Pennsylvania Votes – Even Though Dean/Obama/Brazile/Pelosi Did Not Want It To

We have our party hats on as Pennslyvania votes come in. Obama has fled the state.

Obama has been run out of of Pennsylvania by those bitter and clingy voters.

Obama is unelectable – Obama can’t win big states that are crucial to a November Democratic victory.

Jake Tapper at Political Punch:

There’s this presumption out there, it seems to me, as if it’s just a CRAZY notion that Sen. Barack Obama, D-Illinois, would be able to win the Keystone State, like the idea is INSANE, just unfathomable, as if the state consists of Bill, Chelsea, and les freres Rodham.

I don’t begrudge the Obama campaign for successfully setting Sen. Clinton’s bar so high — that’s its job — and of course I understand that in order for Clinton to have a real shot, she needs a big W so as to eat away at Obama’s 800,000 popular vote lead, and to make the argument to super-Ds that states such as Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Florida are a problem for him.

Fine, fine.

But what’s so crazy about the idea that the Democratic frontrunner — flush with cash and outspending Clinton 3-to-1, running against a candidate with such high unfavorable ratings — should be able to win a blue state primary?

Just because Clinton has the support of the governor and the mayors of the two largest cities? So what? This isn’t about Ed Rendell.

After Obama swept Wisconsin, doing well if not winning in key traditionally Clinton-backing constituencies — labor voters, seniors, white women, Jews — his campaign put forth the notion that he was about to put this thing to bed. But then the dynamics returned to what they had been — seniors, women, whites, and blue-collar voters for her; educated voters, blacks, young voters and men for him.

Why can’t the frontrunner win working class voters?

The Obama campaign may likely spin tonight’s outcome as a W for him as long as she doesn’t win by 25 points. I, for one, ain’t buying it.

Obama is a loser, today and in November. Voters are just not that into him – no matter how much money he spends.

But just what are the targets? Some say Clinton needs to win by 10 points — which was her margin in Ohio last month. Others say eight points. Some say, given the amount of money Sen. Barack Obama is spending on television ads, anything over five points would be a respectable victory for Clinton. Staying within five points would give Obama the opportunity to assert that he overcame a state whose demographics tilted heavily to Clinton.

Hey Barry, you got some ‘splaining to do:

Some ‘splaining to do? No matter tonight’s result, keep this in mind: Obama spent an enormous amount of money on TV — and we mean ENORMOUS. He spent so much that he will have a very hard time explaining a double-digit defeat, despite what the campaign might say. Sure, they can claim he started out more than 20 points behind in some polls. But to lose by more than 200,000 votes after all the money he spent would be embarrassing and could rightfully get superdelegates nervous about his durability. Also, this is the first vote since Rev. Wright and the “bitter” comments, and if he simply performs as well or a tad bit better among white voters than he did in Ohio, the campaign can argue to supers that he wasn’t damaged with these voters for the long term. But if his numbers are worse than Ohio (he lost by 10 points) then, in the words of Ricky Ricardo… he’ll have some ‘splainin’ to do.

Tonight America’s voters will once again realize why Dean/Obama/Brazile/Pelosi have wanted to shut down this election and prevent Americans from voting.

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841 thoughts on “Pennsylvania Votes – Even Though Dean/Obama/Brazile/Pelosi Did Not Want It To

  1. I dont believe it! Did you see how all the people rallied and cheering Obama’s name because its now competitive

  2. Guys, the networks are going to drag this out as long as they can, for the ratings. Breathe. Hillary has this.

  3. young kids have nothing better to do than join a cult! Working people have business to take care of.
    His support is superficiall, they can really trick you when you see all those people at obama rallys, until you realize who they actually are…..

  4. Polls have just closed, people: relax!

    And remember that large cities will come in first, so Obama is likely to lead in the early raw vote.

    Everyone breathe.

  5. Repost from last thread

    birdgal,
    There’s always been more hype about Obama and black voters than there was substance. I know of plenty of AAs who weren’t /aren’t sold on him. The only reason he is getting the majority of the vote now is because of his Iowa win, he proved he could win white votes. So there was a feeling of ‘okay here’s the first black man with a real shot to become president how can we not support him?’ For some it goes deeper, but the idea that blacks will desert the party in droves if he’s not nominated is media BS.

  6. monkeybusiness, I think it bothers people that when Obama wins its already an early projection right at the hour but with Hillary being the likely winner it takes FOREVER and then their choice of words, “competitive” pisses people off

  7. Rickoroberts,

    You are absolutely right about black voters and the south. It’s very helpful for the statewide races but only if a dem can get 40% of the white vote to go with it. But for the presidential races those southern states are so heavily repub it doesn’t really matter if you get 100% of the AA vote.

  8. yeah, martin trying to act like those southern states are gonna swing into the Dems hands come November. NOT

  9. thanks justmein..for the link hes checking the mic in which fox will have always a crappy mic for her that fades in and out..they do that on purpose..i wrote them and told em to….so cbs is good..

  10. i want to see:

    -Dean giving his infamous scream, this time of anguish for Obama’s loss.
    -Michelle Obama crying into her arugula.
    -Kerry’s jaws drop off from shock.
    -Pelosi’s backbone reduced from jelly to powder after Obama’s defeat.
    -Kennedy’s broad face redden with anger.
    -and most importantly, Obama crying into his handnkerchief about how “clingy” bitter people hate him.

    🙂

  11. BECAUSE THEY WANT THE DRAMA, WANT TO DRAG IT OUT.

    Stop freaking out, guys. They have barely counted a single vote yet.

  12. What gets me aboiut these pundits is they are parrots listening to the campaign and reporting it as facts. Obama campaigns says this, Obama campaigns says that….please that’s not facts, thats politics.

  13. jr Says:

    April 22nd, 2008 at 8:13 pm
    Why is it taking so long to get numbers in??
    they said the cops are driving the cratridges out of the machines to the elcetion headquaters..theya re gauarding them

  14. oh well, look at it this way, she didn’t just finish him off right away, we get to watch him suffer slowly but surely!! 👿 hahahahahaha….. I know, I’m being sadistic, it’s in my blood, what can I say…

  15. Hillary’s argument that he can’t win the big states is sinking in. I don’t really think a blowout is necessary but it would be very helpful.

    The word is out, it’s being repeated…it’s sticking to him: He can’t win the Big States.

  16. CNN exit polling: Hillary won white voters (80%) 60-40, and Obama won black voters (14%) by 92-8. Can anybody do the math there?

  17. nikki,

    thank you. the media has been painting a different picture. i don’t think, hillary has lost all aa’s. I think, many aa’s would like to see an aa potus, which i would like to see, but obama is not the right person.

  18. your right whoever said it.. Hillary did the talking point is why cant he close the deal the pundits are on it lol on fox

  19. The female voters make up the majority of the Democratic voters in the fall…interesting. Another strong argument for Hillary

  20. JAS, got it from a poster at Taylor Marsh.

    But they said that the early raw votes usually come from urban/city areas.

  21. justmeinmountdorafl Says:
    April 22nd, 2008 at 8:23 pm

    dija, she probably will do better once she campaigns in the state and wins PA

    who wants to bet she beats 👿 in NC too ???

  22. Personal report on robocall ratio today in PA: About 2-1 in favor of Obama. Also, 2 live calls from Obama campaign and a posting on my apartment door.

  23. CJ, everyone there is busy saying “yes we can” for lack of words/optimism. lol

    there are some buffoons there that think Hillary will cry and drop outta the race soon.

    riiiiight.

  24. here’s why………they are questioning his honesty about what his excuse was for rev wright and ayers

    talking about “if’ he can win the Ge or is he too damaged? will he become even more damaged as this plays out

    to me that is VERY BAD FOR BO

  25. In the last thread, I said that whatever Hillary’s margin of victory is tonight, I will donate that amount of $$ to her campaign, plus 44 cents. Would anybody else like to join me?

  26. I think exit polls are skewed because Hillary voters are often very common sense people that want to vote and go home, not stand around talking to pollsters.

    I also believe that there are AA women (and men) out there who voted for her and will NEVER say so out loud.

    Wait for the votes to be tallied, guys. Breathe.

  27. donna keeps saying obama being brought out of the stratosphere .. another shoe is getting ready to drop. Gut tells me. She also said something that “employees, neighbors, etc” don’t have to get along with the candidate. Rezco bombshell maybe

  28. cackling chickens on cnn, lol, they keep talking over eachother, but I am appreciating most of the comments today. Instead of being adamently against hillary, they are actually talking about obama and his troubles ahead, explaining his associations with people like ayers etc… that is at least a change in the right direction for us.

    bennett is on fire tonight tho, keep pounding him bill!! brazille had to back off, couldn’t deffend O much more as he kept going… hehe

  29. Breathe, people, breathe. Open a nice can of beans, pour on some corn chips, and get a glass of milk.

  30. dot

    something definitely is off with brazilla…….she wouldn’t turn on a dime like this for nothing

  31. from CNN’s exit polling, Hillary should have a 8-9% lead.

