Update of video: Via Hillbuzz
———————————————————————
Normalcy is returning to the 2008 Democratic nomination race. In earlier primaries/caucuses we witnessed 3 voting blocs – Pro-Hillary voters, Anti-Hillary voters, Pro-Obama voters.
We are now witnessing The Rise of the Anti-Obama Voter.
The birthplace of the Anti-Obama voter is once again Pennsylvania – the birthplace of the “Reagan Democrat”.
It’s not White flight, its Wright flight by “garlic noses” and other “Reagan Democrats”:
“We need her,” Barbara Vizzini, a 46-year-old equipment operator from Middletown, said before Hillary Clinton took the stage at a rally in Fairless Hills Monday night. “If we don’t get her, we’re going to end up with John McCain.”
What about Barack Obama? Why couldn’t he beat the Republican nominee?
“The race thing,” interjected her colleague Daniel Kirner, 52, from Tullytown.
“I mean, a president named Barack?” agreed Ms. Vizzini.
Hillary Clinton has spent the past few days courting the white, blue-collar workers who are most receptive to her no-nonsense message of hard work and experience. They also happen to be the people most suspicious of Mr. Obama. Some, like Ms. Vizzini, like him well enough, but echoing Pennsylvania governor and Hillary surrogate Ed Rendell, they think he will have problems with some white voters. Others think he’s an unreliable upstart who will stumble when it counts, or worse, that he’s simply a fraud.
Among such voters, Mrs. Clinton is reveling in her role as the anti-Obama—a grounded, nuts-and-bolts candidate who refers to infrastructure problems on I-95 and declares herself “excited” to be in whatever factory or faded manufacturing center she happens to be touring at that moment.
She frequently says, in an implicit contrast with Mr. Obama’s cosmopolitan heritage, “My father was from Scranton.”
And in a purposeful counterpoint to Mr. Obama’s nonspecific message of hope, Mrs. Clinton casts herself as a deliverer of more jobs, fairer trade and a better economy.
Barack Obama injected race into the nomination process in order to tarnish Hillary Clinton, a longtime advocate for civil rights for all. When Barack Obama was caught lying about his “Pastor”, Obama instead of addressing questions about his own judgment in listening to “Pastor” Wright for 20 years, distracted and diverted the attention of Big Media supporters and once again injected the topic of race. White working class voters were not fooled and are now Anti-Obama.
Hillary has turned the Big Media/Obama demands to drop out to connect viscerally with voters in Pennsylvania – voters long derided by Big Media princes because they entertain themselves by bowling:
On the evening of March 31, Mrs. Clinton spoke at another “Solutions for the Pennsylvania Economy” rally, this time in Fairless Hills, just over the border from Trenton. [snip]
Her speech consisted of a litany of populist applause lines and references to small-bore economic issues—Pell Grants, college loans and targeted tax cuts—that resonated with the attendees. She spoke disparagingly of the “Wall Street money manager,” and said that her father, a former Penn State football player, “was a little skeptical about having a daughter who was a lawyer.” She spoke worshipfully of the workers she recently met, “a nurse, a teacher, a truck driver, a steel worker, right here in Pennsylvania,” and promised a return to fiscal responsibility. She lashed out at oil companies for getting tax breaks, and at “China and their unfair trade practices.”
And unlike Mr. Obama’s supporters, who have been trying hard in recent days not to look like bullies, Mrs. Clinton warmed to the opportunity to underscore (if the Rocky metaphor wasn’t obvious enough) that she’s no softy.
“You know,” Mrs. Clinton said at one point, “I see that sign out there that says, ‘Do not quit.’ Well, you know one thing about me is I do not quit.”
The increased vitriol recently by Big Media against Hillary, and yes as bad as the attacks on Hillary have been since the beginning of this campaign season the recent attacks are profoundly worse – are due to the fact that they have to shout louder to be heard by fewer. By this we mean that the “Reagan Democrats”, the White working class voters don’t believe and don’t pay much attention to Big Media Princes.
By the end, some of the people in the crowd found it frankly inconceivable that she could lose to Mr. Obama.
“She’s got this one locked,” said Mary Yates, a 67-year-old retired worker in a chemical factory. “No Muslim is going to be president. No drug addict. If Hillary isn’t the one, everyone I know will vote for John McCain.”
[dnip]For Mike Tangradi, a 44-year-old union representative, “Any way we get her in, we’re better off.” He said he didn’t trust Mr. Obama’s eloquence, and considered it a cloak for his weakness on the issues. The longer Mrs. Clinton ran, he said, the more time Mr. Obama would have to stumble. “This is about the working people of America, like me,” he said. “She’s the better leader for us.”
Muslim, drug addict, weak, a fraud – inartful ways to express a deep discomfort with Obama – the anti-Obama voter.
On the morning of April 1, Mrs. Clinton, dressed almost psychedelically in a purple jacket and spotted scarf, toured a sheet-metal factory in Philadelphia. As Mrs. Clinton admired the precision of the workers’ craftsmanship, Don Grant, a 57-year-old factory worker who had chatted with her, said he was leaning toward the former first lady because he considered her more grounded.
Mr. Obama, he said, “talks a lot.”
If Mrs. Clinton is to post the sort of big win she’s clearly counting on in Pennsylvania on April 22, she’ll need the support of an army of Don Grants. [snip]
She criticized Mr. Obama’s decision to vote for an energy bill that she opposed. (Mrs. Clinton regularly refers to the legislation as the “Dick Cheney energy bill.”)
“When it was time to turn talk into action, his promises were just words,” she said.
We have written repeatedly, in our own inartful way, about Obama’s flowery talk and unclean actions. The emerging anti-Obama voters sense the basic dishonesty and fraud behind Obama’s flowery talk – that’s why they reject him.
Like that Pennsylvania voter, organized groups are fast becoming Anti-Obama voters. In April 2007, The Order of Sons of Italy in America spoke out against Don Imus and his insults against the Rutgers University Women’s Basketball team.
The coalition ad notes that Don Imus and his producer, Bernard McGuirk have also taken aim at Italian Americans. During the show’s Nov. 2, 2005 broadcast, shortly after President Bush nominated Judge Samuel Alito to the U.S. Supreme Court, McGuirk called Alito a “meat-ball sucking wop,” adding “First Scalia, now Alito. What is [President Bush] doing? Interpreting the Constitution or mixing concrete?” He ended, wishing Alito luck “And to hell with those who don’t like the fact that he’s a God-fearing guido.”
The coalition finds such ethnic epithets as abhorrent as racial and religious insults and need to be dealt with just as severely. Of equal concern was the fact that no journalist, columnist or talk show host criticized Imus and McGuirk for using such offensive language.
The media’s silence is further evidence of an unfortunate double standard of tolerance when it comes to Italian Americans and political correctness even when such offensive language is directed at a respected jurist who now sits on the highest court in the country, the coalition notes.
The Order Sons of Italy In America, as in the Imus situation, speaks again against Obama’s 20 year long “Pastor”:
We write on behalf of the 103 year old Order Sons of Italy in America (OSIA) and our 550,000 family members throughout the nation, and our anti-defamation arm, the Commission for Social Justice (CSJ), to strongly and unequivocally reject and condemn recently reported remarks made by the Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. According to MSNBC and other published and internet sources, Rev. Wright in 2007 stated: “[Jesus'] enemies had their opinion about Him…. The Italians for the most part looked down their garlic noses at the Galileans.” He then called Jesus’ crucifixion “a public lynching Italian style” executed in “Apartheid Rome”. [snip]
Words are important and have meaning, clear and subliminal.
As the words of Obama’s 20 year “Pastor” circulate, along with Obama’s lack of judgment, the Anti-Obama voter ranks swell. Big Media is trying to sell the notion that the Wright “controversy” is over, but it is not.
Andrea Helmer was interested in Barack Obama until she heard sound bites of his fiery pastor’s sermons. Last week, she volunteered for Hillary Clinton’s campaign in Indiana.
“As things came out regarding some of the things his pastor has said, I got concerned,” said Helmer, a 36-year-old respiratory therapist and mother of two in Evansville, Indiana.
Interviews with dozens of Democrats in this overwhelmingly white region — where voters will go to the polls in the May 6 primary — suggest residual concerns over the controversy involving Obama’s former pastor, Reverend Jeremiah Wright.
To be sure, this flies in the face of most polls taken after Obama’s widely praised March 18 speech on race and the Wright controversy.
The Obama distract and divert speech on race, instead of addressing his lack of judgment was praised – by Big Media Princes. The speech has help give rise to the Anti-Obama voter.
Still, there are stirrings of unease among white voters, including those who fear the issue will hurt Obama in a general election. Pew also found that 39 percent of all white voters who had heard of the controversy, including Republicans and independents, said it made them less favorable toward Obama.
John Friend, an uncommitted Democrat and Evansville city councilman, said Republicans may use Obama’s ties to the pastor much in the same way they attacked Democratic candidate John Kerry’s patriotism in 2004.
“It’s going to be like the Swift Boat thing,” Friend said.
Last month, excerpts of sermons in which Wright is heard saying “God damn America” and “U.S. of KKKA” were broadcast on television and distributed over the Internet. In response, Obama delivered what his aides billed as a major address on race on March 18 in which he condemned the remarks.
That didn’t repair the damage for some white voters, said Trent Van Haaften, an Indiana state representative from Mount Vernon who is backing Obama.
“The 10-second sound bite” is all that many voters know about the Illinois senator, who so far has visited Indiana just once this year, Van Haaften said. [snip]
The recent intense focus on Wright is complicating Obama’s efforts to appeal to some in culturally conservative southwest Indiana, which has a record of electing Republicans and conservative Democrats. Evansville is 86 percent white and 11 percent black. [snip]
“Back when Clinton was in office our money was more stable, jobs were coming in, my husband had a lot more overtime,” Helmer said.
That familiarity, along with media coverage of the pastor controversy, is pushing voters toward Clinton, said Democrat Justin Jarvis, a 34-year-old Evansville health-care worker.
“I know people who were previously Obama supporters who view it as reverse racism at its worst,” he said.
Michael Rivera, a 33-year-old computer programmer from Evansville, said he had donated to the Obama campaign and now believes his electability is damaged.
“I understood where he was coming from, but I don’t think anyone else will,” said Rivera, who currently is backing Clinton. [snip]
Phil Hoy, a 71-year-old retired minister who represents Evansville in the General Assembly and supports Obama, said the episode is hard to overcome in his community.
Pennsylvania is giving birth to the Anti-Obama voter.
Great post, as always, admin.
FYI – Bill O’Reilly is going to be talking about Father Michael Pfleger and others apologizing/supporting Wright on his teevee show tonight. Heard Bill O on Sat radio today and he says that this issue has moved from the political arena into a social issue and has set civil rights and race relations back by decades. Most likely worth a watch.
Jake Tapper: Rendell says there’s 50% about Obama we don’t know yet.
blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/04/gov-rendell-the.html
He tells people to hope, and they hope for what they want to hope for. He tells them he represents change, and the people think about the changes they want.
But eventually Obama is going to have to start getting specific, and when he does I don’t think many Americans are going to be happy with the details given Obama’s to-the-left-of-Teddy-Kennedy voting record.
Obama’s toast this election season. He certainly doesn’t know it yet, and the left caught up in his messiah-like presence aren’t about to admit it, but he is.
http://www.kxmc.com/News/Nation/225210.asp
Gerry Ferraro is on Fox right now, and will be on Hannity and Colmes later.
Haven’t had time to read all posts or post myself, but am reading what I can. Now that we are having a primary in Puerto Rico, I want to do as much as I can here for Hillary. I don’t know how to go about contacting the right people.
B Merryfield,
Heh, the Wright thing just won’t go away. Just saw a clip of this Pflegler guy preaching at TUCC, screaming and yelling and defending Wright. He said Wright is one of the country’s “greatest biblical scholars.” Excuse me?
Anyways, yeah, BillO is gonna cover that tonite – and Gerry Ferraro will be on Hannity’s show
Carter maybe to endorse Obama. Wtf is going on! I am soo sick of supers coming out, but all of the Hillary supporters are holding back! Why? We know there are many that support her, the undecideds, so come out! She needs some endorsements now!!!!!!!
Contact the Chicago Archdiocese and voice your complaints about Rev Pflegler. Also contact the Vatican’s representative at the UN. Let Rome know how unpleased you are.
Some good articles: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/04/no_really_hillary_has_a_decent.html
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/barone/2008/4/2/reviewing-the-primary-results-academics-versus-jacksonians.html
Carter is not a surprise. He has hinted all along about Obama. I wouldn’t worry about it.
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Guys, Carter is no surprise. Let’s not focus on what we can not control.
Have you seen Hill’s new NC ad? I think it’s the best of the season.
