prepared to resort to violence — and over two thirds wouldn’t.

    Putting aside whether this poll should even be seen as representative at all, it portrays a movement that seems to want to work within the system to achieve change that isn’t all that radical after all.

  103. Funny true good feel story
    I bought a bar a year ago that had a full kitchen, but i realized i could never make money paying 6 people. So i opened it as just a bar.
    Got really lucky with the best porter in the world. He would sit at the bar until everyone was gone and walk the female bartenders to their car. never asked for a penny. But then one day 6 months into his employment he asked to buy frozen pretzels. i was like sure go head. cost nothing. He was selling the microwaved pretzels with nacho sauce for three bucks a pop. Because it is a business I had to approach him. He had every cent and had over payed on my Sam’s Club account. makes a nice chunk of change selling a burger and fries for 7 dollars. yummy microwavable stuff that costs him under 5.

  104. Henry – the 9% sales tax applies to retail purchases, not electric bills or rent. That and the personal 9% personal income tax replace ALL other taxes, including the 15.3% FICA. And the 9% corporate tax, to my understanding, replaces the current corp tax of 35%. A business owner would be filing as an individual or as a corporation, not both.

    You may see the sales tax as getting smacked at every turn, but even if you spent your ENTIRE taxable income on nothing but new retail items (which no one does – over half of most people’s income goes to rent, utilities, insurance, etc), it’s still only 9%
    Add in the FICA and all the other hidden taxes, and you are probably paying way more than that now. The 999 plan exempts those at or under the poverty level from any income tax.

    A big selling point to me is that everyone pays. The “underground economy” in the USA is several trillion a year. None of it is taxed. Under 999, all those drug dealers and illegal aliens etc will be paying sales taxes. That’s a huge revenue stream.

    Its not perfect, and probably needs some adjusting, but at least he is talking about the kind of scrapping the tax code and starting over that really is needed, IMO.

  105. Also, on the 9% corporate tax, they can deduct any purchases as the cost of business, IF they are buying from US companies. This is a way to drive manufacturing and products back here instead of overseas.

    There is also a plan to set up Empowerment zones in the most blighted and suffering areas of the US, and offer companies deductions for every person on the payroll employed inside the zone. Again, that creates a profit-motive for creating jobs here not overseas.

    As I said, it has some glitches, but his basic idea is that it is PRODUCTION and expansion of US companies providing jobs HERE that is going to drive a rebounding economy. I do like that his focus is on production and jobs. His focus is to make it PROFITABLE for companies to expand and hire here. Which works a hell of a lot better than just scolding them as “bad” for not doing it.

  106. What the ‘polled’ OWS people really said.

    This is from a journalist who saw the actual questions and answers and disagrees with the WSj about their interpretation.

    [M]any of the protesters consider themselves Democrats, many will vote for Obama in 2012, and, relatively speaking, “income inequality” doesn’t actually rank too high on their list of grievances.

    What frustrates you the most about the political process in the United States? {Open Ended}

    30% Influence of corporate/moneyed/special interests
    3% Our democratic/capitalist system
    3% Stagnant middle class wages
    21% Partisanship
    15% Joblessness
    6% Income inequality
    7% Corruption
    2% Entrenched bureaucracy
    2% Bush tax cuts
    2% Obama abandoned left
    2% Military spending
    2% Federal Reserve
    5% Everything

    Also, fascinating:

    What would you like to see the Occupy Wall Street movement achieve? {Open Ended}

    35% Influence the Democratic Party the way the Tea Party has influenced the GOP
    4% Radical redistribution of wealth
    5% Overhaul of tax system: replace income tax with flat tax
    7% Direct Democracy
    9% Engage & mobilize Progressives
    9% Promote a national conversation
    11% Break the two-party duopoly
    4% Dissolution of our representative democracy/capitalist system
    4% Single payer health care
    4% Pull out of Afghanistan immediately
    8% Not sure

    More details at the site.

  107. Thank You
    I look up 999 and just get more confused,
    Hard to weed through all the stuff out there.
    i like Cain and my last name is also Cain. I am of the dark haired light eyed known as black irish. My people were poor poor poor. I went to school every day in clean clothes even if it meant walking on jeans in a bathtub and then ironing the clothes dry. i am 44 and I remember getting off the bus and walking out of my way so the other kids didn’t see where I lived. Used a bucket when it got so cold everything froze. Knew an out house. So cry babies at OWS really piss me off,

  108. South Carolina, Obama’s BASE? Cheap Trick!

    APNewsBreak: Suit may stop SC presidential primary

    18 Oct 2011 | JIM DAVENPORT

    COLUMBIA, S.C. (AP) — South Carolina lacks the authority to conduct a 2012 presidential primary, according to a lawsuit filed by four counties at the state Supreme Court.

