Obama At War With Hillary Clinton And General McChrystal (The New Shinseki)

Hillary Clinton has responded and thrown a grenade in the secret war. The war between Hillary Clinton, joined now by General McChrystal and others, against Barack Obama continues sub rosa. We wrote about this war and how Obama was “waging a secret war on Hillary Clinton” on January 7, 2010 and featured an interview by Sean Hannity of Andrew Breitbart:

“The fear of Hillary Clinton is growing. Hillary Clinton is increasingly viewed as a threat because she can be the 44th person to take the oath of office (Grover Cleveland had two non-consecutive terms, so Hillary can be the 44th person to take the oath of office and be 44 still). The secret war has begun.[snip]

Sean Hannity began with a tedious recitation of a Washington Post story published that very day. The Washington Post story was a hit piece against Bill and Hillary Clinton. Hannity saw the article as another opportunity to bash and beat the Clintons. Andrew Breitbart was not a fool however. Breitbart saw the hit for what it was.[snip]

BREITBART: That’s the answer, is that they all come from that basic orientation. I think that, quite frankly, Hillary Clinton, if she were in charge, would actually be a hell of a lot tougher than Barack Obama is. And perhaps that’s what this entire article in The Washington Post is about, is that she’s been standing off to the side and allowing for these people to hang themselves with their inept behavior.

Andrew Breitbart is right when he says “THAT’S WHAT THIS ENTIRE ARTICLE IN THE WASHINGTON POST IS ABOUT”. Someone, from Chicago, put a hit job out on Hillary Clinton and the Washington Post willingly published. It’s a secret war we are witnessing, not in Afghanistan or Iraq or Pakistan – but in Washington, D.C. as Obama thugs try to take down the qualified and experienced on Day 1 Hillary Clinton. [snip]

Sean Hannity, blinded by his Hillary hate missed a big story stinking up right under his nose. Andrew Breitbart provided an important story but Hannity is so prejudiced and blinded he can’t smell or see a big story when it bites him.

Sean Hannity ignored a big story in order to parrot an obvious hit piece authored at the White House and published in the Washington Post.

There is a secret war of attacks by Barack Obama against Hillary Clinton but Hannity is too busy hating to see it. The more Obama attacks, the more coy Hillary Clinton becomes. Her laughter can be heard throughout Washington.”

As we wrote then, “the secret war has begun”. Now the counterattack from Hillary Clinton and her allies.

* * * * * *

Think we’re nuts about “the secret war”? Bear with us a bit.

The day begins with a “Shock Poll” as Drudge calls it:

Voters Say Hillary More Qualified To Be President Than Obama, Romney, Gingrich, Palin”

Indeed that is a shock poll and Obama knows it. But as more and more people question Obama’s qualification to be president, and more and more apparatchiks bail on him, and more and more jobs are lost (Barack Hoover Obama), and more and more people realize Obama is clueless and has no plan of action for the economy, alternative energy sources, jobs or the oil spill – the main story today is General McChrystal and the interview.



So what is this interview story? General McChrystal, you know, the guy in charge in Afghanistan gave an interview to Obama lover magazine Rolling Stone. General McChrystal told the truth and now he is in trouble (recall General Shinseki versus George W. Bush).

Here is a summary of what happened (keep eyes open for mentions of Hillary Clinton):

“The top U.S. war commander in Afghanistan is being called to the White House for a meeting with President Obama after issuing an apology Tuesday for an interview in which he took shots at top administration officials and his staff described the president as unprepared for their first one-on-one encounter.

In the article in this week’s issue of Rolling Stone, Gen. Stanley McChrystal also said he felt betrayed and blind-sided by his diplomatic partner, Ambassador Karl Eikenberry.[snip]

The article says that although McChrystal voted for Obama, the two failed to connect from the start. Obama called McChrystal on the carpet last fall for speaking too bluntly about his desire for more troops.

“I found that time painful,” McChrystal said in the article, on newsstands Friday. “I was selling an unsellable position.”

It quoted an adviser to McChrystal dismissing the early meeting with Obama as a “10-minute photo op.”[snip]

The profile, titled “The Runaway General,” emerged from several weeks of interviews and travel with McChrystal’s tight circle of aides this spring.

It includes a list of administration figures said to back McChrystal, including Gates and Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton, and puts Vice President Joe Biden at the top of a list of those who don’t.

The article claims McChrystal has seized control of the war “by never taking his eye off the real enemy: The wimps in the White House.”

General Shinseki was fired by George W. Bush for telling the truth and now General McChrystal is in trouble for telling the truth. But at least the truth is out. General McChrystal dared to give the interview to Rolling Stone magazine because he has protectors and people who know the truth must come out about Obama’s bumbling in Afghanistan. Those protectors in the great bureaucratic war are Secretary of Defense Gates and Secretary of State Clinton.

The less informed, the ones who want to protect Barack Obama’s bumbling and stumbling, will portray this situation as a President Truman versus Douglas MacArthur battle. But Shinseki is the model in this sub rosa war via the bureaucracy. The lances and maces of this bureaucratic war are reports, interviews, and hidden alliances.

Recently a bombshell in this war was dropped. The bombshell was a report called Warlord, Inc. – Extortion and Corruption Along the U.S. Supply Chain in Afghanistan. The report and the findings are “sobering and shocking” according to the cover letter to the report.

In testimony before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee last year, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton stated that “…one of the major sources of funding for the Taliban is the protection money.” This is Hillary’s way of saying that the U.S. government itself is the one funding the Taliban in the war against the United States. Someone has to tell the truth about the Afghanistan war and Hillary Clinton told the truth.

Hillary Clinton told the truth about the bumbling and stumbling Obama and that costs American men and women their lives – but no one paid attention due to the many other disasters authored or perpetuated by Barack Obama. That report contained many horror stories in addition to the point Hillary made. Little attention was paid. Something else had to be done to call attention to the Afghanistan nightmare. General McChrystal stepped up.

The dense Marc Ambinder scratches his head at all this and does not see what is staring him in the face:

“What in the heck was Gen. Stanley McChrystal thinking? I mean, I know what he was thinking: he was tired of being the victim of what he believes is a concerted effort on behalf of Ambassador to Afghanistan Karl Eikenberry and others to undermine everything he was given 18 months to do. He was tired of being perceived in the press as a neoconservative killer, Dick Cheney’s hired assassin, or disloyal to President Obama and his staff. He was angry at being blamed for leaking the draft of his report to the President to Bob Woodward. (He did NOT leak the document). He was miffed that a large number of mid-ranking soldiers and battalion commanders and enlisted guys didn’t support his strategy. [snip]

During the strategy review, Eikenberry didn’t think McChrystal’s surge could work. He told the White House that contractors would have to pick up the slack for years to come. McChrystal insisted that he could execute his COIN strategy with a heavy presence of special operations forces … and be out in 18 months (i.e, troops would begin to be drawn down). The White House ultimately sided with McChrystal.

But there were tensions. Even though McChrystal voted for Obama and told him so during their first meeting, he sensed that a number of senior White House aides didn’t really believe that the former commander of the military’s special missions unit during the Bush-Cheney years was suddenly on their side. National Security Adviser James Jones, who is a bit of cipher to McChrystal’s team, may or may not have been one of these aides. No one in the West Wing bought all that liberal internet chatter about JSOC’s alleged crimes — but no one really didn’t buy it, either.”

Obama dithered for months, because of political concerns, and delayed a decision on Afghanistan. For months, American troops died and Obama dithered. When it was discovered Obama had not ever spoken with General McChrystal (just like Obama never spoke with the head of BP) a firestorm forced Obama to meet with the General. Obama came, as usual, unprepared to meet with the General and did not even know who McChrystal is, nor what his qualifications are to speak and be at least listened to on the Afghanistan issues.

General McChrystal in the Rolling Stone article (Link HERE) has few words of consolation for any of the Obama boobs. Only one person gets the respect SHE deserves:

“Part of the problem is structural: The Defense Department budget exceeds $600 billion a year, while the State Department receives only $50 billion. But part of the problem is personal: In private, Team McChrystal likes to talk shit about many of Obama’s top people on the diplomatic side. One aide calls Jim Jones, a retired four-star general and veteran of the Cold War, a “clown” who remains “stuck in 1985.” Politicians like McCain and Kerry, says another aide, “turn up, have a meeting with Karzai, criticize him at the airport press conference, then get back for the Sunday talk shows. Frankly, it’s not very helpful.” Only Hillary Clinton receives good reviews from McChrystal’s inner circle. “Hillary had Stan’s back during the strategic review,” says an adviser. “She said, ‘If Stan wants it, give him what he needs.’ ”

Hillary Clinton knows you either fight a war with the resources you need or you fail. McChrystal speaking out was required. Without doubt, insubordination from a top military officer is dangerous in a democracy. However, silence, when speaking up and telling the truth is required to change a failed policy, is sometimes necessary. McChrystal could have resigned and then let loose. However such additional chaos at the top, not only from bumbling Obama but then to be compounded by a replacement General, would hurt America’s timetable to reduce forces in Afghanistan.

Afghan President Hamid Karzai supports General McChrystal, probably because Karzai also knows Obama is a boob.

What congress should investigate is whether General McChrystal is accurate in his depictions. Obama’s performance on the BP oil gusher, his lack of meetings, his shady explanations for his boobery all require investigation as well and they echo Obama’s bumbling and stumbling in Afghanistan – which is costing American lives and the lives of many others.

General McChrystal has done the nation a service by exposing the boobery at the top. American Generals in Vietnam kept silent for too long. American Generals (not Shinseki) in Iraq kept silent for too long. When the boobery is at the very top, silence equals death.

The war in Iraq and Afghanistan will continue.

The war between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama will continue. Boobery will be defeated.

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322 thoughts on “Obama At War With Hillary Clinton And General McChrystal (The New Shinseki)

  1. This Washington Post opinion article was posted in the previous article’s comments by Fifth Dimension (btw, Gates will say what he needs to in public but he supports, as we wrote in our article, General McChrystal):

    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/postpartisan/2010/06/dont_blame_mcchrystal_blame_ob.html

    Don’t blame McChrystal, blame Obama

    Gen. Stanley A. McChrystal should not lose his job because of the article about him in Rolling Stone magazine. If anyone deserves blame for the latest airing of the administration’s internal feuds over Afghanistan, it is President Obama.

    For months Obama has tolerated deep divisions between his military and civilian aides over how to implement the counterinsurgency strategy he announced last December. The divide has made it practically impossible to fashion a coherent politico-military plan, led to frequent disputes over tactics and contributed to a sharp deterioration in the administration’s relations with Afghan President Hamid Karzai.

    The virtue of the Rolling Stone article is that Obama may finally have to confront the trouble. But the dismissal of McChrystal would be the wrong outcome. It could spell disaster for the military campaign he is now overseeing in southern Afghanistan, and it would reward those in the administration who have been trying to undermine him, including through media leaks of their own.

    Rolling Stone portrays McChrystal as being sharply at odds with Vice President Biden, State Department Afghanistan envoy Richard Holbrooke and U.S. ambassador Karl Ikenberry. Most of its incendiary quotes come not from the general, but his aides — one of whom resigned Tuesday. McChrystal himself apologized for the article; he was reported to be returning to Washington for a White House meeting on Afghanistan Wednesday.

    McChrystal’s enemies were quick to portray him as out of line and likely to be scolded, if not fired, by Obama. My colleague Jonathan Capehart said McChrystal should be ready to resign. But the tensions McChrystal disclosed were not news to anyone who has been following the Afghanistan mission in recent months; I first wrote about them more than a month ago.

    Nor is McChrystal the only participant in the feuding who has gone public with his argument. A scathing memo by Ikenberry describing Karzai as an unreliable partner was leaked to the press last fall. At a White House press briefing during Karzai’s visit to Washington last month, the ambassador pointedly refused to endorse the Afghan leader he must working with.

    Biden, for his part, gave an interview to Newsweek’s Jonathan Alter in which he said that in July of next year “you are going to see a whole lot of [U.S. troops] moving out.” Yet as Secretary of Defense Robert M. Gates tartly pointed out over the weekend, “that absolutely has not been decided.” Instead, Biden was pushing his personal version of the strategy Obama approved, which calls for the beginning of withdrawals next year, with the size and pace to be determined by conditions at that time.

    The real trouble is that Obama never resolved the dispute within his administration over Afghanistan strategy. With the backing of Gates and the Pentagon’s top generals, McChrystal sought to apply to Afghanistan the counterinsurgency approach that succeeded over the last three years in Iraq, an option requiring the deployment of tens of thousands more troops. Biden opposed sending most of the reinforcements and argued for a “counterterrorism plus” strategy centered on preventing al-Qaeda from establishing another refuge.

    In the end, Obama adopted what is beginning to look like a bad compromise. He approved most of the additional troops that McChrystal sought, but attached the July, 2011 deadline for beginning withdrawals. Since then both sides have been arguing their cases, in private and in public, to the press and to members of Congress.

    McChrystal may be at fault for expressing his frustrations to Rolling Stone. He is not at fault for the lack of coherence in the Afghan campaign or the continued feuding over strategy. That is Obama’s responsibility.

  2. Don’t miss the picture that goes with this article:

    http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2010/06/22/2010-06-22_defaced_image_of_president_obama_placed_next_to_unabomber_on_toolbox_at_bronx_fi.html

    A Bronx firehouse is feeling the heat after officials discovered an image of President Obama was painted on a toolbox – and then defaced with the word “hustler.”

    An iconic picture of the President above the word “BELIEVE” appears to have been stenciled on a large toolbox visible inside Engine 45, Ladder 58 in East Tremont.

    Right across Obama’s face is the word “HUSTLER” in big red letters.

    And underneath the image, someone scrawled “Allah Akbar” – “God is great” in Arabic – in black ink.

  3. http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9GGFHKG0&show_article=1

    A federal judge in New Orleans has blocked a six-month moratorium on new deepwater drilling projects that was imposed in response to the massive Gulf oil spill.

    Several companies that ferry people and supplies and provide other services to offshore drilling rigs had asked U.S. District Judge Martin Feldman in New Orleans to overturn the moratorium.

    President Barack Obama’s administration has halted the approval of any new permits for deepwater drilling and suspended drilling at 33 exploratory wells in the Gulf.

    Feldman says in his ruling that the Interior Department failed to provide adequate reasoning for the moratorium. He says it seems to assume that because one rig failed, all companies and rigs doing deepwater drilling pose an imminent danger.

  4. Bravo admin!

    “For months, American troops died and Obama dithered.”

    It doesn’t get anymore dire than that.

    So let’s fill in the blanks…

    Obama dithered and the economy _________

    Obama dithered and the terrorists __________

    Obama dithered and seniors ____________

    Obama dithered and Israel ___________

    and on and on and on…

  5. Boy, things fall apart. The center cannot hold. Right now, it feels like I’m living in a bag of junk rather than the greatest nation on earth.

  6. One point left out in our article: If Obama fires McChrystal, McChrystal will be free to talk. That is probably the one reason why Obama (the petulant and easily bruised) will not fire McChrystal.

  7. Right, admin- and to the right of the story is a Poll.

    Posing the Question:

    Was this simpley a political statement OR a case of Racosm against the President?

    95% Overwhelmingly said it’s Politics
    5% said it Racism

    The worm has turned!
    ___________________________

    Red Robin, Red Robin,

    A robin redbreast in a cage
    Puts all heaven in a rage

  8. admin
    June 22nd, 2010 at 2:01 pm
    http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9GGFHKG0&show_article=1

    A federal judge in New Orleans has blocked a six-month moratorium on new deepwater drilling projects that was imposed in response to the massive Gulf oil spill.

    Several companies that ferry people and supplies and provide other services to offshore drilling rigs had asked U.S. District Judge Martin Feldman in New Orleans to overturn the moratorium.

    President Barack Obama’s administration has halted the approval of any new permits for deepwater drilling and suspended drilling at 33 exploratory wells in the Gulf.

    Feldman says in his ruling that the Interior Department failed to provide adequate reasoning for the moratorium. He says it seems to assume that because one rig failed, all companies and rigs doing deepwater drilling pose an imminent danger.
    _________________________

    Fantastic! New Orleans catches a break and Soros doesn’t get his oil rigs trundling off to Brazil… Catch this Zinger!

  9. One point left out in our article: If Obama fires McChrystal, McChrystal will be free to talk.

    …and the troops will be in real harm.

  10. Basement Angel, the poem you cite is a great poem. We have an article written about it that we have never published. We’ve seen the poem repeatedly cited by Obama defenders. They need to read the poem again because it can be read best as an attack on Obama.

    There is a Nobel prize book winner Chinua Achebe that is very good (and Obama defenders should read as a warning). Also Robert Bork used the last verse of the poem for his book. Joan Didion and Joni Mitchel put the poem to good use.

  11. It can’t be any fun to live your life with a live hand grenade in hand. He’s incapable of making progress because he has no interest in progress.

    How bizarre that we managed to wind up with two presidents in a row who had no interest in being president. Neither of them smart. Both of ’em corrupt.

    What a weird time in American history.

  12. This kind of tells you the kinda guy McChrystal is:

    [snip}

    The night after his speech in Paris, McChrystal and his staff head to Kitty O’Shea’s, an Irish pub catering to tourists, around the corner from the hotel. His wife, Annie, has joined him for a rare visit: Since the Iraq War began in 2003, she has seen her husband less than 30 days a year. Though it is his and Annie’s 33rd wedding anniversary, McChrystal has invited his inner circle along for dinner and drinks at the “least Gucci” place his staff could find. His wife isn’t surprised. “He once took me to a Jack in the Box when I was dressed in formalwear,” she says with a laugh.

    (More from Rolling Stone
    The Spill, The Scandal and the President
    The Great American Bubble Machine
    Obama’s Sheriff)

    The general’s staff is a handpicked collection of killers, spies, geniuses, patriots, political operators and outright maniacs. There’s a former head of British Special Forces, two Navy Seals, an Afghan Special Forces commando, a lawyer, two fighter pilots and at least two dozen combat veterans and counterinsurgency experts. They jokingly refer to themselves as Team America, taking the name from the South Park-esque sendup of military cluelessness, and they pride themselves on their can-do attitude and their disdain for authority.

    …my kind of general. 😉

  13. And that, Basement Angel, is why we are in trouble. The right got Bush the nomination, sight unseen, even though he was not fit for the job. The “left” got Obama the job, sight unseen, even though he was not fit for the job.

    Our refrain: If you elect a boob, expect boobery.

    If you do the same thing you will get the same result. Boobery.

  14. Feldman says in his ruling that the Interior Department failed to provide adequate reasoning for the moratorium. He says it seems to assume that because one rig failed, all companies and rigs doing deepwater drilling pose an imminent danger.
    ——————————-
    finally, a judge who understands the rule of evidence. Here as everywhere Obama’s motive is strictly political. Perpetual power and the country be damned. Black leader in the democratic party need to wake up and take a stand like McChrystal did. Otherwise they become partners in his destructive schemes and that will be their legacy. The time to act is right after the midterm, since that gives the party time to find another leader, and they cannot be accused of scuttling the mid terms. They need to look to their hold card. 90% approval of his disaterous actions will not sit well with the rest of the country, regardless of how loud the Chicago crew screams racist or uncle Tom.

  15. Admin,

    I was just reading the poem this morning and thinking about our time. That line about the best lacking all conviction and the worst being filled with passionate intensity is one of the most brilliant observations of all time. That’s exactly how it feels. The people who should have known better (DIGBY!!!) decided they couldn’t handle the calamity of taking a stand so they didn’t take a stand. Boy, the people supporting Obama, and Bush before, sure took a stand though. It also makes me think of Niemoller’s confession though I don’t think we’re leading up to such a catastrophic development as he dealt with.

  16. Obama may, in his delusional state, believe he will get a second term. But it is not in the cards. The question at this point is whether the party itself will survive, and that is an open question. There is no magic bullet here–the angle and the acceleration are all in the downward direction and bigger challenges by far lie ahead. The question is will the party cling to a failed leader or will they recognize before it is too late that they need a new quarterback and a new strategy. By the time 2012 rolls around the Halperin Heilman book which will shill for Obama will be superceded by a more objective and searching account of this corrupt and incompetent administration. Speaking of which Bob Woodword has been strangely silent of late, or have I just missed him.

  17. I was just reading the poem this morning and thinking about our time. That line about the best lacking all conviction and the worst being filled with passionate intensity is one of the most brilliant observations of all time. That’s exactly how it feels. The people who should have known better (DIGBY!!!) decided they couldn’t handle the calamity of taking a stand so they didn’t take a stand. Boy, the people supporting Obama, and Bush before, sure took a stand though. It also makes me think of Niemoller’s confession though I don’t think we’re leading up to such a catastrophic development as he dealt with.
    ————————-
    Read on . . .

    “And what rough beast
    Its hour come round at last
    Slouches its way to Bethlehem
    To be borne?”

  18. Admin: brilliant analysis. Afghanistan and the Gulf represent all that is wrong with this administration. Politics is elevated over governance, propaganda supplants problem solving, and special interests take precedence over the general welfare. These forces are fused together in this administration and they add up to failure writ large. And there is a momentum to all this where failure begets more failure and nothing will come of nothing. The first example we saw of this was the pirate incident, where he could not decide and the Navy forced his hand by putting a disguised seal on cnn to call the game on him. That was done on a religious holiday and it was scrubbed thereafter, when I went to get a copy of it. But this kind of incompetence is endemic in the administration and it is why apart from everything else stands out as the mutually prominent alternative as rome itself starts to burn.

