Blue Monday

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* * *

The Thanksgiving holiday is over. It’s a Blue Monday.

Wall Street keeps laying turkey sized eggs not seen since the 1930s.

Confirmation that the nation is in a recession and signs pointing to a prolonged downturn sent Wall Street plunging once again Monday, hurtling the Dow Jones industrials down more than 600 points and erasing a huge chunk of last week’s big gains. All the major indexes fell more than 7 percent.

In Chicago, Obama knows he’s not up to the job. Hillary therefore, contrary to our advice, put Country First, again.

Feel safer America, Hillary will answer the 3:00 a.m. call.

“Homeland Security” to us has always had a 1930s “Fatherland” whiff. Can’t we return to the term “mainland” or “lower 48” as a reference instead of “Homeland” and its Tomorrow Belongs To Me ugliness?

Now, there’s more to worry about:

The U.S. military expects to have 20,000 uniformed troops inside the United States by 2011 trained to help state and local officials respond to a nuclear terrorist attack or other domestic catastrophe, according to Pentagon officials.

The long-planned shift in the Defense Department’s role in homeland security was recently backed with funding and troop commitments after years of prodding by Congress and outside experts, defense analysts said.

There are critics of the change, in the military and among civil liberties groups and libertarians who express concern that the new homeland emphasis threatens to strain the military and possibly undermine the Posse Comitatus Act, a 130-year-old federal law restricting the military’s role in domestic law enforcement.

Obama’s convicted slumlord friend and home financier, Antoin “Tony” Rezko, is lonely.

Antoin “Tony” Rezko’s frustration over months in solitary confinement came to a boil this week as his attorneys filed a motion for the judge in his corruption case to immediately set a sentencing date for the convicted political fundraiser.

Sentencing had been put off in early October while Rezko’s lawyers and prosecutors discussed his potential cooperation in the federal investigation into possible pay-to-play schemes in the administration of Gov. Rod Blagojevich. Despite his possible willingness to aid the government, Rezko has remained in isolation at Chicago’s Metropolitan Correctional Center downtown, locked in a cell 23 hours a day.

“Mr. Rezko has remained in solitary confinement at the MCC since June 4, 2008, the day of the jury’s verdict, and can no longer agree to delay sentencing,” the new motion states, asking U.S. District Judge Amy St. Eve to set the earliest possible date to hand down Rezko’s punishment.

After a Blue Monday, things get better.

131 thoughts on “Blue Monday

  1. Maybe Mr. Rezko can do what no one else has yet to do so far; get Obama out of politics and behind bars. I’m sure Mr. Rezko has a fine voice. I bet he can sing, real purdy like.

  2. Antoin “Tony” Rezko’s frustration over months in solitary confinement came to a boil this week as his attorneys filed a motion for the judge in his corruption case to immediately set a sentencing date for the convicted political fundraiser.
    &&&&&

    Anyone know why he is in solitary? Isn’t that reserved for Paul Newman and Steve McQueen?

  3. Anyone know why he is in solitary? Isn’t that reserved for Paul Newman and Steve McQueen?
    ——————————
    or Mary Queen of Scotts in the tower of London

  4. Admin–

    if we substitue the word pardon for letter in the mail

    and–

    if we substitute the word lifer for soldier

    and —

    substitue the title Mr. Rezko for Mr. Lonely

    then I think we have a new hit–

    bots will be loading on their iphones soon

  5. Found a few interesting comments at NQ regarding birth cert:

    http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/12/01/obamas-presidency-sceptics-30-nov-08-open-thread-too/#more-7410

    Comment by Nobama4me | 2008-12-01 10:21:59

    Just heard on MSNBC that some group took a full page ad in one of the Chicago newspapers asking Obatic to fork his BC and prove to the Country that he is a natural born citizen. Of course, MSNBC being the mouthpiece of the President soon-to-be-elect, the hack Shuster said the ad is perpetuating a false Internet rumor that has been disproved times and again. Oh, well, at least they talked about it….

    &&&&&&&&&
    Comment by trixta | 2008-12-01 14:22:59

    Perhaps this is real the change we need — the acknowledgment that we indeed have a Constitution. What a novel idea!

    Obama needs to provide his BC, regardless of the consequences. If this country can’t survive that then our democratic Republic is just a thing of the past, a quaint idea. We’ve already lived in fear for most of these past eight years and I am sick of it! We need to fight and stand for something! Let’s start with our Constitution!

    I say, let’s test the Constitution to see how much of it we actually have left. This should be our cause as PUMAS, in my view, since so much of our Constitution and democracy have been shredded by both Parties.
    &&&&&&&&

    ## But, at the end, many of these like minded people were worried about
    ## riots, etc. if it was pressed…Would there really be riots?

    My reaction is that we don’t dismiss Constitutional requirements simply because a group of malcontents might riot. That sends a clear message that the threat of violence trumps law. We will at that point no longer be deserving of the term civilized and may as well start resolving all disputes with brute force.

  6. ** RUMOR **
    More from same NQ thread:

    Comment by bemused | 2008-12-01 11:45:58

    There is a rumor that SC and VA are going to demand that he show proof he is a qualified candidate. To me this is more hopeful than the Supreme Court dancing around trying to make the narrowest possible ruling, if any. Because, it allows many state citizens with grievances about the nomination and election to speak up, and also opens a peek at local fraud, and ACORN–in other words, I think it will be a lot harder to keep all the dirt down.

  7. Why is the United States Supreme Court agreeing to hear this case? Is it because:

    1) there are cases filed in multiple jurisdictions and they want to put an end to them with one comprehensive ruling which says in effect that he has met the requirements of Article 2 by producing this registration of live birth indicating Hawaii? or is it because

    2) the plaintiff has perhaps proffered a birth certificate stating he was born in Kenya which conflicts with the certificate of live birth certificate, in which case they may well put the burden of proof on Obama to produce a certificate settling the issue conclusively?

  8. Bush was the “change” candidate too:

    http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1208/The_change_candidate.html?showall

    GIBSON: But both candidates wound up criticizing you a lot.

    BUSH: Yes, well, that’s what happens when you’re the incumbent during a tough economic time, but —

    GIBSON: Hurt?

    BUSH: No, not really. You know, I’ve been around politics a long time. Remember, I was the guy in 2000 who campaigned for change. I campaigned for change when I ran for governor of Texas. The only time I really didn’t campaign for change is when I was running for reelection.

  9. Im happy for Hillary she will be the best ,at least we will be able to sleep
    at night.and her work ethic and smartness will keep us safe. She is still a Hughed star of 18 milion Voters with her intelligence,who will always support her for whatever she does.. The national security team people are intellectually smarter than him..
    We still dont know Barack Obama…

  10. This is what Bill said after this morning’s presser. It almost made me cry.

    As an American, I am thankful that President-elect Barack Obama has asked Hillary to be Secretary of State and that she has accepted. As her husband, I am deeply proud.

    She is the right person for the job of helping to restore America’s image abroad, end the war in Iraq, advance peace and increase our security, by building a future for our children with more partners and fewer adversaries, one of shared responsibilities and opportunities.

    She has already earned the respect of foreign leaders and diplomats through her work to promote human rights and the empowerment of women through access to education, healthcare and economic opportunity. And Americans know, from her leadership in the Senate on national security, that she will always put the security, values and the interests of our people first.

    In her service to the people of New York and our nation, Hillary has demonstrated the knowledge, passion, resilience, and capacity to learn that our country needs at this critical time. She loves being a Senator from New York, but as she has in all the thirty-seven years I’ve known her, she answered the call to serve. I commend President-Elect Obama for asking her to be a part of a great national security team. America will be well-served.

  11. LOL…it makes me feel all warm and fuzzy that the media is spinning on its head about Hillary’s potential appointment to SOS. I would venture to say that never in a million years did the media ever envision something like this taking place.

    Makes me feel a trickle down my leg just thinking about it! 😉

  12. It might just be worth watching some of the media thunkheads spin.

    Whatever possessed BO to appoint Hillary as SOS, I don’t know, but I am glad that she will be SOS. She will answer that 3 a.m. phone call, and I feel safer knowing that she will be there. SNL wasn’t too far from the truth.

  13. Campbell Brown…sigh…what a poor excuse for a media anchor. She wants to know what things Obama said were true and what were false during the campaign…i.e….about Hillary being qualified now but not before.

    I would throw this back at her and all the other media people who were in his pocket. Did you follow his agenda because it was so easy for you to rag on Hillary? Where was the truth in ANYTHING you reported during that time?

  14. Here are the transcript Q & A between BO and two reporters? at the presser this morning…these are the kind of reporters who belong at a London gossip sheet, in my opinion. And BO took care of both of them, publicly, (Emjay said grudgingly.)

    Asked by Peter Baker of NYT (who left WaPo 2 years ago when his wife Susan Glasser was removed as assistant managing editor of national news at WaPo) He then went to another paper, then the NYTMagazine, now with the paper…doesn’t always tell the full truth, picks and chooses which details or sources, if any, he is going to use……

    You’ve talked about the importance just now of having different voices and robust debate within your administration. But, again, going back to the campaign, you were asked and talked about the qualifications of the — your now, your nominee for secretary of state. And you belittled her travels around the word, equating it to having teas with foreign leaders. And your new White House council said that her resume was grossly exaggerated when it came to foreign policy. I’m wondering whether you can talk about the evolution of your views of her credentials since the spring.

    OBAMA: Well, I mean, I think — this is fun for the press to try to stir up whatever quotes were generated during the course of the campaign. No, I understand. And you’re having fun.

    But the — and there’s nothing wrong with that. I’m not — I’m not faulting it. But, look, I think if you look at the statements that Hillary Clinton and I have made outside of the heat of a campaign, we share a view that America has to be safe and secure. And in order to do that… we have to combine military power with strength and diplomacy. And we have to build and forge stronger alliances around the world so that we’re not carrying the burdens and these challenges by ourselves.

    I believe that there is no more effective advocate than Hillary Clinton for that well-rounded view of how we advance American interests. She has served on the Armed Services Committee in the Senate. She’s knows world leaders around the world. I have it extensive discussions with her both pre-election and post-election about the strategic opportunities that exist out there to strengthen American’s posture in the world.

    And I think she is going to be an outstanding secretary of state. And if I didn’t believe that, I wouldn’t have offered her the job.

    And if she didn’t believe that I was equipped to lead this nation in such a difficult time, she would not have accepted.

    (He should have been more mature and left that last bit out, (emjay)

    ————————————————————————————————————————————
    John McCormack. Where’s John?

    QUESTION: Thank you, Mr. President-elect.

    You’re known as a pretty good storyteller. Can you tell us a little bit of a story about how Senator Clinton was selected for this job? Was there a seminal moment? How was the offered extended? Can you give us some detail on how it was accepted and kind of the negotiation process that was involved here?

    OBAMA: With respect to Senator and soon-to-be, Secretary of State Clinton, it was not a light bulb moment. I have always admired Senator Clinton. We have worked together extensively in the Senate. I have always believed that she is tough and smart and disciplined and that she shares my core values and the core values of the American people.

    And so I was always interested after the primary was over in finding ways in which we could collaborate. After the election was over and I began to think about my team, it occurred to me that she could potentially be an outstanding secretary of state. I extended her the offer and she accepted.