OkieAtty:
i posted on the other thread about my idea for money bomb vid, not sure if you’ll see it now that we have this wonderful thread!
thanks Admin!
my idea was “womens liberation” use it to drive home to women they should be angry at the way hillary has been treated by
obama, media and the “boys club”
let them put their money where their anger is
i suggested I am woman by helen reddy, some nice you tub vids of her in 1979 that could be spliced into it and i would use other imagery from womens lib movements, perhaps sound bites as well …..well those are my thoughts and ideas
What makes me so mad not to be negative is that most or all of Obamas supporters are really not caring about the issues our country is facing. If they really cared, they would stop and think about who they are voting for! These punks that question The Clintons daughter on Monica were kids when that happened! WtF! White male, African americans, rich college kids, and rich people are voting for this guy, oh and women that want to fit in or stand by there man! I am 32, I save money everyday, working on a ba, I am a bad speller though, sorry. I really care about what happens to me and my future, Im really scared because this hype will fade and we are going to see another bush but from the left! I have no children yet, but one day I would like to. I really hope we all can make a change and get someone with the experience to run a country. SORRY FOR THE RANT!
winhillary:
I totally hear you …..Nice rant
I think the money bomb song should be Twisted Sister – We’re Not Gonna Take It.
Tiny Dancer: that would be a great song too!!
ADMIN,
GREAT POST…
OKIE,
‘SHE WORKS HARD FOR THE MONEY’…donna summers
I know the media is probably touting Obama’s 40 million month. But thats down 15 million. Wasnt March the Obama is the winner, Clinton should drop month?
“We’re Not Gonna Take It” … yeah .. another good one.
Okie, I like Dot’s idea of the Rocky theme.
rocky lost
Sorry, added the second link to the spreadsheet for your fun.
—————
Frankly, the Big Media anti-Hillary hate and the attempt to convince people that the Hillary campaign is dead and Hillary should drop out – is helping us. This is exactly the script that has helped us so much before.
Obama/Big Media say polls are “tightening” then Hillary wins on election night making her victories that much more glorious.
There is a rising and new Anti-Obama voter and these voters will not be reflected in the polls. The anti-obma voter does not like Big Media either and knows Big Media will paint them as racists. The anti-Obama voter will speak out on election day not on Big Media polls.
Read this interesting article, already posted by several commentors, and check out the map with the black lines (especially that Ohio portion which is amazing) on Appalachia:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/04/no_really_hillary_has_a_decent.html
Also, play with this spreadsheet. We (along with the author of the previous article) believe Pennsylvania turnout will be closer to 80%, not 63% and that Puerto Rico will be closer to 2 million voters, not 1 million. But play with the spreadsheet yourself and don’t tell the Obama incense burners – let’s surprise them on the 10 election nights to come. Let them live in their paradise of incense and ignorance.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/horseraceblog/chooseyourown.html
I thought he won?
not the first one
Oh, who cares? Everyone remembers Rocky as a champion? Why be so negative?
Well, Rocky went the distance, all the way to the convention, and then some superdelegates came out and gave Apollo Creed the decision. But in Rocky II, he won the rematch with Creed. Anyway, I suggested the song Eye Of The Tiger in the last thread, and I think it’s good since it fits Hillary’s use of the Rocky analogy.
my intent was not to be negative just pointing out there probably exists a better song
yeah, see even I thought he won .. even if he lost it’s not the whether he won or not .. it’s his fighting spirit and the never give up. That the attitude we want in our leader. One who will go to the mat for us.
Maybe the video could be a two parter .. Eye of the Tiger/We Ain’t Gonna Take It.
I’m ready to roll some more dough big time to our gal.
I think Henry’s right. Go past the theme song and Obamabots will joke that Rocky loses in the end despite the triumph of the will.
Scratch the Rocky theme song.
admin
Exactly. I’ve always said this stuff actually just fires up Hillary’s base and gets the vote out.
esp since apollo creed was african american
Okay, scratch Rocky. I liked the fighting spirit.
The Obamabots are pushing this meme that North Carolina is actually the state where the nomination will be decided. Heh. I think Obama is pretty much “expected” to win NC – but the real story will be when Hillary wins IN, which I think she will. Obama was supposed to have an advantage there since it borders on Illinois.
It’s not good enough to try. We must impart that she will win. People don’t give money for runner-up.
We’re Not Gonna Take It
(Dee Snider)
We’re not gonna take it
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’ve got the right to choose and
There ain’t no way we’ll lose it
This is our life, this is our song
We’ll fight the powers that be just
Don’t pick our destiny ’cause
You don’t know us, you don’t belong
We’re not gonna take it
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
Oh you’re so condescending
Your gall is never ending
We don’t want nothin’, not a thing from you
Your life is trite and jaded
Boring and confiscated
If that’s your best, your best won’t do
Oh, oh, oh
Oh, oh, oh
We’re right, yeah
We’re free, yeah
We’ll fight, yeah
You’ll see, yeah
We’re not gonna take it
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’re not gonna take it
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
Oh, oh, oh
Oh, oh, oh
We’re right, yeah
We’re free, yeah
We’ll fight, yeah
You’ll see, yeah
We’re not gonna take it
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’re not gonna take it,
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’re not gonna take it,
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’re not gonna take it,
We got the right to choose and
No, we ain’t gonna take it
There ain’t no way we’ll lose it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’re not gonna take it,
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’re not gonna take it,
No, we ain’t gonna take it
We’re not gonna take it anymore
We’re not gonna take it,
We’ll fight the powers that be
No, we ain’t gonna take it
Don’t pick our destiny
We’re not gonna take it anymore
PERFECT ..
What’s that old classic rock n’ roll song, We Are The Champions? That might work.
“We are the champions, my friend, and we’ll keep on fighting till the end.”
I’ve always found Whitney Houston’s “One Moment In Time” to be inspirational.
I first heard it when the Dodger’s won the World Series back in ‘87… maybe ‘88.
Great song.
John Edwards says he is not interested in vp. So…where does that leave him in a cabinet?? Attorney General in Hillary’s administration.
Ben, that’s from Queen. That might be good. Might even appeal to her gay supporters.
Lyrics from “One Moment In Time” — it’s quite apt:
Each day I live
I want to be
A day to give
The best of me
I’m only one
But not alone
My finest day
Is yet unknown
I broke my heart
Fought every gain
To taste the sweet
I face the pain
I rise and fall
Yet through it all
This much remains
I want one moment in time
When I’m more than I thought I could be
When all of my dreams are a heartbeat away
And the answers are all up to me
Give me one moment in time
When I’m racing with destiny
How about a video of her accomplishments. Greatest moments kind of thing .. great clips of her campaign speechs …
The New Hampshire moment .. “I just don’t want to see us go backward”
The Debate moment .. “We will be fine but I just want the country to be fine”
……..
Can someone tell me how reliable is newsmax.com
Alright, which one of your from the last article has been annoying poor Donna Brazile? Don’t you know Dean, Donna and Pelosi are beyond reproach?
Whoever is responsible for annoying poor Donna, the Obama shill, has the readers at Politico in a froth. Shame on you.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0408/Inside_Donna_Braziles_blackberry.html
One Moment In Time .. sweeeeet lyrics.
apparently mo and mrs. kerry are campaigning together at carnegie melon university. That an interesting duo?
con, why is that an interesting duo? Both have a lot in common: bad taste in men.
Poor Donna. She lost Gore’s election because of her silly strategy, then try to blame it on Bill C.
Had Gore used BillC he’d have won by so much we wouldn’t have had to have the SC choose.
She turned Gore into the poster boy for boring, dull and completely speaking over the head of average voters.
I think she’s losing her cool because she sees the handwriting on the wall. Obama can not win a GE and they are in panicmode.
Why would she write to a blog about this .. how unprofessional.
They are in a froth aren’t they. I can’t comment for some reason but really I couldn’t care less about poor lil Donna .. she’s on the same wave lenght of MO. Gimme, gimme, gimme .. the country owes us.
you got that right, but I thought it was unusual as maybe Kerry will be wanting a v.p spot on the failed obama candidacy! LOL!!!
Actually, my sister always says Obama reminds her of Kerry.
You know, Ben, there is no confirmation that person is really a Hill supporter. My emails to Ms.Brazile are far more interesting.
Cleary, Ben Smith is still checking in here, and wrote her, not the other way around.
yes, he does remind you of Obama, tall and skinny and talks way to much!!
Kerry as anybody’s veep would make the country vomit. I regret my vote for the donkey face ass hole. I’m glad he lost now.
Professory. Always lecturing. Boring.
Oh, I’ll never vote for Kerry again.
yeah, I voted for the man too, very glad he lost even though we had 4 more years of bushit.
I personally like I am woman song, but probably turn of the men though!
# admin Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 6:30 pm
Alright, which one of your from the last article has been annoying poor Donna Brazile? Don’t you know Dean, Donna and Pelosi are beyond reproach?
Whoever is responsible for annoying poor Donna, the Obama shill, has the readers at Politico in a froth. Shame on you.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0408/Inside_Donna_Braziles_blackberry.html
*************************************
Admin: I that was me (eyes looking down in shame) please please don’t scold me!!
I promise i won’t do it again , I just can’t believe it got onto politico!! WOW the hills have eyes!!!
In TX, so after the County Convention, there’s a State Convention, right?
Delegates will be awarded until then, right?
When does that take place? This whole process confuses me.
confloyd, I was the thinking the same thing. Plus, the media will go on and on about how she’s playing the gender card.
# admin Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 6:30 pm
Alright, which one of your from the last article has been annoying poor Donna Brazile? Don’t you know Dean, Donna and Pelosi are beyond reproach?
Whoever is responsible for annoying poor Donna, the Obama shill, has the readers at Politico in a froth. Shame on you.
politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0408/Inside_Donna_Braziles_blackberry.html
*************************************
Admin: I that was me (eyes looking down in shame) please please don’t scold me!!
I promise i won’t do it again , I just can’t believe it got onto politico!! WOW the hills have eyes!!!
Bill Richardson is not what you might call a model of consistency . . . . .
Richardson Said Obama Can’t Win
Thursday, April 3, 2008 11:49 AM
By: Newsmax Staff Article Font Size
Hillary Clinton is insisting to Democratic superdelegates that her presidential rival Barack Obama can’t defeat presumptive Republican nominee John McCain in the general election.
Ironically, that is exactly what New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson reportedly told Hillary and Bill Clinton — before he endorsed Obama.
Sources disclosed to ABC News that Hillary told Richardson prior to his endorsement: “He cannot win, Bill. He cannot win.”
But one source with direct knowledge of Richardson’s conversations with the Clintons earlier this year, when he was telling them he wouldn’t endorse Obama, told ABC News that Richardson “didn’t think Obama could win” and said about the candidate: “Too inexperienced.”
A Clinton associate told Time magazine: “Bill Richardson is clearly embarrassed that he broke his promise to [the Clintons]. He should come out and tell the truth and admit that he had told both Clintons that Obama wasn’t ready and can’t win.”
© 2008 Newsmax. All rights reserved.
dija, were you respectful or did you curse at her a la Randi Rhodes. I don’t want Hillary supporters to be like Obama thugs.
I didn’t curse anyone, i was cordial, i listed reasons as to why i would not support barack obama
and i talked about how it was un american un democratic to disenfranchise voters.
she is the one that “flipped” out on me…. end of story
obviously they got a hold of her “sent” folder and reported what she said to me.
I sent her an email one time and asked about how to get the FL and MI delegates seated and she sent me back an accusatory, nasty, downright rude message that didn’t even get into the question.
Yeah, but Filbert, that pisses me off. The media has taken all the joy out of electing a woman. It’s fun, fun, fun. But they act like it’s same ole, same ole, and I believe that’s had an impact on young women. They don’t get how extreme it is, a woman fo rpresident.
filbertsf Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 6:49 pm
In TX, so after the County Convention, there’s a State Convention, right?
Delegates will be awarded until then, right?
When does that take place? This whole process confuses me.
———————————————–
June 5,6,7 @ Convention Center in Austin
thanks wbboei… so I guess delegates will be award then.
God, what a stupid way to elect a nominee. Undemocratic and too complicated for the average voter.
well, dija… looks like Ben Smith is making Brazile out to be the victim and Hill supporters a bunch of wackos. That’s the media for ya.
Well, djia, I didn’t like some of the things you brought upp personally.
filbertsf:
I have been reading the comments, it does appear that brazill is taking some heat for her comments, but i am not happy about that at all. i feel violated to some degree, yes i posted them here, I know now i should not have done that .
believe me that will never happen again!!!
Mj:
I appreciate your telling me that, we are each entitled to our own opinion and i respect yours. I did not intend to offend anyone
anywhere, not even donna brazill
Well, you could just apologize to her.
yes mj, they are really downgrading the fact that voting a woman for president would be historic and a great CHANGE also.
How about I Will Survive?
dijia, dude, never apologize. Donna Brazile is doing more damage than anything you or I could ever write.
Disenfranchising hundreds and thousands of voters in MI-FL, going on CNN and pretending she’s got no dog in ther race is hurting America and it’s hurting the Democratic Party.
If anything Brazile should be apologizing to us and thanking God her sorry ass still has a job.
Yes Filbert, the county convention first, then the state convention. It is stupid and one of the resolutions was to get rid of it. The nasty obamamaniacs wants to keep it, it gives them many ways to cheat, so of coarse they love it.