  19. Wbboei,

    I dont think he’s running again though I do think he’s angling to prevent Clinton from taking the nomination so that he can hand it off to one of his very good friends. I think he’d like to beat her one more time.

    He likes gimmicky wins. That’s the sociopath in him. He doesn’t want to win fair and square. He wants to win by force. To not run for a second term and then thwart Clinton a second time, would probably be the biggest thrill of his life.

    I think the organizing in Iowa is about creating a situation where a handpicked successor can be dropped into a well-organized campaign at the last minute, and catch Clinton and her people off guard. If I’m right about this (and I think I am), he won’t sign off until the last possible minute that the paperwork needs to be filed.

    I don’t think his gargantuan ego can deal with the abuse that he’s going to be required to endure on the campaign trail. He’s as thin-skinned as Bush and things are worse than they were during Bush’s presidency. It’s going to be like Bush hiding out in Crawford because Cindy Sheehan is standing outside ranch making him look like the biggest wuss in the history of the world. Only Obama’s case, it won’t be one heartbroken mom, but tens of thousands of pissed-off unemployed people. The men won’t be kind.

  20. Rough day for Barry
    ——————–
    Or, on the 143d day he rested, smiled and said that is good. Even messiahs deserve a rest. Wrecking a country is hard work.

  21. basement angel: good analysis. The only part I would question is whether he is thinking in terms of a successor. It is in the paranoid nature of someone like him to not appoint a successor, because all he can think of is himself, or like Hitler Stalin et al he is suspicious of the people around him gaining too much power. But I completely agree that he wants to prevent Hillary from succeeding him, because he knows she would do a super job as president and the comparison would tarnish his legacy. If that is the case, and it can be shown that his motive is ad hominum and personal as opposed to patriotic and institutional, then he will be relegated to the dust bin of history, rather than carved into the face of Mount Rushmore. In tha case, he and W can go fishing together at Toledo Bend in Texas, and play golf together at Royal Kanapali on Maui. We could save money on secret service protection if we could keep them together where they really belong/

  22. Obama defenders want to turn this into a MacArthur moment, and ignore Shinseki. But the problem is Obama:

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0610/38852.html

    Gen. Stanley McChrystal’s MacArthur Moment was more than an embarrassment for the White House – it was a reminder of just how badly Barack Obama’s “good war” in Afghanistan is going.

    The challenge facing Obama in responding to his loose-lipped Afghan commander has an obvious parallel in Harry Truman’s firing of Douglas MacArthur at the height of the Korean War.

    But it may actually be more comparable to a more chronic presidential leadership crisis — Abraham Lincoln’s dilemma during the Civil War, when he was forced to repeatedly reshuffle his general staff in the face of vacillating public opinion, insubordination and, above all else, uncertainty about how best to a bloody war he couldn’t afford to lose.

    Afghanistan is a mess and it’s getting worse. To make matters worse, the president’s been dealing with internal squabbling on this for some time,” says Steve Clemons, a senior fellow at the New America Foundation, a non-partisan Washington think-tank, who has written extensively on Afghanistan.

    “If there’s a bright side to all this, it’s that the president has an opportunity to re-attach himself to a new policy, fire this guy and start with something new,” Clemons added. “It’s a tremendous opportunity to reset. But he can’t do anything until he fires McChrystal.”

    The general has already apologized for comments attributed to him and his leadership team in a caustic Rolling Stone story, in which his aides reportedly portrayed his commander-in-chief as a disengaged dilettante – and blasted Obama’s Afghanistan team as feckless. He’s been summoned back to Washington to face an infuriated Obama and Defense Secretary Robert Gates, who could remove him from command, reprimand or demote him.[snip]

    Yet even if Obama sacks his Afghan commander, McChrystal’s comments have laid bare a nasty internal battle among members an Obama’s joint military-civilian Afghanistan team splintered by personality conflicts and divided by approaches to ending the longest war in American history.

    Underlying everything is a far bigger problem. Obama’s strategy of shifting the military’s focus – and 30,000 troops – from Iraq to Afghanistan hasn’t yet yielded a major breakthrough. And it’s not clear how many troops he will be able to pull out of the country by next July, his self-imposed deadline for commencing a withdrawal.

    The disaster in the Gulf has obscured a steadily increasing drumbeat of bad news and ill omens on Afghanistan. After mixed results in the campaign to re-take Marja, the Pentagon was forced to delay a critical summer offensive in Kandahar, the cradle of the Afghan Taliban insurgency. Earlier this year simmering tensions between the administration and Afghan President Hamid Karzai broke into the open with U.S. officials sharply criticizing Karzai on issues ranging from corruption and nepotism to the fitness of the country’s fighting forces to electoral reform – set against the backdrop of a resurgent Taliban.

    Then came Gen. David Petraeus’s fainting spell as he testified about Afghanistan before the a Senate committee earlier this month, which many on the Hill saw, fairly or not, as a bad omen.

  23. Mrs smith The people may have turned the leftist media have not, was flicking through the tv today and heard joy behar and DL hugley on the view saying that it was because he was a black president.

  24. wbboei,

    I don’t think Obama cares so much about power for himself as money, and then the power that is derived from money. But I do think he would enjoy institutionalizing a system where the nominee is picked in a smoke filled room and the voters are irrelevant. Just look at his history – he’s contemptuous of actual voters. He’s very much an elitist and as such, doesn’t want to stay in office or wield power so much as chose the people who do wield power – and money, the gazillions he will make sitting on boards, will give him that kind of power if he can institutionalize a system that ignores the voters.

    I can’t think of any benefit for him in serving a second term as he perceives benefits. It just delays the point where he’s an extremely wealthy man going to all the best parties with Jack Welch and the like. I think he wants to live in one of those 5th Avenue Versailles like Henry Kravis did and just receive people and gift favored ones with careers and wealth. A second term doesn’t help that.

  25. http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2010/06/22/mcchrystal/

    Here is the Stanley McChrystal I know: A few months ago, he received an email from a soldier fighting in Kandahar Province. The soldier was frustrated–as most of his comrades are–with the very restrictive rules of engagement that the General had laid down to prevent civilian casualties. Rather than ignore the email or have the trooper reprimanded, McChrystal went to Kandahar and walked a patrol with the soldier’s squad. Afterwards, he had a meal with the squad and explained the necessity for the new rules.

    This is an extraordinary man, with the perfect skill set necessary for the mission in Afghanistan: a thorough knowledge of counterinsurgency and deep experience in special operations. But there is another side to McChrystal: he is so focused on his real job that he hasn’t spent sufficient time learning how to play the public relations game. He speaks his mind; in private conversations, I’ve found, he is incapable of fudging the truth. This leads to a certain myopia, an innocence regarding the not-so-brave new world of the media. He spoke his mind during a question and answer session in London last autumn, expressing his skepticism about Vice President Biden’s preference for a smaller force in Afghanistan, with a heavy emphasis on special operations. And now he has been caught by a Rolling Stone reporter, speaking his mind on a number of subjects.

  26. admin
    June 22nd, 2010 at 2:01 pm

    http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9GGFHKG0&show_article=1

    A federal judge in New Orleans has blocked a six-month moratorium on new deepwater drilling projects that was imposed in response to the massive Gulf oil spill.

    ====================

    Ah, the usual Obama shell game. Make a big public gesture — and let your cronies nullify it without publicity.

    Make a big announcement that medical marijuana will not be prosecuted by DOJ — and appoint an anti-mm crusader to head the agency that really makes the decisions.

    Make a speech against TARP-funded CEO bonuses, let Congress pass a law to get the money back — but never sign the law.

    Etc

  27. jtjames
    June 22nd, 2010 at 3:19 pm
    Mrs smith The people may have turned the leftist media have not, was flicking through the tv today and heard joy behar and DL hugley on the view saying that it was because he was a black president.
    ______________________________________________-

    (facepalm)

  28. basement angel
    How bizarre that we managed to wind up with two presidents in a row who had no interest in being president. Neither of them smart. Both of ‘em corrupt.

    ================

    Well, they were probably selected by the same donors. Same puppetmasters, a succession of puppets: Reagan, Bush Jr, Obama.

  29. “And what rough beast, its hour come round at last, / Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?”

    Great poem!

  30. These lines were written before the rise of Obama, but they read like prophesy:

    “The great catastrophes of history typically involve more than just mistakes. Typically, there has been an additional crucial element–some method by which feedback from reality has been prevented so that a dangerous course of action could be blindly continued to its fatal conclusion.”

    In this case, the crucial element is big media who has censored that feedback from reality, and thereby allowed the dangerous incompetence and misbegotten policies of Obama to continue to their fatal and inevitable conclusion.

    The day of reckoning will likely be 2011.

  31. I expect Obama’s drilling moratorium was all a fake, to be quietly overturned by cronies. However the reasoning behind a real moratorium would be sound. We have seen how destructive a malfunction can be. It’s reasonable to stop all such drilling till all rigs can be checked for safety (or hopefully sent out of our waters, since there is no possibility of making any such operation 100% safe.

    Also, we’ve seen that Obama’s regulators were not enforcing the safety regulations on BP, so they are probably not enforcing them on other oil companies either.

    It is like grounding ALL airplane flights on 9/11. Drastic but reasonable.

  32. Joy Behar is as representative to the left as Rush Limblagh is to the right.

    I also believe the MSM is starting to turn on Barry, the straw that broke the donkey’s back was the Gulf Oil Gusher.

  33. inconsiderable wretch

    It is, indeed, one of the great poems of the 20th century. I can read Yeats for hours turning over and over the words and imagery in my head.

    “the broken roof, the burning tower and Agememnon dead”

    Wow. Wow. Wow. The Irish are formidable wordsmiths. Probably why the English, with their love of literature, really wouldn’t leave. 🙂

  34. turndown

    Also, we’ve seen that Obama’s regulators were not enforcing the safety regulations on BP, so they are probably not enforcing them on other oil companies either.

    It is like grounding ALL airplane flights on 9/11. Drastic but reasonable.
    ——
    I agree.

  35. basement angel
    I dont think he’s running again though I do think he’s angling to prevent Clinton from taking the nomination so that he can hand it off to one of his very good friends. I think he’d like to beat her one more time.
    He likes gimmicky wins. That’s the sociopath in him. He doesn’t want to win fair and square. He wants to win by force. To not run for a second term and then thwart Clinton a second time, would probably be the biggest thrill of his life.
    I think the organizing in Iowa is about creating a situation where a handpicked successor can be dropped into a well-organized campaign at the last minute, and catch Clinton and her people off guard.

    =========================

    I see the same pattern but not necessarily so emotionally-motivated. Well, I’m sure one reason he avoids an honest contest is emotional (plus that he can’t think on his feet). But it may be simply where his abilities lie: to, er, tell different lies to different people in private so as to get their support.

    But I don’t think we can write him off as just a sociopath, goverend by emotion. He has to have shown some consistency to have got as far as he has: handed off from Daley to Kennedy etc. He has to some extent be an ‘honest politician’ ie one who stays bought.

  36. basement angel and wbboei: thanks for reminding me of these great poems; also, and above all, thanks for all your great posts!

  37. “…and the troops will be in real harm.”

    ——————

    as par for the course, this potus continues to make rash decisions without thinking anything through.

  38. http://www.potw.org/archive/potw351.html

    Surely some revelation is at hand;
    Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
    The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
    When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
    Troubles my sight: a waste of desert sand;
    A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
    A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
    Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
    Wind shadows of the indignant desert birds.
    The darkness drops again but now I know
    That twenty centuries of stony sleep
    Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
    And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
    Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

  39. The only way I see Barry not running for a second term is if someone offers him a job with a huge salary, a big title and doesn’t require him to actually work.

    Here are a few suggestions:

    Manager of a major basketball team
    CEO of ACORN international
    King of some country
    Pope

  40. I can’t think of any benefit for him in serving a second term as he perceives benefits. It just delays the point where he’s an extremely wealthy man going to all the best parties with Jack Welch and the like. I think he wants to live in one of those 5th Avenue Versailles like Henry Kravis did and just receive people and gift favored ones with careers and wealth. A second term doesn’t help that.

    =============

    If he could have the promenince without the pesky work, I think he’d like to continue to have some very visible official office.

    Tragically, VP would have been much better for him….

  41. Only Clinton singled out for praise in Rolling Stone article on McChrystal

    Tuesday, June 22, 2010

    Only Secretary Clinton is singled out for praise by Gen. Stanley McChrystal’s officials in the Rolling Stone profile on the U.S. commander of NATO-led forces in Afghanistan. In the article, McChrystal’s aides call James L. Jones, the national security advisor, a “clown” who is “stuck in 1985” and refer to Richard Holbrooke, the U.S. envoy to Afghanistan and Pakistan, as a “wounded animal.” McChrystal, seen in the background of the Nov. 19, 2009, photo above, has apologized for the dismissive remarks about senior Obama administration officials.

    The Wall Street Journal’s Washington Wire blog states:

    Only Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who is portrayed as having strongly backed McChrystal’s plan for Afghanistan, is singled out for praise by the anonymous McChrystal aides.

    The Guardian states:

    The article lists administration figures said to back McChrystal, including defence secretary Robert Gates and secretary of state Hillary Clinton.

    McClatchy states:

    Only Secretary of State Hillary Clinton gets good reviews from McChrystal’s staff.

    Seems like McChrystal’s team is like the general American public in giving Clinton the highest rating among senior U.S. leaders.

    Just last Friday, Clinton, in a news conference with the Danish foreign minister, made positive comments about progress in Afghanistan:

    So we think that we’re making progress. We know how hard it is. The Afghan military and police are improving, and we are working hard to provide the trainers and mentoring that they need. We are looking to see more results from some of the governmental reforms that we’re expecting. But it is just not true that we haven’t seen positive accomplishments. If you look at a lot of the indicators on education, on health, on government capacity, on agricultural output, on economic growth, on a revenue base for the country to function, there’s a lot of positive indicators.

    http://hillary.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/06/22/only_clinton_singled_out_for_praise_in_rolling_stone_article_on_mcchrystal

  42. Check out the photo on Drudge…Barry with a fly on his face and the caption:

    Lord of the Flies.

    😆

  43. http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=climate-expertise-lacking-among-global-warming-contrarians
    Anderegg and his colleagues ranked the researchers based on total number of climate-related publications and found that those unconvinced by the evidence made up just 2.5 percent of the top 200 most prolific researchers, in terms of number of scientific publications. In the total sample, the final list of 93 unconvinced researchers published an average of 89 papers in total compared with an average of 408 among those researchers who accept human-induced climate change. Researchers had to publish at least 20 papers to qualify for the convinced or unconvinced lists, disqualifying roughly 80 percent of researchers from the initial list of potential “unconvinced experts” that was culled from the overall sample of 1,372.

    Of course, some climate contrarians allege an active effort to prevent the publication of scientific findings that would undermine the climate change consensus and point to e-mails stolen from the University of East Anglia in England—so-called “Climategate”—that vow to “redefine what peer-reviewed literature is” to keep certain findings from appearing in the 2007 IPCC report on climate change. Those papers nevertheless made it into the final report. “It is a data-free assertion of conspiracy,” argues Schneider, who has edited the journal Climatic Change since the 1970s. “They have no data on their submission to rejection rates, no data on the quality of peer reviews on them versus others.”

  44. Shadowfax,

    The life of an ex-president – that is, if you aren’t Bill Clinton or Jimmy Carter – involves traveling, going to parties, playing golf at all the best courses and making staggering amounts of money just by using your name. That’s what he is looking for. he wants to live on 5th avenue, make millions per year doing nothing (only a president can do that) and do inside deals. Serving a second term doesn’t make him any more money and just puts off the time where he gets to do what he wants. Plus he has to deal with emotionalism from the people who don’t have jobs.

  45. In another poem, Easter 1916, Yeats provides an accurate description of a Barack Obama Thug who still on Hopium:

    Hearts with one purpose alone
    Through summer and winter seem
    Enchanted to a stone
    To trouble the living stream.

    The horse that comes from the road,
    The rider, the birds that range
    From cloud to tumbling cloud,
    Minute by minute they change;

    A shadow of cloud on the stream
    Changes minute by minute;
    A horse-hoof slides on the brim,
    And a horse plashes within it;

    The long-legged moor-hens dive,
    And hens to moor-cocks call;
    Minute by minute they live:
    The stone’s in the midst of it all.

  46. Maybe Barry thinks he has found an ass to kick, then again, maybe he has picked the wrong fellow…

    *******

    White House Questions McChrystal’s Judgment, Maturity

    Gen. Stanley McChrystal may eat only one meal a day, but he better be ready for a big helping of crow tomorrow when he comes to the White House Situation Room.

    “The purpose of calling him here is to see what in the world he was thinking,” White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said at today’s briefing, referring to the Rolling Stone story featuring the general and his aides bashing President Obama, Vice President Biden and others.

    The president was “angry,”
    (Oooo, angry as he was at BP?) after he read the Rolling Stone story, Gibbs said, calling the story “an enormous mistake in judgment.”

    “The magnitude and graveness of this mistake are profound,” Gibbs said.

    Asked about a passage in the story where a McChrystal aide describes the general as having been “pretty disappointed” after his first meeting with President Obama because the president “didn’t seem very engaged,” Gibbs said McChrystal will “have his attention tomorrow.”

    Gibbs just said parents of the more than 90,000 US troops in Afghaniatan need to be confident that the command structure — meaning McChrystal — is “capable and mature enough” for this mission.

    (Barry thinks McChrystal is immature)

    Could McChrystal be fired?

    “All options are on the table,” Gibbs said, though the president believes the general should be given a chance to explain himself. Gibbs declined to say whether the general’s job is safe, saying the public would know more after the meeting.

    ———
    Pass out the tickets, if McChrystal doesn’t take to eating crow, this fraud is gonna get an ear full.

  47. admin
    June 22nd, 2010 at 4:36 pm

    Shadowfax, you know what flies like. 🙂

    —–
    Big ugly moles????

    Turds????

  48. Reposted from previous thread:

    Paula
    June 21st, 2010 at 10:11 pm
    One major reason Hillary won’t run against Obama: She has no chance of winning because he would get at least 90 percent of the African-American vote, and that demographic makes up a third of the Dem primary electorate.
    &&&&&&&&&&

    She had more votes than Obama in the primaries, and that was when Obama was getting nothing but pillows and compliments while Hillary was subjected to the gauntlet.

    The AA’s that you say are so important mathematically, and the liberal elites, well they’ve had their chance to see what Obama is like AFTER the wooing is done, when he’s on the clock. It’s not a pretty sight.

    And gone now is one of the prime reasons for voting him in the first time, to break the glass ceiling for a non-white person.

    The next glass ceiling to break is that whole winning streak of Penile-Americans.

  49. Obama and Blagojevich, who could ask for anything more:

    http://www.nbcchicago.com/blogs/ward-room/Obama-Didnt-Want-it-Known-He-Was-Pushing-for-a-Black-Senator-Witness-96910599.html

    Former Governor Rod Blagojevich believed that Obama wasn’t formally advocating to appoint Valerie Jarrett to his former Senate Seat because Obama didn’t want it to be public knowledge he was pushing for a black nominee, according to tapes played in the Blagojevich trial today.

    Taking the stand for the second day, John Harris, Rod Blagojevich’s former deputy governor, testified that Blagojevich was very interested in what he could receive in exchange for an appointment. Harris, who was arrested the same day as Blagojevich, is testifying under a plea agreement with the government for a reduced sentence.

    As in prior days, the prosecution used the witness to walk the courtroom through tapes that the FBI recorded.

    Today, Harris testified that then-Congressman Rahm Emanuel called him two days before the election and said Obama was interested in having a close friend nomination to the Senate. Emanuel didn’t mention a name. Harris testified it was clear that Emanuel meant Jarrett, the former chairman of the Chicago Transit Authority who is now President Obama’s senior advisor.

    “He wanted to convey to me that (Obama) had a preference,” Harris said.

    Harris reiterated the conversation to Blagojevich during a session recorded by the FBI. Blagojevich wondered openly how he should respond. “It’s got no bargaining power at all,” Blagojevich said, referring to Emil Jones.

    According to the tapes, Harris told Blagojevich that Emanuel asked whether it would be helpful for Obama to call. Harris told Emanuel “yes” and told Blagojevich he might get a call.

  50. BA
    I’m not sure that Barry just wants to be an Ex, yea, he will have the perks forEVAH, but I think he wants to be more in the public eye, he sees himself as the stud with darkness, a job as bball manager would suit him. Maybe he could get on Celebrity Apprentice with the Donald and outlast Blago’s attempt.

    I would like to put him on Survivor with McChrystal and see if he has the ability to outlast, outwit and outpay him.

  51. Obama and Blagojevich…..the ‘Golden’ boys of Chicago.

    Blago is at least likable enough.

  52. Could McChrystal be fired?

    “All options are on the table,” Gibbs said, though the president believes the general should be given a chance to explain himself. Gibbs declined to say whether the general’s job is safe, saying the public would know more after the meeting.
    —————————–
    He blinked.