    I know that’s not as juicy a story as you were hoping for, but that’s all you’re going to get, John. Thanks.
    ———————————————

    I love it when the MSM gets publicly slapped around a little, especially when they think they have a public figure (or a private one, like Joe the Plumber) by the short hairs in a public venue.

  15. Actually I like that they asked those questions. I don’t think they are looking for any juicy gossip but that would be the predominant question in my mind if I were a 0bot. It is like 0bot telling 0bama: “you sent all those propaganda Hillary hate via email and your media to turn us against her and now you want us to believe that you always thought she was all that.” He says what he said which should at the very least indicate the deception that his campaign was. It is up to those bozos now to figure out that they were taken for a ride. They were hoodwinked. They were bamboozled. He is not the transformational leader they thought he was but a Chicago politician who will say whatever needs to be said to con people to do what he wants. They did what he wanted.

  16. From the biggest egotist in the Chicago Obama headqtrs right now:

    BIDEN: Well, ***Mr. President,*** you’ve assembled quite a team. And I hope and believe that the American people will come to feel as I do that ***we*** brought together one of the most talented national security teams ever assembled. A team prepared to meet the serious challenges we face today and the emerging threats that will confront us tomorrow.

    I have worked with and admired each of the members of the team some as far as back in days, Jim, when you were a Marine liaison to the United States Senate. And so we have a –** I **have a long relationship, with each of these folks.

    ——————————————

    Like I said this morning, how arrogant!

    I think he and Bobo are going to have the Kennedy-Johnston problem.

    I’ll bet $5 bucks right now that, if BO goes for a second term, Joe will not be on the ticket.

  17. Emjay, I like that Biden is saying all that. It shows he is feeling the pinch of being left out.

    {also, I saw the moon, jupiter, venus, threesome in the evening you had mentioned on the board. it was awesome.}

  18. sounds to me as if Biden isn’t going to be a team player…lol… I can’t see Obama wanting to put him in the spotlight too often, yet I can see Biden pushing his way into it anyway. 😉

  19. Campbell Brown…sigh…what a poor excuse for a media anchor. She wants to know what things Obama said were true and what were false during the campaign…i.e….about Hillary being qualified now but not before.

    I would throw this back at her and all the other media people who were in his pocket. Did you follow his agenda because it was so easy for you to rag on Hillary? Where was the truth in ANYTHING you reported during that time?
    —————————————
    Jan- well said. They firmly believed he would follow their agenda when he got in office, and part of that agenda was to bury the clintons–remember those obituaries they wrote? At the time I quoted Mark Twain i.e. rumors of my untimely death have been greatly exaggerated–and now it turns out they were. Also, I fully expect that some of them were promised the press secretary job–Linda Douglass, David Gergen, Tweetie that more than one of them were promised secretary job which he gave to Plouffe. That would have been Axelrod’s doing. No loyalty among thieves.

  20. sounds to me as if Biden isn’t going to be a team player…lol… I can’t see Obama wanting to put him in the spotlight too often, yet I can see Biden pushing his way into it anyway.
    —————————————–
    Jan- you are probably right. But his serial gaffs and proclivity for shooting himself in the foot, and dancing with John Barlecorn (liquor) now and then and most now and forever can be a wonderful distaction for the press. Also he could go into the business of forecasting disasters and become a 21st century Nostardamus. The more you think about it the more you realize what a valuable man he really is. I bet when they vetted him with foreign governments they said Joe, uh uh Joe ohhhh Biden- quien sabe.

  21. Paula, I think I read from Emjay’s post that they won’t line up like that for another 32 years. Well, I won’t be there for its next appearance and I was happy to catch it tonight.

  22. wbboei,

    It’s also amusing to see the confusion among the media about the SOS appointment. Crowley told Dobbs that most of the officials she had talked to were very much on board with Hillary being tapped for SOS. She almost seemed disappointed…lol…little scandal-monger that she is.

  23. haven’t had a chance to read read anything since shortly after 1 pm (pie plate breakdown again) but have to respond to Kerry’s ‘classy’ response to Bobo’s security team…

    Class My A$$______________________________!

    He started a public self lobbying effort, talked incessently about his power, his backing, his qualifications.

    It was so like him and so embarrassing. Someone must have told him to shut up, but it was too late…the damage had been done. Once again, Pickleface was a laughingstock, and this time cannot be “rehabilitated,” as some wag on NPR said about Stephanie Power this afternoon.

    Re Power, who pulled that string?

  24. Bill Clinton’s statement was on the other thread. I want to repost it, because it is so very classy.

    “As an American, I am thankful that President-elect Barack Obama has asked Hillary to be Secretary of State and that she has accepted. As her husband, I am deeply proud.

    She is the right person for the job of helping to restore America’s image abroad, end the war in Iraq, advance peace and increase our security, by building a future for our children with more partners and fewer adversaries, one of shared responsibilities and opportunities.

    She has already earned the respect of foreign leaders and diplomats through her work to promote human rights and the empowerment of women through access to education, healthcare and economic opportunity. And Americans know, from her leadership in the Senate on national security, that she will always put the security, values and the interests of our people first.

    In her service to the people of New York and our nation, Hillary has demonstrated the knowledge, passion, resilience, and capacity to learn that our country needs at this critical time. She loves being a Senator from New York, but as she has in all the thirty-seven years I’ve known her, she answered the call to serve. I commend President-Elect Obama for asking her to be a part of a great national security team. America will be well-served”

  25. oops. Paula posted the Bill Clinton comment above. But, I don’t think anyone will mind, that I reposted it. 🙂

  26. I tell you one thing, Big Media and their friends on the blogosphere better watch their heads…they think they have all this power right now and some consider themselves idol makers.

    Obama just put them on noticed they’d been played. Those who didn’t conduct themselves as professional journalist and instead became propagandists have only hurt their own credibility and trustworthiness.

    Obama doesn’t trust you as far as he can throw you…..he saw how you turned on the Clintons and he knows that if you would turn on the Clintons as quick as you did, he knows “snap” he’s cooked.

    What I find so Machiavellian about this, is that Big Media and their “tin horns” still think they are in charge. NO, they have been played at the expense of what little credibility they once had.

    Christopher Hitchins that elitist from Reuters that has been proven completely ineffective and shown how terribly incompetent with his narcissistic, bombastic pronouncments of pseudo intelligentsia “horse manure” that couldn’t even fertilize a 3x3x8 plot of land to feed his own self. That’s how empty his rhetoric is, because we now his ideas are flawed and worthless.

  27. Hawkish Obama names Clinton as top diplomat
    37 minutes ago

    CHICAGO (AFP) — Barack Obama nominated Hillary Clinton to be a “tough” secretary of state and persuaded Defense Secretary Robert Gates to stay on but gave him a new mission — ending the war in Iraq.

    Debuting his national security team in Chicago, the president-elect said the decision to enlist his former bitter political foe came not in a “light bulb moment” but after a gradual realization she was the best face for US diplomacy. (Yeah, Joe Biden is crazy.)

    “She’s an American of tremendous stature who will have my complete confidence, who knows many of the world’s leaders, who will command respect in every capital,” Obama said.

    Clinton , who must now give up her beloved New York Senate seat and narrowly lost a bitter Democratic nominating battle to Obama, vowed she would give “this assignment, your administration and my country, my all.”

    In her new job, the latest stunning twist in the Clinton political saga, the former first lady said she would ignite new momentum in US diplomacy after the frayed alliances and recriminations of George W. Bush’s presidency.

    “The American people have demanded not just a new direction at home, but a new effort to renew America’s standing in the world as a force for positive change,” she said.

    While stressing the importance of diplomacy, Obama struck hawkish notes which may discomfort some of his more dovish backers, warning the United States should keep the world’s strongest military and would chase down terrorists. (Thown under the bus)

    “In this uncertain world, the time has come for a new beginning, a new dawn of American leadership to overcome the challenges of the 21st century,” Obama said, days after the Mumbai terror attacks sparked a new foreign crisis.

    The decision to ask Gates to stay on was meant to send a clear sign of continuity with America locked in wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.

    Gates said he had decided that with US troops fighting abroad, he felt obligated to stay at the Pentagon.

    “I must do my duty as they do theirs. How could I do otherwise?” Gates said.

    But Obama made clear that after campaigning on a vow to end the war in Iraq, Gates must follow a new political master.

    “I will be giving Secretary Gates and our military a new mission as soon as I take office, responsibly ending the war in Iraq through a successful transition to Iraqi control,” said Obama, who is to be inaugurated January 20.

    “As Bob (Gates) said not too long ago, Afghanistan is where the war on terror began, and it is where it must end.”

    Obama also sent a clear signal to US foes that his well known opposition to the Iraq war would not mean he would hesitate to commit military force if US interests were threatened.

    “To ensure prosperity here at home and peace abroad, we all share the belief we have to maintain the strongest military on the planet,” Obama said.

    Obama also named former NATO commander and marine general James Jones to be his national security advisor in a foreign policy line-up rich in global experience and wise in the ways of brutal back corridor Washington politics.

    The new team will take up the reins in January and will have to get US troops home from Iraq, deal with Iran’s nuclear drive, and mitigate deteriorating conditions in the Afghan war.

    They must confront a resurgent Russia, repair tattered US ties abroad, and target global warming efforts, while the widening financial crisis threatens to further destabilize fragile world security.

    France and the European Union immediately hailed Clinton’s nomination, saying they could work closely together, while Russia struck a pessimistic note.

    “These nominations inspire no optimism whatsoever,” the Russian lower house’s foreign affairs commission chief, Konstantin Kossachev, was quoted as saying by Interfax news agency.

    Obama introduced his foreign policy advisor Susan Rice , who has a hawkish view on using force to halt genocide, as the next US permanent representative to the United Nations and former justice department official Eric Holder as Attorney General.

    Arizona governor Janet Napolitano was meanwhile named Homeland Security chief, at a press conference which saw Obama flanked by his new team, against a backdrop of American flags.

    The president-elect was careful not to intervene in ongoing US diplomatic efforts to quell tensions in South Asia following last week’s Mumbai rampage which killed more than 170 people including six Americans.

    But he said he had been repeatedly briefed by Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, who heads to India this week, and had spoken to Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh over the weekend.

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5j_mAjk-NFrMBu6nYZpeT6ARnacnQ

  28. Hillary Clinton’s Disdain for International Law — Change We Can Believe In?

    By Stephen Zunes, AlterNet. Posted December 1, 2008.

    For those hoping for a dramatic change in U.S. foreign policy under an Obama administration — particularly regarding human rights, international law, and respect for international institutions — the appointment of Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State is a bitter disappointment. Indeed, Senator Clinton has more often than not sided with the Bush administration against fellow Democrats on key issues regarding America’s international legal obligations, particularly international humanitarian law.

    This will be particularly disappointing for those in the international community who were so positive about Obama’s election as president. The selection of Hillary Clinton, at best, represents a return to the policies of her husband’s administration.

    Because the Bush administration had taken things to new lows, many seem to have forgotten the fact that the Clinton administration had also greatly alienated the international community. Regarding Iraq, Iran and Israel, the Clinton administration engaged in a series of policies which put the United States sharply at odds with most of its Western allies and a broad consensus of international legal scholars. And these were not the only issues during the Clinton years over which the United States found itself isolated from the rest of the international community: there was U.S. opposition to the land mine treaty, the strengthening of the embargo against Cuba, support for Morocco’s occupation of Western Sahara, foot-dragging on the Kyoto Protocols, support for Turkey’s vicious military offensive in the Kurdish regions of that country, among others.