I did email Donna and ask about the texas at-large delegate and what they were for. She told me they would be awarded proportionately to each candidate. My friends at the convention believe they are the one who can change their minds. So I still am not sure. I will be there to make sure the rules are followed in my district, maybe I’ll even take a video camera, laptop with video camera on it. So, we’ll see, since this is my first time I might miss a lot of stuff I should not!!
NINE TO FIVE
BTW, I was very nice in my e-mail, thanked her for her years of service to the democratic party and just asked a question.
Look, i’m not saying anyone needs to be overly nice to Brazile. She’s clearly the one with her thumb on the scale trying to pretend voters in FL and MI are imaginary, but since we all know she clearly support Obama, i’d be very cautious what you say to her.
I’d still like to know, if DNC agrees FL and MI will be seated in some fashion, why not add those votes to the pop vote totals?
a few here have emailed with Donna and she swings from nice to abrasive .. maybe it’s one of those “periodic” things.
I have a bad temper, so I have to stifle the things I say pretty regularly, so I appreciate it when you folks tell me I am getting a little overboard. I dont’ want to do anything to hurt Hillary, as I am sure all of us agree on that!! Sometimes though, be are all human and we get pist at the injustice of it all and we blow!! When I that hope everyone forgives me as I am sure of one thing and that we need Hillary for our next POTUS!!
dot: and then, the claws come out.
# Independent Ben Says:
The Obamabots are pushing this meme that North Carolina is actually the state where the nomination will be decided. Heh. I think Obama is pretty much “expected” to win NC – but the real story will be when Hillary wins IN, which I think she will.”
Exactly right Ben. They’re trying to change the narrative in anticipation of Hill taking PA, which they’ll gloss over in making their final push, along the lines that Hillary must “upset” BO in a state he’s expected to take.
Total fuckin’ garbage.
She takes PA and IN, and SHE has the Big Mo’….
Jimmy Carter, what a shock. He’s been at odds w/the Clintons since he sent Cuban refugees to Arkansas in what was for Bill Clinton an election year.
Some people don’t know true progress when they see it. Carter is smart enough to see it, which is why his unofficial “decision” is calculated and embarrassing- to himself.
He’s supposed to know better. Fuckin’ peanut farmer…..
A parody of Bawaaak’s response from a perceptive blogger-for s when the press corps asks him whether he wants to repudiate from his supporter RR for her vile sexist comments
“… I can no more disown Randi Rhodes than I can disown the blogging community. I can no more disown her than I can my white supporters – supporters who helped raise me in the polls, supporters who slandered my opponent again and again, supporters who love me as much as they love anything in this world…”
— Posted by BlueBlood
Next we hear from the sad delusional who supports the god given right to scream fire in a crowded theatre . . . .
13.April 3rd,
2008
3:19 pm This is a little scary actually. Your livelihood is threatened if you oppose Clinton and are honest about your opinions. Welcome to the Gulag Folks
Found this and laughed my $%^ off – http://nationalsquib.com/index.php/barack-obama-ludacris/
It’s hilarious, but also depressing that we are losing to a man that gets endorsements from the likes of The New Black Panther Party and ‘Ludacris’
Spread The Word!
That is why we have to continue the HEAT on Dean. He hasn’t done ANYTHING.
The delegates need to be AWARDED and the VOTES counted.
As Obama always gets a free ride in the media so gets his staff too. After all the flak that, rightly or wrongly, has been aimed at Mark Penn, Obama’s spin doctor David Axelrod sure has had an easy time. Axelrod, Mayor Daley’s ole’ pal and the master of manufactured grass roots support is only discussed, if at all, in the most glowing of terms. This however is an interesting little piece of truth on the real David Axelrod from BusinessWeek:
—
David Axelrod has long been known for his political magic. Through his AKP&D Message & Media consultancy, the campaign veteran has advised a succession of Democratic candidates since 1985, and he’s now chief strategist for Senator Barack Obama’s bid for President. But on the down low, Axelrod moonlights in the private sector.
From the same River North address, Axelrod operates a second business, ASK Public Strategies, that discreetly plots strategy and advertising campaigns for corporate clients to tilt public opinion their way. He and his partners consider virtually everything about ASK to be top secret, from its client roster and revenue to even the number of its employees. But customers and public records confirm that it has quarterbacked campaigns for the Chicago Children’s Museum, ComEd, Cablevision, and AT&T.
ASK’s predilection for operating in the shadows shows up in its work. On behalf of ComEd and Comcast, the firm helped set up front organizations that were listed as sponsors of public-issue ads. Industry insiders call such practices “Astroturfing,” a reference to manufacturing grassroots support.
…
Axelrod’s political connections can cross over into his corporate business. Mayor Richard M. Daley, one of Axelrod’s friends and earliest clients, is pushing construction of a new Children’s Museum in Grant Park to replace a facility on Navy Pier that the museum says it has outgrown. So far, though, “open-space” foes such as Reilly have stymied the move. The museum retained ASK early in 2007. Sedler says Axelrod’s ties with Daley had nothing to do with the contract.
—
Yeah, right, Axelrod just so happened to be an old friend to the Mayor of the Chicago Machine. All these marvelous Chicago Coincidences…
—
Illinois does not require public-affairs firms to register as lobbyists unless they seek to influence officeholders directly. But New York does. In New York City, Cablevision, owner of Madison Square Garden, hired ASK to stop the New York Jets from building a stadium nearby in Manhattan. In its ads and materials, the opposition called itself the New York Association for Better Choices. Records show ASK was paid $1.2 million by Cablevision from 2004 to 2005. LegislativeGazette.com, an online weekly covering New York government, described ASK’s payday as “the biggest lobbying contract of the year.”
…
In politics, Axelrod’s AKP&D is as partisan as they come. But ASK travels easily across the aisle. Gene Reineke, head of Hill & Knowlton’s Chicago office and former chief of staff for Republican Governor Jim Edgar, says his PR firm shared ComEd as a client and now works with ASK on the Children’s Museum. “Their firm is outstanding,” he says. “I think it’s one of the best in the field, to be honest.”
Avis LaVelle, a former Daley press secretary who now runs Lavelle-Cousin Issues Management, also teamed with ASK on ComEd’s CORE campaign. She says their consultancies are practicing a new kind of PR, bringing tools and know-how from the world of politics into the corporate and nonprofit realms. “A lot of what is done to shape public opinion in political life,” LaVelle says, “can be applied to public affairs for corporations.”
—
http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/mar2008/db20080314_121054.htm
mj, b/c Brazile is in the tank for Obama and she knows her boy will lose if MI-FL are seated. She’ll toy with them being seated in “some fashion” but to allow the delegates to be counted would kill her boy’s chances and she won’t let that happen.
Brazile, like other Obama supporters, are just cheaters and thugs. Brazile happens to be a thug in a high position and suit.
filbertsf:
I’m a dudette
and thanks for the pat on the back……I feel terrible for the trouble i have obviously caused this list
that is the only thing i would apologies for at this point, I meant what i said to DB, but do agree as someone stated earlier i should not have put some of my reasons in that email (it was just me being color blind and dumb) if i had it to do over again i would definately leave a couple off my list.
I am thinking that perhaps i should now leave this list ?
well atleast for a couple hours , kids spring concert ttonight…..i will be back to see if you all want me to go or not…TTFN
BTW, I hope Brazile keeps her promise and resign from her post if the MI-FL delegates are seated. She did make that promise and better keep to it. I won’t miss her sorry ass.
filbert, the DNC has a rule for early primaries, they get half the delegates. Donna put her thumb on the scale and said no delegates. I link to a post on it in the last thread. It was completely her. Also, did you know she was the soul reason LGBT did not get their fair allotment of at-large affirmative action delegates? She said it would be an affront to the civil rights movement. Again, she was the soul impediment.
wbboei: they think, it is freedom of speech, but what it is, in reality, is unprofessional and poor behavior, on the part of so-called journalists. It is also slander and harassment. Imus was fired for his racist comments, but it is okay to use vulgar and disgusting language, when it comes to Hillary. This is very, very wrong. If it was reversed, and someone did this to BO, the shout of racism would be so loud. The company dismissed her, not Clinton. She doesn’t have power over Air America. Good for them, for not tolerating that type of behavior. It is plain wrong and unprofessional, no matter, who exhibits it.
Dija, we have not laughed so hard in days. Donna is the one to be ashamed, not you. If you have any correspondence with Dean and Pelosi, do share.
djia, don’t worry about it.
Is it sole or soul? I think i used that word wrong.
You don’t really have free speech rights at work. If you called your boss an asshole, you’d be fired.
Call Every Day
Democratic National Committee
Main Phone Number:
202-863-8000
(For questions about contributions, please call 877-336-7200)
ADMIN REQUEST; PLEASE POST THIS NUMBER WITH A CALL TO ARMS ON EVERY NEW PAGE .. JUST A REMINDER
Djia,
Great job! And don’t you DARE apologize!!!!!!! Neither BO nor Brillo-head can take a punch though they’re experts at lobbing them. Oh the poor poor things.
Admin:
This incident is too too too funny!
Let’s ‘froth’ her ’til she melts.
mj, sole. Soul is something all people have; eveyone, of course, except Brazile.
MJ:Look, i’m not saying anyone needs to be overly nice to Brazile. She’s clearly the one with her thumb on the scale trying to pretend voters in FL and MI are imaginary, but since we all know she clearly support Obama, i’d be very cautious what you say to her.
———————————————–
MJ is right. Brazille is trying to build a case that we as opposed to the Obamanics are the problem, which is why I have been unwilling to correspond with her. And, knowing something of how these types operate they will turn it into an attack in their position rather than how they are abusing their authority. The point is not to be critical of what has been said up to now, but to be circumspect about what we say to her over email from this point forward. Trying to change her opinion is a lifetime exercise in futility–even when she is wrong she is right.
OMG, I got so distracted by the brillo-head comedy I forgot to post this.
Anyone hear about the press conference TUUC held today to get the press to back off? Astroturf strategy for sure. AND they’ve scheduled some sort of ‘reconciliation” meeting or something on May 18.
Dobbs could not get over it. “Why would they want to keep drawing attention to themselves,” he asked. Fat-a$$ Crawley of course defended them, saying, “But there were REPORTERS in the PEWS!’ like she was real shocked and like it was something SHE wouldn’t have done if she needed a story AND she could squeeze her butt into a pew.
djia .. do not leave.
Look, it is one thing to oppose someone, it is another to call them the kind of names she did in public while she was representing her employer.
You know , the press is so boring. The women in the press, for the most part, are the worst, because they to fail to take any joy in one of their own running for President. Now, if Hill wasn’t the best candidate to run for office since FDR I would not support her. But she is! Again, it’s freaking fun to elect a girl President! Fun, fun, fun. I think these girls only slightly younger than me don’t realize this won’t happen again for a long time. That woman who wrote the book about why women should rule could think of only two possibilities, Sebelius or Hutchinson. Kay is a Repub so no thank you. But Sebelius is a boring stiff! Hill’s fun, she’s smart as a whip, she’s stronger then either of the men left in the race. It’s a joy! But, the media pretends it’s so ordinary. it’s so lame.
Thanks, filbert. I thought I got that wrong.
Mad props, djia, for telling it like it is to Donna Brazile! Awesome!
How can they do a reconcilation when the “BEST HITS” of their pastor rail on America and call us heathens.
This is the biggest bunch of hoeey…shows this is getting worse for the ole boy.
Nah, it won’t go away .. just a matter of time before the ad hits the airwaves.
Rhodes should be fired .. Imus was fired and the circumstances are no different. Suspension is not good enough. Who are the sponsors for that show .. anyone know. I’d like to tell them my opinion.
I would like to know when the msm is going to address of OBAMA’s involvement and support of cousin/close relative RAILA ODINGA -the co-President of Kenya?
ODINGA was set up in the oil business by Muammar Quaddafi (no, I’m not kidding),
was educated in Communist East Germany, (Herder Institute, Leipzig & Otto von Guericke Tech. Institute, Magdeburg)
named his first child “Fidel” (yeah, really)
and when he and his Luo followers disputed the election they torched a church with 100 Christian Kikuyu woman & children inside–burning them alive.
Odinga’s followers continued to engage in “clear ethnic cleansing” according to US Envoy Jendayi Frazer.
Perhaps most troubling is Odinga’s links to Islamic extremists.
On 8/29/07, Odinga signed a secret agreement (exposed 11/27) with Sheikh Abdullah Abdi in which he agreed to institute Islamic law in exchange for Abdi’s support–thereby potentially enslaving millions of Christian Kenyan women.
Is Obama responsible for his relatives? Perhaps not. However,
OBAMA campaigned for ODINGA (”your agent for change”-sound familiar?) in August 2006–to such a degree that the Opposition called him Odinga’s “stooge”. Odinga has since visited Obama on a fundraising tour of the US in 2007.