    However, considering exit poll vs actual primary results trend, I say THAT is why Donna Brazillo and the rest of the gan are so worried…Hillary usually gets 5-10% better actual numbers in primaries she is favored in, than not.

  32. Someone wake me up when the numbers start coming in, this looks like it will be another typical PA election with numbers coming in very late.

  33. I just wish cnn would tell that they have no raw data and that it’s not tight at all. they are gonna look so stupid although they are making a lot of Hillary arguments to the SD on the panel tonight.

    Why can’t he close the deal? All that dough, All that Time, All the BIG crowds, All the Hope, All the Change and he still can’t win in the big states

  34. well, a Republican 527 is starting to go after BO. Maybe that’s another thing that Brazilla has her undies in a bunch about.

  35. risgo, the CNN exit polls suggest 5% for Hillary based on racial dems, with 6% of “other” race which is hispanic, asian, and stuff. IF you take this 6% into account and give most of it to hill (as she has won these votes consistently before), her lead should be 8-9% from the CNN exit polls alone. The ACTUAL thing should be greater (I’m guessing)

  36. Jen, most deffinetly there is more dirt on obama, a guy like him, with such a ‘smooth’ personality, cutting corners, huge ego! he is not a clean guy!!! something is brewing.

    Btw, been away for a while, what happened with the rumour about obama once being arrsted? did it die or what?

  37. finally, some number to droze off to….. zzzZZZzzzzz gonna be here for a while it seems, zzZZzzZz …
    0% in, and going strong! 😉

  38. it would be SO COOL if Hillary wins ALLLLLL of the counties maybe just one for Obama much similiar to Ohio?

  39. On Fox someone said, “how is Obama News Network handling this?” lol referring to CNN!

  40. Less than 35,000 votes and Hillary projected to win – our party hat almost fell off.

    Quick guess for such an early projection is that Hillary is doing well in Philadelphia.

    Thanks to everyone for all the good hard work.

    Hooray!

  41. CNN of course wont call it for Hillary

    but what I love about this so far is Philadelphia is 53-47 for Hillary

  42. WOOOOOHOOOOOOO!!!!! Now we just need the percentages, but if they called it this early, it’s not tiny.

  43. Yes, the woman has ovaries of steel! She understands that this is a very serious business. She doesn’t play, and that is what we need in the fall.

  44. # rickroberts Says:
    April 22nd, 2008 at 8:48 pm

    She is going to win it huge. I say more than 20. Bets anyone?

    Ive been saying since yesterday it would be 25%!! 😀

  45. I’ll do it with ya Jen…I’m going to start pecking the ground and laying eggs soon though…It’s that I just can’t resist a challange for a good cause.

    Dot pulled me in for the bomb yesterday.

  46. winhillary Says:
    April 22nd, 2008 at 8:52 pm

    OH WHAT A FEELING IM GOING TO HAVE ANOTHER PRIMARY SMOKE! HILLARY 09!

    meet ya on the porch 😀

  47. I can’t beleive the Repubs are having a primary?!!? I thought it was decided!

  48. admin, do you think they called it early because she is doing well in Philli? I believe Philli is what is coming in right?

  49. Even Obamapost is Headlines says:

    CLINTON WINS PENNSYLVANIA

    1% Reporting: Clinton 60, Obama 40 … Exit Polls: Clinton Leads Among Women, Late Deciders … Obama Wins Men, New Voters … 2/3 Say Clinton Unfairly Attacked Obama … Turnout Estimated At 52 Percent

    It must be a BLOWOUT for these headlines…..YAY!!!

  50. CNN is not projecting a winner yet, because Philadelphia its 50/50 and its 53-47 so far

  51. No back porch smoke for me. I quit cold turkey on February 11th after 37 years.

    Cold turkey on smoking.

    Cold turkey on watching network news.

    Cold turkey on supporting Democratic candidates (except Hillary) after watching the party try to steal this nomination from her.

  52. They called it so early because she is so far ahead in the Philly numbers, where he was supposed to be strong.

  53. Justme

    You and TM are too rich for my blood right now.

    John Harris saying on cspan saying she is going to win “significantly.” Will make it easier to raise $$.

  54. don’t worry guys. u see those BIG empty white spots on the CNN county map?

    All of those white spots are Hillary country. The only obama counties are reporting as we speak while Hillary’s have yet to do so.

  55. I didn’t mean she won Philly, just that she must have done much better than expected, as he was supposed to be so strong there.

    Still, Nutter did a hell of a job.

  56. Votes Percent
    CLINTON, HILLARY (DEM)
    27,664 71.7%
    OBAMA, BARACK (DEM)
    10,946 28.4%

  57. lmao. chill guys. Obama only has four counties so far. And I doubt he’ll get any more than 6 counties out of this whole state tonight.

  58. People, don’t worry about the margins right now. The results are coming from Philadelphia, which is his stronghold. Most of her strongholds have not reported anything. If she beats him by 6 percent in Philadelphia (she may not, he may retake the lead narrowly), he is toast. Stay calm.

  59. i am sure they counted his heavy area’s first , and he isn’t expected to do much more so they called it

    so she stands to get a much higher margin once all the counties are tallied and then the early votes will only add to that later

  60. Scranton and other strong areas for Hillary not even reporting at all yet.

    He is TOAST! woooooohoooooooo!!

  61. woot! woot! Thank you everybody here for the fantastic work on behalf of Hillary. You helped make it happen.

  62. I am going nuts. I come home from work with NO electricity and will not have it til tomorrow. I’m sitting under candlelight with my laptop using dial up with only 34 mins remaining on battery. I have waited so long for this and look what happens. I pray all goes extremely well for Hill. I have to sign off now so I can come back later for updates. Keep the fire and energy going for Hill. Will be back later. Bwaaaaaaaah!!!!!!!

  63. really, people leaving the Obama rally!

    I got a call today asking for volunteers. If anyone here can go, they need you. I have a brother in Hammond and I’d love to visit and help out but my husband cannot travel and he is not able to be left alone.

  64. dot48 Says:
    April 22nd, 2008 at 9:18 pm
    really, people leaving the Obama rally!

    Really? Where?

  65. Hillary is 78 to 22 Obama in Scranton (Hillary’s father’s home) with only 6 percent reporting

  66. Emmy, I said only in my dreams…. its a quiet rally so far…. after they heard it was competitive they were cheering OBAMA O BAMA now its like uh-oh but still of course they’ll spin it if its a close win thats why we can’t afford that

  67. 20 million raised last month. Terry telling that people are swamping her website with donations and still sending the message out. You go!!!!

    Come on people, lets get more $ to her.

  68. I hope Hillary’s main HQ is still open so that people wanting to donate by phone can still do so!!!

  69. wolf said is going show hillary on international and all over the world as soon as she comes out to speak her words.

  70. Terry is doing a GREAT job tonight. He wrapped it up well…advising the need for money, giving out the website, touting that lots of money is coming in now and that she is going to keep going strong

  71. Karl Rove .. Obama not doing as well as he expected in PA overall…AA 55 Obama 45 Clinton …

    He failed miserably in PA.

  72. MSNBC 15% Reporting
    H 53
    O 47

    Per State of PA web site
    Philadelphia county
    H 42.3
    O 57.7
    I am happy to see this county being reported first!!!

  73. 20% in…still to early to fix the final # be patient…yes I just said that after gulping down a bag of popcorn 😆

  74. Fantastic! I will be donating more tonight after doing so yesterday.

    I have put up my first post on Clinton’s win tonight, contextualizing it in terms of the larger nomination contest and giving some idea of what Clinton had to overcome in order to get this Rocky-like victory:

    http://www.villarrealsports.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=452

    North Carolina, a “Black Belt” state, is meaningless as it will not be won by Dems in the general election and it over-represents the African-American vote as compared to both the total balance of the state’s electorate and the even more important national electorate. The African-American vote as part of the national electorate is only 11-12%. That’s it. In the Democratic Party, the AA vote is around 25-30%, and in states like South Carolina (where the Obama race-baiting paid off) it is more like 55%. This has allowed Obama to get pretty but statistically irrelevant wins as concerns the general election.

    Barack Obama is a ‘niche’ candidate who has gamed the caucus system and played the white guilt card to the hilt. You are now seeing the unraveling of a strawman, as we have tried to tell many of the Kool-Aid drinkers.