    The counties, in a case filed Monday, argue a 2008 primary law doesn’t apply to running a 2012 primary. They argue the state Election Commission lacks the authority to conduct the primary and enter a contract with the state Republican Party to pay for it. And they say the commission can’t require counties to cover expenses for the GOP primary.

    The counties said they “are on the precipice of having to expend precious public funds to conduct what is wholly a private function on behalf of a private political party.”

    The lawsuit names the state Election Commission and the state Republican and Democratic parties.

    State GOP Executive Director Matt Moore said the primary is part of the state’s law. “It’s clearly written in this year’s budget law that the state should be involved with the 2012 primary so any claim otherwise is wrong,” Moore said. He said the primary is an important public function, not a private operation.

    The litigation was filed hours after a meeting between county voting officials and the state Election Commission and caps weeks of arguments about counties getting stuck with the tab for putting on the primary.

    The Supreme Court has not decided to hear the case. If it did, and ruled in the counties’ favor, legislators could be forced to come into session to pass a special primary law as deadlines loom for the Jan. 21 contest. The state has to have names to put on the ballot by Nov. 1 and it has to have overseas absentee ballots in the mail by Dec. 7.

    The startling counter-cyclical growth of this industry had been unleashed by a modest bit of economic stimulus: a cash grant program that helps project developers compensate for the crippling credit crunch. In contrast to the familiar tax credits — which tend to go to large, mature companies that have enough profit to benefit from them — cash grants help small, innovative, growing businesses that are plowing revenue into growth. In fact, a recent study found that they work twice as well as tax credits. In 2009, this cash grant program pulled in $4.50 of private capital for every public dollar it invested.
    Keep in mind, this isn’t about the much-debated loan guarantee program (Sec. 1705). This is about cash grants to developers that have committed to building projects: According to the industry, Sec. 1603 has enabled the development of 19,000 solar projects in 47 states and the deployment of $4.4 billion in investment.

  110. I was also a very sick child. had something akin to tetrology of fallot. had three holes in my heart leaking ventricles, four time the normal size and a slew of other things wrong. Learned to speak through a trach. i lived and believe no one owes me dick. One side of my chest is a half an inch higher than the other because they used a new wire on me that broke, i can still recall waking my mother up to let her know the wires were ripping through my skin. never will i forget her screams as she looked at her child with metal projecting out of his skin. Sucks. unfair. i have teflon walls and pig valves. Will never know what it is to not hurt. Big fucking deal. i am what I am. Blessed and cursed. Fucktoids at wall street infuriate me, I get anger but it has to have a point

  111. Henry, you are to be applauded for courage, intellect and out look. I also grew up poor, without a dad, and was always embarrassed to show my friends where I lived. My mom worked several jobs to support me and my sister who overdosed on drugs in 1974 at age 16. I was 12 at the time. Instead of making excuses, I went to school, borrowed 150k to get through college and law school, and at 49 I guess I would be considered a 1% and am very proud of it. I have nothing but contempt for those OWS parasites who want everything handed to them.

  112. I guess I would be considered a 1% and am very proud of it.


    Do you make over $350,000 per year?

  113. jbstonesfan
    I am so so so so lucky
    I kinda think I have more of a responsibility to give another brat a swift kick in the ass because i didn’t have it easy. Not religious per se but i was gifted in some aspects and to not share what I can do leaves my gift dying. With you on OWS- rot in hell pig fuckers is my sentiment(never swore before Hillary4Texas corrupted me– now i cannot stop)

  114. I really really resent turndownobamas statement about making 350k a year.
    I work my ass off and most of my stuff is helping other people make money. I get up and spend hours figuring out how to turn a profit for small businesses. Labor is almost never an issue. i have my own and know it is easier to pay 11 dollars an hour than 7.35. If you bust your ass and sink your capital into a business and it ends up making 350k well then you damned well deserve it. Disagree. Well i suggest you try it.

  115. jbs thinks HE’s in the 1%. $350,000 might qualify him, maybe.

    Remember in 2000 when someone did a poll and 23% of the people thought they were in the top 3%?