Read for yourself:
http://eakenya.org/newsevents/article.htm?id=8
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7176683.stm
http://www.thestar.com/News/World/article/290390
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=57363
http://africanpress.wordpress.com/2007/04/26/how-rich-is-raila-the-odm-kenya-presidential-aspirant/
http://www.raila07.com
http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/blog/2008/01/the_kenya_conne.html,
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/02/obamas-relationship-with-raila.php
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=149_1199587542
Further: On his visit to Africa (campaigning for cousin Raila Odinga), Senator Barack Obama said (according to the Kenya’s “The Standard”):
“I am so proud to come back home. It means a lot to me that the people of my father and grandfather are here to greet me with such warmth,” Obama, 45, told the crowd. [I guess his African grandmother like his American one-- doesn’t count for much]
Police and plainclothes US marines had a rough time controlling the surging crowds.
Raila [Odinga] came to the aid of the security personnel when he took the microphone from the master of ceremonies and pleaded with the crowd to remain calm.
Obama took the crowd to ecstasy when he greeted them in dholuo: “Misawa u duto” (Greetings to all of you)
The crowd responded with cheers and ululation interrupting the senator’s speech by about a minute forcing Raila [Odinga] to take the microphone and intervene again.
“Kare Obama ma nyalo telo America ni en mana jaluo kaka wan (It is true that Obama who may one day lead America is a Luo like us,” said Mama Odhiambo, 45.
Obama said he was proud to come back home saying the visit to the lakeside region meant a lot to him.
“I am so proud to be back home … it really touches my heart when my relatives come out in large numbers to welcome me,” he said.
http://216.180.252.4/archives/index.php?mnu=details&id=1143957392&catid=4
Obama holds dual Kenya/US citizenship and his church promotes “a non-negotiable commitment to Africa” (www.tucc.org)
So, where is “home” for Senator Obama:–Chicago ……or Kenya???
Since many experts consider Kenya still to be potentially on the verge of civil war, what does this mean for the security interests of The United States?
And, what does associating/promoting someone like Odinga say about Barack Obama’s judgment?
A fair question, wouldn’t you say?
/Users/Paulie/Desktop/obama4.jpg
filbert,
‘Brazile happens to be a thug in a high position and suit’.
LMAO!
She is such a brillo-head hypocrite on those talk shows biting her tongue to keep herself from actually coming out and screaming her devotion, “I Woveeeeeeeeee Bwackie!”
Can’t resist; Here’s one post by Donna Brazille. (hehehehe – about 2 dozen down)
‘Life is a *****! Don’t vote for one!’ BTW, I wonder just where Brillo head keeps her blackberry?
Well I don’t know if this is good or bad. HeadlineYahoo: Hillary says she will defend Gay rights …
According to which group you are speaking too I suppose. Just saying. I’m with Hillary on this issue as well.
Eh, I don’t care if they fire her, I just wish these women on the radio were not so predictable. If they fired her, they would just hire another Hillary hater. Why hate Hill? She’s the most progressive, viable candidate actually in my life time.
I think everyone is so predictable they have bored me to death. Hating Hillary, left and right, mostly Left. Women commentators, too dry, cold and humorless to take any fun in Hill’s election. It’s a bore.
i dont get the pa and in polls tighetning up so much. scary. but she has the pa machine with her. where on earth is a 527 for hillary? she relly needs it for ads etc in these states now i think. obama has out fo state help why cant hillary? there was a 527 ready to go prior to ohio-but then it never ran ads or anything. we need a 527 to help her out
birdgal at 7:29 pm: I completely agree. My point was that freedom of speech is not absolute and commmercial speech enjoys less protection under the First Amendment. Justice Holmes was widely regarded as a great civil libertarian (in fact he was a social darwinist) and even he said the First Amendment does NOT confer the right to scream fire in a crowed theater. That is what I was referring to. Nevertheless, the blogger I referred to saw it differently.
Good evening all. I was reading the posts above about the Donna Brazile exchange ending up on Politico. I have had on-again-off-again conversations with her too, but i know some of you know Okie’s friend who used to post here was the target of a smear campaign too. But I agree with Bill Clinton PERSONALLY that if you can’t play hardball, you shouldn’t get into the game. That being said, as we are here in public and as Hillary detractors will use ANYTHING to paint HER with a negative brush, perhaps we should not use so much slang? Four-letter words and nasty name calling is the lowest common denominator anyway. And we get PLENTY of THAT from BO’s side and the Reverend Wright.
I don’t mean to sound like Miss Manners, but maybe let’s up the ante and speak to our objections in a less critiqueable (sic) way. It can only help HC. And us.
Keep those emails to Brazile & Pelossi going:
BRAZILE: info@brazileassociates.com
PELOSSI: american voices@mail.house.gov.
http://www.speaker. gov
sf.nancy@mail.house.gov
ADMIN: Please post!
I agree that Sebelius is boring!! I tried to watch her state of the democratic union speech, she must of failed that class in college. She couldn’t motivate anybody!! Straight monotone speech!LOL!!!
I would not support Sebelius. She does nothing for me.
the polls will tighten but she will win .. wait till voting day. People still have the image of Rev Wright in their minds .. also, nothing like a lil reminder a few days before the primary.
wbboei, we’re just regular folks who are expressing discontent. Brazile needs to know that people are angry with her actions. She probably gets letters from BO supporters fluffing her.
Look at it this way, if it weren’t for the person who posted the video of Randi Rhodes tirade, it wouldn’t have caught the attention of the head honchos at AA.
When people are upset, they need to express it. The people who make decisions need to hear from both sides. It’s part of the job and if Brazile is thinned skinned, maybe that job isn’t for her.
It’s not in my nature to write letters or even talk to people I dislike, but if other people feel compelled to, they should.
I read a teachers union will be running ads for Hillary .. anyone know anything about it?
Can’t resist; Here’s one post by Donna Brazille. (hehehehe – about 2 dozen down)
‘Life is a *****! Don’t vote for one!’
Brazile said that? Jesus, that’s unprofessional.
radio ads i think. whatever happened to the 527 with 10 mil to run ads in ohio. this is insane-a 527 could boost her in these states with ads, mailouts etc.. i will be damned if she wins pa by 51 pct of the vote bc bambi’s money. seriously
Some polls show a tightening, some really don’t. Don’t panic.
@dot48 – The AFT – American Federation of Teachers is fully behind Hillary – It does not surprise me in the least they will be running ads. I can guarantee you that come the days before and on election day the AFT, ASFCME, IUPAT and others will be in full force spreading the message in PA.
mj you ask the question why do they hate hill.
I think it is because they are comfortable in their world, for whatever reason they think it is working for them, they fear change, she is the instrument of change therefore they fear her and from fear comes hate. And when they hang around people with the same outlook the consensus moves to the exteme and they reinforce eachother deny contrary evidence. Sooner or later they crash.
mj, when are you headed to PA? I just got an email from a guy from TX who is now in PA and they said they’re need lots of volunteers and to come soon.
Thanks, wbboei. You are probably right. But when I see these ladies on TV or in the paper talking about “baggage”, it’s just so demoralizing. Only pundits care about baggage what ever the hell that is. Regular people just care about their lives and who gives a heck about them. That’s what they care about. And, I just think it’s really fun watching a great female candidate on the cusp of the presidency. Why don’t they just lighten up?
let me say that again… “and he said they need lots of help and volunteers.”
To: BRAZILE: info@brazileassociates.com
ARE YOU LIVING IN A CAVE?
Hey Donna-
Where have you been when Obama and his surrogates have been attacking Clinton’s character, honesty, morals and electability for months and months? I haven’t seen you telling them to mind their manners. In fact, every time I see you on TV you seem transported with glee when one of the Clinton haters indulges in a character assasinating rant. Why now so shy? Is it because now it’s Obama that’s getting beat up? Because, let’s face it, Donna, MSNBC can over sample every poll they want to show that Wright didn’t hurt Obama–but we know better, don’t we, Donna.
Community News: Rev. Jeremiah Wright and Rev. James Meeks buried Barack Obama (with a little interdenominational help from NOI Louis Farrakhan). Funeral services to be held Tuesday, April 22nd, Pennsylvania..
Here’s another news flash: the DNC is not going to be able to disenfranchise Michigan and Florida when people become aware (as they are becoming aware, Donna) that the primaries were moved up by Republican legislatures over which the voters had no control. Also, when the fact that the Obama camp intentionally removed their name from the ballot to cede a state that they were losing by double digits as a face saving strategy becomes apparent–I think there’s going to be a backlash against the DNC, and you, Donna for playing fast and loose to help your favorite.
Of course, that’s just my humble opinion.
Dot,
Lou speaking up against his pro-BO panel who are quoting BO, “Well, Bo compared this process to a movie that has gone on a half hour too long” and says well, HE signed UP for this MOVIE!!!!
And about BO’s fund-raising – ‘there’s an old saying about “Crying all the Way to the Bank as the movie goes on a half hour too long.”
Love Lou.
ABout the TUCC press conference – I googled but couldn’t find the link – guess it will be on Dobbs transcript later. he’s the one who reported it.
And I agree. Apparently it’s ok for the 2 decades long pastor of a prospective presidential nominee to say GD America bit it’s NOT OK for reporters to attend a public service and report what was said.
Bill-O doing the Catholic priest endorsing Farrakhan thing and saying the Catholic Church now has a problem for supporting Wright.
Well, my plans have sort of fallen through. I am looking for a back up plan.
@filbertsf – of course, when frustrated we should be communicating that frustration. But it falls upon deaf ears when we are in attack mode – many of these people are already on the defensive – a carefully and thoughtfully written letter, that both appeals to the individual (invites them in to read on) and the espouses your objectives, frustrations, will be much better received and/or read than any type of attack – it’s like you need to keep your enemies closer than you do your friends, – there is ample information to obtain from the likes of DB and others but you will close that door before it is open if not strategic and inviting -
Spega, that was a good post on Odinga, I had wondered why Fox had not brought that up!
I don’t know anything about politics over there, but didn’t Kerry’s wife grow up in South Africa under the aparthied movement? Does anyone know about that?
wbboei, I have a better theory. They want to be cool by supporting the first black contender for President. Race is still a biggie in America and they want to show the world how progressive they are. It’s cool to support Obama. They think it shows how open-minded and progressive they are.
Oh SH!T! This priest Pfleiger is going ALL OUT in his support of FARRAKHAN.
And not a word from the media. But Bill-O says he (FOX) will take on these radicals. hehehehe.
But a woman is the ultimate challenge to the staus quo, much more so than any man.
Why is it that BO is considered “African American” when his mother / grandmother is white – what would they think about his “African American” stance -
fdrjim, don’t think for a second that Brazile will be persuaded by a well-written, well-thought out letter.
She has her own agenda set. BTW, from what dijia and others have stated that they have written, they were polite and careful about what they wrote.
It’s Brazile who replied with crass and meaness.
mj Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 8:05 pm
Well, my plans have sort of fallen through. I am looking for a back up plan.
Sorry to hear that.
Well, filbert, i will work out something, but I really wanted to go with someone I know.
Can someone please tell me what “Loyal Order of the Masons” can have to do with this. I keep being told this by someone….
filbert,
I’m ASSUMING that someone posted under brillo-head’s alias!!!!!!
That’s why I copied and linked here. i thought not only was the remark funny but so was attributing it to DB!
I mean, come on, there’s no way she would actually post that on a public forum under her real name, right??????
filbert,
Here’s the link ADMIN posted.
The comment is about 20 or 21 down.
‘Whaddaya think?
basil, oh. You know, I wouldn’t be surprised if Brazile calls Hillary that in private conversations with friends.
I think it’s someone using Donna’s name.
Where does Obama get his money? Seriously …
I don’t know if anyone saw this, but here’s the Sons of Italy statement on Wright.
http://www.osia.org/public/newsroom/pr04_01_08.asp
mj Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 8:11 pm
Well, filbert, i will work out something, but I really wanted to go with someone I know.
Make new friends, dude. I went to TX by myself and didn’t know a soul. I left TX with new phone numbers, new emails and a lifetime of memories.
People who sacrifice time and money for no other purpose than to see Hillary get elected should have lots in common and fun to be with.
No, I did that in NH, that’s probably what I will do, but I am disappointed it fell out with my friend.
mj, s/he didn’t switch to BO, did s/he?
‘But when I see these ladies on TV or in the paper talking about “baggage”, it’s just so demoralizing. Only pundits care about baggage what ever the hell that is.’
What are you TALKING about?????????
Talk about B-O-R-I-N-G!!!!!!!!!
Oh no, he’s still going, but he’s doing some vacationing too and wants to go alone.
What am I talking about? I am talking about the pundits. Why are you upset at me?
dot: I dont’ know, what masons have to do with this. there are many conspiracy theories that have been around for years, but no one has been clear on what they are. The History Channel has a good program on the Masons.
mj, if you are going, what city are you headed to?
Wow, Bill O’Reilly on Fox really went after Father Pfleger. This priest also has strong ties to Obama–another Rev. Wright perhaps?