    This is about damage control. It is all politics. The command structure at the McCrystal level is not in question. It is the command structure above him that raises doubts and threatens the lives of thousands of American troops and Afghans. That is what Obama wants to hide. If you compare this dynamic to the command structure of the third Reich most of Hitlers generals were like Keitel–subservient to Hitler. Even their best general Field Marshall Eric Von Manstein would quiver in the presence of the Bohemian corporal. The one guy who did not cow tow to Hitler was Panzer Leader Heinz Guderian. He would take Hitlers racings and then tell him the truth of the military situation whether he liked it or not. My sense is that McCrystal has some of that in him, since this is not the first time he has gone public. And if Barry cans him, it then as the song says we have only just begun. I apologize for being so wrong about Jones. He is not the man I thought he was.

  53. Google McChrystal/Tillman.

    I personally don’t view McChrystal as a “hero”. Far from it. Obama knew what he was getting. Bottom line- he didn’t care. What goes around comes around?

  54. Former Governor Rod Blagojevich believed that Obama wasn’t formally advocating to appoint Valerie Jarrett to his former Senate Seat because Obama didn’t want it to be public knowledge he was pushing for a black nominee

    What’s the deal with Barry’s affection for Valerie Jarrett?

    Are they having an affair?

  55. I’m hearing that McChrystal has submitted his resignation ahead of Obama meeting, dissing Obama before he can fire him.

    Clever, he now looks like he is in control not Obama.

  56. McChrystal’s actions are clearly indefensible and an affront to American democracy. I have had the sneaking suspicion — for a long time — that the military brass was starting to get a little too ‘uppity.’

    This is not Communist Russia or Nazi Germany. In America, civilians give the orders and the military carries them out. Not vice versa. The generals don’t run the show, the American people do.

    This insubordination is infuriating and frankly disturbing, but it should be stressed that it is a result of Obama’s weakness and ineptitude, Just like his weakness has emboldened Israel’s enemies.

    They do this to him because they know he can’t and won’t do anything about it. You think McChrystal would dare do this to Hillary Clinton? You think he could outflank Bill Clinton? Not likely.

    McChrystal is a tool who has got to go (watch weakling Obama keep him, because he has no choice and no power) and Obama needs to be out the door behind him.

    God help us that these two immature brats are the ones calling the shots in Afghanistan.

  57. Gen. Stanley McChrystal has submitted his resignation, Time magazine’s Joe Klein told CNN, citing an unnamed source. CNN is working to confirm Klein’s information.

    I think in some ways this complicates Obama’s decision now, because this means he has to find a new General to manage the Afghan war. I think it would have been easier to reprimand him and go forward. But it sounds like he could be done.

  58. This is a hell of a dilemma. If Barry cans him it will force a re examination of our Afganistan policy on the eve of the elections. If he keeps him he has to worry when the next shoe will fall. And it will again focus attention on Afganistan on the eve of elections. To anticipate Barry’s moves, you must ignore what is in the best interests of the country and focus exclusively on what is politically expedient for him. If it were simply a McCrytal problem, that would be one thing. But the deep distrust of Obama permeates the upper echelon of the military, and they will be quick to react if Barry pulls the trigger. Just ignore the political assurances that are likely to come out of this meeting. They are just words.

  59. Defiant One, when you have a dickhead like Obama in the Whitehouse, then people like McChrystal is all we got to keep us together and stop him running roughshot over our military, don’t think for one second Obama has not tried to damage our military and will keep on trying to weaken it, it was time for payback.

    Presidents and Dictators can be removed and will be removed and it will take men like McChrystal to do it. Its the last line of defense when all else fails.

  60. Gen. Stanley McChrystal has submitted his resignation, Time magazine’s Joe Klein told CNN, citing an unnamed source. CNN is working to confirm Klein’s information.

    I think in some ways this complicates Obama’s decision now, because this means he has to find a new General to manage the Afghan war. I think it would have been easier to reprimand him and go forward. But it sounds like he could be done.
    ——————————————-
    It complicates Barry’s situation in more ways than one. This is the worst outcome as far as he is concerned.

  61. Thanks AmericanGal. Hooray! 🙂

    Just about everything they are banning started here at Big Pink. “Inappropriate” is another word for reality according to these rules.

    http://newsbusters.org/blogs/p-j-gladnick/2010/06/21/democratic-underground-administrator-posts-absurdly-detailed-rules-mic#ixzz0rcOeKBIn

    Inappropriate attacks against Democrats
    – Insults against prominent Democrats, such as “F— Obama.”
    – Name-calling against prominent Democrats. Calling Barack Obama “Barry” or some other name.
    – Repeating Republican partisan attacks against Democrats.
    – Broadly suggesting that there is no difference between Barack Obama and George W. Bush, or that there is no difference between Democrats and Republicans. (Arguing that specific policies are the same would be permitted.)
    – Suggesting that President Obama has perpetrated a “con job” or “fraud,” or similarly over-the-top assertions of bad faith.
    – Advocating voting against Democrats, or in favor of third-party or GOP candidates.
    – Broad-brush smears against Democrats generally. Broad expressions of contempt toward Democrats generally.

  62. Shit’s hitting the fan……

    McChrystal’s Press Aide Becomes First to Fall on His Own Sword

    By Ed Barnes

    Published June 22, 2010

    | FOXNews.com

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    The media consultant who arranged the interview that got Gen. Stanley McChrystal summoned to the White House has become the first casualty of the general’s candor.

    Duncan Boothby submitted his letter of resignation to the International Security and Assistance Force in Kabul early Tuesday morning. The civilian senior adviser played a critical role in arranging the interview Rolling Stone reporter Michael Hastings conducted with McChrystal, America’s top commander in Afghanistan, and his staff.

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/06/22/boothby-mcchrystal-obama-recall-resignation/

  63. Democratic Underground really has a cheek to keep using the word Democratic. Maybe they should rename themselves to No Dissent Underground.

  64. moononpluto,

    Sorry, that is not McChrystal’s job. His job is to respect the chain of command. Period.

    (And it should be stressed that most of our troops do, god bless them!)

    I am getting a master’s military social work and no one has more respect for troops than I do. But what you are talking about is tantamount to a military coup. Maybe that is suitable for Chile, but I have no intention of letting the Pinochet’s of the world run America.

    America hires and fires Presidents, not generals. If McChrystal felt he could not follow orders, then he should have resigned.

    Criticizing the Presidency is one thing. Undermining the Office of the Presidency (and thus American democracy) is quite another.

    McChrystal has not a leg to stand on. He and Obama are both first-class idiots, and the sooner America is rid of them both, the better.

  65. Inappropriate attacks against Democrats

    Too darn bad, if they acted like Democrats, we wouldn’t be calling them out!

  66. American Gal: Admin…more evidence of a shift in opinion in far left land? The administrator who runs the DU website has put out a new, lengthy set of rules to limit dissent
    —————————-
    Shades of the poem Dover Beach by Matthew Arnold, as the sea of faith on the left ebbs, and ignorant armies clash by night. Hillary is the only answer/

    DOVER BEACH

    The sea is calm to-night.
    The tide is full, the moon lies fair
    Upon the straits; on the French coast the light
    Gleams and is gone; the cliffs of England stand;
    Glimmering and vast, out in the tranquil bay.
    Come to the window, sweet is the night-air!
    Only, from the long line of spray
    Where the sea meets the moon-blanched land,
    Listen! you hear the grating roar
    Of pebbles which the waves draw back, and fling,
    At their return, up the high strand,
    Begin, and cease, and then again begin,
    With tremulous cadence slow, and bring
    The eternal note of sadness in.

    Sophocles long ago
    Heard it on the A gaean, and it brought
    Into his mind the turbid ebb and flow
    Of human misery; we
    Find also in the sound a thought,
    Hearing it by this distant northern sea.

    THE SEA OF FAITH
    WAS ONCE, TOO, AT THE FULL, AND ROUND EARTH’S SHORE
    LAY LIKE THE FOLDS OF A BRIGHT GIRDLE FURLED.
    BUT NOW I ONLY HEAR
    ITS MELANCHOLY, LONG WITHDRAWING ROAR,
    RETREATING, TO THE BEACH
    OF THE NIGHT WIND, DOWN THE VAST EDGES DREAR
    AND NAKED SHINGLES OF THE WORLD

    Ah, love, let us be true
    To one another! for the world, which seems
    To lie before us like a land of dreams,
    So various, so beautiful, so new,
    Hath really neither joy, nor love, nor light,
    Nor certitude, nor peace, nor help for pain;
    And we are here as on a darkling plain
    Swept with confused alarms of struggle and flight,
    Where ignorant armies clash by night.

  67. So you think the military should sit back and take everything thrown at it, bullshit. Not when it is being mismanaged and damaged, no you don’t, sometimes things have to be undermined otherwise its the end of things as you know it.

  68. President Obama expected to make statement on General McChrystal soon. (Sky News UK)

    So I’m guessing he has resigned and there’s not one damn thing Bambi can do about it.

    One last thing, the military is there to stop power grabbers getting power, sometimes they have to refuse to let them get established.

  69. moononpluto
    June 22nd, 2010 at 5:19 pm
    So you think the military should sit back and take everything thrown at it, bullshit. Not when it is being mismanaged and damaged, no you don’t, sometimes things have to be undermined otherwise its the end of things as you know it.
    ______________________________________-

    No, McChrystal should have resigned first. You don’t go making comments like that outside the chain.

  70. “So you think the military should sit back and take everything thrown at it, bullshit.”

    Um…that’s not what I said.

    If military men do not like how the military is run, they can and should resign.

    They cannot undermine the Office of the Presidency, which is bigger than Obama and bigger than McChrystal.

    McChrystal is out of line. Generals do not set the agenda, they carry out the agenda. This is very dangerous stuff you are advocating that has led to military coups the world over.

    The bottom line: in America, the military has no right whatsoever to disrespect the chain of command. Ever.

    Those who find they cannot respect it should resign and run for office. Nobody told them to sit there and take it.

  71. And by the way, many troops who disagree with Bush’s Iraq War conduct have run for office in subsequent years.

    I look forward to McChrystal’s 2012 campaign and primary challenge to Obama (he is an Obama-voting Democrat, incidentally). Nothing would please me more to see these two fools tear each other apart.

  72. In case you had not noticed we had a coup in 2008 and no-one stopped it, Obama was put there for a reason and we are going to find out soon.

    When an office is so demeaned by its occupant it means nothing until its restored..

    Dont misrepresent what i said. I said, The military is the last line of defense, when all else fails and the country is falling into a dangerous situation with an out of control Executive and a congress unwilling to do anything to stop him.

  73. We have civilian rule in this country. McChrystal wasn’t in a position to speak out against the President. If he wanted to do that he needed to resign first. It’s interesting that he didn’t do that because he surely understands the implications.

  74. moononpluto
    June 22nd, 2010 at 5:31 pm
    In case you had not noticed we had a coup in 2008 and no-one stopped it

    Not true. That was a Party primary, NOT a general election, which Obama clearly won outright.

  75. The AA’s that you say are so important mathematically, and the liberal elites, well they’ve had their chance to see what Obama is like AFTER the wooing is done, when he’s on the clock. It’s not a pretty sight.

    ===========================

    Of those who still poll for him, I hope some are just ashamed to admit they made a mistake, and I hope they won’t come out to vote.

    We might compare Deval Patrick, who Axelrod got in as governor of some eastern state on the same hoppey changey hatey whitey platform. Has he come up for re-election yet?

  76. “The military is the last line of defense, when all else fails and the country is falling into a dangerous situation with an out of control Executive and a congress unwilling to do anything to stop him.”

    I wasn’t aware that Obama had suspended all future elections and declared himself President for life.

    There is a way to fix the current situation, and that is by voting the current bums out.

    Maybe it’s just me, but I’m not quite ready yet to see American soldiers storming the White House. Maybe we should wait and see what happens in the next two elections before we start plotting a military takeover? Just a thought.

  77. And when the military takeover happens, I’d prefer just about anybody besides General McChrystal at the bulwarks. The man is a flaming idiot.

  78. Shadowfax

    What’s the deal with Barry’s affection for Valerie Jarrett?

    Are they having an affair?

    =================

    Obama is too cold blooded.

    Hm, is there a correlation between Dem presidents who got things done, and Dem presidents who had affairs? (Truman perhaps a counter-example.)

  79. Sorry, that is not McChrystal’s job. His job is to respect the chain of command. Period.
    ——————————————-
    I can remember a discussion at Annapolis in my second year. The question was what should a subordinate do when he disagrees with the order of a superior officer? And the answer was to advise the senior officer of your concerns, and if he still issues the order, then salute and say aye aye sir. That is the principle which informs all armies throughout the world, but there are times when it leads to catastrophic consequences. If you watch the Billy Mitchell trial where Mitchell advocated the development of air power which threatened the supremacy of the battleship in naval doctrine, and who predicted to the year the attack on Peal Harbor before the fact, and was court marshaled for it, you begin to see some of the moral ambiguities of blind obedience to an order. And of course at Nuremberg that defense that I was following orders did not work despite the eloquent defense proffered by Von Rumstead. Military science must, per force, advocate strict obedience to an order, but sometimes truth and saving the country from disaster requires an officer to speak out in response to an even higher calling. Whether that proves to be the case here or not remains to be seen.

  80. A drop more info… Anyone watching CNN? confloyd??

    Appearing on CNN on Tuesday afternoon, Klein said, “I think he’s probably going to lose his job. A little bit of news: I was just talking to a very reliable source who tells me that McChrystal has submitted his resignation and it’s going to be up to the president…to accept it or not tomorrow.” After the television appearance, Klein clarified that his source says McChrystal has offered to resign, but has not officially submitted his resignation. More details soon.

  81. DefiantOne is correct on all points. Loathe “president” dumbass, but the military doesn’t undermine the the office. McChrystal has now resigned. He can blast away all he wants, but he must be subjected to a court martial for his insubordination. That sort of conduct can not be tolerated.

  82. mj
    June 22nd, 2010 at 5:32 pm
    We have civilian rule in this country. McChrystal wasn’t in a position to speak out against the President. If he wanted to do that he needed to resign first. It’s interesting that he didn’t do that because he surely understands the implications.
    *************************************************************************************

    McChrystal is in the VERY position to speak out. He was obviously insubordinate and will either be harshly reprimanded and ultimately fired or he will resign. As a military spouse, I really do not like him. Hearing that he voted for Obummer just confirms it even more. His specialty might be counter-insurgency but he let his ego get the better of him.

    When it comes down to it, McChrystal knows he doesn’t have enough resources, enough manpower to get the job done. Afghanistan is a huge, mountainous country that is not very developed or friendly to modern infrastructure. The fact that Obeyme doesn’t know what it takes to win this war with the proper resources says it all.

    I think that McChrystal wants out. I would too. Often, I wonder why Americans aren’t asking more questions about Afghanistan. What the hell are we doing? Who are we protecting?

    The whole situation is a mess and, as a military spouse, I’m left feeling unsure and unsteady about why we’re committing troops to a country that doesn’t want to join the modern age. Karzai and his whole corrupt group are a bitter disappointment. Corruption thrives in Afghanistan and our presence there isn’t gonna make it disappear.

  83. moral ambiguities of blind obedience to an order…

    That’s it in a nutshell, do what is ‘right’ or follow an order?

    What about the guys that were chasing after WMB for Bush that realized there were none? Follow orders or tell the truth?

    Anyone see Green Mile? Not sure if it’s truth or fiction…

    — I would never fit in the military, I am not keen on following blind orders and it doesn’t sound like McCrystal is either.

  84. But relieving McChrystal of his command on the eve of a major offensive in Kandahar, which White House and Pentagon officials have said is the most critical of the war, would be a major blow to the war effort, said military experts. The president has set a July 2011 deadline to begin withdrawing troops from Afghanistan, creating massive pressure on the military and McChrystal to make progress in stabilizing Afghanistan this summer and fall when troop levels are at their peak.

  85. mj
    So if he thinks something is fundamentally wrong he should keep his mouth shut?
    Wait til he gets out when no one will listen?
    I just hope that a few members of the elected democratic party have the integrity to follow in his footsteps.
    F o and pelousy
    Give me someone with some integrity.
    Would you apply the same standards to Hitler’s army?

  86. hmmm…let’s see…

    McChrystal resigns…or is fired…

    shortly thereafter, McC gets six figure book contract to write tell all…

    …hmmm…funny with all that time on his hands how his memory will be stimulated…

  87. Maybe Hillary will ask McChrystal to be apart of her administration. She likes smart people that don’t kiss buns and tell the truth… unlike the anointed, BarryCakes Fraudulent Boy King.

  88. silly, but I guess the ‘fly on the wall’ phrase will be modified for O as
    “the fly on his nose” ‘the fly on his hand’…those darn flies really like O…they really like him…

  89. The officer corp who fought world war II had a saying that survival in combat requires knowing when to throw out the book because the guy who wrote it was never in this situation. Does that equate to refusal to follow an order. Sometimes it did, and in those cases, the military officer who went out on the limb felt the need to act appropriately now and justify his conduct at a later time. That individualist steak which you sometimes see in great military officers may be present in this instance. The nation needs to know what is going on in Afghanistan so it does not squander lives in pursuit of bad policies or worse yet the career of a president who cares more about politics than winning the war. It is a much closer question than most people realize, and even if his actions were adjudged wrong in the sense of military doctrine, they may be responsive to a higher calling. In Obama we are dealing with a man who is president in name only. If we had had this kind of candor during the Viet Nam War things may have turned out differently, and fewer crosses would have been planted.

  90. Maybe Hillary will ask McChrystal to be apart of her administration. She likes smart people that don’t kiss buns and tell the truth…
    ———————-
    Right on.

  91. Hillary will publicly stay away from this issue for the time being….
    ————————-
    Correct.

  92. I just hope Barry asks Hillary for advice on how to deal with McCrystal.

    My guess is McCrystal will apologize again and Barry will play the big boss, and McCrystal will go back to finish the major offensive in Kandahar, and it will be egg shell walking from that point on for both of them.

  93. I still don’t get why McChrystal aired this stuff to Rolling Stone, instead of resigning first. If this was a matter of speaking out to cause or prevent some sort of action, he would have done so when decisions were being made. This is different. Maybe he’s exhausted. I’m just not sure why he would think he could say this stuff without losing his position.

  94. I am sure McChyrstal did not take his decision lightly.
    Perhaps it is as simple as he loves the country for which he put his own life in jeopardy over a span of decades as well as those he commanded
    And said I will not let this happen.
    I only know that on Friday I will buy every copy of Rolling Stone I get my hands on.

  95. mj

    From what I have heard he’s resigned and Obama has accepted.
    ——
    Do you have a link for that?
    Everything I read says he has his letter and will present it to Barry, and Barry can make a decision.

  96. “And said I will not let this happen”

    Not let what happen? What is it he’s not letting happen?

  97. “The president has set a July 2011 deadline to begin withdrawing troops from Afghanistan, creating massive pressure on the military and McChrystal to make progress in stabilizing Afghanistan this summer and fall when troop levels are at their peak.”

    And this is precisely why these two boobs must go, quickly.

    This is incompetence of the highest order. I don’t think for one minute McChrystal didn’t know exactly what he was doing. That he would deliberately cause this crisis at such a critical juncture…I’m not going to use the word ‘treason’ but he is putting his troops in harm’s way. Completely selfish.

    But once again, let’s stress that Obama is the original boob enabling McChrystal’s boobery. His half-baked Afghan war plan is ultimately at fault not to mention the fact that he is so weak and half-assed about everything that no one in the military respects his command.

    This is exactly what we were talking about when we argued against electing Obummer in the first place. You get yourself into a cycle of boobery from which there is no easy escape. This is a damned if you do, darned if you don’t situation if there ever was one.

    P.S. Whoever compared American soldiers and what they are trying to accomplish to ‘Hitler’s army’ should be banned.

  98. The bottom line: in America, the military has no right whatsoever to disrespect the chain of command. Ever.

    Those who find they cannot respect it should resign and run for office.

    ================

    O felix snafu?

    Didn’t they say most of the controversial comments came from an aide, not from the General himself? Maybe Rolling Stone somehow entrapped someone, ‘off the record’ that wasn’t, open mike?

    Anyway, it got lots of publicity, and the General will get lots of invitations to tell his side. Maybe it will give him a boost to run for office himself.

  99. I guess I don’t see blah blah blah as a legitimate president and as such do not believe those supposedly beneath him should be following his orders.
    Under this man the American middle class will be decimated.

  100. DefiantOne
    June 22nd, 2010 at 5:25 pm
    “So you think the military should sit back and take everything thrown at it, bullshit.”

    Um…that’s not what I said.

    If military men do not like how the military is run, they can and should resign.

    They cannot undermine the Office of the Presidency, which is bigger than Obama and bigger than McChrystal.

    McChrystal is out of line. Generals do not set the agenda, they carry out the agenda. This is very dangerous stuff you are advocating that has led to military coups the world over.

    The bottom line: in America, the military has no right whatsoever to disrespect the chain of command. Ever.

    Those who find they cannot respect it should resign and run for office. Nobody told them to sit there and take it.
    ************************************************************************************

    Where have you been? I’ve been around the military for over 10 years and there are a lot of people even within the military who do not like how it is run… that is why many are actively trying to change it within and resist the current PC culture and get the military back to where it’s supposed to be: mission readiness.