  116. On 14 October, President Barack Obama announced he was sending United States special forces troops to Uganda to join the civil war there. In the next few months, US combat troops will be sent to South Sudan, Congo and Central African Republic. They will only “engage” for “self-defence”, says Obama, …

    the main reason the US is invading Africa is … China.

    Africa is China’s success story. Where the Americans bring drones and destabilisation, the Chinese bring roads, bridges and dams. What they want is resources, especially fossil fuels. With Africa’s greatest oil reserves, Libya under Muammar Gaddafi was one of China’s most important sources of fuel. When the civil war broke out and Nato backed the “rebels” with a fabricated story about Gaddafi planning “genocide” in Benghazi, China evacuated its 30,000 workers in Libya. The subsequent UN security council resolution that allowed the west’s “humanitarian intervention” was explained succinctly in a proposal to the French government by the “rebel” National Transitional Council, disclosed last month in the newspaper Liberation, in which France was offered 35 per cent of Libya’s gross national oil production “in exchange” (the term used) for “total and permanent” French support for the NTC. Running up the Stars and Stripes in “liberated” Tripoli last month, US ambassador Gene Cretz blurted out: “We know that oil is the jewel in the crown of Libyan natural resources!”

    The Son of Africa Claims a Continent’s Crown Jewels – By John Pilger

    See above, ohanson / October 19th, 2011 at 2:34 pm / Hillary Clinton: America’s Pacific Century
    Compare Hillary’s words there with Obama’s new invasion

  117. Henry and jbstonesfan,

    I applaud your stories and find you both inspirational.

    I feel the same way about the OWS parasites.

    When I look at the mostly young, healthy fresh-faced 20 and 30 somethings complaining about student loans, no jobs, all the problems EVERYONE in this country undergoes until one finds their niche I am disgusted.

    I and most of the people I knew in my 20’s living in Manhattan had NOTHING – not even subway fare many days so we rode bikes. We lived two to three to an apartment if necessary, worked any job we could find and since I was among the “artistic” types spent all remaining time pursuing dreams of grabbing a rung on the income-producing artist ladder knowing full well there were only a few slots available.

    In other words, we took our shot. A few of made it, most did not, including myself.
    Did I, or my other friends, go into paroxysm of despair because we had failed in our chosen professions?

    No. We got up, dusted ourselves off and looked for alternatives. Some of us started small business, some of us took positions in the “real” job world. Some, like me , went back to school and was just 32 credits shy of a PhD before I realized getting that piece of paper was going to be no more economically meaningful than being an expert on several woodwinds.
    So I went into teaching.

    I made no money for years, moved around the country, had to pay off nearly $30 in student loans and did it all with a smile on my face.

    At least I had a chance – and took it – to live my dream.

    No one financed my foray – it was done on my dime, no trust fund, no daddy to pay the bills. They were some of the best years of my life.,

    The dark crew down at OWS naked no sense. How is it possible for someone to decide at the young age of 25-30 that life is not worth it, they will never get out of debt, they will never own a home, never have the life they want?

    That is just fatalism, defeatism and does not belong among young people.

    I think they are spoiled, obnoxious, feel entitled and simply can’t believe that, as is true yes for 99% of the people of the country, it is up to THEM to create their own opportunity.

    If it means working 16 hours a day – something I did for 2 years to pay off debt – then do it. If it means moving to a cheaper location, then do it. If it means changing or upgrading skill sets, then do it!

    But stop hanging around in Zoo-cootie Park whining and crying about what a bad hand life has dealt you and sobbing about how it wasn’t supposed to be this way and sniffling about everything you don’t have and concentrate on what you do have!

    #1 – You obviously have your health otherwise you would not have been able to tolerate living on the street for the past month. It’s your most precious commodity. I’d advise you to move indoors- let’s say to a job – where you won’t be exposed to the elements and threaten your health.

    Second – you have your youth and your strength, The same thing people from thousands of years through human history have relied on to improve and advance themselves.

    Third – Instead of looking at the glass as half empty try seeing it as half-full. I swear it will do wonders for your outlook.


    There are several videos from Oakland. Scroll down and watch the last one, with the masked guy threatening and cursing the reporter, and saying this is bloody revolution.

    Any sympathy I had for this crap is totally gone at this point. I don’t care if there ARE some people at the protests who are sincere, they have to see what is happening, and they are letting it happen.