Video:
Father Pfleger defends Wright and Farrakhan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjJlsGrlbUs
Obama’s Moral Compass
“Friends and advisers, such as the Rev. Michael Pfleger, pastor of St. Sabina Roman Catholic Church in the Auburn- Gresham community on the South Side, who has known Obama for the better part of 20 years, help him keep that compass set, he says.”
http://www.suntimes.com/news/falsani/726619,obamafalsani040504.article
Father Pfleger listed on Obama’s “Faith Endorsements” Page
“The faith community has to be a prophetic voice to bring us to where we ought to be as a country”
faith.barackobama.com/page/content/faithtestimonials
Father Pfleger hosted faith forums as part of the Obama campaign
“During the first three weeks of September, Obama campaign staff and religious leaders from across America hosted faith forums with Iowans in 14 communities where they discussed the role of faith in politics and public service. Some of the forums included Father Michael Pfleger, priest for the Archdiocese of Chicago, and Pastor Brian McLaren, one of Time Magazine’s top 25 most influential evangelicals this year.”
http://www.barackobama.com/2007/10/14/obama_hosts_des_moines_forum_t.php
Father Pflegers church given grant after he contributed to Obama
“One of those long-time supporters was Rev. Michael Pfleger, the politically active leader of St. Sabina Church. He gave Obama’s campaign $1,500 between 1995 and 2001, including $200 in April 2001, about three months after Obama announced $225,000 in grants to St. Sabina programs.”
http://www.chicagotribune.com/entertainment/chi-0705030035may03,0,7803217.story
Father Pfleger supports Jeremiah Wright and asked him to his church a little over a week ago
“I invited Dr. Wright because he is a friend, mentor and hero of mine and because he is someone for whom I have great respect.”
http://www.saintsabina.org/
Father Pfleger uses violent rhetoric in defending Obama who he has known 20 years
“So Father Pfleger is out with a warning: “Do not touch this man,” he says, “for if you do, you will answer to us all.”
http://www.wbbm780.com/pages/185206.php?contentType=4&contentId=290430
Some other choice comments by Father Pfleger: he threatened to “snuff out” politicians in favor of gun laws and defends the Nation of Islam.
Jim Vandehei .. Executive Director of Politico .. needs to be called OUT by the campaign. He is on Fox news saying that her campaign told HIM that they only have 10% chance to win. HE NEEDS TO BE CALLED OUT.
(I had to take a call)
Now…as I was reading….I do want all to know that I believe it perfectly fine to construct arguments to the opposition, or, those that may be. Just like it is ok to mail the supporters and those who are undecided.
In contrast, with all the crap that has been written ABOUT HILLARY, and said ABOUT HILLARY, by Ben’s buddies in the MSM, on Huffington, on Kos, the most vile and awful things. And MS. Rhodes at Air America – that it was this one section of one email exchange that made it in to his Blog.
Wow…no hidden agenda there Ben. Keep up the unbiased journalistic ethics.
Tiny Dancer,
Thanks for the report from the Sons of italy!
I bookmarked and will read tomorrow.
Filbert,
I know what you mean.
Paula, Talk Radio did a segment on 527″s ( another thing i don’t understand too well) and said that a TON of foreign money is pumped into those organizations.
Could THAT be where BO gets his funds?
I hope lots of volunteers get to get on the ground in PA. Would be nice to have the $ to pay like Obama does his. BTW, there is NO way his campaign contributions are not fishy. There is no way he is getting that kind of money. Some day there will be a big investigation into this…
birdgal, I liken the Masons to an ancient version of Fred and Barney’s Loyal Order of the Water Buffalos Lodge or Al Bundy’s “No Ma’am”:
Bunch of frat boys in their middle ages, tired of their wives so they create a secret society. The reason no one is clear on what they are is because they themselves don’t know what they are other than frat boys.
Yup, if it’s about Hillary it’s ok, like that foul cartoon Anglachel posted today. Any kind of sexist or classist or regionalist trashing is just fine with our highminded MSM.
Clinton says she will defend gay rights
By NEDRA PICKLER, Associated Press Writer
58 minutes ago
Democratic Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton said she would defend gay rights as president and eliminate disparities for same-sex couples in federal law, including immigration and tax policy.
Clinton said states such as New Jersey and Massachusetts are extending rights to gay couples “and the federal government should recognize that and should extend the same access to federal benefits across the board. I will very much work to achieve that.”
Clinton’s comments came in an interview with the Philadelphia Gay News that was posted on its Web site Thursday.
Clinton said she and her husband have many gay friends that they socialize with when they get the chance. “I’ve got friends, literally, around the country that I’m close to. It’s part of my life,” she said.
She said that when they ask her why they can’t get married, she tells them marriage is a state law. She said that fact helped defeat a constitutional amendment to prohibit same-sex weddings that she said would “enshrine discrimination in the Constitution. ”
“States are really beginning seriously to deal with the whole range of options, including marriage, both under their own state constitutions and under the legislative approach,” she said. “I anticipate that there will be a very concerted amount of effort in the next couple of years that will move this important issue forward and different states will take different approaches as they did with marriage over many years and you will see an evolution over time.”
Clinton said she opposes a measure that would ban gay marriage in Pennsylvania.
“I would be very distressed if Pennsylvania were to adopt that kind of mean-spirited referendum and I hope it won’t happen,” she said.
Clinton’s Democratic rival Barack Obama and Republican John McCain declined the newspaper’s invitation for an interview. The paper criticized Obama and highlighted his refusal to talk by leaving a blank space on the front page where his interview would have appeared.
Clinton also said she would:
• Eliminate her husband’s policy of “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” that prevents gays from serving openly in the military. Asked if she could do so by a signing order connected to a military appropriations bill, Clinton said she didn’t think that is possible but she would look into it and do it if it were legal.
• Be “very strongly outspoken” against foreign governments that execute gays and use financial assistance and other leverage to prevent the killings.
• Support federal domestic partner legislation to extend rights to all same-sex couples.
• Support services for gay youth, including guidance for schools about the discrimination they face.
• Continue to support gay pride celebrations, to the extent that security would allow. “I don’t think the Secret Service let Bill walk in a parade when he became president,” she said.
Which ladies talking about what baggage and where? And why would that upset you?
Basil, the stupid pundits often say that crap. I was saying it’s stupid. Did you read my other comments? I was questioning why some of these women in the media are so boorish that they can’t take joy in a great female candidate.
Second post to those who have not seen it:
RE: Donna Brazile – I’ve been doing some psychological profiling based on responses sent to me from our FL activists – Donna Brazile has not committed to either candidate – her mindset has been changing over the recent past – she understands the need to be inclusive. We must be careful in our approach to the “ruling elite” – a well documented email, not placing blame, but articulating the strategic importance of recognizing disenfranchised voters, appealing to the tenets of our democracy, will go much further than placing blame. We have the opportunity, if careful in our correspondence, to change the minds of those on the fence. I know, from analysis of responses from DB her mindset is changing – pressure is good but in a controlled and strategic manner – we need not put people on the defensive – remember, most of them already are.
dot48- If that’s what the Politico guy is saying, then, he say who this is- maybe he was talking to a jr, jr, jr. staff member or a volunteer who didn’t know what the F they were talking about.
They make this stuff up – or they don’t have credible sources – and then, they hide behind the “we cannot name our sources” facade so they can hide their BS.
I’m trying to catch up, but there’s a Catholic Priest defending Wright? I can’t see that sitting well in Rome.
as far as women not sticking up for other women, I think its a jealousy issue. It’s very irritating. I have a female bulldog and she will not let another female dog live with us, I can only have a male dog which I have. So those ladies, I equate with my female dog!! LOL!!!
Parrot alert!
Off the subject. I just hadta share this breaking news. My little plum-head parakeet has been trying to ‘nest’ and I just found a pretty little pink and white egg. Now i know why she’s been attacking me! It’s all about territory (which she’s been extending for the past 2 weeks.)
Unlike politicians, she doesn’t claim to be seizing more turf for any reason other than her own selfish little interests. (You can learn a a lot from birds.)
birdgal, I come from a heavily Masonic family. I can answer any questions you have..
confloyd, it’s best you don’t compare female of the human variety to canines.
Tiny Dancer.
LMAO!
Me either. Especially after Wright insulted Romans and Iitalians and schnozzes everywhere.
filbertsf, the Masons are most assuridly not a “frat boy” organization.
I am proud of Hillary Clinton. I am proud to call her a female warrior. Yes, she is the best qualified candidate to ever step on the stage. Her command of every issue is amazing, brilliant and she has real plans to help solve the countries problems.
Women are sometimes our own worst enemy. I think that perhaps Donna Brazil has a little bit of the green eyed monster deep within her, Nancy Pelosi as well.
If you pick and tear apart long enough you can find a weak spot in any person .. to completely rip apart someone from fingertip to toenail over EVERY thing is simply unacceptable.
Bill OReilly called out MSNBC and it’s pundits, Brian Williams, Tweety and Russert. He nailed it.
I agree with Norma Desmond – and not afraid to play Miss Manners. We do represent Hillary as her ardent supporters, and when this stuff, ie. Brazile blackberry info- gets in the news – it is only meant to paint us – and ultimately Clinton as playing dirty politics, and being racists.
I swear there was this time when I felt like the BO campaign was sending the “muslim” rumor stuff in huge volume to Clinton volunteers – just before OH and TX – baiting us to send it around so they could point a finger back at the Clinton campaign for starting the rumors. And lo and behold, the Somali photo shows up on the news – and I’m sure BO campaign was hoping to add fuel to the fire by getting another Clinton volunteer fired.
Djia – I don’t fault you as much as all of us have been complicit – Brazile’s email being distributed (through Spega? and others) that form letter you sent (from Spega?), needs to be thought through made your own responsible words if you are to send it.
Ummmmmm . . . . Jealousy?????? Ambition??????
Welcome Marie3548.
This via Hillbuzz:
http://hillbuzz.blogspot.com/2008/03/howard-stern-on-barack-obama-jeremiah.html
LEMMINGS OFF THE CLIFF…
It seems that every Dem that lost an election, or helped a Dem lose an election, is jumping up and saying, “Amen, Obama will unite the Dems and win the nomination, because he can unite the country and win the GE”.
Pitiful mother fu**ing idiots. We’re wondering at what exact **timed** moment Carter will chime in, joining Richardson. Nobody’s exactly clear on what Edwards will do, but it seems that the higher level officials think the safer bet is to back Obama. I find this…. completely retarded.
Another Kerry/Gore/Dukakis/
Carter(1980) wimp meltdown. Gee, we had no idea Republicans would try to make Topic X, some trivial incident, into some campaign killing kiss-of-death.
Hillary is immune. God Bless her. Barack, not-so-much.
&^&&&&
The good news? It just seems like more unfair piling on. Or if not unfair, worthless / misguided. It takes too much guts to back the woman who is behind by a miniscule amount in pledged delegates and popular votes (ahem, even though those don’t count FL/MI).
They’re all worthless and week. Hill’s going to win it because of the strong / centrist people, and the REALLY BIG TENT (hello, Hill is not afraid to grant an interview w/ Philly Gay News).
American Gal Re: Masons .. I keep hearing they are behind the men vote for Obama.
OMG!!!!!!!
The end really is near! Stern has a serious sincere moment????
Don’t tell me I’m gonna haveta start listening to him, too! Bad enough that it’s all-Fox all-the-time without throwing Howie into the mix!
filbert and American Gal: I don’t have any questions about Masons, but Dot brought up the “Loyal Order of Masons.” I don’t think, there is anything sinister about them. My father was a Mason, and I was a Job’s Daughter. I wasn’t sure how, they figured into the campaign.
hi RGB – welcome…back?
Ininla…I have thought for a long time that BO Campaign released the original Muslim email to “stop the train” before it hit the airwaves re: Farakhan and Wright etc. It was then convenient to say “we have already dealt with that…that was the Clinton people way ack when”
when REAL issues of uncomfortable situations arose later.
my brother is a Mason .. he’s very secretive about it. So I don’t know what they are saying in their lodges…just hearing stuff
A big fraternal organization like the Masons are probably good for raising campaign money. Maybe that’s how BO can raise so much money in so little time.
Bo is has some very wealthy elite people supporting him: Oprah, Kennedy, Kerry, entertainers, oil tycoons like the Getty’s (having a fundraiser in SF this week), Murdoch’s daughter, obambots and their wealthy families, etc. I doubt, all these people are Masons, but they are known for their secretiveness, which tends to generate many rumors.
Norma – i hadn’t thought it was to preempt the Wright issue, but the timing of the racism/muslim baiting from the BO campaign is always a few days before a primary. You can see the pattern – it’s so obvious to me.
But really – that week before many of us left for OH, TX – I seriously sensed the volume of the muslim stuff was growing on the internet, and started seeing that rumor surface again and a small group of us stopped two volunteers from sending it around to others because we knew it was wrong, and had heard what happened in Iowa and the Clinton campaign had zero tolerance policy.
I think BO campaign is baiting us on every level – top to bottom. It’s sophisticated and disgusting.
Is it my imagination or are the bots getting into TM too?
birdgal, it doesn’t matter that he has support from the elite… each can only contribue 2300 per quarter.
The Masons have a wider reach. If they have a code of brotherhood, then if the leaders (or whatever you call them) supports BO, then the bond of loyalty would require that the other brothers contribute to the campaign.
From my experience with the Masons they do not, as an organization, support presidential candidates. My dad is a 32nd degree Mason and he is not aware of any such effort in the several decades he has been a member.