    Superdelegates, it is time to do what you were created to do: Give us Dems — those who have voted for Clinton over Obama by a majority — a chance in November. Choose Hillary Clinton, or leave us with the second coming of George McGovern and a staggering defeat in November.

  75. My concern is if it continues to be 53-47 then Obama will come out and say, even with all the negative attacks I still came out strong (remember the bitter comment, the waffle comment, the refusing to do another debate comment, the wright pastor problems, the ayers problems, the Michele Im proud to be an American for the first time, the Italian comment, the Garlic Comment) and still was able to withstand less then 10 percent margin thats what Im worried about

  76. Guys, Obama himself said 51 percent is a win. It’s a win. There are still many more votes to come in yet, but the fact is he is the PRESUMED nominee in the media, he gets almost all favorable media coverage, he spent MILLIONS AND MILLIONS more than her and still couldn’t close the deal. This is a good night.

  77. don’t worry, scranton’s county and many other hillary couties are at leass than 10% in while Obama’s philadelphia is already 57% in.

  78. Jesus Christ, David Gergen is completely swinging this for Obama. They are saying oh she went after him. Oh 6 point win, all big states, etc., not enough! This is bullshit!

  79. we should give Filbertsf a virtual hug when he comes back for all his hardwork. Pretty sure he went to Pennsylvania to volunteer.

  80. If they let her surrogates on, they need to talk about how he spent more tahn anyone has ever spent in PA and it’s not enough.

  81. Donna Brazille is such an ass…she is so in the Obama camp it isn’t funny.

    Donna Obama hasn’t weathered the storm because all the numbers are not in but Hillary did very well in Philly, Obama didn’t crush her there like Hillary is going to crush him in other parts of the state.

  82. I tired to get the live stream of Hill HQ but couldn’t. So I continue to rely on you guys.

  83. the one thing I do have to admit is that Clinton has been pulling further and further apart from Obama in popular votes for Penn the more she does this the better but still want to see higher then 10 percent at the end of all of this

  84. mj Says:
    April 22nd, 2008 at 9:42 pm
    OMG! CNN is being fucking ridiculous! What the hell is going on here????

    What are they saying??

  85. I think CNN has been good tonight…….is it just me that see’s this??

    I have been flipping thru them all tonight and i have like cnn more

    of course they all have some against hill….but it seems like cnn has raised doubts about obama more

  86. It’s being portrayed, as we predicted, a moral loss. I will concede I am shocked he stayed so close as with that last debate perfomance, I thought 10% could easily happen.

  87. I think Hillary needs to stay out longer so more numbers can come in and BIG MEDIA can’t spin the numbers lower for Obambi, you know he need all the help he can get to LOSE.

  88. well except for jamal…..i hate him

    and CB too she’s horrendous most of the time, yet tonight she seems to be a bit softer on hill and questioning obama too

  89. jbstonesfan Says:

    April 22nd, 2008 at 9:43 pm
    It’s being portrayed, as we predicted, a moral loss. I will concede I am shocked he stayed so close as with that last debate perfomance, I thought 10% could easily happen.
    *****************************************************
    Most of Hillary’s numbers haven’t even been counted yet…these are early votes from Obama’s stronghold. Obama didn’t get the high numbers of AA in Philly like he thought.

  90. Bill Bennett is makin’ sense. Lordy. Gergen is sayin the margin isn’t big enough and we don’t even know what it is. At least Begala is on there tonight.

  91. and the county RIGHT NEXT TO Philadelphia county: Delaware county, which was strongly BO before, is now HIllary! YES

  92. guys…they can spin however they want….don’t let the pundits steal your joy..she won…period

    bottom line..he spent like a drunk sailor on leave…and…still lost!

  93. jbstonesfan, who gives a fuck what the media “portrays it” as?

    The voters evidently don’t. They gave a big Eff You to the media tonight.,

  94. jbstones, shut up. Hillary’s counties aren’t fully done yet, and a lot of Obambi’s early numbers are dropping.

    Hillary just overtook him in 2 counties with a single click of my refresh button. lol

  95. Fox Barone saying that if Hillary gets 8 pt win it would put her ahead in popular vote when Florida and Michigan are included.

  96. MJS that is so cool to see both Pittsburgh and Delaware county going for Hillary hope this will continue to expand the margin between the two

    now it is 55-45

    with 79,038

  97. wow. jithendra, those numbers look great for hillary froms scranton. pittsburg is lookin sweet for our girl.

  98. Don’t be so hard on jbstonesfan. He just has a tendency to see things half empty. Lighten up, jbstonesfan! They will have to eat their words!

  99. Im surprised that Harrisburg, PA the capital of PA would go for Obama? Afterall thats where Rendell works? any idea why?

  100. Some of you are rude and crude. If/when the administrator tells me what I can and cannot post, I’ll respect his/her decision. YOu talk about Obama supporters being rude, some of you need to look at yourselves in the mirror. Shame on you!!! The race is closer than I hoped it would be and that’s my opinion. It ‘s a good win, but I was hoping for a much wider margin.

  101. REMEMBER….No matter what bho says..they are very concerned about the results tonite…the info out there about him had an effect. he is in TROUBLE…they are looking at where he lost votes..

    P.S.–He was not looking for a moral victory..he wanted to win

    as for me, i am very happy…its a win..

  102. guys, there will be some continual fluctuatiosn as Philly finishes up for the night. As soon as philly finishes, the REAL fun of seeing just how big Hillary’s margin will be…should begin. LOL

  103. Obama is only carrying 5 counties (per CNN) that what he did in Ohio and in Missouri (i know he won that state), But he can’t win a GE like that

  104. Dear Gary,

    Thanks to you, we won a critically important victory tonight in Pennsylvania. It’s a giant step forward that will transform the landscape of the presidential race. And it couldn’t have happened without your generous support.

    There will be much more to do beginning tomorrow. But tonight, let’s just celebrate the fact that you and I are part of a remarkable community of people tough enough, passionate enough, and determined enough to win big when everything is on the line.

    Thanks so much for all you do.

    Sincerely,

    Hillary Rodham Clinton

    ********************************************
    jbs – I agree about the rudeness, but it’s probably the “passion” and determination that Hil’s reminding us of above…

  105. yes dot. I’m positive.

    if Philly hasn’t been able to at least narrow the margin to 2-4% NOW even with 70+% in, then Obama is doomed. I expect a solid double digit lead when all is said and done.

  106. Hillary is doing very well. Obama is in trouble with traditional democrats, which doesn’t bode well for the GE. He cannot close the deal, despite throwing all this money in advertising, etc. He closed the gap, but did not close it.

  107. No wonder he has been so touchy lately. The internals must have let him know this was coming.

  108. Contribution Details
    Date: April 22, 2008 8:52 PM EDT
    Contact: xxxxxxxx
    xxxxxxxxxx
    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Amount: $25.44

  109. Yeh-I’m a real troll:
    ——————————————————————-

    Dear Josh,

    Thanks to you, we won a critically important victory tonight in Pennsylvania. It’s a giant step forward that will transform the landscape of the presidential race. And it couldn’t have happened without your generous support.

    There will be much more to do beginning tomorrow. But tonight, let’s just celebrate the fact that you and I are part of a remarkable community of people tough enough, passionate enough, and determined enough to win big when everything is on the line.

    Thanks so much for all you do.

    Sincerely,
    Hillary
    Hillary Rodham Clinton

  110. Guys, if you think someone is a troll, the best strategy is to ignore. They get pushed upthread very quickly.

  111. I still think we should thank the 100 mayors, that’s critical – particuarly the mayor of: Pittsburgh, Philadelphia (took a lot of guts for Nutter to go for Hillary, Scranton, Erie, and others)

    Obama will not win the 5 counties, maybe Philadelphia and Harrisburg

    still I want to see at least 10 or greater

  112. Terry says that the media buys in the next states won’t be as expensive .. but we got to help her with money. I’m asking my neighbor tomorrow to donate .. she wanted Hillary to win tonight and she said Hill will be better than McCain .. she’s a republican but I think I can swing her for a few dollars…

  113. 3 of the 5 counties OBama is leading in: York, Lancaster, and Union, are all within grasp of a Hillary lead.

    Pittsburgh was showing Obama leading all night until just a few seconds ago when hillary jumped ahead.

  114. When the heck is Philly going to be in? I’d like to now which precincts there in Philly are left. Are they heavy AA?

  115. By the end of the night, I’m guessing hillary will have cut into Obama’s popular vote lead by 200k or so.

  116. she took some aa’s that is good news im a proud they voted for hillary..she is really for aa’s to it doesnt matter all the colors of race anyone she cares about!!!