  119. Taking out student loans is taking a chance on yourself, not a guarantee that life is going to come up roses.

    Same way getting married is a chance to live a happy life with someone you love and who loves you back.

    Same thing with most of life’s choices.

    Sometimes things work out, sometimes they don’t. No guarantee that every risk will provide a
    return on investment. No guarantee that someone who trains for a decade to be on an olympics team will make it. Those bytching about student loans evidently never explored the possibility that there was likely an equal chance for failure or success. Why are they blaming everyone else? It’s called life. If you don’t like the results the first time around get off your butt and come up with a better plan.

    Fer crying out loud they get on my last nerve.

    For those in need of amusement chacked the MOTUS site. it is funny as hell complete with running commentary on the OWS goofs handscratched bios.c y

  120. Ghaddafi killed–Hillary was the one who had to throw rocks at Obama to get our support for the Libyan rebels wasn’t she? Also great that Ghaddafi is killed just days after her visit..

    Watch Obama try to take credit like with the Bin Laden death…

  121. Professor Jacobsen points out Sheldon Whitehouse’s over-the-top, blistering condemnation of the Teaparty as the next potential lynchers and rioters, full of destructive and vindictive and dangerous passions vs. his mild words about the much more violent and revolutionary OWS.

    No one at the teaparty rallies was advocating the actual, serious overthrow of the US govt and the constitution. There are quite a few at OWS advocating just that. No one went masked at teaparties, but there are lots of masks and hidden identities at OWS. I’ve seen many of them on camera refuse to give their names to reporters. Why hide what you are doing, if it is something you are so sure will find wide public support?

    But the media and Dem politicians paint one as scary, and the other as just some concerned citizens.

  122. Basil, henry and jbstonesfan-

    wonderful inspirational stories first thing in the morning. I believe many of us here have a story to tell of the trials and tribulations of our youth expressing how we navigated the rough patches overcoming adversity.

    It was great to hear that perseverance and self-motivation are still the engines leading to success. It’s really a shame today’s youth having a leg up from where we started are unable to breach the barriers they claim are the hold-backs to their success.

    And my opinion is taking into consideration the jobs market is virtually closed to the over 50’s crowd in today’s jobs market. Perhaps the delinquent protesters, instead of squandering their valuable time, are unaware of the age advantage they possess in the workplace.

  123. Mrs. Smith1
    October 20th, 2011 at 9:38 am


    um Mrs Smith…lol…

    I earn much less a year than what you are suggesting and that is all I’m going to say. 🙂

  124. HillaryforTexas
    October 20th, 2011 at 9:38 am

    “Any sympathy I had for this crap is totally gone at this point. I don’t care if there ARE some people at the protests who are sincere, they have to see what is happening, and they are letting it happen.”

    Sincere? Hell No! The epic failures still do not believe Obama and Union radicals are the machine driving the protests. Some face saving excuses are hilarious as they drone on and on with anything distracting from their most visible attribute virtuous Pride.. unable to admit they were wrong. Hypocritical pathological dumb-asses leading their flock over the cliff without a care in the world.

  125. I will just say that my brother, sister, and I grew up poor. Our parents struggled to pay to send us to a Jewish elementary school and it wasn’t until we were in high school that we were considered middle class.

    I too had a big student loan that I had to pay off on my own, unexpectedly brought up my sister’s two wonderful children, and finally took care of my mom
    during the last years of her life. It almost broke me financially, but it was a blessing to have her with me.

  126. JanH
    October 20th, 2011 at 10:41 am

    Jan, you are too modest- I am unconvinced you are not in the lucky 1%. Worst case scenario, I think of you in the lucky 1/2%. 🙂

  127. My husband was never going to be able to afford college and med school. So he worked his butt off at 3 jobs for college, and made stellar grades as pre-med. Which was good enough for the US Navy to take him as an officer and pay for his med school/residency. In return he gave them a lot of years making not much money as a shipboard Navy doc.

    He didn’t worry about “fair”, he worried about “How can I find a way to do this?” And he spent a lot of time being paid much less than he was worth, doing everything from delivering pizzas, to moving furniture in the heat, to cleaning filthy cages and mopping floors at the vet hospital, as a stepping stone to maybe one day being paid what he was worth. His Navy years were spent making less than half of what a private sector doc makes, and spending months at a time at sea with no breaks and working constantly to PAY BACK the Navy’s investment in his schooling.