I think that some people are saying the Masons are behind Obama because there are goofball conspiracy wingnuts out there who are convinced the Masons are some kind of shady ultra powerful organization that controls all of mankind. They blame the Mason for virtually anything that happens in the world.
The reality is that there are some predominantly black lodges whose members are no doubt heavily pro-Obama and that may be where this belief is coming from. I’m sure money is being contributed by these members but they are just individuals who are part of Obama’s overall donor base.
It doesn’t help when Clinton backers like Corzine and Murtha add comments like she must win the popular vote….at least keep your mouth shut . Tom Harkin, another ass, told Bill to “chill” today at all. What about Obama “chilling” at a guy who wants a pic??? The hypocrisy would be laughable if not so tragic fro our country.
confloyd,
There’s an occasional troll at TM’s site, but today was the first one I’ve seen in a week or so.
Getting ready to watch Gerry Ferraro on Hannity & Colmes . . .
confloyd – yes, the bots invading TM as well. I think these are paid bots with little assignments, actually.
go to north carolina tv hillary will read your questions for her then answer them on her site..
jbstonesfan
I wish a LOT of people/surrogates would “shut up.” Hillary just needs to stay on message – with the voters. That’s what she does best and we really need it for PA. I’ll be so glad when the “voters” get to speak – so maybe the Obama camp and the media will shut it for a while. PA is critical tho; Obama is pouring a ton of money in there. I’m gonna be making phone calls. Maybe we should all do something constructive for Hill and just ignore all the distractions.
I certainly don’t think Hillary’s base will be happy to be marginalized to “the women”. “the women” have power and we have power in the booth.
Hillary needs to keep doing just what she is doing .. face to face with people.
The Bosnia flap definitely hurt her and I wish they’d come up with some footage from that trip that did show some violence.
vote for Hillary:
Action Alert: Vote on The 2008 TIME 100 Finalists
Go Vote for Senator Clinton on The Time 100 Finalists for 2008.
Who Are the World’s Most Influential?
Vote for the leaders, artists, enterpreneurs and thinkers who, in your opinion, deserve a spot on this year’s Time 100.
Click Here to Vote for Senator Clinton.
time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1725112_1723512_1723932,00.html)
Currently Sen. Clinton ranks #18 and Barack Obama ranks #4.
Ok, I am back……..great concert! my kids school puts on THE best!! I have five kids 24-9 yrs old and we have moved a couple times so plenty of different schools…….so believe me when i say this school is the very best
ok…….y’all got really chatty while i was away…..LOL
thank you for your support, I didn’t want to leave!!!
let’s move on to other things….
Basil!!! congratz on the baby birdie!!! how exciting!!
I hate missing fox now…….thanks for the tidbits……i will have to watch the reruns later……..got hannity on now
Emmy
I’ve been hoping to see you again here.
Go to HillaryClinton.com., then click on Take Action, then Find/Plan Start , put in your zip, and plan a meet-up somewhere.
From that get together, collect emails/tel #s of every one there, AND their friends, each contribute $5 and buy a small starter pkg from the Hillary store.
THEN, find your strongest, most mesmerizing legislator who supports our girl, hold a brunch ralley every Sat., somewhere, have their children come to a kids event and make homemade signs…and on and on.
If you git er up and going, I’ll send you some stuff I have extra from here…and I bet others would contribute too. I would be willing to collect all the little bits and pieces here and send to you in one of Hill’s UPS boxes (though it might be cheaper from FL.)
THEN call the campaign # in Arlington, one of us can maybe get you a contact name, tell them what you have done in 2-4 weeks and ASK FOR HELP.
Feeling jazzed? I’m tired just thinking like that again, after having done it for a year !!
Good luck, ask for ideas as you go along. Oh, and try to get a list of registered Dems in your area, always have a clipboard and lined paper for names, addresses, email and tel info with you at all times!
IB .. Phone Bank .. it will make you feel better.
Everyone here that can PLEASE phone bank…we might not can be boots on the ground but we can canvass the state with supporters of Hillary’s.
hey,
isnt saying brillo head, kinda like saying nappy headed?
isnt that what imus got his ass kicked to the curb with?
if i was black, i’d be f@%$ing pissed about that comment…
no, actually, i’ld be really hurt…
we used to have a lot of african americans on this site, now,
not so much…
HEY EMJAY….
WOW, Geraldine Ferraro TELLS IT LIKE IT IS about the Obama campaign playing the race card . . .
That’s what I said, jbstone. Hillary’s surrogates talk too much. They haven’t been much help, IMHO.
Obama surrogates have nothing but glowing praise for him and they’re always on the attack.
Hillary supporters say things that often times, as a Hillary supporters, you wonder about their loyalty.
Gerry Ferraro says on Hannity that there’s still a coordinated effort from the Obama camp and supporters attacking her. She described hate mails and coordinated voice mails, 24 in one day, all coming from the same state . . . .
Ben: Gerry Ferraro says on Hannity that there’s still a coordinated effort from the Obama camp and supporters attacking her. She described hate mails and coordinated voice mails, 24 in one day, all coming from the same state . . . .
ahhh….. the new politics.
And someone has the gall to tell us to back off Brazile?
You know, there was a girl on TM’s site that said she thought there was something to this hate speech of Wright, etc. She said that “hate” totally surrounds Obama . . . and, you know, I think she’s right.
Agreed Ben….we need a victory in Penn by at least 10% or more. Off coure, BO is closing the once double digit gap, as he is out spending her by millions. I imagine Hillary is waiting for the final week to use whatever resources she has left to regain some distance. What is unsettling to me, however, is that the greatest President in our lifetime, Bill Clinton, is having such a tough time with the SD’s. If someone as supposedly close as Richardson would rat him/Hillary out, what clout, if any, does he have with these politcos who want to jump on the BO “soul train”. Look at that nerdy college kid that Chelsea was kind enough to have lunch with, and whom Bill called several times….the loser went with BO!!!!
keep me posted about Fox, I am at work so I can’t see it. How about a play by play analysis?
Maybe the Obama’s camp is threatening the SD’s. Could they be doing that?
most definitely
What is TTM? What other sites are pro Hillary?
VOTE FOR HILLARY on the TIME “Most Influential” poll.
Obama is at 4; she is listed at 18
http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1725112_1723512_1723932,00.html
Admin: please help & post!
jbs, maybe lininla is right. Your posts smell fishy to me.
djia,
It’s a baby birdie eggie ala the immaculate conception but the (Other) Basilk) doesn’t know the difference. She is very proud of herself Of course she covered her toes in long threads from the towel she was demolisahig for nesting naterials and I can’t get it off her ankle and am praying she doesn’t get hung up on something in the cage and strangle herself. i can’t take it off without someone to help so it’s avian VET EMERGENCY TOMORROW.
Night all
It doesn’t help that a guy like Richardson obviously leaks the contents of a private conversation he had with Hillary.
And for anyone who is worried about the Bosnia flap, I wouldn’t. I think Hillary’s numbers took a bit of a hit from it, especially among men, but it appears that she’s bouncing back now. Ignore all polls until the next SUSA in PA comes out.
Some of this daily crap out of the Obama camp is bound to stick to him. You know, the latest version of “What Obama Really Meant” or his latest incident of rank hypocrisy.
I just read the monologue of Jay Leno, apparently Hillary walked on stage to the theme of Rocky and Jay introduced her as the Italian Stallion. She told Jay that really didn’t know if she’d make the show because she was pinned down by sniper fire.
SHe is too Cool, where does she get that stuff from, she can make fun of herself. Sorry, Oprah, she the one!!
jbstone – take it easy on Bill. Obama is lining the pockets of these SD’s, I don’t think there is any doubt about it. And Richardson, well I’m sure Obama offered him something and so he was willing to betray Bill and Hillary for it. He’s a jerk and his endorsement has done Obama no good at all.
I’ll have to stay up and watch leno tonight
The talk left has a whole thing on it and the comments after are very interesting!
confloyd,
Like I said in the above posts, I think it’s obvious that Obama is lining the pockets of superdelegates. Even a couple of months ago, it was reported that he had contributed over 600K to SD’s.
Also, if it’s an elected official and if Obama won their district, they threaten to run a young african-american candidate against them in their next primary. That’s what they did to John Lewis.
Had a lot of fun campaigning in Texas, will probably head out to Penn soon for the Hillmeister.
How on earth did Obama camp get so powerful?
Donna Brazile is disgusting. She’s a traitor and a Judas.
# confloyd Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:47 pm
Maybe the Obama’s camp is threatening the SD’s. Could they be doing that?
I would bet on it!!
…or is it a bit of a perception that the media is giving out..
dedfg: support from the elite democratic left
actually the longer this campaign goes on, the more scary the thought of him being president becomes…..and we thought Bush was bad.
Can you imagine being able to control the media even more than bush?
It really should be illegal, I am so disenchanted with the whole political thing. It’s is so shady and mobster-like. Has it always been like this or just the chicago mob got into the act?
dedfg -
They got powerful because it’s a concerted, well-planned effort by the elite liberal left of the party – or the neo-libs as some are saying – to take over the Democratic Party. Defeating Hillary Clinton is the sole objective, and you sometimes wonder if the General Election even matters to them.
we need to get the message out more about his ‘new’ politics.
confloyd
I am nearly 45 and as long as i can remember i have heard this ” our government is nothing more than organized crime”
here’s the link to vote on obama
please vote him down!!
time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1725112_1723512_1723519,00.html
I actually think the media has a different agenda . . . but it’s been convenient for Obama, since media control helps his campaign a lot. Axelrod specializes in running a black candidate and using the race card whenever possible. It’s been pretty well-organized, with the organization and focus on the caucuses, the MI/FL deal, and everything else.
We are really lucky to have Hillary running right now.
Its sad, because I truly believe even the most ardent of candidates will eventually have to play politics to get even a tiny bit of good for the American people. I have read Hillary’s life story and honestly believe she has her heart in the right place for us. The rest are on a power trip, like Pelosi and the others!
obama camp though is downright mean.
Hillary really is the candidate that cares about this country.
To think I was actually proud when Pelosi was sworn in, now I realize she is just another dirty politician!! SICK!!!
The one thing that throws a wrench into Obama/Axelrod’s plans, and scares them to death, is the voters. I really feel Hillary has the core Democratic with her, and it’s evident everytime she squares off with Obama in a large state.
well-planned effort by the elite liberal left of the party – or the neo-libs as some are saying – to take over the Democratic Party
Gimme a break. I realize that you’re an independent, Ben, and the only thing we probably have in common is supporting Hillary. But I’m not going to let that comment go unchallenged.
The Democratic Party is the party of “liberals and progressives.” We believe in advancing social progress. How can these so-called “elite liberal left” of the party “takeover a party” when they have always been there. If anything, the centrist and DINOs are trying to take over the party.
If they succeed, the Dems will be no different than the GOP.
The Democratic Party has always been to the left, until recently when the centrist started moving in. People like Mark Warner, Harry Reid, Bob Casey Jr, Harold Ford, and Jim Webb are changing the face of the Democratic Party. They are either blue-dog Democrats or DINOs. The DINOs, like Jim Webb, switched to become a Dem for political expediency.
We need people who still believe that a women has a right to choose, in social progress. Unfortunately, those centrists don’t.
So, actually it gives me even more ambition to fight for Hillary everywhere I blog.
dedfg, you can’t read her book and not realize she was born to be a President! It’s in her heart. If we can get her in, I think she will be one of the greatest! If I didn’t believe this I would not have contributed $ to her campaign. I have never donated in my life before and I am 57 Y.O. I’m one of the old ladies that support Hillary!
BTW, “neo-liberals” or “classical liberals” are not the “elite liberal left.”
Classical liberals are akin to Libertarians.
Ergo, neo/classical-liberals are NOT liberals in the modern sense.
confloyd, I remember when I first saw her in the nineties…and there was talk then about her running for president in the future. So, I have been waiting for this moment for years! LOL!
I have always like her and her style (I never related to the traditional first lady type person)
@filbertsf
I’ve been a Democrat for “most” of my life, and I guess we just see the party differently. The guys like Casey I would describe as conservative Democrats. I feel Hillary is a true progressive, but she is much more moderate and can naturally move closer to the center for a general election – which is how you when them in my opinion.
Hillary is a true progressive. No doubt in my mind. Hillary is also a realist and pragmatist. You can’t succeed in politics by being a stubborn bulldog.
My favorite Hillary quote is: “You can’t lead if no one is following you.”
I will never concede Hillary to the centrist side of the Democrats.
By the way, Casey and Warner are conservative Dems. Jim Webb is a DINO and an opportunist.
“Hillary walked on stage to the theme of Rocky and Jay introduced her as the Italian Stallion. She told Jay that really didn’t know if she’d make the show because she was pinned down by sniper fire.”
lol
Gotta love that Hillary.
Emjay,
Thanks for the tips. It’s funny that you say:
“Oh, and try to get a list of registered Dems in your area,”
because almost NO ONE here is a registered Dem or Repub, since we can’t vote for president. Only the politicians, who get to go to the conventions, are registered in a U.S. party! I suspect EVERYONE will be allowed to vote without registering!
what is a true progressive and DINO? I don’t know where Hillary falls on the spectrum, I just know she’ll be damn good!