  117. MJS – The Secty of State’s web-site has better numbers for York:

    OBAMA, BARACK (DEM)
    6,372 45.4%
    CLINTON, HILLARY (DEM)
    7,673 54.6%

  118. Pls. hook me up to a live feed when Hillary acceptance speech comes on, I am at work and unable to see!

  119. On CNN, Gergan just said that there’s things worse than losing (the GE, I assume) in order to build the Democratic Party…I think that’s what I heard. He said Superdelegates have to look at that.

  120. York county now Hillarys!

    Now down to four counties: Lancanster, Philadelphia, Dauphin, and Union

    now its 10 percent seperating the two and almost 100 apart

  121. Gergen on CNN saying SD won’t pick Hillary over Obama because party would lose blacks and young. Says there are things worse than losing an election!! Unreal! This is an argument not based in fact–Gergen has drank major Koolaid this year. Who in their right mind would think this way?

  122. ok, another Philly border county, Montgomery, is solidy Hillary’s now.

    And York just turned to HIllary’s Baby Blue color 😀

  123. obieoneka-NO-by will probably talk, but will diss hillary in his speech and show how whiney and petty he truly is

  124. so the dems are ready to LOSE … doesn’t he know that those blacks and young will drop away once he loses

  125. Former PA congressman saying on Fox that Wright etc has had an impact and that the press has only been covering Obama critically for 2 weeks.I think this is a good point–it’s only been a short time that the press has actually questioned Obama.

    Pat Cadell saying NC numbers may not be correct with white voters and she may be polling higher.

  126. “Gergan just said that there’s things worse than losing (the GE, I assume) in order to build the Democratic Party”

    How in the hell does losing an election help build the party??? Obviously, if they think he’s bringing in new voters, a loss would indicate that the party is LOSING more voters than it gains. How can that possibly be a good thing? The bots can’t win, there aren’t many of them, and they alienate everybody else. Great. Trading Massachusetts for Wyoming wouldn’t make sense even if he could do it, which he can’t.

  127. I used to think Gergan was level headed…but you are right….too much Kool Aid for him lately, apparently.

  128. “Gergan just said that there’s things worse than losing (the GE, I assume) in order to build the Democratic Party”

    This sounds so stupid. Total nonsense.

  129. long road to 1600 Pa avenue and it runs through PA.

    she looks very satisfied and solid. smiling. bill, chelsea, and hillary’s mother walked in with her..

    good energy in the crowd.

  130. jithendra Says:

    April 22nd, 2008 at 10:17 pm
    @mj… 6% of results from philly in… 10% more from philly…

    I don’t know what this means?

  131. “….never stopping believing in the promise of America….to fight for everyone whose ever been counted out….”

  132. you know you can count on me to stand up strong for you every way to the White house

    this has been an historic race and I commend Obama

  133. She says that the American people can “count on her to stand up for them” … this narrative is also becoming talking points and it is sticking. Fighter, one who will fight for you,

  134. Just got home from work – according to the SOS office, less than 50% of the districts remain. Anyone know which areas havent been counted yet?

    And don’t forget, the mail-in ballots get counted tomorrow, if I am correct?

  135. and people said to drop out but the american people dont quit and they deserve a president who doesn’t quit either

  136. you desreve a leader who listens to you

    wo desrve a cahmpion to stands with you

    a ccommander in chief who will finally bring you home (to the military in iraq)

  137. mj, i think now, its prbbly just the less urban areas in the areas surrounding philly that are being counted.

  138. great site-see what counties are in etc..
    politics.nytimes.com/election-guide/2008/results/states/PA.html

  139. justmein, that is bullcrap.

    Hillary won basically every single county in the state. I think those are just the definitive numbers so far. When all is said and done, I think HIllary will net around 15-20 del. (maybe more or less, who knows?)

  140. it’s so not fair how they are doing the delegates .. she got screwed in Texas and now again in Pa on the AA districts getting more delegates …

  141. moononpulto, I agree, most of the counties are still only like 20 percent reporting – soon Pittsburgh and Philadelphia (two of the largest cities) are done

  142. yup – moononpluto – bill clinton was in milford, PA – a city with only 1200 people. last time they saw a president was JFK…so, yes, rural strategy GOTV.

  143. the same guy with the boxing gloves was there last night is there again right behind HILLARY pretty cool

  144. none of the counties besides philadelphia and pittsburgh have really moved in the last half hour or so.

    anyways, I think I’ll go to bed.

  145. delaware went back to Obama again 144817 seperating the two and 54-46 come on lets see higher then 10 percent

  146. this is a huge victory!!! With the $ he spent, the time he spent in PA and he still couldn’t get within striking distance.

  147. Well, the narrative that Obama can’t close the deal is getting a little play already tonight. I expect that after her win and speech tonight SDs are going to really want to stay neutral for awhile.

  148. philly 97% in.. only 3% left… thats it… now the lead increases to 145K .. i think she will lead by 200K votes by the end… and it will be b/w 10 – 14

  149. I am sick of Jeffrey Tubin acting like he knows what he is talking about. He should be in Texas covering the custody cases of those 450 kids and leave the politics to someone else.

  150. Yeah, so he has more $, big deal. He can’t pay people to vote for him. Donating to him is the equivalent of setting your money on fire.

  151. Obama definately will come out to say well we all knew Penn will go to Clinton but we were able to come close werent we? despite all the mudslinging against me I still come out even when I couldn’t finish my waffle Im still here with you even when you are rude to me I still want to be your president please leave me a lone but I still want to be your president

  152. “And she is a republican”

    ahhh…..that explains it. Months ago she was so anti-clinton that I turned the channel when she came on.

  153. I wish one line was added to Hillary’s brilliant speech:

    “DNC How dare you tell millions of voters THEY DON’T COUNT”

  154. good evenig Hill fans!!
    Am new to blogging on this site, but I watch it every day and appreciate everyones point of view and enthusiasm!!! I really feel Hill will take the nomination in Denver. the glow of Obama is not as bright and is getting dimmer every day. Go Hill go!

  155. excellent moononpluto – not watching b/c i’m at work, but i hope she’ll make double digits, will help shutdown the punditry a little.

  156. BACK TO 10%! YES!!!!!!!
    They’re booing his attempt at graciousness. Real class those Stink-pots. Smug thugs.

  157. now trying to say tht all that matters is “new voters” … he sticks his foot in his mouth again.

    well shit, its back to 8 percent

  158. now back to 9 percent but remember most of the counties havent even have 100 percent reported

    now its back to 10 percent

  159. Why don’t CNN show the telepromter because you know Obambi can’t remember his lines without reading them first.

  160. yes, back to 10

    Hillary needs to get into Indiana and get Evan and his whole crew working hard for her .. like Rendell and Nutter

  161. I dont know why people say Obama is a great orator, I watch him (remember Im deaf) so I can’t hear his voice but I read the captions and watch his facial expressions/body language and I just feel a sense of ‘coldness’ from him he lacks genuineness

  162. The county that Scranton is in is showing 65% reported with hillary leading 74% to 26%

    Hillary’s father would be proud.

  163. Wow, if you really want to help that sick man, you should drop out now because your health care plan sucks.

  164. she will over take the popular vote with PA,KY,WV,PR

    she will have all the big states except IL (no biggie)

    and she will be a stronger candidate than 👿

    he’s damaged goods and she is not

    FL and mI ……will factor in

    pretty strong argument to the SD

  165. Howard Dean and Donna Brazile in their zeal to undermind Hillary and prop up Obambi…they have really helped our girl. Keep up the great work dickwads because if you knew how much your b.s. is helping Hillary you would stop it.

    So from the bottom of my heat, thank you.

  166. Chester from the SOS web-site with 22% in:

    OBAMA, BARACK (DEM)
    7,051 54.3%
    CLINTON, HILLARY (DEM)
    5,926 45.7%

  167. 177089 seperating the two

    people please work hard from now until 2 weeks – for NC and IN – we need to get a head start with the newspapers there, the people, and the likes to show WHY Obama can’t win the general election – to educate people who he really is, and why is he afraid to debate her anymore – and so on forth this is critical, very important. Plus to continue to RAISE money big time!

  168. yes we need the team who did letters to the newspaper editors .. those who did superdelegate letters .. we need to continue to call the dnc .. start calling tomorrow to Indiana and North Carolina.

  169. dot48 I agree and commend you for this we need to have visibility I think this is what helped Hillary in Penn and a lot of the grassroots so this will continue to help Hillary – I think with Penn’s in Hillary category I think people have to take a long and hard look at Obama – some will say well he won a lot of states – we have to stay, those states will be red, no matter what, it will be difficult is that a cahnce you want to take?