    I’m not saying that higher education is not too expensive, or that there is not a real issue with lack of good jobs in this country. That needs addressing. But when I see young people poo-pooing the idea of working several low-paying jobs or going without to get there, because “they shouldn’t have to do that” it makes my blood boil.

    I used to work 7 days a week, often 12 or 16 hours a day when I was a single mom. And we scraped by, and we did without. I didn’t own a television for 7 years, much less have cable and internet. When I went back to college, I had to make a decision. I am smart, and academically gifted, and would have loved nothing better than to go pursue a Masters in english literature or political science or philosophy or some such thing. But I needed to FEED my family. I needed the best income for the shortest time/tuition commitment I could find. So I got a 2 yr nursing degree – not because it was my big life’s dream, but because it was practical and made sense. And it paid the bills for many years.

    I see a lot of “I have an absolute right to pursue any dream I want, regardless of economic realities, AND get paid handsomely just for doing it” in these protestors. Sorry, but that’s not reality. Reality is tough choices and hard work.

  128. President Kennedy 1961 Inaugural Address
    ask not what your country can do for you
    Uploaded by CSPAN on Jan 14, 2009

  129. Well said, H4T and Jan.

    I dunno, when I spent years studying music I was hoping it might one day provide a way to make a decent living (which it eventually did – just not in the way I had imagined) but I enjoyed the heck out of every single course I took.

    I loved learning, I had a passion for the subject, and that in itseld was worth every penny I later paid beck for the two degrees I got in the field.

    These friggin sniveling brats at OWS make me want to PUKE! Honestly, it’s like they think that just because they finished college they are entitled to . . . what? It is outrageous. And the ones who say the government should pay back their student loans, don’t even get me started on that.

    It’s like the people who want the government to pay off their mortgages becausew they bit off more house than they can chew. Screw that.

    Or like someone who bought a $100g car that can’t afford it and wants my tax dollars to pay for his extravagance. No way, Jose. If you couldn’t afford $100,00 in student loans you should have gone to a community college. If you couldn’t afford a $650,000 house you should have bought a fixer upper.

    What you should NOT be doing is blaming everyone else for your errors. I am not your mommy or your daddy and neither is the American taxpayer. Live and learn, stop bytching and crying, make the best use of the hard lessons you have learned and move the f**K on.

    About cars – I just bought my first ever new one and I am no spring chicken. I was forced to do something coz the ten year old Kia died. I now have a car note I would love to not pay. But I will budget and make room for it and pay off every d@mn penny because I decided to buy it instead of a used model because as a single woman living on a hill in the country I wanted a five year warranty. And no, there is no transportation available here except by car.

    Whose fault is that? The government’s for not running subway lines out to the Catskills?

  130. I’m not saying that higher education is not too expensive, or that there is not a real issue with lack of good jobs in this country. That needs addressing. But when I see young people poo-pooing the idea of working several low-paying jobs or going without to get there, because “they shouldn’t have to do that”


    Depends on the alternative. Hillary said her college loan was at 4%. She said the system has changed for the worse since then.

    It doesn’t make sense to admit that college is now overpriced but also criticize the protestors for SAYING it’s overpriced.

  131. No one at the teaparty rallies was advocating the actual, serious overthrow of the US govt and the constitution. There are quite a few at OWS advocating just that.


    Really? I posted some figures from the WSJ interviewer’s poll. Where do you find “serious overthrow of the US govt and the constitition” in that list?

  132. Lovely comment from H4T’s link to Sen Whitehouse:

    “The Democrats are now resorting to drama because their positions have little merit, they are mired in corruption and their policies have failed miserably. They have tried nearly every contrivance of bookkeeping to fool people into believing their economic policies are worth a darn, they have used every type of junk science to rationalize their nutty policies on energy and the environment and they seem to be involved in so much pay-to-play schemes and crony corruption that they have little credibility left.

    Lets hope there is enough of our population that hasn’t had their brains filled with the all that liberal junk from academe over the years so that they are still able to think for themselves in the next election.

    We’ll see, won’t we.”

  133. Here are the largest factors from the WSJ interviews arranged by largest number:

    What frustrates you the most about the political process in the United States? {Open Ended}

    30% Influence of corporate/moneyed/special interests
    21% Partisanship
    15% Joblessness
    7% Corruption
    6% Income inequality

    Other factors are like 4%

    What would you like to see the Occupy Wall Street movement achieve? {Open Ended}

    35% Influence the Democratic Party the way the Tea Party has influenced the GOP
    11% Break the two-party duopoly
    9% Promote a national conversation
    9% Engage & mobilize Progressives

    More details at the site.