    Your take is not only incomplete but it’s short-sighted. Unless you’ve got a family member or spouse working within, you have NO idea. It is stupid to get out of the military when you’re close to retirement or have made the military a career. People may not like the way the military is run by both military/civilian leaders, that just makes them more determined to help the military get back to what’s more important: mission readiness and not PC correctness.

    McChystal may have been wrong to speak out of turn but many officers (and enlisted) are speaking out of turn and criticizing this president behind his back. I know, I’ve talked to some of those officers. It’s happening and you should realize it if you truly want to work with the military as a career. That’s how the military works… it’s just not composed of brain-numbed zombies. There are a lot of independent self-starters who LOVE the military and all it stands for and want to make it BETTER not worse. You cannot really say that’s what Obeyme wants for the military.

    I’m sorry, but you may think that the military has “no right” to disrespect the chain of command but it’s happening. The military is a community and when somebody is doing something that damanges mission readiness (and that can be anything from not paying child support, being in so much debt that you become a liability, not being physcially fit, etc.) somebody is going to bring it up to the unit commander. Such discourse often results in changes to military policy.

    The military is an ever-evolving part of the larger American society. There are many already separating (if they’re brave enough to face this economy WITHOUT a job) because they hate this president. However, there are many more members who not only question this president but have questioned McChrystal, TO HIS FACE. It’s happening and will continue to happen until the current problems within the military are addressed, which are many, and long-standing (way before Bush became president).

    I’m sorry, but you can still criticize chain of command and do your job so that mission readiness isn’t compromised. McChrystal was out of line but it doesn’t make what he said any less true. What he said in the article has been bandied about for months. The military has studied/experimented with counterinsurgency for YEARS and it cannot be the only approach to the situation in Afghanistan. That the Obeyme administration and McChrystal made counterinsurgency the focal point of winning Afghanistan was fool-hardy and wrong.

    I don’t know if you realize this, but the Air Force, historically was created through bucking the system (ala Billy Mitchell), and openly criticing Army control of aviation. There is a history of criticizing/confronting/disrespecting authority (ummm, General MacAuthur and the Korean War) to address problems. Sometimes successfully and sometimes not so much. To say it can never happen or shouldn’t really is missing what historically and currently is NOT the case.

  101. Another version…

    A senior Capitol Hill source tells me that General Stanley McChrystal had tendered his resignation to President Barack Obama and that the White House is actively discussing a replacement who could be quickly confirmed by the Senate.

    The source said that among the names being touted as possible successors are General James Mattis, the outgoing head of the US Joint Forces Command and due to retire after being passed over as US Marine Corps commander, and Lieutenant General William Caldwell, commander of Nato’s Training Mission in Afghanistan.

    Of course, offering to resign is not the same as actually resigning and it remains to be seen whether Mr Obama will accept the resignation. Donald Rumsfeld offered to resign as Pentagon chief on more than one occasion but President George W. Bush requested that he continue in post before eventually firing him in November 2006.

  102. asks did anyone else read Vince Flynn’s “Term Limits”? I envision Gen. McC as one of those special ops and commandos that love our country and will do or cause to be done what is necessary to preserve it much like the main character in the book. Not literally, but figuratively. If I am dreaming please do not wake me from my dream; I would like to think that there are heroes out there. now. still. again.

  103. Rod Blagojevich on Obama: “Do they think I would just appoint Valerie Jarrett for nothing?”

    On another tape just played by prosecutors, Rod Blagojevich is heard talking to John Harris over the phone on Nov. 3, 2008 — the day before the election.

    They are discussing how Barack Obama is sending two representatives — union leaders Tom Balanoff and Andy Stern — to visit to talk about Valerie Jarrett.

    “Do they think I would just appoint Valerie Jarrett for nothing?” Blagojevich is heard saying of the Obama camp. “Just to make it happen?”

    Judge Zagel has called a one-hour break for lunch. Court will reconvene at 1:30 p.m.

  104. The McCrystal episode hearkens back to the Court Marshall of Billy Mitchell, and a movie by that name.

    In this 1955 Otto Preminger film, Gary Cooper stars as World War I hero Brigadier General Billy Mitchell. The film recounts Mitchell’s efforts to prove the viability of a strong air force. The hidebound military higher-ups refuse to finance aviation any further, figuring that the strength of the United States lies in its navy. When a friend is killed by flying a faulty plane, Mitchell charges the War and Navy department with incompetence and criminal negligence. When the brass tries to quietly court-martial Mitchell, they are forced into the open by the strength of public opinion, largely in Mitchell’s favor. Subjected to the grilling of prosecutor Alan Guillon (Rod Steiger) during his trial, Mitchell sticks to his guns, even outlining a potential Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor unless the military wises up and strengthens its air power.

    The trial ended Mitchells career but his his warning was vindicated years later. And do note, this man came from the richest family in Wiscosin. He could have stayed home and clipped coupons. Instead he decided to serve his country. That is what they used to call patriotism before the age of Obama.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAnOtWm5OrM

  105. Several thoughts…

    1. Nice to read that Hillary seems to be standing on the correct side of the fence
    with regards to Afghanistan. Kudos to her. I still would like to know her true feelings with regards to Israel.

    2. Comparing Ronald Reagan to George W. and Obama is a mistake. Until a few years ago, I bought into Reagan hate. I voted against him. In retrospect, I would now cast my votes for him. He was NOT a stupid man, and anyone who states otherwise is being blinded by partisanship. During the recent Obamacare drama, I watched a video of Ronald Reagan and his opinions regardings UHC. I found myself nodding my head in agreement with his words. He explained his position cogently, and much better than anyone else had done during the Obamacare debate, and it was recorded better than thirty years ago.

    3. Partisanship is passe. It’s now country over party. Losers need to lose their elections, and that means using one’s vote as retribution when a politician has failed to live up to expectations.

    4. If Obama thinks he is re-electable, then he is in denial.

    5. Sarah Palin has very good political instincts. I believe that she would make a decent president, as would Hillary.

  106. It’s a shame about McChrystal. Honesty is something I admire, and something that needs to take DC by storm.

  107. I have mixed feelings about McChrystal claiming Hillary sided with him. If her position was if you are going with the surge strategy then you have to commit the resources, well, I guess that’s one thing. But if it was simply pro-surge….I don’t support the mass use of unmanned drones in Aghanistan(Biden), or the surge strategy(McChrystal). I really think this war has gone on too long and we are looking more like the soviets over there every day.

  108. I have mixed feelings about McChrystal claiming Hillary sided with him. If her position was if you are going with the surge strategy then you have to commit the resources, well, I guess that’s one thing. But if it was simply pro-surge….I don’t support the mass use of unmanned drones in Aghanistan(Biden), or the surge strategy(McChrystal). I really think this war has gone on too long and we are looking more like the soviets over there every day.
    ————————————–
    Hillary supported his military strategy only. The decision to take on the administration was his alone. Now everyone will be focusing on Afghanistan, which is what is needed. This was a service to the country. What Obama says about this is pretty irrelevant in the overall scheme of things. He is now up to his ass in alligators.

  109. Seems like the people who are doing the fighting and dying should have some say in this too. There is more at stake here than beltway parlor games.

    McChrystal’s Remarks Signal the Frustrations of A General Who Knows He Cannot Win
    By Gen. Paul Vallely (ret.) &

    Afghanistan has been a major debacle based on an errant strategy since early 2002 when General Tommy Franks and the Bush administration decided to convert the war there from an unconventional to a conventional plan. They fell into a trap and erred with a strategy of counter-insurgency warfare, i.e. nation building, before the enemy is defeated.

    Our currently top military leader in Afghanistan, Gen. Stanley McChrystal and his predecessors fell into the trap as well. And now we are in unwinnable situation.

    Gen. McChrystal, as well as the troops, are in a total state of frustration. Rolling Stone magazine is an interesting media venue for McChrystal to vent his frustrations. If I were McChrystal and knew I was going to be fired, I would announce my resignation before being embarrassed by a White House photo-op. And I would state emphatically why I am retiring.

    Added to the mess is incompetent political and diplomatic leadership.

    Nine years. No victory, no clear winnable strategy

  110. You can bet those Rolling Stone magazine’s will be rolling off the shelf…they are going to make some money. LOL!

    I feel so bad for the General…he deserves a medal…the only one in America that will stand up for the TRUTH…Obama doesn’t like “whistle blowers”, because he is a crook.

  111. wbboei
    June 22nd, 2010 at 7:55 pm
    Seems like the people who are doing the fighting and dying should have some say in this too. There is more at stake here than beltway parlor games.

    McChrystal’s Remarks Signal the Frustrations of A General Who Knows He Cannot Win
    By Gen. Paul Vallely (ret.) &

    This is why I said I had mixed feelings. Because I don’t think this is a winnable war. I think Bush ignored this war for too long. I don’t agree with the Biden unmanned drone approach. In fact, I find the mass use of unmanned drones unconscionable and something that makes future endless wars easier for the us to get into. But I never believed in the surge either. If hill’s point was if you are going with the surge, you must commit the resources, then I agree. If it was simply pro-surge, then I strongly disagree.

  112. This is why I said I had mixed feelings. Because I don’t think this is a winnable war.
    ——————————————
    Agreed.

  113. You can bet those Rolling Stone magazine’s will be rolling off the shelf…they are going to make some money. LOL!

    I feel so bad for the General…he deserves a medal…the only one in America that will stand up for the TRUTH…Obama doesn’t like “whistle blowers”, because he is a crook.
    —————————————–
    The complaints by McCrystal echo the way military people in general feel about Obama. They will be examined with surgical precision I am sure after the smoke clears. As for Obama he is the latest iteration of the ruler of the queens navee– a total incompetent who cheats the system to reach the top. Here is what Gilbert and Sullivan had to say about that:

    Sir Joseph.
    Of legal knowledge I acquired such a grip
    That they took me into the partnership.
    And that junior partnership, I ween,
    Was the only ship that I ever had seen.

    Chorus.
    Was the only ship that he ever had seen.

    Sir Joseph.
    But that kind of ship so suited me,
    That now I am the ruler of the Queen’s Navee!

    Chorus.
    But that kind of ship so suited he,
    That now he is the ruler of the Queen’s Navee!

    Sir Joseph.
    I grew so rich that I was sent
    By a pocket borough into Parliament.
    I always voted at my party’s call,
    And I never thought of thinking for myself at all.

    Chorus.
    He never thought of thinking for himself at all.

    Sir Joseph.
    I thought so little, they rewarded me
    By making me the Ruler of the Queen’s Navee!

    Chorus.
    He thought so little, they rewarded he
    By making him the Ruler of the Queen’s Navee!

    Sir Joseph.
    Now landsmen all, whoever you may be,
    If you want to rise to the top of the tree,
    If your soul isn’t fettered to an office stool,
    Be careful to be guided by this golden rule.

    Chorus.
    Be careful to be guided by this golden rule.

    Sir Joseph.
    Stick close to your desks and never go to sea,
    And you all may be rulers of the Queen’s Navee!

    Chorus.
    Stick close to your desks and never go to sea,
    And you all may be rulers of the Queen’s Navee!

  114. ” If I were McChrystal and knew I was going to be fired, I would announce my resignation before being embarrassed by a White House photo-op.”

    I believe the General already submitted his resignation, heard it on Fox and other outlets. Resign before the damn useless photo-op.

  115. Tim,
    I agree with that.

    Wbboei…LOL!

    On the biggest news story in months and I am sitting in a Doctors office for 5 hours. THey even turned off the TV.

    I stand with the generals…McKrystal if he is fired, he loses everything, he risked everything to tell Americans the real story…I admire his testicular fortitude!

  116. Sarah Palin has very good political instincts. I believe that she would make a decent president, as would Hillary.

    They are not remotely comparable and to list Hillary as the “also” is a little hard for me to understand. Perhaps you missed the poll that is part and parcel to the talk about Hillary today from Rasmussen?

    “As for Sarah Palin, ex-governor of Alaska and the 2008 GOP vice presidential nominee, only 26% feel she is qualified to be president, but 61% do not. Thirteen percent (13%) are not sure.”

  117. Sarah Palin has very good political instincts. I believe that she would make a decent president, as would Hillary.

    Yep, I agree. Both love America and Americans and at this point, that is the most important point.

  118. Wbboei-

    “The McCrystal episode hearkens back to the Court Marshall of Billy Mitchell, and a movie by that name.’

    Completely agree…and what a great film!

  119. IMHO, the General knew exactly what he was doing. This man has been in the military for close to 4 decades, he knows the ins and outs of the media and how to use it. This was a direct confrontation with the idiot in the WH by a proxy of the media, and heck the General was smart enough to use a lefty magazine as his weapon of choice.

    This General is good man, a very patriotic man, I will trust and respect his opinions infinitely more than the community organizer in the WH.

  120. tim, I agree

    Just went to look at Oberman to see what he is saying…he was making fun of a southern white redneck…gee I love those elitiest’s!

  121. OT but I just got an alert on my iPod touch from the AP saying that Interior Secretary Salazar says he will issue an order imposing drilling moratorium.

    Didn’t a court just rule the other day that the administration couldn’t do that?

  122. wow, can someone confirm this?

    the General joked and called Biden “Bite-Me”, LOL, I am so loving this General. And I cannot stop laughing. If the General is saying all this on the record, heck, whats he going to unleash if he resigns completely?

  123. TheRealist — Thanks. I heard only the ending part of that segment on TV, and I didn’t know if it was the General or someone else.

  124. is the rolling stone article link no longer working? it keeps giving me a 404 error. Anyone else having this issue?

  125. confloyd
    June 22nd, 2010 at 8:34 pm
    tim, I agree

    Just went to look at Oberman to see what he is saying…he was making fun of a southern white redneck…gee I love those elitiest’s!
    _______________________________________

    More of the non-stop “Obama brand”.

  126. mp
    June 22nd, 2010 at 8:43 pm
    Americangal:

    BO and Salazar will be appealing the lower courts ruling at the circuit level….
    ____________________________________

    And they’ll be appealing the Fifth Circuit’s affirmance after that.

  127. my opinion of what will happen tommorow so the community organizer can save face. The General offers his resignation today (which he has done), Mr. Community Organizer makes a big thing that he hasn’t made up his mind and won’t until he speaks to the General face to face (which he has done). Then tommorow, the thin skinned Mr. Messaih says he will rise above any of this because the mission is more important, refuse the resignation, he will say he reprimanded the General and sending him back to Afghan.

  128. Secretary Clinton addresses State Department for Pride, saying gay rights are human rights

    June 22nd, 2010

    Secretary of State Hillary Clinton addressed members of the State Department at an event celebrating LGBT Pride Month.

    She recognized “with gratitude the contributions made by LGBT members of the State Department family every single day.”

    She mentioned that 10 years ago, she was the first first lady to march in a Pride Parade.

    As a senator she was a sponsor of the Employment Non-Discrimination and hate crimes legislation.

    Addressing the dangers many LGBT people face around the world, Clinton said, “These dangers are not ‘gay’ issues. This is a human rights issue.”

    Clinton said: “So here at the State Department, we will continue to advance a comprehensive human rights agenda that includes the elimination of violence and discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender identity.”

    She added that in countries where Pride parades are new, members of the American Foreign Service are marching. In countries where citizens come out publicly, American officials are expressing their support.

    http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid1705667530?bctid=97867356001

  129. Realist, Thankyou for posting that article in Rolling Stone…I knew I liked this General…his favorite beer is no less than Budlight lime…he’s my kind of man…that’s a great beer…I wonder if he drinks it with salt and lime?

  130. “Unless you’ve got a family member or spouse working within, you have NO idea”

    Well to begin, I am the son of an air force chaplain’s assistant and a disabled veteran who met on a bar on Hunter Army Airfield outside of Savannah. For good measure, I have two uncles who are Vietnam vets, two first cousins who have done multiple tours in Iraq, and my adopted brother finished his service four years ago.

    I am also training to do military social work at the only school in the country who offers a master’s degree in military social work.

    So, by your own standard, I DO have an idea. But your standard is off, because once again, in America civilians control the military, not vice versa. I am at a complete loss as to how someone who claims to have so many military connections does not grasp this rather simple facet of American democracy, the adherence to which by two years of soldiers and civilians has helped keep America from sliding into military fascism (France in the 1800s anyone?)

    The fact that so many military people are resistant to the concept of civilian control of the military indicates to me that something has gone horribly, horribly wrong in 1) the teaching of American civics in our schools and 2) basic military training.

    I maintain again, that military people who have such strong convictions against military policy that they find it impossible not to publicly undermine the chain of command (and thus damage the OFFICE of the Presidency and with it the American Constitution) need to resign.

    McChrystal and those like him may think they are damaging Obama, but really they are damaging the Presidency itself. If McChrystal wanted to work against Obama privately, he should have done so. He should have expressed his opinions PRIVATELY to sympathetic civilian ears – like those of Secretaries Clinton and Gates – and let them lean on the Presidency.

    The way he did what he did is absolutely indefensible and frankly dangerous.

    General Eisenhower turned President Eisenhower was absolutely right to kick General MacArthur out the door when MacArthur (falsely) thought he was bigger than the Office of the Presidency.

    McChrystal is no MacArthur on his best day. All you need to know about his judgment is that he voted for Obama as revealed in the Rolling Stone article.

    Like his boss, he is a profoundly narcissistic and selfish man, and his resignation should be accepted.

  131. “Mike Huckabee Makes A Cocaine Joke About 2012 Rival Sarah Palin”

    Cannot stand this disgusting man, I absolutely cannot stand this pathetic loser who loves to make fun of women, even when he praised Hillary it was because she was Bill’s wife, not as Hillary Clinton, it was such a backhanded compliment to Hillary.

    What a sexist pig!

  132. South Carolina – Nikki Haley indeed has won the nomination (and probably the office). Tim Scott, a black Republican (also endorsed by Palin) has also won big against Strom Thurmond’s son.

    In North Carolina, Elaine Marshall has beaten Cunningham to be the D nominee for Senate.

  133. I doubt Obummer will accept the resignation (another bad decision) because he is weak and incompetent, thus, ironically, proving McChrystal right.

  134. 2. Comparing Ronald Reagan to George W. and Obama is a mistake. Until a few years ago, I bought into Reagan hate. I voted against him. In retrospect, I would now cast my votes for him. He was NOT a stupid man, and anyone who states otherwise is being blinded by partisanship. During the recent Obamacare drama, I watched a video of Ronald Reagan and his opinions regardings UHC. I found myself nodding my head in agreement with his words. He explained his position cogently, and much better than anyone else had done during the Obamacare debate, and it was recorded better than thirty years ago.

    =======================

    Reagan was a professional actor. Or course he could memorize and speak lines well.

  135. Quote from the rolling stone article

    “I’d rather have my ass kicked by a roomful of people than go out to this dinner,” McChrystal says.

    Ouch!!!!! Bo was looking for an ass to kick?

  136. Yup. Confirmed that McChrystal is a foul, childish man who likes to “leak” through advisors and aides and who has little control over his staff.

    As unfit for command as Obama. Got to go.

  137. blowme0bama
    June 22nd, 2010 at 8:53 pm

    mp
    June 22nd, 2010 at 8:43 pm
    Americangal:

    BO and Salazar will be appealing the lower courts ruling at the circuit level….
    ____________________________________

    And they’ll be appealing the Fifth Circuit’s affirmance after that.

    ========================

    Crying “Please don’t throw us in the briar patch” as their cronies go on drilling.

  138. Obama’s Nobel prize winning Energy Secretary praising BP in 2007 (Chu’s deputy at the energy department used to work for BP):

  139. “He was NOT a stupid man, and anyone who states otherwise is being blinded by partisanship.”

    That would be news to Alan Greenspan, who said Reagan was the least intelligent President he ever worked with, and basically called him dumb.

    I can not imagine anyone regretting not supporting Reagan, particularly in his second term when he suffered altzehiemers disease throught out the entire term. Not a surprise really, the press has busily remade Reagan’s imagine. Obama was apparently a big fan so…

  140. admin — Dr. Chu is actually a very smart man, the problem is he is a physicist, he is not an executive, the only thing he has run is his own lab at Livermore, he would make a good long term policy guy, but for practical purposes, he is not good at all in a govt exec position.

  141. Then tommorow, the thin skinned Mr. Messaih says he will rise above any of this because the mission is more important, refuse the resignation, he will say he reprimanded the General and sending him back to Afghan.

    ==================

    You betcha.

  142. defiant one-
    Understand why you would “have to go…”
    don’t think you did read it. and seriously question your comprehension if you did. Specifically says he did not leak his report. The general is quite a man and quite an American hero. To lump him in with Obama is just plain wrong.

  143. Larry Johnson read the piece and thinks it’s a hatchet job on McChrystal.

    noquarterusa.net/blog/2010/06/22/the-end-of-afghanistan/#more-47363

  144. Raygun – “He was NOT a stupid man, and anyone who states otherwise is being blinded by partisanship.”

    Nope – I am calling a spade a spade, just like I do with Obama. Raygun was a B rate movie cowboy, and that’s as good as he got.

  145. adMIN: Looks like the fix with BP was in in 07′, This is just information that leads me to believe BP did not care if they blew a few things up….the government certainly wasn’t going to stop them.