  170. most inetersting i saw tonight-brger said that yahoo told her that 80pct of obama searches ere neg-on rev wright, hamas etc.. she said most searches on hillary are positive on policy. what does that tell u?

  171. he spent 4-1 to Hillary in Penn and can’t even recognize the state – can’t even congratulate Hillary we should point this out!

  172. why should his rally get full coverage .. he conceded and they need to break away. they never covered Hillary in any of hers

  173. mj: it’s not time to worry about chester…. there are still more counties that have not finished counting

  174. He is the biggest windbag – and note that he’s temporarily shed the drawl for a midwestern “twang.” Again, I ask: why is he speaking after Hillary? She’s the winner!

  175. Well, HWC said city of Chester actually in another county, so don’t know why Chester is going for him. Is there a school there?

  176. I just want 10 or more win ..

    also, don’t forget Hill will be on morning joe in the morning.

    also, hillary will get a lot of absentee votes too

  177. He totally lost tonight. Why are we treated to his entire speech? They did not do this for Hill on his wins.

  178. I wouldnt mind just for a weekend to fly up to Indiana or NC to campaign for HIllary but $$ always an issue unless someone wants to sponsor me? 😉

  179. “Well, HWC said city of Chester actually in another county, so don’t know why Chester is going for him. Is there a school there?”

    There’s a college in West Chester, and it’s like affluent white latte liberal

  180. Informed .. the campaign called me today. I am unable to go to Indiana .. they need volunteers.. contact the HQ if you can volunteer. They need massive volunteers

  181. And the prick Olberman, after the other prick Mathews actually praised the speech, said when is she going to have to be humble….I went from loving this man a year ago to despising him.

  182. Here’s a little storyline I think is worth pursuing:

    Every single large Democratic state has voted. There are none left. The only large Democratic state that Barack Obama managed to carry, he happens to represent in the US Senate. Indeed, one can count on her right hand all the Democratic primary states that Barack Obama has carried to date. If our party leaders are not troubled by this development, they are a very stoic crowd.

  183. Let’s write to the networks to complain about the unfair coverage – that BO LOST and should be cut off after conceding tonight – like they usually do.

  184. Pittsburgh was good at 10% MOV, but SDs should be looking at the results of the populous counties immediately bordering Allegheny – Beaver, Butler, Westmoreland, Washington – all 70/30 landslides.

    With these results, McCain would whip BO’s ass in the general.

  185. Southern Chester County is an industrial corridor along I-95 between Wilmington, DE and Chester/Philadelphia. The rest of the county is just outer suburbs/towns. I think the big King of Prussia outlet mall is in northern Chester County.

    Delaware County is a mix of African American, working class, and Starbuck’s liberals.

  186. “If our party leaders are not troubled by this development, they are a very stoic crowd.”

    DC Dem, it’s not getting your ass handed to you, it’s party building. Get with it.

  187. Hello my friends! Anything good happen while I was away?

    Pat Cadell on FOX predicted over an hour ago that it may take until all the votes are in, but the lead will be in the low teens.

    Cadell also called at least a 10-pt win on Hannity’s show the other day.

    Didn’t know if anyone mentioned that, havent checked the thread yet…

  188. Obama speech..always talks about change,change, change but never says how he is going to make these changes!! Just pass the kool-aid around and we will all be happy!! His “changes” are becoming more transparent and flimsy every day

  189. Tomorrow, I’ll check on airfare to IN or NC, wherever the campaign needs people. If I can swing it, I’ll go. I’ll have to find someone to feed my cats.

  190. Justmein – then maybe I’ll see you there.
    BlueDem. Hill by 10pts right now with 85% in. It’s been swinging from 8 to 10%. And, they’re saying that BO “couldn’t get Casey democrats” with Casey’s support!

  191. “If our party leaders are not troubled by this development, they are a very stoic crowd.”

    Democratic leaders don’t care about winning. It’s all about “feeling good” and drinking a good Latte.

    When have Ted Kennedy or John Kerry ever backed a winner in Presidential elections? Democrats are like battered spouses. They like to lose and then come back, do the same damn thing, and lose again.

    This election was in the bag. All they had to do was not STEAL the nomination from Clinton with the Mich/Florida heist and you’d go into the election with two larger than life party figures in Clinton (plus bill) and Obama in the wings for next time.

    Instead, the Democrats shot themselves in the foot and the only way they could win the election now is if McCain dies of a heart attack the week before the election. He’ll nominate a female VP and clean the Dems clock.

    Doesn’t matter to me. I went over to town hall and switched my registration to Republican. I hate the Republicans, but if the the Democrats are too stupid to win an election, imagine how they would be trying to govern?

    I’ll vote for Hilllary in November (write-in if I have to) and then I’m washing my hands of Howard Dean, John Kerry, Ted Kennedy, and the entire mysoginistic lot.

  192. Blue DEM

    Pat Caddell also said he thought the exit polls were way off…looks like he was right..oh happy day

  193. Maureen Dowd is . . . well . . . we all know what Maureen Dowd is, but she does have this priceless reflection on Hillary’s victory in Pennsylvania, “Certainly Howard Dean will be of no use steering her to the exit. It’s like Micronesia telling Russia to denuke.”

  194. if you look at western part of Penn – its practically 60 or above for Hillary – this is where Obama hurt himself with the bitter comments

  195. Informed,
    Yeah, I’m anxiously waiting on 11% to go through the roof!

    I’d thought beforehand somewhere between 6-14% would be more than anyone could ask for, and anywhere from 11-14 would be ecstasy.

    BIG BIG NIGHT.

  196. Me, too, BlueDem – wow! Very happy night! And, I absolutely LOVED her speech. Perfection.

  197. That’s right Anbritt.

    Again they tried to fuck us with exit polls and a totally slanted ‘pre-game’!

    Now we can laugh at them.

    Soon, we’ll laugh at them all.

  198. tm says that the campaign is shooting rack up big dough tonight to show superds. makes sense. and we will need it. obama is going to go pure apeshit on hill in indiana and nc. she will need funds going forward.

  199. notice a pattern in the previous winners of the penn primary?

    Democrats
    2004 John Kerry
    2000 Al Gore
    1992 Bill Clinton

  200. Chester has some very wealthy “mainline” suburbs.

    Delware County has some super chi-chi inside the beltway and alongside the beltway neighborhoods plus four colleges: Swarthmore, Haverford, Bryn Mawr (the only college town with its own Ferrari dealership), and Villanova.

  201. You just KNOW we’re going great guns when Huff Post breaks out the giant red, anti-Hill font.

    ‘Clinton survives another day!’

    Oh, this is wonderful to see, have no doubt.

  202. “why should she exit … she’s won the last 4 of five … texas, ohio, pa, rhode island .. he won what?”

    Yeah, she’s the only candidate in history who, according to the media, gets negative momentum from winning.

  203. 3% of Philly held back – I sure hope they don’t stuff the box with whatever they need for BHO. (I hope Mayor Nutter’s peeps have control of the situation.) They stuffed the boxes big-time in Cook county IL – that’s a big portion of Stinky’s popular lead.

  204. Woo-hooo, Blue! Replaying part of speech on CNN now. (The part where she plugs the website!)

  205. Gergen: ‘major victory for her, much moreso than an hour ago’.

    He should have known better than to be running his mouth an hour ago.

  206. Hey, admin: After a year of obsessively commenting about my adoration of Hillary and disdain for the Candidate Who Must Not Be Named, I’ve had to try and catch up on my life. But when Hillary pulls off something like this, I am just beside myself with honest to goodness

    JOY!

  207. With current popular vote breakdown.

    Per Real Clear Politics w/ FL

    Obama 14,772,613 +882442(PA)=15,655,055

    Hillary 14,475,866 + 1,078034(PA)=15,553,900

    A difference of only 101,155

  208. Bring about chnge to washington??? I can not believe so many dem’s are buying into bill bradley’s failed message.

  209. those of you that want to press the issue about infidelity, and drug use with Larry Sinclair, I think it is very valid. However, if you are planning to use it as a gay issue, I wish you would think twice about that. As a gay person, it is very offensive to have people use gay sex as a weapon against anyone.

    Just my 2 cents.

  210. debbie .. I am not even sure that it is true. However, if he cheated on his wife and used drugs while doing it, yes I think it is a valid issue. The whole thing again would go to his truthfulness, his credibility and his character.

  211. Hey, he’s playing the lobbyist card – he goes straight to the source and his bundlers are with the principals in energy companies, drug companies, etc.
    And, he did no such thing as “bring parties together” in Illinois. He just took orders from Emil Jones and the soon-to-be-indicted-other-friend-of-Rezko, Gov. Blagojevich.