    Even worse, Hillary Clinton allied herself with the Bush administration on many its most controversial actions, such as the 2003 invasion of Iraq, threats of war against Iran, support for Israel’s 2006 offensive against Lebanon and 2002 offensive in the West Bank, opposition to the International Criminal Court, attacks against the International Court of Justice, and support for the unrestricted export of cluster bombs and other anti-personnel munitions used against civilian targets.
    continue….

    http://www.alternet.org/audits/109264/hillary_clinton‘s_disdain_for_international_law_–_change_we_can_believe_in_/
    *****************************************************
    This is a long article but it is very interesting how Obama’s campaign slogan Clinton/Bush resonated with these Kool-aid drinkers. I’m still amazed at how nothing in Obama’s background supported their ideals, in fact his actions (votes) has always been opposite to his rhetoric.

  29. gonzotx Says:

    December 1st, 2008 at 11:09 pm
    What about that Powers thing? Please tell me Hillary will have nothing to do with her?
    —————————————
    Powers should go back to teaching at Harvard where she will do no harm. Public life is not for her. She is a gaffmaster, a bridge burner, a self promoter, and a Machiavellian. Snakebit in other words. Not somebody you want to have around.

  30. pm317 Says:
    December 1st, 2008 at 8:47 pm
    Actually I like that they asked those questions. I don’t think they are looking for any juicy gossip but that would be the predominant question in my mind if I were a 0bot. It is like 0bot telling 0bama: “you sent all those propaganda Hillary hate via email and your media to turn us against her and now you want us to believe that you always thought she was all that.” He says what he said which should at the very least indicate the deception that his campaign was. ======== BETTER LATE THAN NEVER. FINALLY CHALLENGING HIS LIES.

  31. I still do not like Hillary accepting SOS as she will be serving at the will of the President and can be fired at any time. That said she will make a great SOS as long as she is given free reign and not being tethered on an Obama leash.

    The funny thing is that “3:00 am Call” ad must have really hit Obama’s inner circle right in the gut because they knew it was true.

  32. It’s also amusing to see the confusion among the media about the SOS appointment. Crowley told Dobbs that most of the officials she had talked to were very much on board with Hillary being tapped for SOS. She almost seemed disappointed…lol…little scandal-monger that she is.
    ———————————————————–
    The press and the bots are going through the early stages of hopium withdrawal on the one hand and Clinton delusion syndrome on the other which is a double hit. The appointment of Hillary hits them on both fronts and it is not present. You can be pretty sure that with a yound twit like Crowley when she says most officials were unboard, the truth is she could find no official who would go on record against it.

    And that is the problem with these young petty patriarical women like Crawley, and that she thinks she is a prom queen Campbell Brown. They take on this I hate Hillary air so they can appear to be battleworn, skeptical and sophisticated. Who do they think they are kidding?

    Maybe it works in the sordid world of cnn where camera men pull their pants down and hang themsleves from trees in Central Park (the initial details were sketchy and I had hoped to hear it was Cafferty– not this time), but the rest of us do weary of it and at the end of the day they just look ridiculous.

  33. “Free At Last”.In the words of MLK she has freed herself from MSM large and small local and national fair and unbalanced.Yes
    boys she has won the media battle to deystroy her and the DNC is going to be in a shambles for as long as she stands on the world stage and fights for peace prosperity for all.She is now the most important woman in the world and welcomed everywhere in the name of humanity.Obama will be reduced to an insignificant
    inexperienced and untrustworthy head of state and our Allies will
    will call on Hillary for her calm toughness and understanding of their needs and will always be ready for them at any time.
    Yes Media you LOST and she WON!!!!!!

    BY ABM90 A confident and upbeat faithful Hillary Devotee.

  34. GALLINGTON: The Clinton coup
    Daniel Gallington
    COMMENTARY:

    The big news from the Obama transition was the announcement of the new “national security team.” But that’s not the big story. The big story is how Hillary Clinton – as the next secretary of state – will impact on the bureaucratic struggles over U.S. foreign policy and national security affairs in Washington.

    The most obvious tension (and over her selection itself) would have already happened with Vice President Joe Biden – who fancies himself a foreign policy guru – and who would have surely urged President-elect Obama to name a much weaker secretary of state. In fact, Mr. Biden was betrayed by the Clinton choice: After all, Mr. Biden was picked to shore up Mr. Obama’s deservedly “rookie” foreign policy image, and was expecting to have a significant foreign policy role, a la Dick Cheney – but not now, not ever.

    Do you think Secretary of State Hillary Clinton intends to pay any attention to what Vice President Joe Biden thinks? Nope, she doesn’t work for Mr. Biden and will make that clear to him if it becomes necessary. So, like Al Gore before him, expect Mr. Biden to be marginalized – totally – in foreign policy and national security matters. However, and for most conservatives – who shuddered at the thought of Mr. Biden’s (and Mr. Gore’s) influence – this will be regarded as a very good thing. Nevertheless – and an interesting “indicator” to watch from here on out – will be the nature and extent of Mr. Biden’s official foreign visits, which will be jealously monitored by the Clinton State Department. He will go to official state funerals, however.

    Appointing Mrs. Clinton as secretary of state also weakens the traditional National Security Council structure – and the personal stature of the national security adviser. The proof? In the past, when the stronger and “better connected” personality is at State (or Defense, as with Donald Rumsfeld), a much weaker personal status has resulted for the national security adviser. Remember the Kissinger move to State? He took his influence and access with him. It was consistent with this reality for the appointment of a career military officer – James Jones – as the national security adviser. Gen. Jones may already know not to “mess with” Hillary Clinton when it comes to policy matters – if he doesn’t, he has a very tough time in store. His job was – and is – to be the token Democratic (and resident intellectual) senior military officer, and Mrs. Clinton will not have much of anything to do with him: She will regard him as a policy “coordinator” only.

    In this respect, and very significant in Mrs. Clinton’s coup, is the recent report that Hillary will have “direct access” to the president. Translation: this is “official notice” that the new secretary of state plans to bureaucratically ignore the NSC and the national security adviser. There will be few, if any, White House (read Joe Biden) people – other than the president – with any influence over Mrs. Clinton. That will occur only when Gen. Jones and/or Mr. Biden convince the president to “tell Clinton something” – that simply won’t happen very often, if ever.

    We can also expect to soon see deputy secretaries (or even lower) at the NSC “principals” meetings, heretofore attended personally by the secretaries of state and defense. After all, you don’t think Mrs. Clinton will attend meetings called by some – i.e., Gen. Jones – White House staffer? And you don’t expect to see the defense secretary attending NSC meetings that Mrs. Clinton only sends a deputy to, do you? As a result, Hillary will only show up at meetings chaired by her president.

    The bottom line: If she couldn’t be president, you can be sure Mrs. Clinton wanted to be secretary of state, and further, that she will not regard it as a demotion from being first lady when she had direct access to -and influence on – the president, albeit of a different kind.

    To complete the Clinton foreign policy coup, look for a politically weaker (and nominal Republican) figure for the longer term at the Pentagon. My guess for the defense secretary (after the interim carry over of Robert Gates) is Colin Powell, the ultimate Washington policy-waffler, who endorsed Mr. Obama after it was obvious to most that Mr. Obama would win. So, while connected Democrats (e.g., Mrs. Clinton) clearly won’t trust Mr. Powell – because he might turn on them – they may need him at Defense to moderate its policy influence.

    Meanwhile, Mr. Gates’ interim job at Defense – primarily – will be to finish taking the blame for the Bush failure in Iraq.

    What about the influence of the outgoing secretary at State? Condoleezza Rice is an academic, and, shares more with Madeleine Albright than most might first think. Expect to see both Miss Rice and Mrs. Albright serving as functional advisers to Mrs. Clinton; this would be a very smart move on Mrs. Clinton’s part, and allow her to deflect – politically – away from policy decisions that turned out badly for her.

    Perhaps ironically, Miss Rice had already started the transformation of U.S. foreign policy back to its more traditional – and liberal – views. And, while she wasn’t the pushover Colin Powell was for the softer institutional State line on issues, she was at odds with most everything the Rumsfeld Defense Department had to say. Recall also that after Mr. Rumsfeld resigned, there was the installation of Mr. Gates, a perceptively much weaker defense secretary (at least when compared to Mr. Rumsfeld) and this has played out to be the “end game” for the Bush second term, as far as national security policies are concerned.

    As a result of these dynamics, the transition at State from Miss Rice to Mrs. Clinton will be quite subtle – perhaps even seamless. However, in the coming years we can expect to see much more “internationalism,” with regard to a whole range of foreign and national security policy issues – and Miss Rice has clearly set the stage for this.

    What external events could alter the near-term directions for our national security and foreign policy?

    — Another terrorist attack at home.

    — A militarily belligerent Iran or North Korea.

    — A militarily belligerent Russia – particularly against new NATO (and former Warsaw Pact) members.

    Unfortunately, any or all of these events are likely – especially during the first year of the new administration.

    Daniel Gallington is a senior fellow at the Potomac Institute for Policy Studies, in Arlington, Va. He held a series of senior national security policy positions.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/dec/02/the-clinton-coup/

  35. Carby New! I am ROTFLMAO!!!!!! (Good to see you back)

    “What I find so Machiavellian about this, is that Big Media and their “tin horns” still think they are in charge. NO, they have been played at the expense of what little credibility they once had.

    Christopher Hitchins that elitist from Reuters that has been proven completely ineffective and shown how terribly incompetent with his narcissistic, bombastic pronouncments of pseudo intelligentsia “horse manure” that couldn’t even fertilize a 3×3×8 plot of land to feed his own self. That’s how empty his rhetoric is, because we now his ideas are flawed and worthless.”

    But I haveta admit I am completely disillusioned by HRC accepting SOS. I’m still suffering the aftermath of a bad case of BODS (BO derangement syndrome)has done and I don’t expect to recover until he’s out of office. She (IMHO) has betrayed her supporters and the country by throwing her hat in the ring with that lying fraudulent POS. I want my 1G back.

    😡

  36. Clinton stars in Obama team

    THERE is something about Hillary Clinton. She is not very tall, she is a conservative dresser, but when she enters a room she fills the space, even when she shares it with the president-elect.

    On Monday, when Barack Obama and his choice as vice-president, Joe Biden, stood before eight American flags crowned with gilded eagles and revealed the names of the six top members of his national security team, it was the petite woman in the inky navy pantsuit who was the centre of attention.

    No matter that on one side stood the first African-American attorney-general of the US, Eric Holder, and the long-standing Bush Administration official Robert Gates, who has agreed to stay on to end the Iraq war he has been running for two years.

    Or that on the other side she was dwarfed by Jim Jones, a former supreme allied commander of the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation, a physically imposing former marine who makes Mr Obama look puny.

    The fascination with Mr Obama’s national security team lies entirely in Hillary Clinton, who will be secretary of state – and how the once-fierce rivals will find a way to work together, as they inevitably must.

    Will this team of rivals work the way the president-elect hopes? Or will it be the “clash of rivals” that will crash and burn and provide the Washington media with the most thrilling tale of power and ambition?

    The first challenges of accommodating such big personalities were clear at the news conference when it came to who should speak. Last week the new economic team stood mute beside Mr Obama as he explained his choices for these important roles.