Emmy
so that voters are not turned away, make sure what the rules are, and get people registered!
If you don’t, you may find Obama camp challenging those who come to vote. I’m serious, check on the rules tomorrow, and start writing letters-to-the-editor to make sure all start to realize they HAVE TO BE REGISTERED !
here’s what’s coming in the fall IF obama is nominee
h t t p : / / news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080403/pl_nm/usa_politics_election_dc;_ylt=Ara9q7MavhsDhVjPJrQopHes0NUE??
Republicans feel good about Obama match-up
By John Whitesides, Political Correspondent Thu Apr 3, 1:43 PM ET
WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Hillary Clinton may be the Democrat who Republicans love to hate, but some Republican strategists say they have no fear of a match-up with her rival Barack Obama in November’s presidential election.
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Many Republicans have long believed Clinton, the polarizing New York senator and former first lady with the high negative ratings, would make an easier White House foe by energizing conservatives and alienating independents.
But Republicans say the relentless Democratic nominating battle has given them new hope for November and exposed weaknesses in Obama that will play a central role in any general election campaign against the Illinois senator.
“I believe he has a glass jaw — and he is going to get hit hard,” said Republican pollster Tony Fabrizio.
Obama’s voting record in the U.S. Senate — one magazine ranked him the most liberal senator in 2007 — and during his years in the Illinois state Senate will get a more thorough examination in a campaign against Republican John McCain than it has so far, he said.
“He portrays himself as a centrist and a moderate, but if you look at his votes it’s tough to see anything but a liberal. He is more liberal than Hillary Clinton,” Fabrizio said.
The questions raised by Clinton about Obama’s lack of experience and suitability as commander in chief will be revitalized, Republicans say, as will the controversy about inflammatory comments by Obama’s pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright.
Coupling that with Obama’s weakness among blue-collar Democrats and Hispanics, and the possibility of a prolonged nominating fight that turns off Clinton backers and independents, Republicans are gaining confidence about a November race against Obama.
“Originally people thought Hillary would be better to run against only because she generated so much ill will among the Republican base,” said Republican consultant Rich Galen.
“But I don’t think professional politicians on the Republican side have a rooting interest anymore because it doesn’t matter. We can beat either one. We just wish the election was tomorrow,” he said.
WHO CAN WIN?
The question of who gives Democrats the best chance in November is central to the battle between Clinton and Obama as they woo superdelegates — the party insiders and elected officials who are free to back any candidate and are likely to decide the tight race.
The two campaigns have waged a war of words, memos and conference calls with reporters to make their case. The Clinton campaign says she is a known quantity with proven success in big swing states and with key constituencies like women, Catholics and Hispanics.
Clinton was heartened by a Quinnipiac University poll this week that showed her beating McCain in three key swing states — Pennsylvania, Ohio and Florida — and running better against him than Obama. “The polls are reflecting the arguments we’re making,” Clinton strategist Mark Penn said.
The Obama campaign says he would rewrite the electoral map, bringing in new voters and drawing independents and some Republicans in a broad coalition that would also help Democrats in other races around the country.
“We are going to put more states in play than Senator Clinton,” said Obama campaign manager David Plouffe, adding Obama “would provide the best atmosphere for down ballot candidates.”
But the Clinton campaign leaped to highlight recent comments in The New York Times Sunday magazine by Rep. Tom Cole of Oklahoma, who heads the Republican party’s efforts to elect House of Representatives members. He said he thought Clinton would be the stronger candidate.
“He’s ideologically well to the left of Hillary Clinton, for all his rhetorical gifts, and I also think he’s got a national security deficit,” Cole said.
“I think she’s a plausible commander in chief, and I don’t think he is. It may not matter. But those two areas are where we would fight the election, and with McCain, I think we contrast with him very well,” he said.
Republicans have been successful at painting Democratic candidates like Al Gore in 2000 and John Kerry in 2004 as too liberal and out of step with everyday voters. But part of Obama’s appeal has been his promise to rise above partisan divisions.
Fabrizio said there were dangers for Republicans in Obama’s ability to attract new voters and increase turnout, but his record in Illinois on topics like sex education, crime and spending would be fertile territory for researchers.
“In order to bring out those new voters, you have to maintain the same level of excitement. If Obama gets tarnished, that excitement is going to wane” among those voters, Fabrizio said.
“What more are you going to tell the American people about Hillary Clinton? But most Americans didn’t even know Barack Obama eight months ago, and there is so much more for them to know.”
them people in Penn are not going to go obomba.there are very afraid of wright his right hand man and spiritual advisor maybe going to the white House..you never know he might even ask him to be VP//.he is a dirty politician..they will not to many workers that understand Hillarys message…hes the man,well news is he is not…the Liar and crook,will come out..I think his money is tainted..someone will find out…and to his knees doing the dean scream..
I have come to believe that the Obama phenomenon, does not have anything to do with the issues, or with the most qualified person. It’s LOVE. It’s like falling in love with this charismatic person (of course, I none of us find him charismatic, but he’s mesmerized a lot of people.) Love is an irrational state. No one can say anything bad about the beloved. Otherwise, how is it possible that the Wright issue did not make people see the light, or that the silly Bosnia flap was more important than the Wright deal?
What can be done to make enough people fall out of love, or amke sure the undecided do not fall for that?
Also, I wonder what would happen if Obama got the nomination but all the Hillary supporters just wrote in her name and she won?
Webb. like Lunz, has an awful hair piece imo. As for President Clinton, the greatest POTUS in my life time, he is working so hard he is bordering on exhaustion. Many of you may not be aware, but in between campaigning in the various Staes, he often makes 2 or 3 trips to private fund raisers in one day to help raise needed cash. My contact down here advised he will be coming back yet again to S. Fla as it is very Hillary friendly.
Lastly, some of you have a lot of nerve continuously questioning my “loyalty”. I resent it and even if you think my posts are negative, so what??? I am expressing how I feel. Unlike some of you, I happen to live in Florida , a state where Hillary one big, and my vote is not being heard. Moreover, my county(Palm Beach) voted proportionaterly higher for Hillary than any county in the country!!! Enough of the crap alreeady…
filbertsf Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:44 pm
And someone has the gall to tell us to back off Brazile?
If you are talking about me, this is only because I do not trust her, not because I give a crap about her.
dedfg, I went a few weeks ago and say her in Waco,Tx and she was something to see. SHe came with Wesley Clark, he spoke first and was hard to understand because of the echo and I wondered if we would be able to understand her. SHe came to the mike and spoke slower and softer and there was only a hint of an echo, she carried that fiasco without a misstep, very professional.
I have heard Obama’s speech here and there over the tv and he says the same thing over and over again, you’d think the bots would like to have something a little different once in a while, but I guess if you hypnotised you don’t mind anything!LOL!
You guys ever wonder why I’m down when people like Fonda, Maddow, or Pelosi endorse Obama? It’s not that I think their support/endorsement is important or influential. It’s b/c I see them as true liberal progressives. Their ideology is more akin to mine than the likes of John Murtha (who is also a blue-dog Dem).
For them to turn their backs on a true progressive like Hillary is what really gets me down.
Yes, just wait until the republicans get on his case….his campaign will not survive it…We need that momentum now. I always deep down believed that they were scared of running against Hillary.
We need that momentum to bring obama down now is what I meant to say.
Was watching Hannity tonight 4-3-08 and he read an article to Geraldine Ferraro where Obama said the same thing that she did about his race (Chicago Tribune 6-26-05) intersting he used his race baiting tactics against her and the media ate it up. I tried to bring the article up but I had trouble with it.
mj, I wasn’t talking about you, ya goon. It was that other guy who was talking to me.
mj, you were half-right. The part you got wrong was advising dijia to apologize. You know, I have a thing about never apologizing, especially when you mean what you say and do.
My post got covered up with a big gray square. Does this happen on other people’s computers? Was anyone able to read it – about the Obama-fest being irrational LOVE?
jbstonesfan: We hear enough negativity just by turning on the TV or reading the news….most of us don’t constantly want it brought here too. This website is supposed to be a source of encouragement for people. I know all of us at sometime or another have expressed our concerns and discouragements….but not ALL the time.
Usually when a conversation turns a bit, it is nice to have such great people here to encourage us to go out blogging/campaigning/donating/etc… for Hillary even more!
filbertsf
I will have to wait for Paddy4Hill to come on tonight, but I think it is time you read her thesis about the neolib movement.
BTW, if anyone here kept it, will you re-post, again. Thanks.
It’s also time to re-post the C-Span video that BMerry saw last summer, and someone found it in the archieves….the AA roundtable with D Brazile on the panel.
Admin:
Do you still have that?
Maddow and Fonda I don’t really understand, but I disagree with you about Pelosi, and indeed the more elite, highly educated liberals in this way, Hillary is almost retro-liberal, much like FDR. She focuses a lot on bread and butter issues, I don’t really see Pelosi like this, but you would know better than me. I know Kerry is not a bread and butter liberal. As my Senator, he has done very little for the working class. Those issues just don’t interest him, but they are the most important issues to most of the electorate.
We really need to pounce on obama to lou dobbs and anyone in the media who will tell the truth about what the obama camp is doing to ferraro…… …still a coordinated effort from the Obama camp and supporters attacking her…. hate mails and coordinated voice mails, 24 in one day, all coming from the same state . . . .
This shows who he really is and how he is not ‘new’ but represents the worst kind in politics.
I found this blog to be a god-send, because even the places where I used to go have gotten so ugly! Its nice to feel energized about your candidate and not torn down on everything you say about her!
Emmy, I could read your post. That gray square has happened to me in the past, too. I have no idea what it is.
My post on Politco;
Brazile has lost all credibility as a party leader by her obvious partisan comments in favor of Obama. After all, she was Gore’s campaign manager(and managed a losing camapign, unlike President Clinton’s two(2) winning campaingns), and we all know Gore blames President Clinton for losing in 2000. How CNN has her on as an objective commentator is quite remarkable. Then again, they have William Bennett, Gloria Borger, and some other guy, all whom are either anti Clinton or pro Obama. If the DNC railroads Hillary, I , along with millions of other democrats, will be forever severing our ties with a party that is more interested in the flavor of the month, than traditional democratic values.
Posted By: jbstonesfan | April 03, 2008 at 09:33 PM
Let’s not be too hard on jbstonesfan. I was a worry – wart when I first started here. I think jbstonesfan will find our support to be stimulating so that s/he can do as much as possible pro-Hillary.
mj, trust me, Pelosi is a liberal. Alexandra Pelosi has said that her mother warned her about never trusting a Republican.
Call Pelosi what you want, she’s a liberal. Since when do we look down on high educated people? The more educated you are, the more you tend to be liberal. There’s no shame in that. I don’t understand why you’re turning that quality into a negative. We need educated people in our party.
By the way, as you can see by my moniker, I am a huge Rolling Stones fan and attended Bill Clinton’s 60th birthday at the Beacon theater show. The movie “Shine A light” , directed by Martin Scorcese , has just come out, and there are a few moments with Bill, Hillary, Dorothy, and the Stones….great stuff!!!!
Yeah, the bread and butter issues, that why I like her, must be cause her and Bill weren’t always rich. They had hard times when they were young, especially Bill, but Hillary has always been aware of the issue of poverty and middle class.
That Kerry, dean, pelosi, and kennedy would rather throw this election away on Obama just for revenge and power! So that tells me they don’t care about the average joe!
I don’t think we know that about Gore. That’s media spin, but that has been unproven.
confloyd, if you don’t know whether Hillary is a progressive or a DINO, you’re gonna get a smack from me.
A DINO — like Jim Webb — is basically a Republican wearing Democratic clothing.
I had stopped reading politics on the web for a while, until I heard about this site and a couple of others.
This is a real refuge.
What would happen if all Hillary supporters just wrote in her name in the GE, if OB gets the nomination, and she won? (One can dream!) But I really mean it. Would she become President?
I started disliking Pelosi after what she did to Jane hartman(sic). She wants no woman more intelligent, powerful, or attractive as her….she is a HUGE failure.
BlueDem
Please try to use f****** for the F-bomb.
And for others:
we have also been criticized for using WTF and STFU, frequently.
In truth, I would be more comfortable here, and I know some others who would be, as well.
Wow, has everybody read this latest article on Rezko? There is lots of juicy stuff coming out of his trial now – and it looks like the governor might even be indicted. One person who has now been implicated as a go-between in one of Rezko’s schemes turns out to be the lawyer Obama first worked for in Chicago.
article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzdkMzJlMTU1NGRmODM4NWY5YjNiY2JhNjZkZTk0ODc=&w=MA==
It really bothers me when the narrative has become “the uneducated, racist, Archie Bunkers vs. the smart, educated enlightened ones”. It is SO classist. Many of us have Ph.D.s (I do). It seems to me that blue-collar workers, thank God, are not so prone to falling in love with Precious. They are the smart ones here. They are focusing on what Hillary wants to do for them and for the country.
jbstonesfan, Jane Harman deserves the criticism. Pelosi’s beef with Jane is not b/c she’s a woman. It’s b/c Harman rolled over for the Bush and GOP controlled Congress.