  212. aww, this sweet comment on TM:

    “I just gave my $20… $1 for each of my twin boys x 10pts.

    For my boys… For their future… For every dream I hold for them and for my country. May Hillary Clinton be the first President they are old enough to remember and be inspired by. May they be among the first generation of men who grow up truly not seeing any difference between what men and women are capable of and can dare to dream to be.

    Plus $44 from me to Hillary.”

  213. The big story of tonight should be the shift of the race of his to lose to one of hers to lose. Many SDs still on the fence will have seen enough to know he can not win in November and will now move towards Hillary. Even some of his committed may start to gravitate ever-so-quietly out of his orbit. The largest state he has won to date is MO. Not saying much. His big wins in the Black Belt and in power house red states like ID, UT, KS (ha ha ) and so forth back in February will soon fade into the political past. The perception about Hillary for both SDs and the voters in upcoming contests have been altered by PA. Many may have thought that OH, TX, RI, were flukes. Now they know differently. There has been a sea change. If she can win IN, KY, WVA, PR., Hilary will win by not losing and it will be decided in Denver in her favor. Picking up additional wins in either NC/OR or both, will decide it before Denver. Just a little more work, but very important work, to clean things up before dinner can be served, so to speak.

  214. Jas,
    That looks much better now, doesn’t it? Thanks.

    Joe Friday,
    You made me burst out laughing on that one 🙂

    OandrewD,

    Something I haven’t said, been keeping it secret and hoping.

    No idea if true, but had the idea that Hill locked up Edwards endorsement weeks – if not months – ago, when she went down to NC.
    If that were the case, it’d make ALL the sense in the world to hold off on an announcement if they looked at the primary map and projected when they’d need it most.
    Elizabeth Edwards joining up with CAP and then publicly endorsing Hill’s HC plan have done nothing to dissuade me – though Ill stress again I have nothing to base this on.

  215. i wonder how many absetnees need to be counted tommorrow? bet we get more votes. its sinking in-bambi got whipped and the pundits are having to admit it. even gergen is toning down. also-i think garin and williams deserve credit -they are encouraging hillary to be hillary. ehr speech was so emotive tonight. its hard for her to do this as the press has hunted her for so long on natl camera. but she did. hillary is being herself-her speech was very inspiring.

  216. MJ: I beleive she is leading with MI, however that state is little different, because Obamas name was not on the ballot.

  217. Blue Dem, that has been my secret hope, too, since Elizabeth Edwards spoke favorably about Hill’s health care plan.

  218. I gave $200.44 last night, can’t give more for a while…

    Does anyone know a ballpark figure for absentee ballots? Given PN’s higher than average elderly population, I am thinking there may be a couple of percentage points get counted tomorrow.

  219. Ok, gotta know what they’re saying;

    To: Interested Parties

    Fr: The Obama Campaign

    Re: A fundamentally unchanged race

    Da: 4/22/08

    Tonight, Hillary Clinton lost her last, best chance to make significant inroads in the pledged delegate count.

    The only surprising result from Pennsylvania is that in a state considered tailor-made for Hillary Clinton that she was expected to win, Barack Obama was able to improve his standing among key voter groups since the Ohio primary. For example, among white voters, Obama narrowed the gap with Clinton by six points. Among voters over 60, he nearly cut the gap in half, from 41 points to 24 points. And Independent voters – the group that will decide the general election and a group Obama is particularly strong with – were not able to vote in Not surprisingly, she led by as much as 25 points in the weeks leading up to the election.

    As he has done in every state, Barack Obama campaigned hard to pick up as much support and as many delegates as possible and was able to stave off Clinton from achieving a significant pledged delegate gain from Pennsylvania.

    The bottom line is that the Pennsylvania outcome does not change dynamic of this lengthy primary. While there were 158 delegates at stake there, there are fully 157 up for grabs in the Indiana and North Carolina primaries on May 6.

  220. JAS
    thanks for the breakdown on the popular vote!! How can anyone even suggest that Hill quit! This is NOT how the dem leaders wanted this to go Ha Ha

  221. As much as I want an 11%+ win, a 200k+ win, the GREAT NEWS is nothing is changing the storyline tonight.
    The die is cast and is spin-proof.

    MAJOR VICTORY FOR HRC>

    CNN: 2.5M raised since race was called tonight!

    Whoo-Hoo!!!

  222. there are hill and Obama areas left, Obama’s larger but HIll’s got more, i think we will keep the margin!!!

  223. that should signal to the sd’s that the race is still in Hill’s favor .. new donors and major money in one night

  224. blue democrat, fundamentally unchanged race? please! HE CANT EVEN win rural areas, blue collars, women, people who make under certain amount of money, etc, dont tell me that nothing changed

    you havent won the big states

    California
    Mass
    New York
    New Jersey
    Ohio
    Texas
    and now
    Penn

  225. justmeinmountdorafl,

    Hey. I report. U Decide 🙂

    What are they gonna say?

    He got FUCKING SPANKED!

  226. news.google.com/news/url?sa=t&ct=:ePkh8BM9E0Kzg0WIKTUHq03CWvwZmTk5iUWVCsk5mXkl-XkGrEKcWqxFqVXZ-QYsSPKZxSYmevlF6QYsMJf9YgOaCgA1vxhr/8-0&fp=480ea6883b3b8232&ei=QK8OSLmnJIyk-wGWh5yfDA&url=http%3A//www.pennlive.com/news/patriotnews/index.ssf%3F/base/news/1208391003162620.xml%26coll%3D1&cid=0&usg=AFrqEzeiG8EdEwhb4i9AKilOrCSCY1UD-g

    More on heavy requests and returns for absentee. Look slike 2x that of 2004.

  227. news.google.com/news/url?sa=t&ct=:ePkh8BM9E0Kzg0WIKTUHq03CWvwZmTk5iUWVCsk5mXkl-XkGrEKcWqxFqVXZ-QYsSPKZxSYmevlF6QYsMJf9YgOaCgA1vxhr/8-0&fp=480ea6883b3b8232&ei=QK8OSLmnJIyk-wGWh5yfDA&url=http%3A//www.pennlive.com/news/patriotnews/index.ssf%3F/base/news/1208391003162620.xml%26coll%3D1&cid=0&usg=AFrqEzeiG8EdEwhb4i9AKilOrCSCY1UD-g

    Spam filter. Absentees double 2004 numbers.

  228. Howard Fineman on news saying he heard Elizabeth Edwards may be making campaign stops with Hillary in NC.

  229. is there a count on how many absentees there are. I think most of the elderly voted absentee so as not to have a confrontation with Obama supporters!

  230. fox news website huge victory picture of hillary with bigger than life “the tide is turning!”
    over the picture 😀

  231. Greta on Fox reported that ONCE again Chelsea was at a college in NC and got the Monica question. Surely that couldn’t have anything to do with the innocent BO campaign could it?

  232. Contribution Details;
    Date: April 22, 2008
    Amount: $130.44

    I hope to attend a fundraiser next month and will make a larger connection at that time. Looks like a double digit lead may hold. With 94% reporting, the 10% lead is holding for Hillary. We got to ask people to keep raising money and contributing and calling and visiting Indiana and North Carolina.

    IT’s been a great day!

  233. Time to quit being surprised by this contest
    CLINTON VS. OBAMA | It’s far from first political battle marked by dirty little digs and Swiftboat saboteurs

    April 22, 2008Recommend

    BY CAROL MARIN Sun-Times Columnist
    Time to take a timeout.

    Time to quit being surprised about anything when it comes to the Clinton-Obama fight for the presidency, including Clinton’s victory last night in Pennsylvania.

    Non-Surprise No. 1: Negative Campaigning
    Gosh, you’d think listening to the cable chatterers that until this pitched battle for the White House, American politics was marked by high-minded messages, not dirty little digs and swift boat saboteurs. That so much oxygen has been sucked up marveling about Clinton being negative and Obama being forced to be negative back is baloney.

    This is a battle of two warriors for the highest stakes possible and the notion that nice was ever going to be part of either of their equations is nuts.

    Non-Surprise No. 2: Bill Clinton
    Tell me, when exactly did the former president worry about appearances? When he hooked up with Jennifer Flowers? When he jogged through the streets of Washington in those preposterous, non-presidential running shorts? When he was getting more than pizza from Monica Lewinsky in the Oval Office?
    Enough of the Democratic finger-wagging that Clinton is ruining his legacy with red-faced rants about the race card and other unseemly utterances.

    The Comeback Kid couldn’t care less. He plays to win and he plays it his way.