    In contrast, every one of the national security team – and Senator Biden – had something to say on Monday. Once the decision was made to allow Senator Clinton time at the lectern, the others also had to have the right to explain their vision for the job.

    Mr Obama heralded “a new dawn of American leadership” and lavished praise on Senator Clinton.

    She promised loyalty and asked God to bless the new president and his administration.

    Everyone else spoke about how humbled and honoured they were to serve.

    Senator Biden called it the “most talented national security team ever assembled”.

    But will these individually brilliant people be able to find common purpose in their new mission to restore America’s place in the world?

    Mr Obama said he preferred to have strong-minded people with strong opinions around him.

    He chided the media, saying the far bigger risk in the White House was the tendency towards “group think”.

    But then came the inevitable questions about the less-than-flattering things Mr Obama said of Senator Clinton during the primaries, and vice versa – such as the time he said that being first lady basically involved having tea with foreign dignitaries.

    And the lacerating comment by a surrogate, Greg Craig, now Mr Obama’s White House counsel, who described her foreign affairs experience as “thin”.

    And what of Senator Clinton’s derisive remarks about Mr Obama’s lack of experience to be commander-in-chief?

    A testy Mr Obama accused the media of playing a Washington game of dredging through old file footage to score points.

    He will certainly receive frank and fearless advice.

    The challenge for the new president will be to continue to steer his own course amid such strong personalities.

    http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/clinton-stars-in-obama-team/2008/12/02/1227980018985.html
    *****************************************************
    There is a fascinating photo on the site that gives a perceptive view of the dynamics in the room. Notice Susan Rice (Obama’s advisor) is no where in the frame.

  37. GALLINGTON: The Clinton coup
    Daniel Gallington
    COMMENTARY:
    ————————————
    Thanks Carby: it is a good article and for what it is worth I agree with it mostly. The one area he may be misreading slightly is the Jim Jones piece. Time will tell, but I believe Hillary will see him as an asset and rely upon him for good advice on the military aspects of Iraq and Afganistan. Part of his job, I assume, will be to sort through what the generals are telling him, and give a reality check to withdawal plans forged in the cauldron of political expediency. Interestingly, Iraq withdrawal will continue to be the galvanizing issue of the far left, and the appointment of Jones gives Hillary some cover on that. Regardless of what the bots want she will not allow a failed state to materialize and the withdrawal timetable will be predicated on the ability of Iraqi troops to defend the government and the people. My assumption, based on little or no hard evidence is that they are ready to assume that role in large parts of the country now. That plus political exignence plus economic necessity will get things moving sooner rather than later but not soon enough to satisfy the bots.

  38. THERE is something about Hillary Clinton. She is not very tall, she is a conservative dresser, but when she enters a room she fills the space, even when she shares it with the president-elect.
    ———————————————
    No question about that.

  39. carbynew Says:

    December 2nd, 2008 at 9:15 am
    Clinton stars in Obama team
    ———————————–
    Yes, a very very revealing picture. It must break the hearts of big media to see this happen. I started to say I wished pumpkinhead was alive to see it, but fortunately I caught myself. He is better off where he is and so are we. I rely on St Peters discretion and ability to spot a four flusher when he sees on when I say that.

  40. wbboei Says:
    The one area he may be misreading slightly is the Jim Jones piece. Time will tell, but I believe Hillary will see him as an asset and rely upon him for good advice on the military aspects of Iraq and Afganistan. Part of his job, I assume, will be to sort through what the generals are telling him, and give a reality check to withdawal plans forged in the cauldron of political expediency.
    *****************************************************
    I too agree with the article and thought his take on Jim Jones was a little simplistic…not disagreeing with the reality but his take on him only as a “coordinator.”

    I thought that was a little bit simplistic and limiting…your take seem/feel more right.

    I don’t know Daniel Gallington political “bent”…is he a conservative or neo conservative? He sound like a neo conservative but I don’t know, just guessing.

    RE: The Far Left…I don’t trust them at all because too many of them have been infiltrated by those who hate this country.

  41. http://www.dcexaminer.com >> OpinionNov 6, 2008 … Daniel Gallington was a liberal “D” in the 60’s – now, he’s more of a conservative “R” with some definite libertarian leanings.

    The outfit he works for Potomic Institute is a think tank on security related matters, etc. His prior government experience in in that area as well.

    I dont think he is a neocon in the New American Century mode. Frankly I dont know how to label him.

  42. “THERE is something about Hillary Clinton. She is not very tall, she is a conservative dresser, but when she enters a room she fills the space, even when she shares it with the president-elect.”

    *********************************************************

    And Obama knows it! He hates the fact that she has such an amazing presence as well as being liked internationally. Both of these factors are something he may never have. His adoring crowds are gone. Now he has to impress people who can run circles around him where experience and knowledge are concerned. His only choice was to surround himself with the likes of Hillary so that his own frailties wouldn’t be as noticible. He will take credit, fumble with explanations of policies that are not really of his making, and need tutorials to understand basic governing 101.

  43. carbynew: That photo of the team does speak volumes. Both BO and Senator or Madame Secretary look very comfortable together. It must drive the bots crazy, just like it does with some of us. It seems to be a good team, and I wish them the very best.

    Someone was asking about Powers. I believe, she is on the state department transition team, but will not have a formal role in the state department. Hopefully, she will return to teaching at Harvard.

  44. The people who look stupid here are the press. They did not do their job. They drank the Kool Aidd Hook Line and Sinker, and now who looks foolish. It is not O, as politicians say what ever they have to get elected.

    It is the press, as it is their job to question these people, and they did not do their job.

    I don’t like seeing her as SOS, but I still take satisfaction in the fact that she beat out Kerry and Richardson who sold their souls to O. It would be sweet to have BC get her job in New York. I am also glad that NM is rid of Richardson, and Diane Denish, who was a avid HRC support will be given a change to perform as Governer which will help us get her elected into the job soon.

    There are also rumors that the Mayor of Albuquerque, another HRC supporter, might have a role in her SOS position. These two people in NM worked hard for her and deserve some rewards.

  45. NMF,

    That’s the only silver lining, IMHO.

    ‘I don’t like seeing her as SOS, but I still take satisfaction in the fact that she beat out Kerry and Richardson…’

  46. Isn’t it ironic, that a woman who has been vilified and pilloried in the MSM, as polarizing, divisive, dishonest, calculating, etc., has been named as SOS? The pundits must be going nuts.

  47. Alaska Senator Murkowski Not Entertained By Potential Palin Run
    By The Staff at wowOwow.com

    Alaska Senator Lisa Murkowski minces no words when it comes to rumors that fellow Republican Sarah Palin may try to take her job. “I can guarantee it would be a very tough election,” said the Senator. And she’s right – both women, who look like they could be sisters, are enormously popular in their home state, raking in about 80% in approval ratings.

    Some speculate that Palin, who failed to achieve a White House win as John McCain’s running mate, will run for Senate to boost her national image and position herself for a possible 2012 presidential run. Murkowski, however, discounts such logic. First, says Murkowski, a loss would prove devastating for her national image, nor does she see a win as a direct route to the White House, “If she wants to be president, I don’t think the way to the presidency is a short stop in the United States Senate.” Meow!

    Also, if Palin did win, she would become a junior Senator, one who lacks the authority or position to prove truly effective. And that point raises even larger issues of seniority. If Palin ran, she would be undercutting her own party’s power – a big no no in the political sphere. “One thing that Alaskans clearly appreciate is seniority,” remarked Murkowski. “If she were to kind of move me over, if you will, to run for national office again at the expense at this seniority that’s been built, I don’t know if Alaskans would look too favorably on that.”

    Murkowski’s criticsm may be a bit personal – Palin defeated her father in the 2002 Gubernatorial election and often touted the fact that she routing out the state’s “old boys network.” Many assume, of course, that the Governor was speaking directly about Murkowski’s father. When asked about those remarks a few months ago, Murkowski apparently cut the interview short.

    While considering her home state situation and her presidential prospects, Palin should also keep in mind Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal. Top John McCain strategist Steve Schmidt this week predicted that it isn’t a question of “if,” but “when” Jindal will be elected president. Apparently Schmidt doesn’t have high hopes for Palin, either. Perhaps the good Governor should be happy with what she has: a relatively powerful position and star power, both of which could be tarnished if she runs – and loses – in the 2010 Senate run.

    http://www.wowowow.com/post/alaska-senator-murkowski-not-entertained-potential-palin-run-150713
    *****************************************************
    This is what I found interesting aout this article…The Republican base love Sarah Palin and they think the McCain campaign handled her terribly wrong and did not protect her, in fact many feel they purposely sabataged her with the team they put around her and the leaks.

    I don’t see anyone talking about having a women president, no matter how accomplished or worthy for that job. No one is floating the idea of having a woman leader from any party.

    I blame these weak outdated women groups who have wasted decades by getting out manuvered…if we want to see women in more leadership roles then we better start supporting strong women candidates from both parties or we will see another repeat of what happened to Hillary Clinton this year.

    http://www.teamsarah.org

  48. As I previously stated, I regret her accepting, not b/c she could not be the finest SOS in history, but because as we have seen both weeks prior to, and the day after she was announced, what we shall see for at least the next four (4) years….specifically, the unrelenting attacks from MSM and the double standard that will be applied to Hillary. Just watching the pundits last night from Eugene Robinson( has always been a Clinton hater or did his black pride just ripple over this election) to the ass clowns they had on Fox and CNN, I am absolutely convinced more thana ever that Hillary will be the fall gal for all that goes wrong…

  49. So I wonder how the women’s groups feel now that HRC has a strong role of SOS. I don’t think they counted on that.

    I have been reading on AOL about the BC stuff. They do not state it has been verified that he was born in Hawaii. They state only that they have been shown a BC, but that you can get a Hawaii BC and be born somewhere else. They also point out the the PA law suit was not dismissed because of frivolious, but because they the court felt they were not entitled to bring the law suit. It is amazinging how things get twisted. Again the only authority given by a poster was the fackcheck one. That is a volunteer group, and really not entitiled to legal documents.

    I WANT TO KNOW WHY THE VITAL RECORDS PERSON OF HAWAII HAS NOT STOOD ON THE FRONT STEPS OF THE COURT HOUSE WITH O’s BC AND STATED HE IS A LEGALLY BORN CITIZEN OF THE US. I would have thought he would have done this long again. I did not realize (stated in the last post), that any legal treaties etc he would sign would be illegal.

    I had also wondered about, if verified he is not eligible by the consitution to be President, how the replacement would go before Jan 20 vs after.

    For some reason I always felt that HRC would have a role in a McCain administration.

  50. Bill Clinton not interested in wife’s Senate

    By Paul Steinhauser
    CNN Deputy Political Editor

    WASHINGTON (CNN — Former President Bill Clinton has no interest in replacing his wife in the U.S. Senate, his spokesman said, adding any speculation that he would be interested is “completely false.”

    Former president Bill Clinton’s spokesman said he will continue to expand the work of his foundation.

    As Hillary Clinton prepares to make the move from Capitol Hill to the incoming administration following her nomination yesterday as President-elect Barack Obama’s Secretary of State, the race is on to replace her in the Senate.

    Monday Hillary Clinton said “leaving the Senate is very difficult for me.”

    The task of choosing a successor to Clinton will be just as tough. That job falls to David Paterson, New York’s Democratic governor.