  146. Obama is screwed no matter what he does in this McChrystal matter. If Obama fires him he risks more secrets of boobery revealed, the Kandahar offensive falling apart (if it does not go well many will say it’s because of the firing), a potential that McChrystal becomes either a nominee or a surrogate in 2010/2012 – and his long dithering process to decide what to do in Afghanistan reveals him even further in over his head.

    If there is no firing, Obama is further weakened and looks extra weak, the chain of command will be secured around his neck like an old hound dog, his allies will be disheartened, his opponents will laugh at him.

    We suspect that Obama will fight this bureaucratic war in the only way he can – bureaucratically. That is, demand a letter of resignation (to show he is tough and in charge), pound his chest in public and tell everyone how angry he is and how he beat up McChrystal, pound his chest some more, and at the end of the day – do nothing (but more words).

    Obama must know he has been made to look like a fool and that McChrystal is a stalking horse for those who agree with him. Obama is the cause of all this “things fall apart” narrative that is building. Obama is not qualified to be president.

  147. #
    turndownobama
    June 22nd, 2010 at 9:18 pm

    Then tommorow, the thin skinned Mr. Messaih says he will rise above any of this because the mission is more important, refuse the resignation, he will say he reprimanded the General and sending him back to Afghan.

    ==================

    You betcha.

    ————
    And if he doesn’t, he is a meathead.

  148. admin
    Obama is screwed no matter what he does in this McChrystal matter.
    ———
    Yup, yup and one more, YUP!

  149. TheRealist
    June 22nd, 2010 at 8:24 pm
    Sarah Palin has very good political instincts. I believe that she would make a decent president, as would Hillary.
    They are not remotely comparable and to list Hillary as the “also” is a little hard for me to understand. Perhaps you missed the poll that is part and parcel to the talk about Hillary today from Rasmussen?
    “As for Sarah Palin, ex-governor of Alaska and the 2008 GOP vice presidential nominee, only 26% feel she is qualified to be president, but 61% do not. Thirteen percent (13%) are not sure.”
    -===================-

    Umm, perhaps I’m one of the 26% who see past the character assassination that the lamestream media did to Sarah. Perhaps Alaskans know more about Sarah
    than the rest of the country who were treated to the political rape of a decent person. Perhaps I recognize that what was done to Hillary was done to Sarah AND her family. Perhaps Sarah has the guts, the strength, and the smarts to confront the menace that occupies the White House, and do it in a very visible way. Perhaps you are too emotionally tied to a damaged brand that has pushed the capable Hillary out to allow the neophyte, who had less real life experience than either Hillary or Sarah, to create all this turmoil we are witnessing today. Perhaps I respect both women, but give Sarah the edge because she has NEVER bowed, broke bread… or whatever with the usurper in office. Perhaps you have put your own biases into what I wrote. Perhaps I am just sick of people parroting the lies about Palin. Perhaps I would be happy with either Palin or Clinton. Perhaps me and my knee jerk support for everything Democrat ended in 2008. Perhaps I supported Hillary, but became deeply disillusioned when she asked what we wanted from her just before she announced her support for Obama, but then seemed not to listen to many of us. Perhaps that felt like a betrayal, especially to someone whose vote for Hillary did not count. Perhaps I will continue to wish for the destruction of the corrupt Democratic party, and work to make sure it happens. Perhaps I have come to the conclusion that Democrat does not automatically make right. Perhaps I am a gay, working class white man who is fed up with a Democratic party that claims to be for the little
    guy, but offers “solutions” that bring new meaning to the word “wacky”. Perhaps the Clintons need to exit the Democratic party like so many good Democrats before them. Perhaps I will register independent soon. Perhaps.

  150. Anybody watching Hannity…some interesting stuff on the Blago trial….Whats going on with the oil drilling?

  151. mj
    Admin, do you disagree with Larry Johnson then? Not a hatvhet job on McChrystal?
    ——————————————————————————

    I read the article and for the life of me I cannot figure out “according to the aides” used so many times!!!

    So it could be a hatchet job/setup or rolling stone (just like other journalists) must line up a lawyer to stop a libel suit!!!!!

  152. “don’t think you did read it. and seriously question your comprehension if you did. Specifically says he did not leak his report. The general is quite a man and quite an American hero. To lump him in with Obama is just plain wrong.”

    Frankly, I don’t care what you think. I waited with baited breath for the article to go online, read it, and wrote an article about it.

    The general is QUITE a man, but that was not the portrait of a hero, unless you like your heroes petty, shallow, and undermining the Constitution.

    He should never have been in the position he is in now. Remember, Obama fired General McKiernan who was a perfectly good commander for no reason to replace him with McChrystal, who was an Obama-voting sycophant. First time since Korea that a commander was replaced mid battle, all pointing again to Obama’s boobery.

    McChrystal’s support for Obama in 08 was the first red flag. I don’t believe for one minute he didn’t leak this stuff, just like he “didn’t” leak the report last fall.

    Next year when he “doesn’t” leak again, we’ll go through the same rigamarole.

    McChrystal is a doofus. That’s probably why Obama will keep him because birds of a feather flock together.

  153. Oh, and if McChrystal didn’t leak then this is the second time in a year that he has lost control of his staff, further indication of his incompetence.

    If he leaked, he’s corrupt and needs to go. If he didn’t, he’s incompetent and needs to go.

    I just hope he will take Obama out the door with him. I’m frightened we’ll end up stuck with them both calling the shots in Afghanistan. Scary.

  154. Funny how someone will quote the opinion of an apparent ideologue like Alan Greenspan. For being an intellectual, I would say Greenspan’s intellect failed him.

    Yes, if I could redo the elections in which I voted against Reagan, I would cast my votes for him.

  155. are you meaning to attack the respondents who love Hillary and find her 3 times as qualified as Palin? That is Rasmussen not the Realist, and they clearly think that the two are not comparable.
    I don’t do personal attacks and disdain those who do. You are entitled to your opinion, but this is HILLARY is 44, and that is who I support.
    If you can’t make a case for your opinion without needless ad hominem bs, you can’t make your case imo…

  156. MP/Realist…It’s above my pay grade. That’s why I asked admin. My inclination is McChrystal knows the war is lost, like the article wbboei posted suggested, and he also knew he was being set up as the fall guy when the surge fails, so he set out to get his side of the story out there. See, the administration tried two strategies at the same time. The surge, and Biden’s less boots/more unmanned drones. They were saying yes to the surge, but also yes, we are leaving in July ’11 and will rely more on unmanned drones. My feeling is that left McChrystal in an unenviable spot of trying to implement a policy that didn’t really have the full support of the admin.

    For my part, I support Biden’s approach less, but was not a big fan of the surge because I think Bush ignored Afghanistan for too long and there really was no road back. My guess on Larry is he’s wrong. It’s not a hatchet job.

  157. Mj, these are not mutually exclusive propositions (ours and Larry Johnson’s).

    Our version:

    McChrystal was not happy with many things. He clearly does not respect Obama or the people around him. McChrystal tried to get the situation changed internally but that did not go well. He likely discussed matters with those (Hillary, Gates, Graham) that agreed with him but they told him there was not much more they could do publicly. They probably told him they would try to help and that he should continue to try as well.

    Rolling Stone came along with a request for an interview. McChrystal thought it would be a good idea to get his views out in a long profile. Rolling Stone reporter gets stuck with McChrystal in an airport and he gives good quotes. McChrystal’s aides are just as upset as the General and they unload their views thinking it will help.

    Rolling Stone, knows a good story when they see one. Rolling Stone writes a hatchet job (paints the General and his aides as caricatures). Everybody is happy, except Obama.

    BTW, the immediate apologies and phone calls to his allies inform us that McChrystal knows what he is doing. Like that Billy Mitchell business Wbboei wrote about, McChrystal is doing what he wants to do – get his views out. Other than the drama, does anyone think McChrystal is hurt by this? He has to feign remorse, and no doubt he is nervous before the bureaucratic battle to come when he meets with Obama – but he is helped by this.

    Also, remember that according to the article McChrystal’s aides think Obama was intimidated by the military. That is no doubt true – they can smell weakness a mile away. They know Obama plays to the troops like a Caesar but that the general have the connection and loyalty of the troops.

    This is all normal bureaucratic infighting, by other means. That it has a military uniform attached to it makes it a bit more dramatic, but that is all. Lastly, Billy Mitchell is still remembered – does anyone remember the names of those who opposed him?

  158. Mj

    IMO It’s a “we should get out of Afghanistan asap because we can never win” piece and those “hit” including the general are merely collateral damage. He’s one hell of a character though, isn’t he?

  159. Realist, bless your heart. Ad hominen? Hardly. Your obvious intent was to put down people who see something in Sarah thaf you don’t, so right back at you.

  160. “Also, remember that according to the article McChrystal’s aides think Obama was intimidated by the military. ”

    When I first read that line in the article this morning, the picture in my head was the military brass in the room say “boo!” and Obama jumps up in the air.. I told that to my husband and could not stop laughing. Sorry, it is not very kind but..

  161. jtjames
    June 22nd, 2010 at 3:19 pm

    “Mrs smith The people may have turned the leftist media have not, was flicking through the tv today and heard joy behar and DL hugley on the view saying that it was because he was a black president.”
    ____________________________

    Hmm…. first of all there is no-joy in Joy Behar. There is very little you can learn listening to her ruminations. The sound of her own voice is her biggest fan.
    ___________________________________

    “People constantly having the need to appy a label to everything neatly boxing them up in catagories assigned to their cornrowed cerebral warehouses.”

    haha! Funny! That is not to say the labels assigned are correctly identifying the subject. Most likely nothing but arbitrary sign posts marking their way with ity-bity breadcrumbs that vaporize when their browsers shut down for the night.

    The perfect example are the 33 oil rigs Soros is looking to evacuate from the Gulf to Brazil. Obama went through alot of trouble getting the moratorium on those rigs knowing they couldn’t stay idle for any length of time because time is money… some as much as $750,000 a day. A good Judge came along and spoiled poor Bambi’s plans to deliver those rigs to Soros. Thanks Judge for advocating for the average man and saving hundreds of Gulf jobs.

  162. Oh Goody!!!! A black republican congressman in SC……I hope he win

    Watch out for Race baiter Clyburn!!!!!

  163. Listening to Fox, most feel McChrystal will leave. Then I hear McCain say we can’t leave Afghanistan nor Iraq until they have a stable government, and we know attacks against the US will never happen from there again.

    Personally, I don’t believe that will happen. Too many people over there have lost civilian family members and the terrorists will take over when Obama pulls out.

    That being said, I guess it doesn’t matter if McChrystal is out or not…the people that died over there died for nothing or we stay there until the end of time.

    Damn Bush for starting this war over WMD cloak of lies.

  164. OMG- Obama overules the Judge’s lifting of the moratorium on drilling in the Gulf!

    Interior secretary to issue new drilling ban

    After Judge rules against Obama’s six-month moratorium after Gulf spill-

    WASHINGTON – Interior Secretary Ken Salazar said Tuesday he will issue a new order imposing a moratorium on deepwater drilling after a federal judge struck down the existing one.

    Salazar said in a statement that the new order will contain additional information making clear why the six-month drilling pause was necessary in the wake of the Gulf oil spill. The judge in New Orleans who struck down the moratorium earlier in the day complained there wasn’t enough justification for it.

    Salazar pointed to indications of inadequate industry safety precautions on deepwater wells. “Based on this ever-growing evidence, I will issue a new order in the coming days that eliminates any doubt that a moratorium is needed, appropriate, and within our authorities.”

    The White House, which had hoped the ban would provide time to ensure other wells are operating safely, immediately said it would appeal.

    The judge’s ruling comes in a lawsuit filed by drilling companies to reverse the ban imposed by the Department of Interior, which halted the approval of any new permits for deepwater drilling and suspended drilling at 33 exploratory wells in the Gulf.

    A federal judge in Louisiana granted the drillers’ request for a preliminary restraining order that would prevent the ban from taking effect until a trial is held. He did not set a trial date.

    District Judge Martin Feldman said the Interior Department failed to provide adequate reasoning and that the moratorium seems to assume that because one rig failed, all companies and rigs doing deepwater drilling pose an imminent danger.

    White House press secretary Robert Gibbs countered that “continuing to drill at these depths without knowing what happened does not make any sense and … potentially puts the safety of those on the rigs and the safety of the environment in the Gulf at a danger that the president does not believe we can afford right now.”

    Salazar said in his late Tuesday statement imposing a moratorium “was and is the right decision.”

    “We see clear evidence every day, as oil spills from BP’s well, of the need for a pause on deepwater drilling,” Salazar said. “That evidence mounts as BP continues to be unable to stop its blowout, notwithstanding the huge efforts and help from the federal scientific team and most major oil companies operating in the Gulf of Mexico.”

    Does judge own oil stock?

    Feldman’s financial disclosure report for 2008, the most recent available, shows holdings in at least eight petroleum companies or companies that invest in them, including Transocean Ltd.,

    Read more at link:

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37841204/ns/disaster_in_the_gulf/

    Jindal very, very disappointed and I’m sure angry and upset!

    This isn’t over folks, not by a long shot! Stay tuned-

  165. “Lastly, Billy Mitchell is still remembered – does anyone remember the names of those who opposed him?”

    Billy Mitchell had the good sense to direct his criticisms against Army and Navy leaders, not against President Coolidge. Future Congresses and Presidencies elevated his stature and restore his rank. Is that in McChrystal’s future? Please.

    I don’t think anybody has forgotten Presidents Eisenhower or Lincoln, nor confused them with the generals they fired. And even so, nobody is going to confuse McChrystal with Generals MacArthur, McClellan, Hooker, Scott, Meade, or Burnside.

    Those were great Americans. McChrystal is a child.

  166. WOW! Obama is the freaking Mafia….its just terrible….everything is a secret. This is getting scarier and scarier.

  167. Admin, craig crawford also noted was the only one not on McChrystal’s list. Maybe he was a Hillary primary voter. LOL

  168. Ambrose Burnside? More famous for the term “sideburns” than (thankfully) as the general who lost the battle of Fredericksburg? “…remembered as one of the most one-sided battles of the American Civil War. The Union Army suffered terrible casualties in futile frontal assaults on December 13 against entrenched Confederate defenders on the heights behind the city, bringing an early end to their campaign against the Confederate capital of Richmond.” Really?

  169. Admin:

    Don’t forget the clenched jaw. You know that Gibbs will march to the podium and tell us that POTUS was so “enraged” that his jaw was “clenched”.

  170. General Eisenhower turned President Eisenhower was absolutely right to kick General MacArthur out the door when MacArthur (falsely) thought he was bigger than the Office of the Presidency.
    ————————–
    I believe it was Harry Truman who sacked Mac. It would have been interesting if Eisenhower had done it however because Mac later said about Eisenhower: “He will make a great president. He was the best clerk I ever had.” In no way shape or form is this McCrystal. This is a general who felt the need to speak out for the good of the country and at the expense of his own career. He wants to win the war, and that is more important than Obama’s political itinerary which is running the war now.

  171. “WOW! Obama is the freaking Mafia.”
    ______________________

    You bet he is- Especially when his Boss, pounding his fists on the table, says: “Get me those RIGS!”.. If there ever were a place the Civil War breaks out- it is in this place, an Obama-made tinderbox known as La!

  172. blowme0bama: the 5th circuit is your circuit is it not. What does the politics of the 5th circuit look like today? I remember it when Judge Brown was the big gun, but that has been maybe 30 years ago.

  173. Greta just said that Barry called Jan Brewster to tell her he would give her help with wild fires.

    Did they talk about the law suit against Arizona – Nope.

    Did they talk about the help he would give her for the border – Nope.

  174. shadowfax, That fire has been blazing for several days and they are just now going to help…I heard this 53 days ago in New Orleans. He waited until the oil was onshore to do anything…then did a half ass job!

    I think the General wanted out, there’s too many bosses in this administration. I don’t blame him.

  175. blowme0bama: the 5th circuit is your circuit is it not. What does the politics of the 5th circuit look like today? I remember it when Judge Brown was the big gun, but that has been maybe 30 years ago.
    _________________________________________

    Edith Jones is chief. I’m shooting from the hip here, but I think there may be 1 Clinton appointee. Rest are Raygun, Boosh 1 & 2.

  176. When it comes to basic logic there is a profound difference between correlation and causation. Propagandists like msnbc conflate the two. Yes, the judge owns oil stock and he struck down the moratorium which the Obama Administration imposed. But that does not mean he struck down the moratorium BECAUSE he owned oil stock. Yet that is what msnbc implies by their caption. In this case, the pleading by the Obama administration was defective and they were unable to carry their burden of proof. The problem with msnbc is that they assume that everyone who opposes Obama is either as corrupt, thuggish and racist as they are.
    People of common sense need to boycott them. They have nothing to offer the public but treason and mind rot.

  177. Edith Jones is chief. I’m shooting from the hip here, but I think there may be 1 Clinton appointee. Rest are Raygun, Boosh 1 & 2.
    —————–
    sounds like drill baby drill.

  178. Confloyd
    I think the General wanted out

    I’m beginning to come to that conclusion, he may feel with limited support (troops) he can’t ‘win’ in Afghanistan. If he ends up staying in, I bet he will make a deal with Barry to get more support of some sort, I doubt the General will take humiliation without getting something for his troops.

  179. I actually support a moratorium on drilling. And, the back and forth suits is pretty SOP. I don’t really have a partisan view of this. It’s normal government process.

  180. McKrystal, By all accounts in a man of discipline, sleeps 4 hrs a day and eats one meal day. Has only seen his wife 30 in 9 nine years. He is totally into his job, why would a man who made this far up the chain of command to being a 4star general to suddenly let his guard down and let this story to be written….there’s something here that stinky.

    O’Reilly is saying that Rolling Stone is a leftie magazine, what I read of the article, it seemed like a hit piece on the general as well…this smells like a set up.

  181. mj
    I actually support a moratorium on drilling
    ———-
    I do too, at least until there is real safety on all the rigs so this can’t happen again…and if that’s not possible, they can yank them out.

  182. I saw two films of Obama today…the man looks extremely sick…he would not look directly in the camera…both eyes looked black underneath….the other pic looked like his eyes looked unequal…just saying the man is not well.

  183. just saying the man is not well.

    —-
    Maybe that’s the sign of lies cetching up with him, lost his ego’s mojo.

    Going from anointed to being laughed at, isn’t fun I guess.

  184. How ‘Rolling Stone’ Got Into McChrystal’s Inner Circle

    [snip]
    You’re in Kandahar at the moment. Surely you’ve heard, but your article has unleashed a furor stateside. President Obama will be meeting with General McChrystal on Tuesday. Did you expect this?
    I’m actually shocked by the response. Because usually we end up ignoring Afghanistan, so I’m quite surprised it’s creating such a stir. I knew I had some decent material to work with, but I’m surprised at the level of involvement.

    You think that Afghanistan has fallen off the radar back home?
    I think it has. And I think that McChrystal and his staff feel that, too. That’s part of the frustration that was vented in the story.

    You reported a lot of sentiments that are usually only expressed in private—why were the general and his team so candid?
    Part of it was the circumstances. They were in a different environment. They were in Paris. But you would really have to ask them why they gave me the access that they did.

    Can you explain how the article came about—what was the pitching and reporting process?
    I was Baghdad correspondent for NEWSWEEK for two years, and I left the magazine after covering the elections. I wrote a piece for GQ before Obama took office that raised some serious questions about the direction we were taking in Afghanistan. So it was something I wanted to be writing about. I saw General McChrystal and his new strategy as a way to look at our Afghan policy to see if it’s working or if it’s a totally insane enterprise. I met with editors at Rolling Stone, they seemed into the idea, so I e-mailed McChrystal’s people. I didn’t think I was going to get any access at all. It’s one of those strange journalistic twists. They said yes, come on over to Paris to spend a couple days with us.

    How much time did you spend with McChrystal over the month?
    Another strange journalistic twist. The Icelandic volcano happens, and so my two-day trip turned into this month-long journey following General McChrystal and his staff around from Paris to Berlin to Kabul to Kandahar and then back to Washington, D.C. I wasn’t with him at every moment, obviously, but fairly regularly over that period of time.

    One of the most vivid scenes in the stories comes when you are out with the general, his wife, and his team for a night on the town in Paris. His team is entirely forthright with you, did that surprise you?
    Well, they were getting hammered, I don’t know at that moment if they were being the most forthright. Of course it was surprising. A lot of the reporting that is getting most of the attention happened right away in the first few days in Paris. So I was surprised—because they didn’t know me.

    It was always clear that you were a reporter and you were, in essence, on the record? And more, the entire article was thoroughly fact-checked, yes?
    Yes. It was crystal clear to me, and I was walking around with a tape recorder and a notepad in my hand three-quarters of the time. I didn’t have the Matt Drudge press hat on, but everything short of that it was pretty obvious I was a reporter writing a profile of the general for Rolling Stone. It was always very clear.

    What’s the response from the military been? Do you think your access will be cut in the future?
    The most interesting response has been, in Kandahar, and having more than one person come up to me and saying, “We heard about your story, and we like McChrystal, but the message needs to get out there that these restrictions he’s putting on the soldiers are no good.” So it’s actually been a positive response among the soldiers here.

    more…

    http://www.newsweek.com/2010/06/22/rolling-stone-author-discusses-general-mcchrystal-interview.html

  185. “This is a general who felt the need to speak out for the good of the country and at the expense of his own career.”