    Non-Surprise No. 3: Money Isn’t Everything
    Barack Obama is nothing short of a supernova when it comes to raising hundreds of millions of dollars. Clinton has done well but as an emergency $5 million dollar loan to her campaign demonstrated, he has outshone her.
    So far, he’s spent a staggering $189 million but still has $40 million on hand. She’s spent $163 million and is running in the red.

    And yet, Obama’s ability to out-raise and outspend Clinton in New Hampshire, Ohio, Texas and Pennsylvania did not buy him victory in those big states.

    That doesn’t mean Clinton can win without money. And Indiana will be the cash crucible for her campaign. But she seems willing to run on empty.

    Non-Surprise No. 4: “Healing the Party” Handwringing
    Remember Al Gore? Remember the rift between him and the Clintons when he ran in 2000 but didn’t want Bill out there stumping for him? That was one of about a thousand rifts in the party before this currently evolving one.
    And is the Republican Party currently riftless just because John McCain, bane of the Bush conservatives, is the presumptive nominee?

    Non-Surprise No. 5: The Voters
    We can poll until we’re purple. And often do.
    But voters, far from being sick of this election, far from being put off by all its twists and turns or its increasingly negative nature, are going to the polls in droves.

    And delivering surprises that should no longer surprise us.

    It won’t be the candidates, it won’t be the pundits, it will be the American public who will tell us when this thing is over.

    And what they’ve said—at least so far is that it isn’t.
    http://www.suntimes.com/news/marin/909810,marin042208.article

  234. wait-fineman is saying e edwards may endorse and campaign with hillary? i better turn on the tube that i ahve avoided. that would be huge. e edards carries great weight-and it is very hard to attack her. she could help hill win nc.

  235. OK, gang, the message of the day tomorrow is that Bambi cannot win the general, he should drop out.

    The numbers on the gun owners, Catholics, people who attend church weekly, and union households have to be eye-popping to the SDs.

  236. yes, she really could help Texan. Maybe more than her husband – though we’ll tak’emboth!

    Hill4TX: FOX & Friends is on in the morning…they said that?

  237. i will believe the edwards thing when we get better reporting on the matter. would not be a surprise but dont want to get my hopes way up eitherr

  238. did you see what John King said?

    Obama is clearly becoming more of the Dukakis candidate we can’t risk that!

    we should make a comeback list to Obama’s letter outlining areas he lost ground to since Texas, Ohio, and Rhode Island and now Penn (the blue states)

  239. Can’t Begala say anything about the fact that Obama has been slandering Hill with Repub taling points for over a year?

  240. new diary at kooks tonight….. what do you think? this could be a real tide turner in NC!!

    http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/4/22/234944/780/685/490544

    Fineman: Elizabeth Edwards to appear w/Hillary in NC
    by LauraC
    Tue Apr 22, 2008 at 08:49:44 PM PDT

    snip:
    Howard Fineman is reporting on MSNBC that Clinton will soldier on to North Carolina and to not be surprised if Elizabeth Edwards makes several appearances with Hillary and let her feelings be known who she stands with. He says that this could have a real impact there as they love Mrs. Edwards.

    He did say that while this was likely to happen, John Edwards would remain “neutral” on the sidelines.

  241. Okie, don’t you just love Pat! He’s looking better all the time…who knew beside you and Idunn.

  242. Hi Guys-
    Greetings tonight from Harrisburg, PA! Just some quick thoughts from ‘ground zero” I was struck by how many Dems are just not informed about Obama’s toxic associations–or about the many ways he has lied, misrepresented his record etc. When I mention Meeks or Odinga–blank looks. We need to brainstorm about what we can do to get THE INFO ON OBAMA OUT. If we can’t rely on the media, what are alternate ways we can reach people? When people learn more and more about Obama–they become “unsold’. What can we do? Thoughts…?

  243. WAPO: BO Considering Harshly Negativity .

    Good, let Mr New Politics hang himself.

    Give us an excuse to unload on you!

  244. Yes, Southern. I’ve liked pat for a long tioime. Well, not so much liked as respected….

    Guess what? I texted my mom and told her about the 2.5M. She was going to donate tomorrow, but now with the fundraising results, she’s so amped she’s online right now donating for the 1st time ever. EVER. She’s never given money to anyone. She’s so happy. Jubilant actually. She loves Hillary.

    The news about Elizabeth is amazing!

  245. doesnt matter, he spent millions and millions and millions and still lost. haha, i bet his fundraising goes to shit now.

  246. I had gone to bed but couldn’t resist getting up to see how things were going. I just LOVED the Carol Marin piece! She really gets it!

  247. Hey, Southern – I’ve been fighting Idunn for Buchanan for months! He’s our new boyfriend! OMG, who would’ve thought?

  248. lol same I cant go to sleep, lol John King now analyzing the race – Obama is the Michael Dukakis and John Kerry candidates

    Obama outspent 3-1

  249. Ok, I may be imagining this, but Hillary wore baby blue today and larry king wore baby blue suspenders and ties, and wolf blitzer wore baby blue tie and John King blue tie…Hillary’s color on the map is baby blue.

    Does this mean anything?

  250. Those Obama Senators boys must hate her,

    She embarrassed them in RI
    She embarrassed them in Mass
    She embarrassed them in Penn

  251. “Among voters over 60, he nearly cut the gap in half, from 41 points to 24 points.”

    Wow, that’s super impressive. If he only loses to McCain by 24 points, we’ll consider it a moral victory.

  252. Oops, sorry Informed…I forgot who was going for Pat…did you beat out Idunn? A bunch of us may consider getting in that race! Yep! Who knew!

  253. Kennedy, Kerry, Richardson & Casey have not helped Obama.

    That’s a ol’ boys club of Democratic Party losers, eh?

  254. gerond, thing is the election results don’t actually reflect the exit polls, so I’d say that is not for sure.

  255. Seeing the TV dickheads forced into reporting the facts – not praise for HRC, mind you, just facts – is like being in the desert and finally getting a few drops of water.

    terrible analogy.

  256. Wow and SurveyUSA was wrong. Had her only winning by 6. And we were all concerned about the 8 point drop in a week.

    lninla was right, due to Passover, SUSA stopped polling 3 hours earlier than normal each night on Sat. and Sunday this past weekend. IMO, this probably accounts for the difference.

  257. I am just so glad Hillary kicked his ass in York county after Kennedy campaigned there all day sunday and people fawning all over him saying this is Obama country.

  258. Don’t forget Gov’s Janet Napolitano and Bill Richardson who couldn’t deliver AZ or NM. AND both owe their careers to the Clintons.

    Still trying to find out the number of absentee ballots requested. There will probably be 1-2 percentage points in those ballots.

  259. John King of CNN said “Hillary Clinton thumped Obama with the Swing voters.” The voters McCain will go after in the G.E. and he was so convincing with it that Candy Crowley looks worried for Obambi.

    Even my Husband agreed that Hillary makes Obambi look weak. What kind of message is Obambi sending to Iran….geesh.

  260. The Obama camp wants you to know that certain segments of PA voters reject him only half as hard as OH voters.

  261. Obama is the Michael Dukakis and John Kerry candidates

    Wow. I can’t imagine a worse insult for a politician than to be called Dukakis/Kerry.

    John Dean is so crunchy granola: probably thinks it’s CNN praising Obama again. YEEEAAAAAHHHH! DUUUUUKAAAAKIS!

  262. So if my gorilla math is right, she’s about 4K votes from getting 11%?

    That sound right?

    She’s at 215K w/96% reporting now.

    Are these remaining counties good ones for us?

  263. ok I am sleeping after a huge night, but I wanted to commented on my vote:

    I was so excited to vote for the first time today, but I was also lucky.
    As I walked out of the polling station I thought about my grandmom.
    She is very old and today I drove her to vote Hillary.
    My first ever voting was for a woman candidate for President.
    It took my Grandmom a lifetime to be able to do that.
    We both have one woman to thank.

    Thanks Hillary

  264. Just visited Sugar’s. she had this from Michael Moore:

    “My endorsement is more for Obama The Movement than it is for Obama the candidate.”

    Well, look at Hillary’s movement you giant, fat-assed bowel movement.

  265. yeah CNN really turned on him tonight, maybe they are letting us know something, Jon King was saying he was talking to a lot of Democratic hierarchy and SD’s and all are worried about Obama, that was strikingly telling.

  266. pike is 38 reporting – so far favorable to Hillary
    monroe is 98 reporting – favorable to Hillary
    wayne is 67 reporting – so far favorable to Hillary
    bucks is 96 reporting – so far favorable to Hillary
    montgomery is 64 reporting – so far sorta close leaning Hillary
    lehigh is 93 reporting – favorable to Hillary
    union is 74 reporting – favorable to Obama
    allegeny is 99 reporting – favorable to Hillary
    philadelphia is 97 reporting – favorable to Obama
    chester – 56 reporting – favorable to Obama
    delaware – 97 reporting – favorable to Obama

  267. I hope Hillary will stay on Obamas ass about a NC debate, even better, if Elizabeth Edwards calls him out on the debat issue.