    A spokesman for Hillary Clinton said the senator will remain in office through her confirmation, and Paterson said Monday that he’ll announce his choice in January.

    The replacement will serve for two years, then a special election will be held in November 2010 to decide who will fill out the final two years of Clinton’s term.

    Paterson, who has already taken himself out of the running, has a strong bench to choose from. There are a number of possible contenders, including at least a half dozen members of New York’s delegation in the House of Representatives, New York State Attorney General Andrew Cuomo, Buffalo Mayor Byron Brown, Bronx Borough President Adolfo Carrion, Nassau County Executive Thomas Suozzi, Caroline Kennedy and her cousin, Robert Kennedy Jr..

    But some were suggesting that the former president replace his wife. In an op-ed last week in the Washington Post, journalist and author Karl Meyer and his wife urged Patterson to “send Bill Clinton to the Senate.”

    Responding to such speculation, Clinton spokesman Matt McKenna tells CNN that “it’s completely false. President Clinton is excited to expand the work of his foundation which has more than 1,000 staff and volunteers in 44 countries advancing projects on HIV/AIDS, climate change, sustainable economic development and childhood obesity.”

    Only two former presidents have made the move from the White House to Capitol Hill. President John Quincy Adams lost his re-election bid in 1828. Two years later he returned to Washington after winning election as a congressman from his home state of Massachusetts. He served in the House of Representatives until his death in 1848.

    President Andrew Johnson, who served out the remainder of President Abraham Lincoln’s term, also served briefly in the Senate in 1875, seven years after Congress voted to impeach him.

    http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/12/02/bill.clinton.senate/

  51. One of the big issue with me is how the left and the media made such a big issue about his donor list to his foundation. I still feel it is wrong to make those names public. I don’t have a problem with turning the names over to Team Obama as a matter of review but all the speculations and rumors that Pres. Clinton donor lists was suspect was insulting to me ( I donated) and any other person who may have donated.

    What gets me is that Bill and Hillary Clinton are not political novices so you don’t think they would have thought about this before she campaigned for POTUS?

    I wouldn’t be surprised if Bill and Hillary Clinton got just want they wanted in the negotiations.

    Re:Bill Clinton for the Senate…He doesn’t want that job, he has more influence as a private citizen, then he will be as Harry Reid whipping boy…no I would have love to see Chelsea in that seat but she is too young to be appointed Senator….darn!

  52. Biden to Palin: With the race over, ‘no one pays attention to me’
    Posted: 10:55 AM ET

    From CNN Political Producer Alexander Marquardt

    Biden said that Palin attending the NGA conference Tuesday is a sign the election is over.

    (CNN) – In the first few moments of his remarks to the National Governors Association Tuesday, Vice President-elect Joe Biden thanked fall rival Sarah Palin for attending the bi-partisan conference, saying it’s a “a metaphor for the fact that this election is over.”

    “I want to thank all of you for being here and Governor Palin I want to thank you particularly,” Biden said to the Alaska governor. “I think it is, I hope, the whole country can see it’s sort of a metaphor for the fact that this election is over and here we are.

    “We’re all together, we’re all dealing with a common [economic] problem,” he continued. “This is not a Democrat or Republican problem, we’ve got ourselves a problem.”

    President-elect Obama and his VP greeted Palin as they walked into the room to a standing ovation. In his opening comments, Biden lamented the lack of attention he now receives compared to Palin.

    “As I told you when we walked in, since the race is over no one pays attention to me at all,” Biden told Palin as the governors laughed. “So maybe you’ll walk outside with me or something later and say hello to me.”

    Biden’s comments were just his third set of public remarks since Election Day.

    politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/12/02/biden-to-palin-with-the-race-over-%E2%80%98no-one-pays-attention-to-me%E2%80%99/
    *****************************************************
    LMAO!! I wonder if Joe Biden is going to continue his “crying” for the next 4 years.

  53. Just got into a huge argument with a rightie at my local coffee shop when he stated “Bill will manage to screw it up for her somehow”…I responded that “you mean an ex-president who is universally beloved throughout the world, raises 100’s of millions of dollars for aids, poverty, Hurricane relief, and is giving up tens of millions of dollars in speaking fees to support his wife..I guess those type of values with always be overlooked by you Clinton haters who are still hung up on him geting a BJ in the White House”….

  54. I didn’t like that Gallington article because it pushed the stupid MSM meme that Hillary isn’t a team player, even though that’s exactly what she was as a member of the Senate. Plus, she and Biden are good friends, and I expect them to work well together.

  55. Caroline Kennedy along with Teddy, disgraced not only JFK, who would have seen Bo as the fraud he is, but betrayed Jackie as well by not supporting another strong, brave woman like Hillary. Caroline has done NOTHING to help this country , unlike Robert Kennedy’s family.

  56. Obama, Biden meet Palin at governors meeting
    By Sam Youngman
    Posted: 12/02/08 10:49 AM [ET]

    President-elect Obama and Vice President-elect Biden greeted former rival and Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin (R) on Tuesday at a meeting of the nation’s governors.

    Palin, who famously accused Obama of “palling around with terrorists,” was the first governor Obama greeted as he entered the room to applause. While the two shook hands, it was unclear what was said between them.

    Biden was set to single out his former vice presidential rival as a “partner in progress,” but veered off script and instead said he wanted to thank Palin “particularly.”

    “I might point out, as I told you, we walked in. Since the race is over, no one pays attention to me at all,” Biden joked in his delivered remarks. “So I’m — maybe you will walk outside with me or something later and say hello to me.”

    Biden said he thinks “the whole country can see the sort of a metaphor for the fact that this election is over and here we are.”

    “We’re all together,” Biden said. “We’re all dealing with a common problem.”

    Even though Obama did not mention Palin by name in his remarks, he did extend an olive branch to the Republican governors present, saying that he is offering them “the same hand of friendship and cooperation that I offer our Democratic governors.”

    “We have a strong and vibrant democracy,” he added. “We compete vigorously during an election. But with the end of that season comes the time to govern together — and that time is now.”

    Obama and Biden had traveled to Philadelphia to address the National Governors Association meeting.

    thehill.com/leading-the-news/biden-calls-palin-a-partner-in-progress-2008-12-02.html
    ******************************************************
    LMAO!!! Is Joe Biden “crying” over his role in the Obama’s White House?

    How does the know they go off script…do they get an advance copy before or after the event?

  57. Carby, Jan–if Caroline Kennedy got the position it would be an eggregious, ill-timed and patently transparent example of nepotism of the worst order. The job of Senator should never be a matter of patronage. If Patterson does that it should be a glaring issue in his next campaign. There are so many other candidates who would be better. We need a stong senator from New York, not a celebrity lightweight. Hillary is irreplaceable but we should try to find someone strong. My personal favorite is RFK jr. I believe there is some real substance there.

  58. Great response, jbstonesfan, lol!

    BTW, Bill didn’t “screw it up for her” when she was in the Senate, so it ain’t going to happen when she’s SoS, either.

  59. Bravo jbstonesfan!

    ——————

    Wbboei, I agree completely. RFK jr. would be a wonderful addition to the senate.

  60. “I might point out, as I told you, we walked in. Since the race is over, no one pays attention to me at all,” Biden joked in his delivered remarks. “So I’m — maybe you will walk outside with me or something later and say hello to me.”
    ——————————————–
    Oh but we should. We could start compiling a little book of Biden gaffs similar to what they did with Bush, plus a stop clock to count the days until he leaves office. Trust me its coming.

  61. Didn’t Schumer say somewhere that he preferred a less celebrity senator. If C. Kennedy gets it, I would not like it one bit. What has she done to deserve it?

  62. pm317 Says:

    December 2nd, 2008 at 1:13 pm
    Didn’t Schumer say somewhere that he preferred a less celebrity senator. If C. Kennedy gets it, I would not like it one bit. What has she done to deserve it?

    ————————————————————————————————–

    Apparently, because her name is “Kennedy.”

    —————————————————————————————————-

    wbboei Says:

    December 2nd, 2008 at 1:08 pm
    Carby, Jan–if Caroline Kennedy got the position it would be an eggregious, ill-timed and patently transparent example of nepotism of the worst order. The job of Senator should never be a matter of patronage.
    ———————————————————————————-

    Didn’t Ted Kennedy say that he wants his wife to take over his seat, when he is no longer able to work? There should be a law against that. Nepotism at its worst. Talk about entitlement.

  63. The big news from the Obama transition was the announcement of the new “national security team.” But that’s not the big story. The big story is how Hillary Clinton – as the next secretary of state – will impact on the bureaucratic struggles over U.S. foreign policy and national security affairs in Washington.
    ——————————————
    That point really does bear repeating. The bureacratic struggles are the quicksand of Washington. They are what cause administrations to fail.

    Hillary said at one point that when she and Bill came to Washington from Arkansas they had a plethora of executive experience but nothing could have prepared them for what they encountered when they arrived in the capital.

    You can call this a coup and it some respects it was since it was never Obamas idea to appoint her initially, and it is clear he was against it.

    But did you notice how within a few weeks time, she made it happen, got him to support it, moved the bureacracy, marginalized the press and got the elites in both parties saying yes. The bots are irrelevant to the governing process.

    If people blink they are apt to miss it. This is the creme of leadership, it is what makes a country successful, it is what we have not had in Washington for many years and in its absense things just slide. That is fine when you have a margin of error as we had in the past, but today it is gone. Bush and the big oil elites tried to reduce all this to a military equation and you see where it got us.

    Coalition building is one of her many strengths plus an enduring love of this country and its people. The other remarkable thing about Hillary is she will always be a work in progress in the sense she is always learning.

    This primary campaign caused her to evolve beyond her washington personna into a bona fide populist.

    However, there may be a problem down the road. I believe Obama will encounter fierce resistance on his domestic agenda depending on what occurs.

    In that case, he may look to foreign affairs, see the progress she is making, the accolades she is getting and think it is easy. At that point he will be tempted to stick his nose into foreign policy directly and that is a fools errand.

  64. wbboei,

    What is your guess about what they talked about in that 1 hr tete-a-tete at Feinstein’s house after the primary?

  65. basil,

    Imo Hillary was sincere till June. After that we have two facts:

    1. she and Bill slowly escalated their campiagning for BO
    2. BO is appointing what some call ‘Bill’s third term’, restoring the Clintons’ 90s cabinet, etc.

    The simplest explanation is that the Clintons escalated their support in exchange for promises by BO to appoint Clintonistas etc.

    Imo BO is an empty puppet, handed off from one machine to another: from Chicago Daley Machine to Washington Kennedy/Pelosi machine. And now perhaps for his next stage, becoming a puppet of the Clintons’. I certainly hope so!

  66. Email from Bill Clinton to supporters, sent out today, in case anyone missed this:

    ——–

    Dear [Hillary supporters],

    I am sure you have heard the exciting news: Hillary Clinton is nominated to be our next Secretary of State! This is great news for our country. She understands the challenges we face, and her experience and judgment will help President Obama restore America’s reputation in the world and make our nation more secure.

    Take a moment to celebrate this wonderful news by sending Hillary a message of congratulations:

    http://www.hillaryclinton.com/feature/state/?sc=4031&utm_source=4031&utm_medium=e

    This nomination would not have been possible without the hard work of everyone like you who has supported Hillary throughout the years. I know I speak for her when I say thank you for everything you have done for her.