    Oh please. It had nothing to do with principle. He used his aides to make a bunch of highly unprofessional, snarky, insubordinate asides, often in degrading, unprofessional, and vulgar language.

    Let’s not start pretending that McChrystal gave a Gettysburg address in opposition to the President’s war policies — and even if he had, he should have resigned before doing so.

  186. Shadowfax
    June 23rd, 2010 at 12:11 am
    catching
    _________________
    catching, cetching; as long as it gets him.

  187. difiant one, I think your wrong on this because this General has always had to get Obama’s attention to get him to do anything. Look what happened with the troop levels, it took Obama 4 months to do anything, apparently last week they shut down the Kandarhar operation and we heard nothing as to why or when it would resume. Obama can’t handle more than one thing at a time it seems…

    It does seem to me that Biden has sold his soul to the devil though. Looks like its Obama/Biden against Gates/Clinton…this is a set up…who gave permission for that reporter to be embedded that long?

  188. They have nothing to offer the public but treason and mind rot.
    _______________________________

    More “Obama brand”

  189. DefiantOne

    Maybe they should just hang the General at high noon to make you feel better.

    I reserve my judgment on why he did it until I get more facts.

  190. Is sounds like Michael Barone wants McChrystal fired, but it’s a bit hard to tell:

    http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/politics/Whether-he-likes-it-or-not_-Obama-must-command-96929789.html

    We didn’t need this. By “we” I mean the large majority of citizens who want America to succeed in Afghanistan. By “this” I mean the Rolling Stone article which quoted Gen. Stanley McChrystal and his aides saying uncomplimentary things about Barack Obama, Joe Biden and other civilian officials.

    It’s true that most of the negative remarks were attributed to staffers rather than to McChrystal himself. And it’s true that none of them amounts to insubordination or refusal to carry out orders, the offense for which Gens. George McClellan and Douglas MacArthur were appropriately fired.

    But a commander has the responsibility of setting the tone of his subordinates. And it is astonishing that a general would give such ready access to a writer from Rolling Stone, especially one who is, as the article makes clear, skeptical about the general’s strategy. [snip]

    Obama’s decision-making on Afghanistan so far could be characterized as splitting the difference. He added troops early on and opted for McChrystal’s counterinsurgency strategy while propitiating his party’s left wing with something in the nature of a deadline for withdrawal.

    While backing McChrystal, he also appointed as our civilian leader in Afghanistan retired Gen. Karl Eikenberry, who disagreed with McChrystal’s strategy. By all accounts, including Rolling Stone’s, they have not had the close cooperative relationship that Gen. David Petraeus and civilian honcho Ryan Crocker had in Iraq in 2007 and 2008.[snip]

    Obama leads a political party which before his election argued that Afghanistan was the good war (and Iraq the bad one) but which is now divided on whether we should persevere there. He faces an opposition party which mostly supports our course in Afghanistan but is worried about our prospects there and fears a premature withdrawal.

    He is not the first president to head a national security establishment that is divided and distrustful, as the Rolling Stone article confirms. And he is surely not the first president to be the subject of disparaging remarks by his military subordinates.

    But unfortunately those remarks have come out into the open in a way that makes it very hard to go on splitting the difference. If Gen. McChrystal has to go, as seems likely as this is written, then it may be time to consider other changes in personnel.

    And it may be time for Obama to embrace a word he has been reluctant to utter: Victory. His duty is to set a course that will produce success, to install the people who can achieve that goal and to give them the backing they need.

    We didn’t need this, and Obama didn’t either. But he wanted the job, and now he must command.

  191. John Dickerson does not want McChrystal fired. Where he gets the silly notion that Bob Gates, who made his career from selective leaks in deep background, doesn’t leak is a mystery:

    http://www.slate.com/id/2257817/

    Last week Gen. David Petraeus collapsed. This week Gen. Stanley McChrystal did. The top commander in Afghanistan and his team were the subject of a profile in Rolling Stone in which they looked petty, frustrated, and reckless. President Obama and his staff now must evaluate whether to relieve McChrystal of his command.

    You’re never supposed to surprise your boss. The story not only surprised Obama, it presented him with a new problem when he’s already facing a few. Yet unlike his most recent problem—the Gulf spill, where he’s limited by what he can do—on this issue, the president has total control. He has two decisions to make. The first is about McChrystal’s future. The second is about the strategy in Afghanistan. Whatever the president decides about McChrystal, he will have to explain it in the context of the strategy in Afghanistan. As a Pentagon official has said, “McChrystal is the Afghanistan strategy.”

    In the article McChrystal himself says Obama was unprepared in their first meeting and makes fun of Vice President Joe Biden as well as Richard Holbrooke, the administration’s special envoy to Pakistan and Afghanistan. He also appears to knock the current Ambassador to Afghanistan Karl Eikenberry. And the quotes from his aides are worse. The general view of his team seems to be that they know best and Washington is clueless; one aide calls White House National Security Adviser James Jones a “clown.”

    Granted, this is the kind of trash talking that goes on every day in private and particularly around men trained to be ferocious and fight wars. These guys were just dumb enough to do it in front of a reporter, and in some cases it appears as though this talk occurred in McChrystal’s presence. He’s responsible for his team, and they wouldn’t speak so freely if they thought the boss believed something else. But the fact that McChrystal himself does not seem to have said anything insubordinate may be the deciding factor in how the president treats him now. Also, a lot of the material is also about personalities and behavior, not the policy in Afghanistan.[snip]

    Obama isn’t the only boss McChrystal has irritated. He’s also ticked off Defense Secretary Robert Gates. Gates, as a general matter, hates this kind of talking out of school. It reflects badly on the mission if the person leading it shows this lack of judgment. Also, McChrystal was Gates’ handpicked general. And internally, it puts the Pentagon on the defensive in the intramural battles with the White House. Reports are that Obama is “furious.” What House aides were already chafing at pressure they were getting from the military to soften the terms of the planned withdrawal of troops from Afghanistan in July.

    A lot of people have been calling lately for Obama to get angry. (If only Tony Hayward’s aides had said stupid things to Rolling Stone.) Congressman David Obey, a fierce war critic, has called for Obama to fire McChrystal. But this is probably a case in which the country needs the calm, unemotional Obama. This particular Rolling Stone story, and the months-long fracas between the White House and Pentagon over Afghanistan strategy, already has too much testosterone. If for no other reason than to bring the humors in alignment, there needs to be a force for restraint.

    There are a lot of reasons for the president to overreact. He has to send a message—to his military, to foreign leaders, and to political opponents—that reaffirms the general principle of civilian control of the military and his control of the Pentagon in particular. There’s also a cheap public relations reason to slap McChrystal extra hard. Given the criticism Obama has received for not showing command in the Gulf, he could presumably use this opportunity to look tough.

    At the same time, it’s important to see this controversy in context, and that argues for restraint. The article is an outgrowth of a skirmish that has been going on since the Afghanistan policy review started last year. Obama made his policy choice in December—essentially, send more troops but with a clear date in July 2011 for withdrawal—but the battle has continued behind the scenes. One recent battle concerned Jonathan Alter’s account of the policy review in his book, which Pentagon officials read as a score-settling by those in the administration who felt the military had tried to roll them. The president has to send the clear message: enough.

    But the main reason the president has to show restraint is that he can’t let the controversy become a proxy for undoing the Afghanistan policy he still supports. He has to rap McChrystal on the knuckles but turn the message back to the mission—the war in Afghanistan is at a very tough point. Violence is increasing, and this year may be one of the deadliest years for American troops. Progress has been slow. Unless Obama has problems with McChrystal’s performance, and there’s no evidence that he does, McChrystal’s remarks are beside the point. McChrystal will have to go back to Afghanistan and carry out Obama’s mission, and he can’t do that from a weakened position. That’s true not just with his own troops, but with leaders in Afghanistan. If the administration posture is really to be more accommodating of President Karzai then getting rid of McChrystal makes no sense. He’s the administration’s best asset with the Afghan president.[snip]

    The most damaging part of the article, from a policy perspective, is its description of the counterinsurgency strategy. This is the central theory behind both the Iraq and Afghanistan conflicts. Petraeus used to be the face of the counterinsurgency doctrine—calm, learned, steady. McChrystal was thought to be in his mold. If this article becomes gospel, there’s a chance that the reckless McChrystal becomes the new face of the strategy. This will make it harder for proponents to argue for the strategy in the future if for no other reason than it distracts from signs of progress.

    The second half of the article suggests that the strategy has been a failure because the troops asked to carry out the theory don’t buy it. This is one of the key challenges and tensions of counterinsurgency warfare, as Marine Gen. James Mattis explained when I talked to him earlier this year. But the tension between assuming more physical risk and using less force in the hopes of winning over the population is not a new tension. It’s a part of the strategy and complexity that Obama signed onto after months of review.

    Still, that doesn’t mean that Obama welcomes the chance to reiterate his strategic rationale. This controversy will kidnap the White House agenda. Today’s message was supposed to be about health care, and in his remarks the president was distracted by a fly. He shooed it away, joking that the last time that had happened he’d dispatched the fly completely. This McChrystal story is a much bigger distraction and will require much more careful handling.

  192. “This is a general who felt the need to speak out for the good of the country and at the expense of his own career.”

    Oh please. It had nothing to do with principle. He used his aides to make a bunch of highly unprofessional, snarky, insubordinate asides, often in degrading, unprofessional, and vulgar language.

    Let’s not start pretending that McChrystal gave a Gettysburg address in opposition to the President’s war policies — and even if he had, he should have resigned before doing so.
    —————————————————
    1. I think McChrystal is a military genius where Obama is not.

    2. I think McCrytal is concerned about winning the war and saving lives whereas Obama is interested in hoops, gala parties and stealing elections.

    3. I think McCrystal is engaged in the problem whereas Obama is not.

    Under these unique circumstance, with a military deadline approaching, he put his career on the line by pointing out the problems in a public forum. There was not other way to get through to Obama and resignation at that point was not an option.

    If he had proceeded in blind deference to an order it could lead to a military disaster like this:

    THE CHARGE OF THE LIGHT BRIGADE

    Alfred, Lord Tennyson

    Half a league, half a league,
    Half a league onward,
    All in the valley of Death
    Rode the six hundred.
    “Forward, the Light Brigade!
    “Charge for the guns!” he said:
    Into the valley of Death
    Rode the six hundred.

    “Forward, the Light Brigade!”
    Was there a man dismay’d?
    NOT THO’ THE SOLDIERS KNEW
    SOMEONE HAD BLUNDERED
    THEIRS NOT TO MAKE REPLY,
    THEIRS NOT TO REASON WHY,
    THEIRS BUT TO DO OR DIE:
    INTO THE VALLEY OF DEATH
    RODE THE SIX HUNDRED (emphasis added)

    Cannon to right of them,
    Cannon to left of them,
    Cannon in front of them
    Volley’d and thunder’d;
    Storm’d at with shot and shell,
    Boldly they rode and well,
    Into the jaws of Death,
    Into the mouth of Hell
    Rode the six hundred.

    Flash’d all their sabres bare,
    Flash’d as they turn’d in air,
    Sabring the gunners there,
    Charging an army, while
    All the world wonder’d:
    Plunged in the battery-smoke
    Right thro’ the line they broke;
    Cossack and Russian
    Reel’d from the sabre stroke
    Shatter’d and sunder’d.
    Then they rode back,
    BUT NOT THE SIX HUNDRED

  193. I am just curious
    do paid bots get paid overtime or hazard pay when the administration begins to sink?
    I post here but follow about 15 other pro hillary sites and I read all of the posts and it seems to me I find the same things being said here and elsewhere under different names and in all cases they are stoking a fire.
    I am probably wrong but sometimes I read people looking for an argument and then I go elsewhere and I see the same argument being made under a different user name. Funny thing language has its own sort of dna.
    Specific.
    The next time I encounter a bot regurgitating marching orders and creating dissonance on a pro hillboard. I will simply copy and paste the propaganda they posted on another post.

  194. We didn’t need this, and Obama didn’t either. But he wanted the job, and now he must command.
    ——————————
    A bridge too far. Obama lacks the aptitude or the moral character to command an army. Barone does not tell us what it takes to command an army. But Napoleon sure as hell did. And if you look at what he said on the subject you will see that Obama is not up to it: “a head that receives just impressions and estimated things and objects at their real value. He must not allow himself to be too elated by good news or too depressed by bad. The impressions he received should be so classed as to take up only that space which they deserve to occupy, since it is upon such a just comparison and consideration that just impressions and the power of reasoning and right judgment depends.”

    Translation: you cannot get the aptitude for command from a teleprompter. And, party animals need not apply.

  195. Heard someone say it is now Iran’s move. I said what? She said I’madinnerjacket will not let this pass and neither will those who funded the flotilla. She laughs and informed me that the money behind the original flotilla is the same behind the super mosque. I had no idea our discussions were a chess game for her.

  196. John Dickerson does not want McChrystal fired. Where he gets the silly notion that Bob Gates, who made his career from selective leaks in deep background, doesn’t leak is a mystery:
    ——————————
    I think he misreads Gates entirely. Dickerson and Slate are Obama worshipers and it permeates their analysis.

    The other things Napoleon wanted was a strong mind not a brilliant one. And a bias for action as opposed to an unwillingness to take risks. If Bambi were a general he would be a dandy like McClellan parading his troops around Washington for the amusement of politicians and the ladies, rather than Grant engaging the enemy and spilling blood at the Battle of the Wilderness, Cold Harbor, Petersburg and Spotsylvania.

  197. Heard someone say it is now Iran’s move.
    —————————————-
    The statement is materially misleading. It implies that Obama has done something which begets a response. In fact Obama has done nothing. Iran has walked over him time and again. Iran, not Obama, has been the moving party.

  198. A few months ago in downtown Pittsburgh at the very sad excuse for a subway station there were a butt load of the national guard or some armed force conducting some sort of excercise. They were telling people to walk on this side or move this way and everyone obliged. It was disturbing to watch people be herded just because someone in a uniform told them to do so. If I am not mistaken they have no authority unless the governor or president grants it to them and in such case it has to be about national security. Yet no one challenged the orders they were given. I sat and watched the whole thing and at first thought something serious was going down but after a few minutes I realized it was just an excercise.

    So i say yes an officer should respect his/her commanders unless of course the sovereign is cracked.

    The troops I saw ordering the sheep around had zero right to do so, but not one person posed a challenge?

  199. While I am at it gotta bitch about one more thing
    Lame stream media made a huge todo about a Harvard Student who was attempting to fly without a state/federal for a man who was not an American. Why how??? Because he is attending Harvard he doesn’t have to carry ID? He has a Visa but had lost his ID. Lame stream media reacted as if he was being profiled? His Harvard ID should have been sufficient? Are you kidding me? A student ID? Last I checked Harvard is not a part of my government. Anyone can find a store in any major city and get a college ID for twenty bucks.
    Yet this story was relayed about the mexican Harvard student being profiled. I can’t get on a flight without an official ID but a hispanic student should not be questionned?

  200. “This is a general who felt the need to speak out for the good of the country and at the expense of his own career.”

    Oh please. It had nothing to do with principle. He used his aides to make a bunch of highly unprofessional, snarky, insubordinate asides, often in degrading, unprofessional, and vulgar language.

    =============================

    Not mutuallly exclusive. He could be motivated by principle and still choose an unconventional — thus attention-getting — style of broadcasting the message. (Tho as I’ve said, I suspect a large portion of snafu.)

    Anyway, you cannot read his mind. You cannot know whether he was coming from principle or not.

  201. Something to ponder
    I worked in a restaurant in Manhattan from 2000 to 2002 or there about
    The IRS came after me and everyone who worked there for under declaring tips.With fines and interest it was over 4 thousand dollars. Funny thing those who were working illegally always claim six dependents and no verification is required when you fill out the with holding forms. So tell me please why I should not be upset. The IRS came to my place of employment to have a sit down and evaluate the cost. They came up with a figure and let those of us that were legal pay the amounts without interest or penalty, but I never thought about it before but those working illegally making what I made didn’t have to pay a penny as they just moved on with a new social.
    FYI– if you every go somewhere and really want to thank your sever. Give it to them in a handshake. For whatever reason it is then considered a gift and not a tip???

  202. admin said:
    BTW, the immediate apologies and phone calls to his allies inform us that McChrystal knows what he is doing. Like that Billy Mitchell business Wbboei wrote about, McChrystal is doing what he wants to do – get his views out. Other than the drama, does anyone think McChrystal is hurt by this?

    ==================

    Probably he will offer resignation which Obama can’t accept because Obama couldn’t replace him on short notice. In other words it’s more like threatening strike than resigining.

    Even if he was fired/resigned — how much retirement money would he lose compared to the money he sill make from this publicity?

  203. TurnDownObama, regarding that earlier apology comment: from working on campaigns we always recall a great saying which is a way of life in dysfunctional campaigns (as many, if not all, Democratic campaigns are). That saying clued us in to what McChrystal was doing.

    The saying:

    If it’s a good idea go ahead and do it. It’s much easier to apologize than get permission.”

  204. “Maybe they should just hang the General at high noon to make you feel better.”

    Shadowfax

    Perhaps you won’t be satisfied until the military is beating down our doors and installing itself in the White House, since clearly you think it’s fine and dandy for Generals to ignore American elections and declare themselves commander-in-chief.

  205. “Anyway, you cannot read his mind. You cannot know whether he was coming from principle or not.”

    Neither can you. I can infer from his boobery that he was not.

    At any rate it doesn’t matter. The proper way to handle this was by private pressure on civilian leaders or by resigning.

    Cussing out the President through leaks to magazines is wildly inappropriate behavior for a general.

    It is quite clear that some people here are so blinded by Obama hatred that they no longer understand common Constitutional concepts like civilian control of the military. These defenses of the indefensible McChrystal are tantamount to Obot defenses of Obama no matter what he does.

    McChrystal is simply out of line no matter how you slice it.

  206. “1. I think McChrystal is a military genius where Obama is not.

    2. I think McCrytal is concerned about winning the war and saving lives whereas Obama is interested in hoops, gala parties and stealing elections.

    3. I think McCrystal is engaged in the problem whereas Obama is not.”

    __________________________

    Sorry but a military genius who was engaged and concern wouldn’t have voted for Obama in the first place. The starting point with McChrystal is that he was one of the few generals who supported Obama’s election.

    Genius? I think not.

    A boob votes for a boob then acts like a boob when appointed by the boob. None of this is remotely surprising.

  207. “Anyway, you cannot read his mind. You cannot know whether he was coming from principle or not.”

    Neither can you. I can infer from his boobery that he was not.

    At any rate it doesn’t matter. The proper way to handle this was by private pressure on civilian leaders or by resigning.

    Cussing out the President through leaks to magazines is wildly inappropriate behavior for a general.

    It is quite clear that some people here are so blinded by Obama hatred that they no longer understand common Constitutional concepts like civilian control of the military. These defenses of the indefensible McChrystal are tantamount to Obot defenses of Obama no matter what he does.

    McChrystal is simply out of line no matter how you slice it.
    ———————————————————–
    The difference between your position and ours is not that we are too blinded by Obama hate as you put it to understand the importance of civilian control over the military. Rather it is the fact that you trust Obama to do what is right by the American People under the Constitution, whereas from the days of Rezko Obama is more inclined to do what is right for people like Soros. To which you will undoubtedly say that under the Constitution, the fate of Obama is for the voters to decide. To which we will say that Obama people rigged the primary so the voters could not decide, and they are rigging the general election through Soros programs like the Secretary of State Project, the voting machines and ACORN’s next iteration. To which you will say this is conspiracy talk. To which we will say history is a series of conspiracies and if you study the history of this one the answers become clear. Which gets us back to the whole question of Billy Mitchell and whether his speaking out did any good. He foresaw the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor more than a decade before the fact. If we had heeded his call then American lives would probably have been saved. From a tactical standpoint, your analysis is correct. From a strategic standpoint, I want to hear what the general in charge of the operation and his staff are thinking. Larry Johnson has raised the intriguing question of who in the Obama Administration set up this interview. He has also suggested that the original purpose of the interview was to showcase the counterinsurgency policy, and in the course of those discussions, comments were made about Obama. Instead of reporting on the counterinsurgency efforts, the writer elected to publish and emphasize the ad hominum comments which was ultra vires in terms of what he was there for.

  208. To the last point, if Larry Johnson’s assumption is correct then McChrystal may not be guilty of what you accuse him of namely an effort to undermine civilian control of the military.

  209. Defiant One: there is a better than even chance that the message got corrupted. I know from experience how this happens.

    Years ago, the Congresswoman I have spoken of before decided to accept an interview from an outdoor magazine which was environmentalist to the core. I objected to this arrangement because it was likely to produce a hit piece, but she went forward with it anyway. She felt she could explain her pro growth position in terms that the tree huggers could relate to and I for one was skeptical. The writer was an intense young man from the east coast. She was the Chairman of the House Committee on Forest and Forest Management. We boarded a small aircraft and flew over a national forest. He interviewed her and took some photos of her in a Pendleton shirt in the wilderness. By the end of the interview we felt she had made the substantive points that needed to be made, and waited with some trepidation to see how it would be reported.