  134. Here’s what some people’s logic amounts to:

    “Well, I had to walk through an Iowa snowstorm to get to the caucus and couldn’t get in the door and the Bots shouted me down. But nobody should try to change that system! These PUMAs are just complaining, they want a free ride, they want to be able to cast a vote without going to caucus! They should all have to do what I did!”

  135. Our mission here is to defeat Obama while hoping, by some miracle, Hillary is the next president.

    Prying into people’s income and the past has nothing whatsoever to do with getting rid of Obama while celebrating Hilary.

  136. Basil, Henry, H4T, JB and all others who, like 99%, had to scratch a po ass for years: Bravo!

    These kids are more like the .0001 percent.

  137. If someone is making a million dollars a year, I AM HAPPY FOR THEM!!! Why the hell should it be any of my damned business how much money they should be allowed to make?

  138. “If you bust your ass and sink your capital into a business and it ends up making 350k well then you damned well deserve it. Disagree. Well i suggest you try it.’

    B..B..b..But HENRY!!!!!!!! that makes you a dirty scheming nasty rotten 1 percenter!!!!!!!!! oh the inhumanity!!!!!!!!!! Well, D@mn it, you should quit trying to make a living, employ others, support your brat, sell your business, give it all to OWS and go down to Zoo-cootie park and scream your head off about what a raw deal you’ve had!

    To not do so is downright, well, UnAmerican. Oh, wait, that’s what the OWS group want – an antiAmerica – I’m confused.

    One thing I know for sure is I am not one of the 99 percent nor do I want to be one of the 99 percent and even if the 99 percent considered me one of them I would hightail it out of dodge and go live life on my terms.

    And about HC talking about 4 percent student loans, so what! Back in the 1920’s a new Ford cost $895. Mortgage rates are currently less than 4 percent but a few decades ago they were over 10. Stuff changes. Deal with it.

  139. “We hope he will be captured or killed soon,” CNN quoted Clinton as telling reporters during her first visit to the country, which makes her the highest-ranking U.S. official to travel to Libya since Gadhafi was toppled from power.

    Previously, Clinton and U.S. officials have only stated publicly that they hoped the former Libyan strongman — whose whereabouts are still unknown despite his regime’s collapse — would be “brought to justice.”


    That one of the most powerful people in the world would make her go-to phrase, not the legal, ethical, and just phrase “brought to justice”, but that yet another person should be “killed” without a trial, is dumbfounding.

    Also, why has there been so little in the corporate media about the killing of Alawaki’s son and the other teenagers by a U.S. drone?

  140. Yes turndownobama….I make more than 350k. You can do the math, but as of last week I have withheld over 247k in federal income taxes this year.

  141. Worst job I ever had was about ten years ago when I found myself unemployed had no choice had to work. Went to a day labor place which sent me to a recycling place in Brooklyn. had to wear really thick gloves and pull glass bottles out of garbage. Vile job and i was unable to move the next day from soreness. (repetitive motion) Sucked but i was broke and it got me food and a MetroCard.
    Loved two fer Tuesdays at Dominoes. I’d buy four and eat pizza all week long. Second worst job was a produce packing plant pulling bad oranges off the line. Same people sent me there.

  142. jbs,

    If that’s personal takehome net not gross, then maybe you can accurately claim to be in the 1%. 😉

  143. I don’t get people who begrudge others for making a decent living. I made choices and i live with the consequences. While others were busting their asses studying to become doctors or lawyers I was stuffing every drug known to man in my person. No regrets but there is an opportunity cost. I am responsible for my situation. My tastes run on the cheap side anyhow. 500 dollar jeans seem silly to me and my palate cannot distinguish between decent boxed wine and 2000 bottle.(Yes I have had) Don’t need or want. Quite content in levis, fruit of the loom and a big sippy straw for a box o’wine. i do like to travel though.

  144. Chatter about smoking caused me to pull Love in the Time of Cholera off the bookshelf for the first time in 25 years. Even better read decades later.

  145. And about HC talking about 4 percent student loans, so what!


    In spring 2008 Hillary introduced this as a campaign issue. She thought it was important to improve the student loan situation. She said the current situation was too harsh, and wanted it brought back to the 4% she paid.

    However, in the WSJ interview data, the 188 OWS interviewed (open ended) didn’t mention student loans! So that seems to be a straw man.

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