    Sincerely,
    Bill Clinton

  67. wbboei said: You can call this a coup and it some respects it was since it was never Obamas idea to appoint her initially, and it is clear he was against it.
    But did you notice how within a few weeks time, she made it happen, got him to support it, moved the bureacracy, marginalized the press and got the elites in both parties saying yes.
    ====================

    I guess I wasn’t watching. 🙂 You think HIllary wanted to leave the Senate for SOS, planning it weeks in advacne? Or months in advnce? Maeks sense by hindsight, if she had Bill were out in the international world lining up support over teacups. That would make sense of HIllary not goign to Denver: busy elsewehre preparing the world for the next move.

  68. jbstone,
    Agreed.
    I am not happy about HRC as SOS. TTTT, I don’t know what the heck to make of it other than she’s just another typical politician.

    Everyone,
    I will be seriously ill if Patterson appoints C. kennedy to fill HRC’s senate seat. He’s already done enough damage to NYS and he’s only been in office half a year. Just after he replaced Spitzer, he said that if BO weren’t elected it would be proof of racism. He also insulted HRC before she conceded to Bo by saying she should have withdrawn weeks before and was damaging BO. He’s another nasty Affirmative Action POS SOB.

  69. I would love for there to be a movie made of this amazing couple in the years to come. One that shows the hardships, the triumphs and accomplishments. One that is honest.

  70. basil,

    I’m going to politely disagree…lol… I don’t think I will ever see Hillary as just a “typical politician.”

  71. Jan H,

    I just can’t think anything else, jan . . . I’d love to have someone dissuade me but at this point I feel like she didn’t live up to what she promised. I feel like she caved. And I think that’s a tragedy for women.

    I think she stepped into the “SECRETARY” position all too willingly. I think she should have fought to the bitter end for the nomination. I still admire and respect her but i am seriously disillusioned. I think the SOS position was decided on before the convention and if that’s true then she strung her supporters along, just like Bo did with his. 🙁

  72. basil,

    I understand. I just don’t know that she had that many choices towards the end of the primary. I think the pressure was immense and that the delegate counts were a huge factor. I think she was thinking of New Yorkers and her obligation to them, and I think overall she was thinking of what was best for the party. We might not agree, but I believe those were at lease a few of the underlying factors in her decision to step down.

    Becoming SOS is, I believe, something she heartfelt believes that she can do better than many others. I just know that I feel safer knowing that she will be in that position. As disappointed as I am that she isn’t the president elect and that she was wrongfully cheated by Obama and the DNC, another part of me is so very greatful that she will be in such an important position. I just don’t think her options in the senate were very positive ones. I think she would have stagnated and been pushed out of the limelight by the likes of Reid, Kennedy, and Pelosi.jmo

  73. Palin: Campaign is over, ‘appreciated’ NGA meeting
    Posted: 02:30 PM ET

    From CNN Political Producer Alexander Marquardt

    Palin said she appreciated Obama and Biden meeting with the nation’s governors Tuesday.

    (CNN) – Governor Sarah Palin told reporters following the National Governors Association meeting with President-elect Barack Obama and Vice President-elect Joe Biden Tuesday that she appreciated the new administration reaching out to the country’s governors, brushing aside ‘unflattering’ comments made by both tickets during the campaign.

    Asked how she felt about a partnership with people she spoke unflatteringly about on the campaign trail, Palin replied that the jabs were “mutual.”

    “But the campaign is over and I so appreciated this meeting that we had,” Palin said. “I’m quite optimistic about moving forward in a bi-partisan manner as we do forge this partnership between states and the federal government.

    “I appreciated that President-elect Obama recognizes, first that he recognizes how valuable it is to have governors in his cabinet and we assume that all will go well and some of these governors will be in his cabinet,” she continued, adding that governors “know best” about the economic issues raised Tuesday.

    “In fact, remember on the campaign trail I tried to convince the majority of voters that governors knew best. Obviously that didn’t work, I’m here and VP-elect Biden is there,” she said, calling the meeting “overall great.”

    The Alaska governor briefly waded into subject of Tuesday’s meeting, saying that she and other governors present had “great concerns” about increased spending under an Obama administration.

    “When much of the economic problem that we are facing today perhaps was caused by too much debt, that solving those problems will not come from incurring more debt so we do have some concerns about these. This is going to be a matter of re-prioritizing federal dollars though and putting them to use in the wisest fashion for taxpayers, for constituents.”

    politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/12/02/palin-campaign-is-over-%e2%80%98appreciated%e2%80%99-nga-meeting/#comment-2136352
    ******************************************************
    I love this woman. She doesn’t backdown from anything, including her own party. No matter how the media and the Dimocrats try to define her she comes back swinging.

    She’s a fighter and the future. Loved her comment: “the jabs were mutual.” HAH! not going to cry and not going to defend myself with the media.

    http://www.teamsarah.org

  74. Get used to it friends >Hillary is here to stay so please don’t get in her way.The eyes of the world will be on her as the best we have to offer in the formation of a new peaceful and prosperous world that we all crave.If you disagree with the direction she will take us “Get Off The Hillary Express” and enjoy the leftovers.

    By ABM90 My Hope for her success is Eternal

  75. basil9,

    There’s an old saying and it does apply here:

    “Where life hands you lemons, make lemonade.”

    I think we all believe Hillary would have been a great president but the grassroots and party leadership didn’t want her…so what should she do…stay in the Senate and be marginalized or become SOS and help our country in a difficult time and help a inexperience President-elect. during the worst time in this country history in the last 40 years.

    There is no wiggle room for mistakes, proven leadership is highly needed right now, and make no mistake about it, with Hillary Clinton at State this help us greatly.

  76. Joe Biden to Sarah Palin: Walk With Me?
    By Tommy Christopher
    Dec 2nd 2008 1:33PM

    Joe Biden has been getting a lot of press lately for, well, not getting a lot of press. At today’s Governor’s conference, he ad-libbed some tragicomic remarks about the shadow cast by his GOP counterpart, Sarah Palin.

    From Politico:
    “And Gov. Palin, I want to thank you particularly.”

    “I might point out, as I told you, we walked in. Since the race is over, no one pays attention to me at all. So I’m – maybe you will walk outside with me or something later and say hello to me,” prompting laughs from all, but an especially loud one from Kaine.

    “It’s great to see you, Governor.”

    I think the Obamas can call off their search for a White house pooch, with Biden assuming the role of adorable, sad puppy.

    Credit Biden for having a sense of humor about all of this. Only in the bizarro world of American politics would Joe Biden be overshadowed by Sarah Palin, but he takes it in stride.

    I also credit Biden for putting his ego aside and not responding to impatient media reports about a lack of definition in his role as VP. Considering the steady supply of leaks from the transition office, this shows considerable discipline on the part of Biden and his staff.

    news.aol.com/political-machine/2008/12/02/joe-biden-to-sarah-palin-walk-with-me/
    *****************************************************
    Joe’s comment to Sarah Palin is getting a lot of play…Gaff machine strikes again. ROTFLMAO!!!

  77. I guess I wasn’t watching. You think HIllary wanted to leave the Senate for SOS, planning it weeks in advacne? Or months in advnce? Maeks sense by hindsight, if she had Bill were out in the international world lining up support over teacups. That would make sense of HIllary not goign to Denver: busy elsewehre preparing the world for the next move
    ———————————–
    Turndown: I think she originally intended to go back to congress and head up the health care initiative. That avenue was blocked. I think she went back with a set of expectations of what would need to be done to protect invisible people and protect the middle class. That avenue was blocked as well. There were people in congress who betrayed her. In short, there was no avenue for her to serve the country to the full extent of her abilities.

    I firmly believe Obama never intended to offer this positon to her, but his own people miscalculated and dangled that job to gain political points.

    At that point she had to decide where her talents would be best utilized. While she was making that decision, nations around the world registered support and the opposition party approved. The political ground shifted in her favor. And she negotiated direct access to Obama and her own team responsive to her. That is how it should be

    I know the perception of an early deal provides a convenient explanation for why she did not pursue her candidacy to the convention, but that is not accurate. The reasons she did that was to hold the party together, protect legacy and shore up her position with AAs.

    The other minor thing is she did not have the votes to win.

    That is my honest assessment.

  78. basil, the way I have come to analyze this situation, 0bama was good at lying, cheating, and stealing the election with of course help from the media and party elites. But he does not have any idea nor did he have any plan for governing. Realizing this, the senior people (achievers) in the party which includes Hillary, have come to his aid — how can they sit on the sidelines? They will have to say “let the country go to dogs..” They can’t and they won’t. Once he got the nomination he became the Democrats future and unfortunately others including Hillary have to suck it up and protect the brand for posterity. He should have been stopped soundly in the Primary and early in the primary. It is telling though that all his second-class supporters are now not enough to step up to the plate in terms of their own resume and accomplishments. Goes to show you further that he did not have a plan for governing.

  79. I appreciate everyone’s perspective and you all know what an avid HRC fan I am but just as I didn’t excuse BO for race-baiting, thuggery, lying and cheating, I can’t pretend HRC has been the Joan of Arc we’d all like to believe she is. That’s as unrealistic a view as that of the Boboweenies who consider BO their Messiah.

    I was cheering loud and long for her to win, mostly because she was the better candidate but also because her victory would have shattered the glass ceiling. The difference between her candidacy and BO’s is that she was absolutely the most competent person for the job whereas Bo was only a symbol and nothing more. (A symbol of WHAT will be debated for years to come.)

    But she was also a symbol and I think she owed it to the country to fight to the bitter end, if for no other reason then to set a precedent for women who come after her.

    For me to believe she was bullied, pushed out, threatened, means I believe she wasn’t up to the task, wasn’t strong enough, did not, in fact, possess that testicular fortitude.

    I can’t imagine BO having backed down. Can you?

    Being a symbol carries responsibilities. She accepted that during the spring. She realized she was fighting for all women, and then she threw in the towel.

    While I understand why I can’t say I respect her decision. There are times, IMHO, it’s better to go down with the ship and in this instance I think that would have been a better choice for her as well as us.

    Of course I realize the obstacles she was up against. I know how unfair it is that 98% of AA’s voted for BO and that’s not considered racist. I understand that MSM never cites the percentage of whites who DID vote for BO thus disproving claims of racism.

    I haven’t expressed these thoughts until now because I wasn’t sure she would take the SOS position. Now that she has, I have to admit it’s diminished her in my eyes. Not that it matters, and I’m not trying to criticize her; I’m just saying she’s only human and in the end, rather than rising to the level of the heroic, she got cold feet and decided to crash back to earth with the rest of us mortals.

    BTW, I think she would have been just fine in the Senate. If we come up with too many excuses for her actions we’ll be doing the same thing we’ve accused the Bots of doing for BO.

  80. FedEx the Supremes about Obama’s eligibility
    WND makes it easy, cheaper to ask justices to resolve questions
    Posted: December 01, 2008
    10:26 pm Eastern

    2008 WorldNetDaily

    WASHINGTON – You can make sure the Supreme Court justices have a piece of your mind when they review a case Friday challenging the eligibility of Barack Obama under Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitution, which stipulates the position can only be filled by “a natural born citizen.”

    Because the Supreme Court justices do not accept faxes, e-mails or telephone calls, there is only one way to make your voice heard in time for Friday’s preliminary hearing – overnight delivery of your letter.