    Three weeks later, we got our answer. The opening line of the piece read like this:

    “To fall under the spell of the conservative right’s dusky siren, to entertain her environmentally suspect position, well, nothing seemed more unlikely. Then she belipsticked, besilked, beguiling, entered the room.”

    By the same token, it is not unlikely that Larry is right, and McCrystal never tried to undermine civilian control, believed the writer would discuss counter insurgency and was surprised as we were to learn that the writer took an entirely different tack that had nothing to do with the core discussion, but was calculated to shock and sell magazines.

  210. By the same token, it is not unlikely that Larry is right, and McCrystal never tried to undermine civilian control, believed the writer would discuss counter insurgency and was surprised as we were to learn that the writer took an entirely different tack that had nothing to do with the core discussion, but was calculated to shock and sell magazines.

    =====================

    And to save some lives in Afgan and elsewhere?

    O felix vino.

  211. wbboei, your last two comments were excellent. I understand about people being upset or concerned about insubordination, but firstly, no oneis even 100% certain if the writer of this article is being FAIR to the general. Somehow, I doubt it.

    I have a much bigged beef, and that is how our civilian government, the one that has placed conditions on the military on how to fight the war in Afghanistan, has set conditions that make a dangerous job even more so to our troops. Obama’s ass isn’t under fire in Afghanistan. His dithering about Afghanistan resulted in a perception that he could care less about the death of American troops. Don’t American troops have a right to feel that their government that has placed them in harm’s way actually supports them? McCrystal wants to win, and wants to save as many of his troops from harm as possible doing so. If our CIC’s mixed messages on the war in Afghanistan has placed our troops in more danger than necessary, and our CIC’s representatives to Afghanistan are part of a problem that only our troops bear the consequences of as far as the unnecessary dangers of bad policy, then I am glad that this general MAY have spoken out. Yes, if this is true, it is insubordination, but maybe now, the end result will be a policy that does right by our soldiers, not our politicians who sit in ivory towers.

    As the writer of Lame Cherry likes to write, “have an Obama day”. I usually chuckle to myself when I read that. It surely doesn’t mean what the words seemingly imply. I take it to mean “have a F’d up day” since that is the type of day most can expect from the boy wonder.

  212. Sorry about my typos. I see them all, and they are attributable to my fingers trying to function properly on this I-phone. Between the small keypad, and the small screen, it makes it difficult to type. I hope to have a new laptop soon. Some of my fingers actually start to fall asleep while using this phone for typing. Sometimes I even need to straighten out my pinky with my other hand since it won’t move on its own without the extra help. I have never had that problem before until I started using this phone as my means of access to the web.

  213. henry, there are three pro-Hillary sites that I visit. I used to visit bitterpoliticz every day, but do so very infrequently now. I also visit this site, and Hillbuzz. Taylor Marsh was a “used to visit” until her flip made me want to hurl. Every now and then I go there under a different name (but still similar) to express myself. It usually does not go over well with the new lot of followers she has, but I want them to know that there are Democrats or recent former Democrats who think them traitors, insane, or what
    have you. Can you provide the names of some of these other pro-Hillary sites so that
    I may check them out? It was very difficult back in 2007/2008 to find a pro-Hillary site since the net was controlled by bots. It was only by word of mouth that I was able to find the Taylor Marsh site, and that was only after being abused for a very short time on Dkos, TalkLeft by BigTentDumb-o-crat, DU, and a couple more. These “DemoRats” were the reason for the start of my transformation from pro to anti-Democrat, or more like anti-Obamacrat, of which there are too many for me to want to call myself a Democrat. Their progressive, more like fascist, manipulations are to blame for the rot in the Democratic party. They can have their party, because I am over it.

  214. From Gateway Pundit:

    The Missouri General Assembly recently passed the Health Care Freedom Act. That means that on August 3rd, Missouri will be the first state to have the opportunity to approve a bill that will ban Obamacare in Missouri. The bill will:

    “Deny the government authority to penalize citizens for refusing to purchase private health insurance or infringe upon the right to offer or accept direct payment for lawful healthcare services.”

    The Missouri Record has more on this historic vote in Missouri.

  215. “Yes, the judge owns oil stock and he struck down the moratorium which the Obama Administration imposed. But that does not mean he struck down the moratorium BECAUSE he owned oil stock. Yet that is what msnbc implies by their caption. In this case, the pleading by the Obama administration was defective and they were unable to carry their burden of proof. The problem with msnbc is that they assume that everyone who opposes Obama is either as corrupt, thuggish and racist as they are.”
    _________________________________

    My feelings exactly. msnbc as the feigned citizen’s advocate for Truth and Justice is laughable. On it’s face, idling the oil rigs seems reasonable if in fact the rigs are under examination for safety reasons. However, there is proof a more sinister reason exists. George Soros made the call he wants the idled rigs sent to Brazil for his US Taxpayer funded Petrobras off shore drilling project. Now he can’t very well get his oil rigs if the good judge thinking about putting oil co employees back to work lifts the moratorium now can he? If safety is the driving factor for the moratorium, BP employees would be sounding off about unsafe working conditions. I haven’t heard or read a word concerning unsafe working conditions for the majority of oil rigs. In fact an autonomous insurgence of safety precautions has precluded an official order calling for it.

  216. Mass amnesty which was mentioned upthread is another Democrat disaster in the making. The party is hell bent on “remaking” aka “destroying” this country.

  217. As a Roman Catholic, the inference above that the Pope does not work is insulting, as is saying a non-Catholic faux Christian named Obama could even be considered for that position.

  218. nomobama
    June 23rd, 2010 at 8:10 am

    As I mentioned months ago; the Immigration Bill is the answer to Iowa’s bussing voters in from Illinois.. Will Guatamala be too far to go for prospective voters?

  219. “Will Guatamala be too far to go for prospective voters?”
    ____________________________

    On second thought- Obama opening the border flood gates for illegals we assume is aimed at hispanic ethnicities when Obama most likely will be hustling an insurgency of muslims into the country from the four corners of the world.

  220. DefiantOne
    June 23rd, 2010 at 4:14 am

    Perhaps you won’t be satisfied until the military is beating down our doors and installing itself in the White House, since clearly you think it’s fine and dandy for Generals to ignore American elections and declare themselves commander-in-chief.

    ———————————————————

    Why not, that is exactly what the superduds did at the primary. They have set the example. The superduds ignored the American voters in the Dims primary, and they declared themselves commanders in chiefs. Why should the military not follower their lead.

  221. I agree Mrs. Smith, but in a more “legal” way.

    Once a no good cheater, always a no good cheater.

  222. No disrespect for Catholics, but no deference to the Pope either. There have been all kinds of Popes. Several of them declared holy wars on Jerusalem.

    Do we have to have the same respect for imams and ayatollahs who declare fatwas against Americans or Jews?

  223. Larry Johnson has raised the intriguing question of who in the Obama Administration set up this interview. He has also suggested that the original purpose of the interview was to showcase the counterinsurgency policy, and in the course of those discussions, comments were made about Obama. Instead of reporting on the counterinsurgency efforts, the writer elected to publish and emphasize the ad hominum comments which was ultra vires in terms of what he was there for.
    ******
    Larry’s thesis is that McCrystal was sand-bagged by Rolling Stone, possibly with the blessing of the WH. If so, this is rather odd:

    “While some media commentators initially tried to deflect criticism of McChrystal by suggesting he was misquoted or thought he was speaking on background or off the record, Rolling Stone’s editor, Eric Bates, stated Tuesday that the general had been allowed to review the piece before it was published and voiced no objections to its content.”

    As predicted by history and the last Russian General in Afghanistan, Obama’s attempt to “show up” Bush by “winning” the Afghan War is turning to shit.

    “On Tuesday, when the uproar began after advance copies of articles were provided to the media, US-led forces suffered 10 fatalities, the second time that single-day casualties have risen to that level this month. The total number of US troops killed since the beginning of the war has risen to 1128, while the total number of fatalities for all US and NATO-led forces has hit 1854, according to iCasualties.org, which compiles casualty reports.

    Meanwhile, the US military command has been compelled to postpone the offensive against the city of Kandahar, Afghanistan’s second largest city and a stronghold for insurgents resisting US occupation, because of setbacks in the area. At the same time, McChrystal was compelled to acknowledge that the recent offensive carried out by US troops in the largely rural Marjah district of Helmand province had failed to dislodge the Taliban and had turned the area into a “bleeding ulcer.”

  224. “Larry Johnson has raised the intriguing question of who in the Obama Administration set up this interview. He has also suggested that the original purpose of the interview was to showcase the counterinsurgency policy, and in the course of those discussions, comments were made about Obama.”
    _____________________

    Larry makes a valid point- However, since a firing is on the WH table; how will our troops respond if McCrystal is fired for speaking his mind and they find themselves bereft of trustworthy command?

  225. Larry makes a valid point- However, since a firing is on the WH table; how will our troops respond if McCrystal is fired for speaking his mind and they find themselves bereft of trustworthy command?
    ********
    I guess my question is who is the “user” and who is the “usee”…The military is very wary of the “Media” and it’s hard for me to believe that senior officers “shot” their mouths off to a Rolling Stone reporter. Now the RS editor says that McCrystal read the story and didn’t object. IMO, a possible scenario is that McCrystal et. al. were told to do the job with half the troops requested, thing are going to hell in Afghanistan, the American media is not reporting that Mr. Obama’s War is going down in flames, and none up the “chain of command” reports from McCrystal has gotten results. Ergo..the Rolling Stone article.

    “how will our troops respond if McCrystal is fired for speaking his mind”

    McCrystal has to go….There can’t be a double standard in the Military for “speaking his mind”…the principle of civilian control transcends McCrystal or his sociopathic boss.

  226. I think McChrystal wants out, and he will get his wish, but I also believe that he is doing a favor for his soldiers by bringing to light the current situation in Afghanistan. It is possible that he is risking his career for the betterment of the war effort. Our government, and the govrrnment of Afghanistan is making it very difficult for our soldiers to win this war. A war needs to be fought like a war, not be run as a ice cream social.

  227. SCHADENFREDUE: pleasure derived from the misfortunes of others.

    As we watch Obama stumble from one self-made crisis into the next, I can’t help but feel slight guilt at our schadenfreude. But it is delicious.

    This McChrystal episode continues this trend. Obama kicked out the previous leader of the Afghanistan operation for his hand-picked guy McChrystal. Despite several concerns about McChrystal’s past actions (Pat Tillman cover-up, and a few others).

    And I find it funny that media folks are asking “What the heck was he (McChrystal) thinking??”(MoDo expresses this in today’s ranting). Believe me, this wasn’t some flippant move. There had to be plenty of reasons. The main one being that OBAMA IS INCOMPETENT, and needs to be shown a lesson. McChrystal found Obama to be “disengaged” when he finally met Obama in the White House. And Obama has let yet another situation devolve into mayhem with his feckless “leadership”.

    This web site has a tremendously detailed accounting of Obama’s mishandling of the previous transition:

    scribd.com/doc/33417393/The-Emperor-s-General-President-Obama-and-the-Whitewash-of-Gen-McChrystal%E2%80%99s-Role-in-the-Cover-up-of-Pat-Tillman-s-Friendly-Fire-Death

    This was where on May 11, 2009, Obama fired Gen. McKiernan and nominated McChrystal. This also documents Obama’s “Big Time Fumble”

    May 13th 2009: Obama’s “Big-Time Fumble” at Sun Devil Stadium: On Wednesday, May 13th 2009, President Obama delivered his commencement speech to Arizona State University’s graduating class inside Sun Devil Stadium. But, in his speech that
    focused heavily on serving a larger good and “placing character over celebrity and substance over appearance,” Obama did not mention Pat Tillman.

    As Bob Young wrote in his May 17th column, “Obama’s Big-time Fumble”:

    “Maybe it simply was an oversight that Obama forgot Tillman, although we were told Sunday that Obama was staged inside the Arizona State football locker room before his speech – where there is a photo of Tillman. And he walked right up and out of Tillman Tunnel to reach the stage.”

    “Perhaps Obama was sensitive to the fact that the speech came shortly after the
    announcement that Gen. Stanley A. McChrystal would become the top American
    commander in Afghanistan. McChrystal was deemed by a Pentagon investigation to be
    responsible for inaccurate information from the Army about Tillman’s death, and the Tillman family has been critical of what it believes was his role in a cover-up of the real events that took place.”

    “knowing what a big sports fanaticO bama is … we were shocked that he passed up a
    wide-open opportunity. … He encouraged ASU’s graduates not to chase “the usual brass rings” … He told them such an approach elevates “appearance over substance, celebrity over character, … and said it’s just the sort of thinking today’s young people must end.”

    “… With apologies to all whom Obama cited, from Thomas Paine to Colonel “Finger Lickin’ Good” Sanders to Cardinals quarterback Kurt Warner, is there any better example of character over celebrity and substance over appearance than Pat Tillman, the guy who made his name in the very stadium where Obama stood? Tillman literally stopped
    chasing the brass ring and gave up millions and an NFL career to join the Army’s elite Rangers and fight in Afghanistan. He died there, the victim of friendly fire.”

    “… “Obama had a wide-open opportunity to remind us that Tillman could be the best
    example in our lifetimes of someone who eschewed popularity and personal advancement to devote himself to a bigger purpose. For some reason, the president passed.”

  228. I think McChrystal wants out, and he will get his wish, but I also believe that he is doing a favor for his soldiers by bringing to light the current situation in Afghanistan. It is possible that he is risking his career for the betterment of the war effort.
    *******
    That is my opinion also. If that is his motive then he is going about it the wrong way. Possibly his thinking is “A general doesn’t quit when troops are in the field, especially in a loosing war effort but if I tell the “truth” and get fired.blah..blah.” I also suspect that the senior officers, including McCrystal, are thinking that if they had gotten the 60,000-100,000 troops that he had asked for that they would be “winning”. Another replay of “we would have won but the “civilians stabbed us in the back”. The military has been stabbed in the back but not from not getting enough troops but from a lack of courage by Obama’s political string pullers to “pull the plug”. Truman was the last President to have that type of courage when he fired MacArthur and decided to hold the line at the 38th parallel. Truman’s approval rating was 22% when he left office but he made the right call.

  229. “is there any better example of character over celebrity and substance over appearance than Pat Tillman, the guy who made his name in the very stadium where Obama stood?”
    ______________________________________________

    It likely didn’t occur to him as he was so self-absorbed thinking he was the shining embodiment of those lofty ideals he was espousing.

  230. Well, we’ve thrown a plate of spagetti at the wall, now we’ll have to wait and see what sticks!

  231. Mrs. Smith
    June 23rd, 2010 at 10:56 am
    Well, we’ve thrown a plate of spagetti at the wall, now we’ll have to wait and see what sticks!
    &&&&&&&&

    Linguini, fettuccini, or angel hair?

  232. This was where on May 11, 2009, Obama fired Gen. McKiernan and nominated McChrystal
    *******
    IIRC, the bottom line on firing McKiernan was that he wouldn’t support the “idea” of funding and arming Afghan war lords and militias. We are now starting to get the “stink” of that policy decision reported in the “media”.

  233. MODO: McCHRYSTAL SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN HIRED FOR THE JOB.

    Some telling excerpts:

    It’s just another sign of the complete incoherence of Afghan policy. The people in charge are divided against each other. And the policy is divided against itself. We’re fighting a war against an enemy that we’re desperately trying to co-opt and win over in a country where Al Qaeda, which was supposed to be the enemy, is no longer based.

    “McChrystal’s defenders at the Pentagon were making the case Tuesday that the president and his men — (the McChrystal snipers spared Hillary) — must put aside their hurt feelings about being painted as weak sisters.”

    “cChrystal never should have been hired for this job given the outrageous cover-up he participated in after the friendly fire death of Pat Tillman. He was lucky to keep the job after his “Seven Days in May” stunt in London last year when he openly lobbied and undercut the president on the surge.”

    nytimes.com/2010/06/23/opinion/23dowd.html?adxnnl=1&ref=opinion&adxnnlx=1277305222-JkSqbDNPTWQgeT9+1NztrA

  234. Another “take” on the RS piece

    “The article raises as many questions about its author as it does about the command culture surrounding McChrystal. It is difficult to fathom that any reporter would be granted warts-and-all access to the inner sanctum, with no strings attached. Were there any? It is equally hard to understand how members of Team America could feel free to speak as unguardedly as they did — much less cut loose under the influence of alcohol, as Hastings described it — and expect a good journalist in their midst to not record his observations.”

    http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINION/06/22/innes.mchrystal.reporting/?iref=obnetwork

  235. Also from the Tuesday CNN piece:

    “Rolling Stone executive editor Eric Bates, however, struck a less optimistic tone during an interview with CNN on Tuesday.

    The comments made by McChrystal and other top military aides during the interview were “not off-the-cuff remarks,” he said. They “knew what they were doing when they granted the access.” The story shows “a deep division” and “war within the administration” over strategy in Afghanistan, he contended.”

  236. To me the most important thing here is that we are in a losing war, and the White House and media are keeping that fact largely hidden to protect Obama. I think it is important for the American People to know that what Obama has portrayed as the good war is a disaster. In Viet Nam that did not happen.

    It seems clear that the media wants to portray this entire bruhaha as a chain of command issue, to divert public attention from the real issue. For that reason, I am less invested in that issue than I am in the big picture here. Obama is running this war on his election time table and that will cost American lives. I want him to be held accountable.

    I hope Obama accepts the resignation of McCrystal on the grounds the Defiant One suggests. I think that will turn McCrystal into a martyr in certain quarters, direct public attention to the losing situation in the good war as Obama described it, and get him on the outside the tent pissing in. For those reasons I doubt he will do it.

    On the narrow question of whether McVrystal should be fired, here is what one reader poll at FOX says. Perhaps the reaction would have been different if those comments had been made about Bush. Then again perhaps not:

    Fire him. 10% (21,676 votes)

    Nothing. He apologized. Just move on. 62% (138,226 votes)

    Not Sure. 20% (43,789 votes)

    Other 8% (18,104 votes)

  237. wbboei
    June 23rd, 2010 at 2:34 am
    I doubt McCrystal will bet fired. Bambi is afraid to do that.
    —————————————————————————

    Bambi is afraid of his own shadow…..we look at it this way, at least Obama is not at the gym, basketball court or playing golf….he really working this morning even if it is just jacking his jaws.

  238. “To me the most important thing here is that we are in a losing war, and the White House and media are keeping that fact largely hidden to protect Obama”
    *********
    Exactly…We are loosing another un-winnable war and expanding the un-winnable war is the only campaign promise that Obama has kept. IMO, unless there is a reactor leak from a “should have been decommissioned nuclear power plants” that Obama re-certified for another 20 years, Mr. Obama’s Afghanistan disaster will be his legacy.

  239. JUNE 23, 2010

    Clinton conspicuously silent on McChrystal flap

    Josh Rogin
    Wednesday, June 23, 2010

    As various officials and lawmakers weigh in on the Rolling Stone profile of General Stanley McChrystal, one voice is conspicuously absent from the chatter: Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.

    “Only Hillary Clinton receives good reviews from McChrystal’s inner circle,” the story reports, quoting an advisor as saying that “Hillary had Stan’s back during the strategic review”

    A State Department official told The Cable that Clinton and her staff were not contacted during the writing of the article; they found out about it Monday evening along with everybody else. But Clinton hasn’t issued any statement on the story, even though it directly attacks two of her senior staffers, Special Representative Richard “Wounded Animal” Holbrooke and Amb. Karl Eikenberry.

    Clinton was also among the only officials named in the story who did not receive an apology call, presumably because the comments about her in the story were so favorable. Holbrooke and Eikenberry both got calls, which seemed redundant since both were in Kabul with McChrystal this week and even sat in meetings together with the General and Afghan President Hamid Karzai.

    There are two plausible explanations for Clinton’s silence. First of all, McChrystal works for Defense Secretary Robert Gates, and Clinton may not want to step on his toes by seeming to weigh in on an issue surrounding a military official. She also may not want to fuel speculation that she is gunning for Gates’s job, however unlikely that possibility really is.

    “The secretary of state has backed McChrystal to the hilt, even going against her own ambassador, Karl Eikenberry. Her get-tough stance is fueling talk that she might replace Gates as defense secretary,” the article says.

    The other reason Clinton might be keeping silent is because she is preparing to defend McChrystal inside today’s Afghanistan strategy meeting at the White House, and criticizing him openly in the press would impair that cause. Clinton could be one of McChrystal’s last friends inside that room — and he needs all the friends he can get.

    The State Department official declined to comment on Clinton’s views on the article, or whether she felt McChrystal should be relieved of his command. Neither Holbrooke nor Eikenberry responded to requests for comment on the article.

    But State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley was compelled to talk about the story when asked about it directly at Tuesday’s briefing. He tried to distance the State Department from the mess altogether.

    “I think our focus is on the civilian component of the ongoing strategy,” he said, adding that Clinton has read the article but hasn’t even told Crowley what her opinion is.

    Crowley also sought to downplay the divisions among the president’s Afghanistan team, another signal that the State Department is not in favor of shaking up the command structure in Kabul, which could be hugely disruptive for civilian efforts there as well.