  268. I say that we should not count that he cut into her lead with the over 60, they voted absentee, I just know it!

  269. Paddy4Hill

    So glad to see you!

    Would you do us a favor and repost your thesis re the neo-libs? There were 2 separate posts, one about 1/3 the length of the first.

    Thanks so much.

    Xie xie.

  270. Carby, picked up hubby from the bar earlier. He was in the living room yelling at the TV as 👿 gave his speech. Kept calling him a liar and saying the DNC was full of shit as folks would vote for Hillary in the GE but not for 👿 no matter what they may say in an exit poll.

    In all fairness, he hates Hillary and McCain, too, but thinks the Dems only chance is Hillary in the GE.

  271. we need to remind people the consequences of trying to go with the “popular kid with the bucks”

  272. Email from the campaign for ALL OF US:

    Dear ,

    Thanks to you, we won a critically important victory tonight in Pennsylvania. It’s a giant step forward that will transform the landscape of the presidential race. And it couldn’t have happened without your generous support.

    There will be much more to do beginning tomorrow. But tonight, let’s just celebrate the fact that you and I are part of a remarkable community of people tough enough, passionate enough, and determined enough to win big when everything is on the line.

    Thanks so much for all you do.

    Sincerely,

    Hillary Rodham Clinton

  273. We should go with the angle, typical elitist trying to buy his way into the whitehouse, that destroyed Mittens.

  274. “ok I am sleeping after a huge night, but I wanted to commented on my vote:

    I was so excited to vote for the first time today, but I was also lucky.
    As I walked out of the polling station I thought about my grandmom.
    She is very old and today I drove her to vote Hillary.
    My first ever voting was for a woman candidate for President.
    It took my Grandmom a lifetime to be able to do that.
    We both have one woman to thank.

    Thanks Hillary”

    I used to take my father to vote, he was in a wheelchair. They’d let me go in the booth and pull the lever for him. It’s a great feeling isn’t it? He taught me to never forget: “In this family, WE VOTE!”

  275. the obamathugs cannot spin a 10-point loss. goes to show money is not everything. he had mega crowds but those crowds could not stop a 215,000 vote loss.

  276. OkieAtty Says:

    April 23rd, 2008 at 12:16 am
    Carby, picked up hubby from the bar earlier. He was in the living room yelling at the TV as gave his speech. Kept calling him a liar and saying the DNC was full of shit as folks would vote for Hillary in the GE but not for no matter what they may say in an exit poll.

    In all fairness, he hates Hillary and McCain, too, but thinks the Dems only chance is Hillary in the GE.
    *****************************************************
    The problem with the dems in the G.E. is that with Obama at the head of the ticket he will hurt the party…did you see all the counties Obama lost…this has been repeated time and time again in swing state and states dems needed to win in November.

    That’s why the SDs are worried…Obama can’t help down the line democrats…we will get creamed by the repugs in Local, State and National races with Obama at the Head of the ticket….CREAMED!!!!

  277. terrondt, they keep focusing on Obama was able to cut in Hillary’s lead from 33 at the beginning of this to 10, Im so sick of this!

  278. Canaan, when I was a kid, both of my folks would take me to the polls with them, in FL and in TX. Every time, I got the speech about how critically important it was to be informed and vote. It was one of the greatest lessons they ever taught me.

  279. TV Alert

    Think Charlie Rose said last night that his show tonight would be devoted to the PA Primary. He is on here at 11:30 CDT.

  280. carby, absolutely. Hey did that GOp guy running the “bitter” mailer win his race? What was his name?

  281. Casey has been made to look a right dickhead in front of the whole of PA. I worry for Mayor Nutter though, they are going to go after him with a vengeance.

  282. admin, be sure to include the email from Obama on how they’ve been able to do b etter then expected, Im so sick of it!

    Goodnight my HILLTEAM sleep well and onward to the coming states where we ALL will work together to ENSURE A BEAUTIFUL WINNING STREAK for HILLARY

  283. This is effing nuts. He has lost every large state in the union beside his home state where he ran up cook county. WTH?

  284. I’m not worried about Nutter. He is a man with integrity and he obviously voted his convictions and his intent is to help his constituents with solutions that will benefit them. I don’t think anyone can really fault him for anything in conscience.

  285. Patrick Murphy was saying that on CNN the other day about Hillary having ahd a lead of 33. Fool should have been worrying about keeping a seat in congress he only won 2 years ago by 1500 votes. He is going to lose re-election now that Tom Manion has entered the race as his opponent.

  286. Hey, Spega!

    Glad to see you online again.

    As to getting the facts to the people, your project of commenting in local papers is great. I’ve got your IN and NC lists at ht t p : / / http://www.ironmyvote.com/comment-local-papers.htm

    Another good idea from Skmf is having flyers on line for download and people print them out on their own printers and leave them on buses, landromats, etc. I can help format the flyers if anyone is interested. Not sure where they should be posted. Did hillaryclinton.com have a place for that?

    The quickest thing is for everyone to do their own flyers at docs.google.com and then their friends download from there also. When someone puts up a new flyer, post the url here and email it to me and some others to post around.

  287. Ni hao Emjay,

    I can re-post it.

    What a wonderful day it has been. A major set-back for those trying to mold the Party into some version of the British Lib-Dems. The wins in PA and other Big Blue states show that most Democrats want a Party that looks more like Tony Blair’s New Labor. This is the way for Democrats to become the new majority Party. Americans, like our English cultural cousins, steer away from extremes and prefer moderation. Outside of Reagan, most elections are won there.

    Bu keqi

  288. Blue Dem-As always, you have great ideas!! Let’s do it!!

    Anyone currently on line–check out Larry King/CNN the Republican Reed is defending Hill from Ron Reagan–who is claiming that Obama has been “thoroughly vetted”. They have this crazy Obama supporter on telling Lanny Davis Obama DOES connect –and if he doesn’t it’s because they’re racists… Reagan’s totally drunk the kool-aid.

  289. ppp(d) poll showed obama up 3 points in penn yesterday, I can’t wait to call him tomorrow and ask him again why his poll is so off!

  290. Taylor, thanks for the fun video.
    I had to stop over here because I have spent the morning patiently explaining to people how it is entirely possible, even probable, that Clinton will end up the nominee. People are so brainwashed by the MSM that even those who favor Clinton cannot seem to listen to logic.

    Thank goodness there’s plenty of it over here.

    Very early this morning I was at a face-to-face meeting with Clinton’s top advisers, which I hope to have time to summarize on my blog. But for now I’ll just say that they are very, very smart. They know how to win. They are totally inspired by Senator Clinton – more all the time, just like so many of us.

    Here’s the hard news. To compete effectively in Oregon (where early voting starts May 1), Clinton needs to raise 10 million dollars in 8 days. So please donate. If you want to participate in a match you can do so at http://tinyurl.com/3xgokg. And feel free to send others that way.

    But it doesn’t matter where you get onto to http://www.hillaryclinton.com. Please just go online and match your last contribution if you can.

    Senator Clinton is ahead in Indiana but she can’t win there being outspent 3 to 1.

    HLF | Homepage | 04.24.2008 – 12:29 pm | #

    *************************8
    I’m posting this here from http://www.taylormarsh.com HLF is an AVID Hillary supporter and she brings us updates on the campaign sometimes. She is maxed out but time to time she does matches which encourages us to donate to Sen. Clinton. She in turn has done matches to Taylor, to Maya Angelou’s foundation, to a project headed by Podesta to get more liberal pro-Hillary on the radio etc.

    She now has another match challenged as listed above. You just have to do it through her link above. She ususally posts the receipts when she pays her match to whereever the match is suppose to go.

    Admin does so much work here that I think we should email Heidi and see if she can do a match to ADMIN.

    Thoughts?

  291. TO EMKAY:
    I noticed that you asked about me a few days ago. I still post here but after 5pm and weekends, I can’t post as I can’t access the white box from my home computer. I can only post from work.

  292. I thinkt hat we may be able to garner the spin this week. The incredible amount of money that Sen.Clinton has raised in one day has got to take the drive by media by storm.

    It is impressive and if heralded today as it was mentioned yesterday, it will give the impression of momentum which she surely has now.

    We HAVE to win IN and there is a decent chance of Oregon with their mail in vote.

    Guys, continue to donate and call. Sen Clinton wants us to try to get at least 1-3 new people to donate, even if it is for $5, so spread her link far and wide.

Comments are closed.