    To make that process simpler, more convenient and less expensive, WND has devised a plan to get a concise letter on the subject, over your name, delivered to all nine justices by FedEx for the price of just $9.95. This offer ends Thursday at noon Eastern time to ensure all letters are delivered by Friday morning to the Supreme Court.

    Another way to arrange to deliver your letter is to call 1-800-4WND-COM.

    “If we didn’t do everything possible to let the Supreme Court justices know what a concern this is to millions of Americans, I would feel like I was letting down the Constitution and the men who framed it – not to mention every citizen of the United States living now and in the future,” said Joseph Farah, WND’s founder and editor. “This constitutional eligibility test has become a key issue with me because if the plain language of the Constitution is no longer taken seriously by our nation’s controlling legal authorities, we have become an outlaw nation – no longer under the rule of law but under the rule of men.”

    Farah personally drafted the letter that will be sent to the justices above the name and address of all those participating in the program.

    “I hope our effort helps inspire you to take a minute of your time to weigh in on this issue,” he said. “Feel free to send your own letters by overnight delivery, if you have the time and don’t mind the extra cost. But this program will allow more Americans to have their say.”

    Farah launched a petition drive on WND two weeks ago that calls on all controlling legal authorities to ensure the Constitution is followed on the question of eligibility and for full public disclosure of the facts of Obama’s birthplace and parentage. More than 125,000 people have signed on to the petition in that time.

    Obama has claimed in his autobiography and elsewhere that he was born in Hawaii in 1961 to parents Barack Hussein Obama Sr., a Kenyan national, and Stanley Ann Dunham, a minor. But details about which hospital handled the birth and other details provided on the complete birth certificate have been withheld by Obama despite lawsuits and public demands for release.

    The letters will be individually addressed to each justice over the names and addresses of those who take part in the limited-time program. The body of the letter reads:

    Dear Associate Justice ______:

    If the Constitution doesn’t mean precisely what it says, then America is no longer a nation under the rule of law.

    A nation no longer under the rule of law is, by definition, under the rule of men.

    Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitution clearly stipulates “No person except a natural born Citizen” shall be eligible to serve as president of the United States. That statement has clear meaning, and the Supreme Court of the United States is one of the controlling legal authorities in ensuring that the Constitution is enforced – even if doing so may prove awkward.

    With the Electoral College set to make its determination Dec. 15 that Barack Hussein Obama Jr. be the next president of the United States, the Supreme Court is holding a conference Friday to review a case challenging his eligibility for the office based on Article 2, Section 1.

    I urge you to take this matter most seriously – and judge it only on the clear, unambiguous words of the Constitution: A president must, at the very least, be a “natural born citizen” of the United States.

    If you agree that this clear constitutional requirement still matters, the Supreme Court must use its authority to establish, beyond any shadow of a doubt, that Barack Hussein Obama Jr. qualifies for the office under that standard.

    There is grave, widespread and rapidly growing concern throughout the American public that this constitutional requirement is being overlooked and enforcement neglected by state and federal election authorities. It’s up to the Supreme Court to dispel all doubt that America’s next president is truly a natural born citizen of the United States.

    I urge you to honor the Constitution in this matter and uphold the public trust.

    Sincerely,

    Your name

    Your address
    “My letter is going out today,” said Farah. “I hope yours is, too

    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=82449

  81. A beautiful picture of the Taj Hotel Dome with the triply play from Jupiter, Venus and the moon.

    deccanherald.com/UserFiles/DHGallery/Dec22008/up2.jpg

  82. pm317 Says:

    December 2nd, 2008 at 4:30 pm
    basil, the way I have come to analyze this situation, 0bama was good at lying, cheating, and stealing the election with of course help from the media and party elites. But he does not have any idea nor did he have any plan for governing.
    &&&&&&&&&&&&&

    Obama was looking for power and stardom. He won’t relish “rolling up his sleeves”. So he’s outsourcing the heavy lifting to, well, the Clinton Administration. He hopes they can make him look good.

    I don’t think he’s much of a leader, nor that he is interested in governing (such as policy wonks Clinton, Gore, and Hillary). He’s kinda like Bush in that regard.

    He’ll be on plenty of vacations, do lots of exercise and jogging, and he’ll even become another expert in clearning brush. I hate these faux “common men”.

    Now Teddy Roosevelt, there was a real down to earth person. There have been others. Obama certainly is not one of those.

  83. pm, thanks for the photo. Last night, my wife said, “go look out the window”. I forgot. So this was cool to see.

  84. Here is a list of the reasons why I think HRC should have bypassed the SOS position.
    (I won’t go into the reasons I think she should have fought for the nomination and refuse to campaign for him after he stole it.)

    1 – She’s out of the running for a 2012 presidential bid.

    2 – She’s symbolically, as well as actually, under his thumb and assuming the age-old woman’s position.- on the bottom.

    3 – She’s given credence to his campaign’s charges of racism against her and BC.

    4 – By naming her SOS, BO ensures BC will not publish his tell-all book about what really happened during the primaries.

    5 – Bo has improved his public standing while diminishing hers. By making her answerable to him, instead of the 20+ million people of NYS, he’s robbed her twice; first of the nomination and now of her base. Her base was made up of pro-HC, anti-BO women. Now that she’s embraced him, his policies, his presidency, she has turned her back on her supporters and she appears nearly as duplicitous as him.

    6 – He will use any and every opportunity to blame her for all foreign policy failures and is probably already plotting ways to get rid of her.

    HRC is a big girl. If she and her campaign didn’t know what BO was up to, well, she should have been better prepared. I don’t buy that he had a huge money advantage. She had name recognition, access to power-politicians. Everyone thought she was a shoo-in for the nomination. She should have realized there was no caucus strategy and that was a weak spot. Why didn’t she? Was she so sure of her nomination she didn’t think it necessary? Did she believe it would be wrapped up after Super Tuesday? If so, she’s guilty of the same over-confidence and over-stepping BO has exhibited.

    Of course I never would have said this during the primaries because like everyone else on 44 I prayed she had a card or two up her sleeve.

    She didn’t.

    She should have.

    Frankly, there’s no excuse for her having lost to him. I can’t excuse her by saying Mark Penn, Solis-Doyle, her staff, her advisors, her party, let her down.

    If I excuse her I show disrespect by implying she wasn’t strong enough to have won by herself.

    No excuses. Not for BO. Not for her.

    But I still adore her and I wish her all the best.

  85. wbboei Says:

    December 2nd, 2008 at 4:22 pm
    ————————————————————————

    I agree with your entire post.

    Basil, HRC couldn’t go to Denver to “fight it out.” She did not have the support of the super delegates, who told her, prior to the withdrawal, that they would not vote for her. Was the SOS pre-arranged in June? I don’t think so.

    She is not diminished in my eyes. I am not walking in her shoes, so I tend to believe, she is doing the right thing for herself and the country. It is an honor to be nominated for SOS. The other sweet part, is that we will see her on the world stage, and there is the potential for her to be very effective. In addition, SOS is not Kerry or Judas.

  86. basil and others,

    I shared negative feelings about Hillary — until Obama appointed so many of the Clinton admin, especially the economists (and they ACCEPTED). To me this is ACTION, real evidence that some good people, somewhere, are now pulling his puppet strings.

    This was a big surprise to me. But I expect HIllary and Bill were behind it. It’s one card they had up their sleeves (for the last couple of months anyway). So I’m back to more or less trusting them again, to be making the best of the situation, and perhaps turnig it to solid good for the world.

    Less solid, the support HIllary as SOS is getting from the rest of hte world and from people who really know and care at the top levels.

    Also the real crises going on and brewing, more terrorism, etc. International things may be getting so bad that we NEED the best people (ie Hillary) on guard duty for a while.

  87. Basil,

    I read your post very carefully. I do disagree with the major points, but I do respect your opinions and just wanted to let you know.

  88. Basil,

    The only reason she lost was because of the intimidation during the caucuses. On the one hand, I believe that if you can’t guard against cheating then you deserve to lose. On the other hand, I also believe that she would have made those losses up had the media not been so biased against her.

    On accepting the SOS post, I agree with you. She shouldn’t have.

  89. Jan,
    Thanks.

    Rickya,
    If there had been a strong caucus strategy in place, BO wouldn’t have racked up all those wins and the press would not have turned so rabid so soon. (IMHO)

    On another note: (just got home)

    What’s up with the GA Senate race?

    How come the repubs are winning 833,000 to 533,000 when the 11/4 race was tied?

    ACORN???????

  90. birdgal,
    It would be an honor to be nominated if it wasn’t the fraud doing the nominating. (IMO)

    BTW
    Chambliss is the GA winner 60% to 40%.!
    WTF??!!!! The election results stink to high heaven. I will never beleive there wasn’t vote stealing and fraud going on. Now that BO’s the prez-elect, i guess ACORN didn’t bother to activate the dead.
    At least BO won’t have a filibuster-proof congress.

  91. basil, rickya,

    Obama’s caucus strategy (begun c. 2004 or earlier) was to campaign to caucus-ready supporters: young and full of testesterone. And to run in a year when his opponent was an old woman whose signature issues appeal to the sort of people who CANNOT attend caucuses.

    Even after Hillary caught on that she was being blindsided and started doing all she could for the caucuses, her voters STILL could not turn out — and deal with the bullying at the caucuses.

  92. I understand and I don’t mean to sound like I’m bashing HRC. But I am very cynical and I feel that she has to take full responsibility for her loss. And we shouldn’t coddle her or protect her or try to justify it. She dropped the ball. Agreed, it was under tough circumstances but, much as I hate to admit this, BO’s team out-maneuvered, out-bullied, out-spent and out-strategize her. I hate his guts but ya gotta give credit where it’s due. He got down and dirty and it worked.
    Of course I’ve got my fingers crossed that the Supreme Court checking into the COLB on 12/5 may throw a monkey wrench in BO’s coronation but I’m not gonna hold my breath

    For some reason, I feel that if she’d pressed for the full roll call and not given in she and her supporters could have walked away with dignity. She could have returned to the senate. The story of the caucus fraud could have been spread far and wide. But now, with her taking SOS, there’s nothing left for me to hang on to. She drank the kool-aid.

    I don’t like Kool-aid.

    😈

  93. basil9 Says:

    December 2nd, 2008 at 9:05 pm
    birdgal,
    It would be an honor to be nominated if it wasn’t the fraud doing the nominating. (IMO)

    ———————————————————————————

    I know what you mean. 🙁

    post at 9:51 is all too true. The process was very corrupt, which is why, she did not have a chance in Denver. As far as reporting the caucus fraud, far and wide, no one would report on it. The information was out there, but MSM would not report on it.

    I don’t like the kool-aid. It is 👿

  94. basil, if those republicans who stayed home on Nov 4th had shown up to vote, we would not be in this situation. May be the GA GoP woke up.

  95. Hail to Hillary Clinton our new SOS. My modrern day Joan of Arc my she wield her sword with her words as she fights for us.

    I will sleep better knowing that when that 3:00am call comes Hillary will be there to handle it. She could have fought to the bitter end and I wish she had, but she still would not have won. So many truned on her and I will never understand it as long as I live. She did they only thing she could and folded to fight another day. If she had’nt gotten out they would have finished off for good and thats what they really wanted. She did the only smart thing and came up with a new game plan and it looks like she’s winning. There are still great things to come from Hillary.