    “In any team of heavyweights, you’re going to have different personalities,” Crowley said.

    “I just don’t think that this is going to distract us from our focus on the mission.”

    http://thecable.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2010/06/23/clinton_conspicuously_silent_on_mcchrystal_flap

  240. Morning Bell: Obama’s Leadership Vacuum

    June 23rd, 2010

    More than two years ago, then-presidential candidate Hillary Clinton launched a campaign ad that took direct aim at Senator Barack Obama’s inexperience. It painted the picture of a telephone ringing in the White House at 3 a.m. and asked the question, when there is a crisis in the world and your children are safe and asleep, “Who do you want answering the phone?”

    Now, two years later, there are several crises confronting America, that telephone is ringing, and President Obama isn’t quite sure what to do about it.

    The first crisis is the War in Afghanistan, a lynchpin in the War on Terror and a key to ensuring U.S. security. Gen. Stanley McChrystal, U.S. commander in Afghanistan, reportedly tendered his resignation yesterday following a Rolling Stone article that portrayed him and senior aides on his team as dismissive of top Obama administration officials. Apart for being an embarrassing moment for both President Obama and Gen. McChrystal, the story revealed a larger problem for the president – festering, internal dissension regarding his administration’s Afghanistan strategy. As Politico reports, there are divisions among Defense Secretary Robert Gates, Vice President Biden, Gen. David Petraeus, Richard Holbrooke and others.

    Those divisions are of Obama’s own making, stemming from his lack of leadership and failure to make a firm commitment to victory in Afghanistan. It took the president 10 months to decide on an Afghanistan strategy, he took a middle road in only committing 30,000 additional troops to the mission, many fewer than Gen. McChrystal had requested, and he imposed an artificial timeline for withdrawal that sent mixed signals to the country, the military, our allies and our enemies about America’s resolve to win the war. Now, as the president contemplates Gen. McChrystal’s potential resignation, it appears he is reaping the bitter harvest of his failure to take decisive action.

    There’s another crisis spewing from deep in the Gulf of Mexico, where the environmental and economic repercussions of the Deepwater Horizon oil spill continue to spread, 64 days later. Even after President Obama addressed the nation on the government’s oil spill response, 59 percent of Americans do not believe he has a clear plan for tackling the crisis.

    Is it any wonder? Yesterday, a federal judge struck down the president’s six-month ban on oil drilling, concluding that plaintiffs likely could show “the Administration acted arbitrarily and capriciously in issuing the moratorium.”

    The ruling followed protests from Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal and 19 Gulf lawmakers, including Democrat Rep. Charlie Melancon (LA), who complained that the ban would pile on even more economic hardship to the embattled Gulf region. Despite the ruling, the protests, the economic consequences, and a poll showing that 56 percent of Americans believe offshore drilling is necessary for U.S. energy security, Interior Secretary Ken Salazar says he will issue a new order re-imposing the moratorium on deepwater drilling.

    The Heritage Foundation’s Hans von Spakovsky writes that the ban is just one example of the Obama administration’s oil spill failures:

    From the unjustified 24-hour ban imposed by the Coast Guard on the barges that were pumping oil out of the water to check on whether they had fire extinguishers and life vests on board to the Army Corps of Engineers’ delays in allowing Louisiana to build berms and sand barriers to protect its wetlands, the administration has acted more like the Keystone Cops than a competent and effective government.

    And then there’s the budget. President Obama’s administration has been marked by a spend-now, cut-later (or never) mantra that has featured the largest single-year increase in domestic spending since World War II and a trillion-dollar health care plan. Recognizing that all that spending might cause a public relations problem, the president appointed the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform to study ways to improve America’s fiscal future. Why make a decision when others can do it for you?

    Taking a cue from their leader, House Democrats announced yesterday that they won’t pass a budget this year. Even though that’s never been done in the history of the modern budgetary process, they want to wait until the president’s commission issues its report in December before making any moves.

    Following President Obama’s Oval Office address on the oil spill last week, MSNBC commentators Chris Matthews, Keith Olbermann and Howard Fineman, three of the president’s most ardent media cheerleaders, roundly criticized the president’s speech. Fineman said “Obama should be acting like a ‘commander-in-chief.’” Olbermann complained the president “wasn’t specific enough.” Matthews observed, “I don’t sense executive command.” Each of those observations comes down to one thing: leadership. And these days, the man picking up the White House phone at 3 a.m. doesn’t seem to have it.

    http://blog.heritage.org/?p=36823

  241. #
    DefiantOne
    June 23rd, 2010 at 4:14 am

    “Maybe they should just hang the General at high noon to make you feel better.”

    Shadowfax

    Perhaps you won’t be satisfied until the military is beating down our doors and installing itself in the White House, since clearly you think it’s fine and dandy for Generals to ignore American elections and declare themselves commander-in-chief.
    ——-
    Good thing you’re not jumping to conclusions here.

    A few snarks over beers and next thing you know, the black ops are beating down my door and taking over the country.

    If anything, this group of Team America seem like the type of soldiers that would prevent this from happening, while the so called, ‘commander in chief’ actually scammed the election, thug-ed the primary to steal the White House.

    Standing on principle while overlooking the reality isn’t getting you to the truth.

  242. At a time when violence in Afghanistan is sharply rising and several central planks of the president’s strategy to “disrupt, dismantle and defeat” the Taliban and Al Qaeda have stalled, many of the president’s top advisers have continued to criticize one another to reporters and international allies alike, usually in private conversations, and almost always off the record.

    “Yes, we do hear them disparage each other,” said a senior European diplomat who works closely with the United States on Afghanistan strategy. “It’s never good to hear that.”

    Bruce O. Riedel, a senior fellow at Brookings Institution who helped the administration formulate its initial Afghan policy, added, “This flap shows once again that his team is not pulling together, but is engaging in backbiting.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/24/us/politics/24mcchrystal.html?th&emc=th

  243. #
    jtjames
    June 23rd, 2010 at 11:47 am

    Just saw President Clinton on Tv at the world cup USA V ALGERIA game.

    Good to see Bill is off having fun for a change, he should have taken Hillary with him.

  244. What’s the deal with not knowing if McChrystal is in, or is he out?

    They spoke for 30 minutes and no one seems to think telling the American troops or voters is important?

    I hope Barry decides faster than it took to get a dog for his daughters. His daughters would probably still be waiting if Uncle Teddy didn’t get the dog for him.

  245. McKrystal was in the WH for 20 minutes and now we hear nothing….the the war strategy session took place….this doesn’t sound good for the General.

  246. I just heard that Hillary, and Petreas are at the war strategy meeting….I think the news reporters are pist off because no one is telling them what has happened to the General….Personally I think Obama fired him….the “one” can’t take any kind of criticism…he looked sick yesterday…so these little remarks really got to him.

  247. the the war strategy session took place

    Was McChrystal in that session?
    Top Brass want McChrystal to stay per CNN.

  248. What Should Happen to Gen. McChrystal?

    Voting at Fox

    Fire him. He admitted to making inappropriate comments, and he should get the ax. 10% (24,149 votes)

    Nothing. He apologized for his “poor judgment.” He and the White House should just move on. 62% (151,692 votes)

    Not Sure, but this is probably not the time to be changing generals at such a critical time in Afghanistan. 20% (48,574 votes)

    Other (post a comment) 8% (19,285 votes)

    http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2010/06/22/decide-happen-gen-mcchrystal/

  249. KABUL, Afghanistan (AP) — Afghan officials said Wednesday that firing Gen. Stanley McChrystal would disrupt progress in the war and could jeopardize a pivotal security operation under way in Taliban strongholds in the south.

    At the end of a one-hour video conference Tuesday night with President Barack Obama, Afghan President Hamid Karzai expressed his confidence in the top NATO commander in Afghanistan, Karzai spokesman Waheed Omar said.

    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/06/23/afghan-leaders-voice-strong-support-embattled-nato-commander-mcchrystal/

  250. No one knows if the General was at the meeting…the reporters saw the General left the WH and then about 30 minutes later the War session began…it doesn’t look good.

    Two people died during the oil spill operation today.

  251. They removed the cap they put on the oil well…so the oil is gushing more. They are having trouble with the gas coming out of the well.

  252. That doesn’t sound good for the General…Obama is more like Mao, you couldn’t tell the truth about that dictator either.

  253. America and England are the 2 teams to qualify out of Group C against all odds. Hilarious, Must be the Clinton Magic.

  254. jeswezey
    June 23rd, 2010 at 9:16 am
    No disrespect for Catholics, but no deference to the Pope either. There have been all kinds of Popes. Several of them declared holy wars on Jerusalem.
    Do we have to have the same respect for imams and ayatollahs who declare fatwas against Americans or Jews?

    jeswezey
    June 23rd, 2010 at 11:54 am
    What was disrespectful to Catholics?
    -_____________________________-

    Let’s see. The Crusades happened hundreds of years ago. Since that time, the Catholic Church, as a world body, has led a relatively peaceful existence. Comparing the leader of the Catholic church to the Imams and Ayatollahs in today’s world who make death threats to those they consider infidels is an insult, as if modern Popes have ever behaved in the way you described current Islamic leaders. They do not even compare in the least. Your comment was disingenous, and a slap at Catholics through their religious leader.

  255. McChrystal met with Obama but left the white house before the 11.30 am strategy meeting.

    ——
    Maybe the meeting was to talk to Brass on if to keep him or not. This wouldn’t happen with him in the room.

    Just speculating here…

  256. bloody hell, cap is off the gusher because of crash with some type of submarine!!! you’ve got to be kidding me.

  257. Nobama: “The Crusades happened hundreds of years ago.”
    Granted.

    “Since that time, the Catholic Church, as a world body, has led a relatively peaceful existence.”

    Tell Galileo that. Pius didn’t stand up to Hitler very well either.

    “Comparing the leader of the Catholic church to the Imams and Ayatollahs in today’s world who make death threats to those they consider infidels is an insult, as if modern Popes have ever behaved in the way you described current Islamic leaders.”

    Well, Ratzinger started his career by accusing Islam (not the jihadists) for much violence in the world. Made a bad name for himself among the Catholics I know.

    “Your comment was… a slap at Catholics through their religious leader.”

    There are hundreds of millions of Catholics in this world, and the Pope is just one of them. Set aside the imams for a sec… Do you think I would feel insulted if someone said something derogatory about Nixon, who was a Quaker like me? What’s so special about 1 little Catholic in this world?

    I don’t remember who it was here who made the original comment that o could leave the presidency and seek prestigious employment in various positions, including the Papacy, but that didn’t seem to be a slap in the face to all other Catholics. Again, what’s so special about the Pope?

  258. O/T, but I want to give this analysis exposure. I found it in a central NJ local paper, then searched for it online.
    [caveat: Jonah Goldberg and Rep. Mike Pence (R-IN) spoke Wednesday at a forum on the tea party and populism sponsored by the conservative Hudson Institute’s Bradley Center for Philanthropy and Civic Renewal. The panel also included former House Republican leader Dick Armey, who has helped organize tea party protests; author and commentator Bill Kristol; and Michael Barone, author and editor of the influential “Almanac of American Politics.”]

    Tea party took root before Obama
    BY CHUCK RAASCH, Gannett National Writer
    June 17. 2010 12:48PM
    WASHINGTON – It is a misnomer and political miscalculation for detractors and supporters of the tea party movement to view it strictly as a recoil to President Barack Obama and his policies. Indeed, as leading conservative activists, thinkers and writers said this week, millions of conservative Americans seethed in quiet discontent over the spending and growth of the federal government under Republican George W. Bush. Only the fight against terrorism kept the fire from breaking out under Bush’s watch.
    snip
    “There was a lot that a lot of loyal Republicans put up with, and conservatives put up with, because the war on terror was a legitimate, overriding issue,” Goldberg said. [Then] The Obama administration took runaway spending under the Bush administration and put it on steroids….
    [Salient points:]
    The bailout of Wall Street banks and brokerage houses under Bush + $787 billion stimulus of Obama caused the Tea Party to come alive.
    Attacks on Sarah Palin who has become a voice if not a leader of the movement helped galvanize protesters.
    This Tea Party is the 5th grass-roots limited government movement in the last 50 years, but only the second rising from ‘fear and despair’ [Armey]
    Perot is a lesson for Tea Party Activists tempted to start a new party, and for a GOP establishment unsure of how to react to it….
    http://gns dot gannettonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100617/COLUMNISTS01/6170301

  259. Newsweek How ‘Rolling Stone’ Got Into McChrystal’s Inner Circle

    Reporter Michael Hastings explains the backstory to the piece that upended a general—and maybe even a war.
    It’s the kind of story that ricochets through Washington—and around the world—at lightning speed. “The Runaway General,” published by Rolling Stone and written by former NEWSWEEK reporter Michael Hastings, recounts the misgivings of Stanley McChrystal (the commanding general in Afghanistan) and the closest members of his team about President Obama, French diplomats, civilian leaders in Afghanistan, and pretty much everyone. Immediately, Afghanistan President Hamid Karzai proclaimed his support for the general. But calls are getting louder for his resignation. Obama has summoned the general to explain himself face-to-face in Washington. NEWSWEEK’S Andrew Bast talked by phone to Michael Hastings, still in Afghanistan, about his article and how it had turned Washington (and perhaps the war) on its head.

    You’re in Kandahar at the moment. Surely you’ve heard, but your article has unleashed a furor stateside. President Obama will be meeting with General McChrystal on Tuesday. Did you expect this?
    I’m actually shocked by the response. Because usually we end up ignoring Afghanistan, so I’m quite surprised it’s creating such a stir. I knew I had some decent material to work with, but I’m surprised at the level of involvement.

    You think that Afghanistan has fallen off the radar back home?
    I think it has. And I think that McChrystal and his staff feel that, too. That’s part of the frustration that was vented in the story.

    You reported a lot of sentiments that are usually only expressed in private—why were the general and his team so candid?
    Part of it was the circumstances. They were in a different environment. They were in Paris. But you would really have to ask them why they gave me the access that they did.

    Can you explain how the article came about—what was the pitching and reporting process?
    I was Baghdad correspondent for NEWSWEEK for two years, and I left the magazine after covering the elections. I wrote a piece for GQ before Obama took office that raised some serious questions about the direction we were taking in Afghanistan. So it was something I wanted to be writing about. I saw General McChrystal and his new strategy as a way to look at our Afghan policy to see if it’s working or if it’s a totally insane enterprise. I met with editors at Rolling Stone, they seemed into the idea, so I e-mailed McChrystal’s people. I didn’t think I was going to get any access at all. It’s one of those strange journalistic twists. They said yes, come on over to Paris to spend a couple days with us.

    How much time did you spend with McChrystal over the month?
    Another strange journalistic twist. The Icelandic volcano happens, and so my two-day trip turned into this month-long journey following General McChrystal and his staff around from Paris to Berlin to Kabul to Kandahar and then back to Washington, D.C. I wasn’t with him at every moment, obviously, but fairly regularly over that period of time.

    One of the most vivid scenes in the stories comes when you are out with the general, his wife, and his team for a night on the town in Paris. His team is entirely forthright with you, did that surprise you?
    Well, they were getting hammered, I don’t know at that moment if they were being the most forthright. Of course it was surprising. A lot of the reporting that is getting most of the attention happened right away in the first few days in Paris. So I was surprised—because they didn’t know me.

    It was always clear that you were a reporter and you were, in essence, on the record? And more, the entire article was thoroughly fact-checked, yes?
    Yes. It was crystal clear to me, and I was walking around with a tape recorder and a notepad in my hand three-quarters of the time. I didn’t have the Matt Drudge press hat on, but everything short of that it was pretty obvious I was a reporter writing a profile of the general for Rolling Stone. It was always very clear.

    What’s the response from the military been? Do you think your access will be cut in the future?
    The most interesting response has been, in Kandahar, and having more than one person come up to me and saying, “We heard about your story, and we like McChrystal, but the message needs to get out there that these restrictions he’s putting on the soldiers are no good.” So it’s actually been a positive response among the soldiers here.

    You write that General McChrystal is perhaps closer than any American to Karzai. If the general goes, what does that do for the relationship between Washington and Kabul, and well, the future of the war?
    You’d think it would be hard for the relationship between Karzai and Washington to get any worse, but obviously a change in generals is not going to help. Whoever it is, they would have to establish their own relationship. Gen. McChrystal and his guys take a pretty pragmatic view toward Karzai—he’s the only game in town. I assume any general is going to have the same problem, because the wheels are set in motion and coming up with a solution to deal with Karzai is one of the major issues.

    Describe how this debate all looks from Afghanistan, away from the politics of Washington—what does the war look like today?
    I’m getting ready to go out on a mission with U.S. troops. They’re concerned with doing the job that’s in front of them. I’m trying to take the same attitude—I’m just reporting the story that I’m here to report right now. The way I view journalism is you try to focus on the story, report what you see and hear, try to piece it together, and then tell the reader what is really happening. I did that, and the aftermath is not really something I can control. Especially when I have no Internet connection, the power keeps going out, and the occasional fighter jet flies overhead, which is not suitable for phone interviews, at all.

  260. What hasn’t been mentioned is that McCrystal, et al are in clear violation of the law, specifically the UCMJ, Sub Chapter X. Punitive Articles, Article 88, 134 (others??).

    “Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ)
    ART. 88 – CONTEMPT TOWARD OFFICIALS
    Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.”

    ART. 134 General Article
    “Though not specifically mentioned in this chapter, all disorders and neglects to the prejudice of good order and discipline in the armed forces, all conduct of a nature to bring discredit upon the armed forces, and crimes and offenses not capital, of which persons subject to this chapter may be guilty, shall be taken cognizance of by a general, special, or summary court-martial, according to the nature and degree of the offense, and shall be punished at the discretion of that court.”

    However, my opinion that McCrystal should have resigned before calling BS on Obama may not be valid under UCMJ Article II. ????

    “Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ)
    ART. 2. PERSONS SUBJECT TO THIS CHAPTER
    (snip)
    (4) Retired members of a regular component of the armed forces who are entitled to pay.
    (snip)

  261. An arbitrator I know uses me as a sounding board on the cases he is handling. I do this for free so my warning to him is you get what you pay for, and he accepts my input for it is worth. He asked my advice on one particular case, which seemed simple and straightforward based on the facts established in the hearing. I gave him the obvious answer and he seemed troubled. I asked him why. He told me that the problem was he knew too much about the parties, the issue, and what was really going apart from what was pleaded and proven in the rarified environment of a courtroom.

    Later on I thought to myself that I have the same problem as it relates to Obama. To dismiss it as hate is to miss the fundamental point. We know too much, we have been through too much to accept the airbrushed image proffered by big media or to accept the integrity and finality of their judgments.

    When it comes to issues like the chain command Obama will demand the rule of law and will condemn any soldier who dares to speak out against him in a public forum whereas when bush was president he would have been called such a soldier a hero. By the same token we know that Obama will demand the rule of when it comes to Miranda rights for terrorists who are not Americans, but will decry the rule of law when it comes to protecting our borders.

    When dealing with such a man, it is hard to approach controversies with pure objectivity. We know too little and at the same time too much about his to approach these questions in an abstract manner.

  262. Reporter Michael Hastings explains the backstory to the piece that upended a general—and maybe even a war.
    ——————————-
    And voila! Another media star is born!! Like we need more of them.

    That said, what this guy has done a service to the country by exposing the conflict between the military and this uber political White House. Such rifts waste American lives and treasure.

    Judging from today’s headlines, Obama is not cool, not detached, not cerebrial. He is furious. That is the word his handlers want planted in the newspapers. And so it is. We are not interested in the seven faces of eve. We are interested in coherent policy decisions which in Obama’s case are conspicuous by their absence.

    Staged hissy fits are no substitute for leadership.

  263. “Good thing you’re not jumping to conclusions here.”

    Don’t play holier-than-thou after suggesting I wanted the General hanged, shadowfax. One good hyperbolic snark deserves another.

    Team America (childish name) is not going to save America by shredding the Constitution and undermining the office of the Presidency.

    The reality is that McChrystal is just flat out wrong. The reality is that the American people call the shots. We give the orders, they follow them. McChrystal would do well to remember that.

    The reality is that he just got a strong reminder, as military men sometimes do. The reality is that he is NOT commander-in-chief.

  264. “Rather it is the fact that you trust Obama to do what is right by the American People under the Constitution, whereas from the days of Rezko Obama is more inclined to do what is right for people like Soros.”

    And that is for the American people to correct in future elections, not for General McChrystal to stage a military coup.

    You clearly do not trust Americans to solve the Obama problem. You would rather a military dictatorship, but you will not get it.

    Neither McChrystal or Obama are bigger than the Constitution of this country or of the People. McChrystal got his reminder today. Obama will soon get his.

  265. “By the same token, it is not unlikely that Larry is right, and McCrystal never tried to undermine civilian control, believed the writer would discuss counter insurgency and was surprised as we were to learn that the writer took an entirely different tack that had nothing to do with the core discussion, but was calculated to shock and sell magazines.”

    Nice try but he read the article before publication, confirmed by both he and the author.

    You can twist yourself into pretzles until the cows come home trying to defend McChrystal, but the fact is he was wrong, insubordinate, and had to go.

    Civilian control of the military is sacrosanct and crucial to democracy. That’s the long and the short of it.

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