  96. “BTW
    Chambliss is the GA winner 60% to 40%.!
    **************
    That’s the pits. Of all of the scum in Congress Chambliss is the worst. His 2000 campaign guaranteed him a place in Hell.

  97. Hi, everybody! I hope this makes the thread – have had a hard time getting on board lately. And I might get smacked down for what I say but here goes.

    Basil, in regard to HRC, I disagree with you on every point. On some points I suggest you just plain need to learn more, but all in all it’s your point of view I find out of focus. That’s my opinion, it isn’t humble, and I make no apology for it.

    You might have liked to see her carry on, banner before her, into Denver, denounce the DNC, the other candidate, trot out all sorts of mud against him and them, scrabble for delegates, stomp on the floor and make demands, but how do you think that scenario would have ended?

    Life is not Hollywood movies, Basil. You can only fight against the Company if you don’t mind being out of work at the end of it. Seems to me Hillary did not want to sacrifice her career opportunities for heroic posturing. And that’s a very good thing for our country and our world. She has so much to offer! She is so hugely talented, and we need her because it’s the others who are ordinary politicians, who are fit for not much more than political squabbling and posturing. Hillary Clinton goes where she can get real work done. That’s humility, resilience, and wisdom.

    Put your disappointment where it belongs: not in HRC but in your own unrealistic romanticism, and in the political system that failed her, and the misogynistic tradition rooted in thousands of years of so-called civilization.

    Stand behind her with pride in her accomplishments — that’s what it means to support the cause of women.

    In spite of all the hatred and disgusting machinations to destroy her, Hillary, as Maya Angelou foresaw, has again risen.

    I stood on the shore and watched a sailboat on the heaving ocean yesterday. Such a beautiful boat, strong and lithe yet fragile, too, rising and falling with the wind and waves, tacking sail to every advantage, and I thought, “That’s a good sailor out there. That’s Hillary.”

  98. Congratulations Sarah Palin (and Saxby)
    Posted by: Erick Erickson

    Tuesday, December 2, 2008 at 10:04PM CST

    Both Sarah Palin and Barack Obama campaigned in Georgia. Palin flew all over the state rallying Republicans. Obama flew under the radar heavily targeting black voters, demanding support for Martin, and running heavy radio advertising on urban stations.

    Ladies and Gentlemen, black voters turned out for Obama, but not for Obama’s candidates. Remember that for 2010.

    But folks, remember this too: Sarah Palin asked Republicans to turn out and they did. Of all the Republicans who campaigned for Chambliss, she was the only one that went all over the state for him. And it paid off.

    http://www.redstate.com/diaries/redstate/2008/dec/02/congratulations-sarah-palin-and-saxby/

  99. carbynew,

    This tells us one thing – 2012 is not a lock for Obama, not even in the Democratic primaries, i think.

  100. Basil: the primary was more than your normal contest. It was a morality play in which the bad guys won. It is hard to get over that. A couple things may help: i) first, the blog by William posted below which reminds us of what occurred (and no less what would have happened to her if she had stayed in the congress, and ii) second, realize that she saw the deadend that awaited her in congress better than most people did, and skillfully maneuvered him and all the other forces in play into a position where she has the second most important job in the country. I believe the day will come when she becomes president. In the meantime she will do great things for the country. And it is a tribute to you and others that you had the faith you did in her. She can read a power grid better than anyone, and knows when to hold em and when to fold them. There is always another poker hand. (PS. Obama is a one term president).
    ————————————–

    Taylor, I can’t disagree with much of what you said, except that if Hillary doesn’t get this nomination, I don’t think her “power base” is going to be much. The Democratic “leaders’ have had this fixed up for some time. Hillary withdraws, they say nice things about her, they urge/threaten her to strongly support Obama; and she goes back to the Senate with no realistic chance of ever being President. Obama controls the Party and the DNC, gets rid of most of the people that didn’t support him; and makes sure that if he wins two terms, the next candidate is the person he picks for VP, or someone he favors. Hillary thus becomes one of those tragic figures who is in the wrong spot at the wrong time, and never is able to do the kind of things she wanted so much to do for the country. Any other view of where she’ll be after withdrawing is naive and wishful, I think. In this case, she didn’t even really lose; but as I tried to recount below, was the victim of a nominating process carefully stacked against her. Outside of sending her own squad of bully boys to lock people out of caucus rooms and scare them, I don’t know what else she could have done. She won every big state except Obama’s own; she won virtually every swing state, mostly by comfortable margins. She has been the victim of the DNC fix and a rabid media, which is not going away any time soon. The only nice thing they will ever say about her is when she withdraws, just like Gore.

    The horrifying thing is that the goal of the media has not just been to get Obama nominated. It has been to absolutely destroy the career and reputation of Hillary Clinton. The fact that they continue to talk about something which by any rational analysis is an absolutely non-story, is as evil as it gets. The media may be what is most wrong with this country. At the start of every election cycle, like Charlie Brown hopefully running up to kick the football, I somehow think that this campaign will be different; that the media will actually try to be fair and provide reasonable coverage. And every time I immediately see that they are worse than the last time; more biased, more vicious, more slanderous, more willing to twist and distort reality to their own purposes. Or maybe it’s just that they’re too stupid to understand much of anything; after all, I know that a college education is not what it used to be. And being a frat boy or sorority girl with a nice smile may get you on TV, but it doesn’t give you any qualifications for analyzing anything. What’s happened with the RFK “story,” however, is far worse; because it is deliberately intended to make Hillary look like a bad person, which she most certainly is not. But I’m sure there will be lots of hand-slapping and high-fiving done in the newsrooms and on the news desks, if Hillary withdraws. So justice never does come to such despicable people as the Dowds, the Roland Martins, the Anne Kornbluths, the Andrea Mitchells, the Russerts, Matthews, and all the others.

    Frankly, I’d take this to the convention, tell the DNC and the media to go screw themselves, and let’s see what actually happens. But Hillary is no me, and she does not want to be hated by her colleagues, who have mostly tried to diminish her throughout the campaign, in favor of a propped-up, inexperienced, arrogant, elitist, calculating, disenfranchising, lying opponent. Obama is their candidate, not ours, if “ours” means the vast middle-class, the working people, those who truly care about the immense problems facing our country, and who realize that we desperately need someone immensely hard-working and competent, not a lazy inexperienced person who reads a teleprompter well. The fight Hillary has waged is for all of us, and she has gone to every state to do so. I wish I could think of something positive or cheerful to see out of a Hillary withdrawal, but I cannot. I see perhaps the end of the last New Deal Democrat to remain on the political stage; and I see an endless series of empty images parading to the White House, carefully selected by the corporate powers, and sold to Americans by the media like a new brand of perfume

  101. I am shocked. My world is tumbling down. The terrible things those right wingers are saying about the messiah. Sacreligious:

    “Land of the Free and Home of da Whopper” Peter Griffin…Family Guy

    conform and celebrate diversity….or else!!!

    Steel-Belted Radial Right Winger

    “I’ll create 5 million jobs from out of unicorn farts and pixie dust” Justatron paraphrasing Obamessiah…yes I love it that much.

  102. That’s the pits. Of all of the scum in Congress Chambliss is the worst. His 2000 campaign guaranteed him a place in Hell.
    ——————————————-
    SHV: that may well be true. Reading the blogs I see alot of people who agree with that conclusion possibly for different reasons. But the silver lining to this is Bambi does not get a filerbuster proof majority in the Senate, if my ailing memory serves. That is big. It may limit his success on the domestic agenda, while Hillary makes progress and captures headlines on the international agenda. This will infuriate our own big media and there is not a hell of alot they can do about it. I believe the task of goverance will be a millstone around bambis neck. Revolutions eat their children.

  103. “Basil, in regard to HRC, I disagree with you on every point. On some points I suggest you just plain need to learn more,”
    Why the insults? I didn’t direct my post at you.
    “how do you think that scenario would have ended?”
    With her dignity intact.
    ‘Life is not Hollywood movies, Basil’.
    Awwwww……. Comeon, grape. I think I deserve better than that.
    ‘She is so hugely talented . . . That’s humility, resilience, and wisdom.’
    I agree with you, there.
    ‘Put your disappointment where it belongs’
    This isn’t Daily Kos, grape, and I sure don’t deserve your evident vitriol.
    “in your own unrealistic romanticism, and in the political system that failed her, and the misogynistic tradition rooted in thousands of years of so-called civilization.”
    I’d say something nasty but like I said, this isn’t Daily kos and I’m not a cheeto. But it’s pretty presumptuous of you to accuse me of unrealistic romanticism and of being ignorant of misogyny.
    “I thought, “That’s a good sailor out there. That’s Hillary.”
    I saw the same boat and I thought, just another ordinary sailor. No captain, there.

    But, like I said, I still adore her and respect her. Too bad you can’t agree to disagree with your fellow 44 warriors.

  104. SHV,

    I know next to nothing about Chambliss but I’m thrilled BO won’t have a filibuster-proof congress.

    Pelosi and Harry-those-tourists-stink-Reid are dangerous, IMHO.

  105. Basil9

    It is us who have failed HRC, not she us. She won the majority, and the party bullied and bribed the delegates at the convention. The Dem adminstration said that if that happen to O, they would riot, they were all primed to do that. Why did not the majority come forward and riot at Denver. It is we who have let her down, not the opposite.

    And the crap about his superior grass roots staff it just that crap. It is the same as the crap about his being intellilgent. HE DID NOT WIN THE THE DEMOCRATIC NOMINATION, HE BRIBED AND BULLIED HIS WAY TO IT AGAINST THE MAJORITY OF THE REGISTERED DEM. The Chicago mob tactics does not mean you are better, only that no one is willing to stand up to youl.

    Somehow we keep forgetting that she won.

  106. NMF,
    I agree that the DNC screwed her but what I will never understand (or accept) is that the Clintons had no idea of what they were in for.

    Everyone knows they’re brilliant people.

    But if they’re so brilliant, they should have foreseen some of what was thrown at them. If they didn’t, they were unprepared and Bo wasn’t. He took advantage of their (or their staff’s) sloppy management. HRC was head of the ticket and she has to take responsibility for miscalculating. Her supporters don’t do her any favors by insisting the fault was on everyone else..
    I sure don’t feel like I let her down in any way. I called, wrote letters and even donated hundreds of dollars I couldn’t afford.
    But I am also not going to excuse her. From my perspective, THAT’S insulting and infers she, as a woman, was incapable of playing in the sandbox with the big boys.
    As far as threats of riots, she should have called their bluff. (IMHO)
    And I haven’t forgotten she won but I do recognize she didn’t take that extra step and seize power she was entitled to.
    Again, can you imagine BO having stepped aside?

  107. Basil, there’s no “vitriol” in what I said. (cruel and bitter criticism) You have stated over and over for months that you are personally, bitterly disappointed in HRC even though many of us have tried to help you to a clearer view of the situation. Factual analyses well laid out in the manner of wbboei and many others are not reaching you, so I decided to go to the fundamental flaw in your view of HRC, which is your desire for a hero who pursues a willful course regardless of the consequences. That’s simply not who HRC is.

    By the way, it’s no ordinary sailor who can handle a sail on a heaving ocean – it calls for great skill sharpened by years of experience, a cool head, knowing what your boat can do, knowing the water and which way the wind is blowing. An ordinary sailor would stay home on such a day or foolishly go out and be dashed to bits.

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