Pelosi was upset b/c Harman never fought back with regards to the Iraq War.
BTW, Harman is a blue-dog Democrat from a very GOP-rich district in Orange County, CA; and Pelosi is a liberal in very liberal-rich SF.
Like I said, we may all be Demcrats, but like different Christian denominations, we have our differences.
So I am hearing Hillary saying that there is no such thing as a pledged delegate, then I need to make sure that we have real representation at the convention in Denver, correct? The bots tell everyone they are Clinton supporters and then vote Obama, so we need to make sure the real Clinton supporters are the one that are going to Denver!!
No, I am highly educated myself, but again I disagree. If Pelosi is more bread and butter than I am aware fine. But you are wrong to say the more educated you are the more liberal you become. That may be true socially, but not economically. It’s what you prioritize. Look, I live in perhaps the bluest state in the country, and yet Boston is becoming the most gentrified city in America. I do think Hillary is more focused on bread and butter issues than say John Kerry ever has been. I look at my Governor who one would assume was very liberal and on some issues he is. He was for impeaching Cheney, for instance. For marriage equality. But his “jobs” program was to build casinos, which are really just a regressive tax, as often they attract those who have the least. He could have, should have tried to institute a progressive income tax, or tried a small asset tax, as we have the most millionaires per capita in the country. He also suggested privatizing some of our infrastructure rather than again raising taxes or using a state bond system to pay for repairs. So, it’s how you prioritize. And, I do think hill is more in the mold of FDR than any viable candidate in my lifetime. That may just be that she has more knowledge o economics or more courage, but I find many liberals who have comfortable means, either don’t prioritize bread and butter issues, or simply often lack the sophistication to foster progressive economic policies.
It’s also untrue….everyone I know who supports Hillary earns a high six figure salary and is highly educated. Even my AA office manager who earns 50k has told me she thinks Obama is too inexperieced and wants Hillary(I do, however, sign her pay check ..lol).
I wish they would throw out all caucas’s since Obama cheated so bad on all of them, we should just go with the pop. vote on the closed primaries and go from there!
Well, San francisco is a city that gets it right even on issues of poverty and a living wage. They should be a model for the country. It’s very rare.
Caucus is a dirty word in my house……..if we lose, you can blame that undemocratic , activist driven, archaic system. Let the friggin people vote!!!
Let me make a correction: Redondo Beach is part of LA county. So Harman is a Rep in LA County… nonetheless, her district is very GOP.
Lookee here about Harman:
“Rep. Harman is a member of the Blue Dog Coalition of Conservative Democrats”
jbstone, so don’t say that Pelosi dislikes Harman b/c H is “more attractive” and “intelligent”
San Francisco is way too liberal for most Americans. Those are the very same demographics that is going for Barry. Moreover, call me a moderate democrat, but I don’t appreciate some of their disrespect towards our troops. Hillary had it right all along…she understands we are facing threats from terrible people, it was simply how this war was handled post Saddam that really screwed things up.
For those debating Jane Fonda, Liberals vs. moderates vs conservates:
It does not seem to us that this election is about that.
We might write something up on the topic because it goes to our argument on our very first article that the greatest threat to Hillary would come from PINOs and the “liberal” Big Media outlets and the Hillary Haters on the Big Blogs. That has pretty much been shown to be the case.
Michael Barone has an article today which might interest those writing about Fonda, Libs vs. Mods, etc.
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/barone/2008/4/2/reviewing-the-primary-results-academics-versus-jacksonians.html
Barone is writing about a “Jacksonian” divide in this election.
“Relying on exit polls, analysts have been seeing the battle for the Democratic nomination as tribal warfare, between blacks and Latinos (and Jews), between young and old, between upscale and downscale. These analyses support that view and show another sharp division in Democratic ranks.”
Here is the thrust of Barone’s argument (and we will reserve judgment and opinion until we read and understand the argument fully, right now this is food for thought for those interested in these matters, so no warfare please. There is a lot to disagree with here but it does tilt to our argument that this is not a left/right divide.):
But looking at these electoral data suggests to me that there’s another tribal divide going on here, one that separates voters more profoundly than even race (well, maybe not more profoundly than race in Mississippi but in other states). That’s the divide between academics and Jacksonians. In state after state, we have seen Obama do extraordinarily well in academic and state capital enclaves. In state after state, we have seen Clinton do extraordinarily well in enclaves dominated by Jacksonians.
Academics and public employees (and of course many, perhaps most, academics in the United States are public employees) love the arts of peace and hate the demands of war. Economically, defense spending competes for the public-sector dollars that academics and public employees think are rightfully their own. More important, I think, warriors are competitors for the honor that academics and public employees think rightfully belongs to them. Jacksonians, in contrast, place a high value on the virtues of the warrior and little value on the work of academics and public employees. They have, in historian David Hackett Fischer’s phrase, a notion of natural liberty: People should be allowed to do what they want, subject to the demands of honor. If someone infringes on that liberty, beware: The Jacksonian attitude is, “If you attack my family or my country, I’ll kill you.” And he (or she) means it. If you want to hear an eloquent version, listen to Sen. Zell Miller’s speech endorsing George W. Bush at the 2004 Republican National Convention. The academic who hears the Rev. Jeremiah Wright declaiming, “God damn America,” is not unnerved. He hears this sort of thing on campus all the time. The Jacksonian who watches the tape sees an enemy of everything he holds dear.”
——————
In contrast to Obama, Clinton has given herself the image of a fighter. And it’s not entirely inauthentic. Against very unfavorable odds, she is continuing to campaign and to insist—and for Jacksonians, this is among the most admirable of qualities—that she is not a quitter. She is fighting fair and foul—think about her lies about being under fire in Bosnia—but she is still fighting, and Jacksonians may not hold her lies heavily against her. We have seen her rebound from humiliations professional (healthcare) and personal (Monica Lewinsky) and keep fighting. This is off-putting to academics but admirable, or something close to that, to Jacksonians.
When I first noticed Obama’s weak showings among Appalachians, I chalked them up, as many in the press will be inclined to do, to an antipathy to blacks. But that simply doesn’t hold up. Go back to 1995, and look at the polls that showed that most Americans would support Colin Powell for president. I don’t think you’ll find any evidence of resistance by Jacksonian voters to the Powell candidacy. Rather the contrary, I suspect. He was a warrior, after all, and always exudes a sense of command. Or go back and look at the election returns in 1989 in which Douglas Wilder became the first black governor in our history, in Virginia. Jacksonians in southwest Virginia showed no aversion to Wilder; rather the contrary.
—————-
Clinton’s support from Jacksonians gives her, as I have argued, a chance to overtake Obama in the popular vote and an opportunity to argue to the superdelegates that she should be the Democratic nominee. They’re a significant bloc of voters in Pennsylvania, North Carolina, West Virginia, and Kentucky (although I should note that this week’s polls in Pennsylvania show her running behind my projections). The Democratic Party has seldom won a presidential election without their support: Jimmy Carter carried Jacksonian voters in 1976, and so did Bill Clinton in 1992 and, by a lesser margin, in 1996. If Al Gore had carried just West Virginia or Kentucky or Tennessee or Georgia or Arkansas—all states carried by Carter in 1976 and Clinton in 1992, all heavy with Jacksonians—he would have been elected president in 2000, and we wouldn’t have spent 37 days arguing how to count the vote in Florida. This Democratic primary contest has become a bitter fight between blacks and Latinos, young and old, upscale and downscale—and academics and Jacksonians
Sorry Filbert, I do know what a progressive is, but I had never heard of a DINO, so I just wanted to contrast and compare. Please don’t threaten violence Filbert, to know me is to love me, I am a real dedicated Hillary supporter, and brand new to this political arena. So you will just have to overlook my ignorance!???
But you are wrong to say the more educated you are the more liberal you become. That may be true socially, but not economically.
I’m not pulling this out of my ass, mj. There are statistics.
h t t p ://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?PageID=945
jbstonesfan Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 11:14 pm
San Francisco is way too liberal for most Americans. Those are the very same demographics that is going for Barry. Moreover, call me a moderate democrat, but I don’t appreciate some of their disrespect towards our troops. Hillary had it right all along…she understands we are facing threats from terrible people, it was simply how this war was handled post Saddam that really screwed things up.
What the hell?! Are you a freaking troll? San Franciscans don’t respect the troops? You sound like Bush-bot to me.
Ted Kennedy endorses Clinton for President.
Chelsea that is, tonight at the Montgomery County Democratic commiittee rally Ted Kennedy said he hope we will all be here in 2020 campaigning for Chelsea clinton for President.
Chelsea and Rendell spoke to the 700 members before Kennedy and received a rousing reception.
If you think their is a division b/t blacks and Jews now, wait until we(Jews) vote over 30% for MCcain should Barry get the nomination.
confloyd
DINO is an acronym for Democrats In Name Only
pass this around-fraud guys. fraud.
—–
I’ve created intros into the actual footage of rule breaking from the Texas caucuses and mashed it together with the footage. Please circulate far and wide!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIJVLxhmbXw Obama Calling Hillary Delegates
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjBeVYvMOwc Rules Schmules!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgWLtY6AVTs Resolutions? Anyone?
I could care less of what YOU think….
The article in the National Review that Independent Ben mentioned is definitely worth reading! Could that be something that might burst the love-bubble? (I don’t think so. I think we have to count on enough Hillary-supporters voting in the primaries that are left so that she gets the popular vote.)
Guys, don’t fight. We need to be civil to each other here, while disagreeing.
Geez, I was just flipping thru CNN and they were discussing whether or not Hillary said Obama “can’t win” is racist! This stuff just HAS to stop. It’s not good for the country . . . at all.
The fact that you say “call me a moderate Dem” but I think San Francisco disrespects our troops and “i think we should respect our trooops.”
I don’t know one person who disrespects the troops. We all owe them a debt of gratitude. So liberal Des disrespect troops, but people who respect the troops are “moderate.”
Disagreeing with the Bush policy does not equal “disrespecting” the troops.
In 2003, I was one of those kooks who protested against the war. Never got arrested, but sure as hell protested. Never once did I say anything about the troops. Same goes for my liberal brethens.
jbstonesfan you seem really smart and a genuine democrat! Thanks for pointing out about how much your wealthy white friends make and juxtapose it with how little your black employee makes.
Anything the least beat negative said about Obama is interpreted as racist. Gimme a break. The Obama campaign was definitely counting on this.
rjk, is that from the Onion?
Emmy – I believe there are some Obama associations popping up in Rezko that’s he gonna need to explain. Perhaps next he will need to make a big speech on the corrupt nature of Chicago politics – and why we shouldn’t look at his involvement in it.
No I just watched in on local Philadelphia news.
So generous of Ted.
That really disgusts me. Chelsea is ok, but not her mother.
It’s just as innacurate to say ‘we Jews’ will vote 30% McCain as it is to say ‘all educated people are X (whatever)’, or ‘all blue-collar workers are racist’. Jews, especially, come in all stripes, from the most conservative to the utmost liberal.
Now, if you are Jewish and happen to live in Florida that’s a different story…
Ted is probably an old lech?
This campaign is like the most amazing, most bizarre unfolding event I’ve seen in my lifetime. I mean, LOOK at the baggage this guy Obama would carry into a General Election. Are these people (his supporters) crazy? The country barely knows this man and if anybody scrutinizes his past record, his past associations, what makes him tick – then they’re called a racist.
In Rezko, this prosector Fitzgerald is a pretty tough guy. If Rezko is convicted I’m sure he will immunize him and find out what he has to say about his involvement with one Barack Obama. And Obama still could be called as a witness. Would Obama perjure himself? I think without a doubt.
I would love it if Fitzgerald has a few sealed indictments and one has Obama’s name on it.
Leno is on. Hillary just did a taped comic piece. Interview coming up.
filbertsf Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 11:12 pm
Let me make a correction: Redondo Beach is part of LA county. So Harman is a Rep in LA County… nonetheless, her district is very GOP.
Lookee here about Harman:
“Rep. Harman is a member of the Blue Dog Coalition of Conservative Democrats”
jbstone, so don’t say that Pelosi dislikes Harman b/c H is “more attractive” and “intelligent”
*****************************************************
I’m from LA County and Redondo Bch is no way GOP territory. Redondo Bch is is near Santa Monica and Playa del Rey…it’s no way GOP, it’s a very diverse area.
I’ll say this once again, California, including LA is not as liberal as people think. Yes, LA County trends Democratic and we are liberal in social programs but no way do we HATE republicans or don’t like FISCAL discipline….prop. 13 and the taxpayer revolts passed overwheming in LA County and still cause the polititians fits.
Also our High Schools and Univeristies support ROTC programs…I’m a receipient of Jr. ROTC programs and many of my friends and family members served in the military. I like Jane Harman and she is a popular here in So Cal.
plural Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 11:32 pm
So generous of Ted.
That really disgusts me. Chelsea is ok, but not her mother.
I feel the same way. Depressing.
JSTONESFAN,
DO YOU LIVE IN SAN FRANCISCO?
i live 5 minutes outside of the city, you sound like a republican, making generalizations…
the BAY AREA, which is a cluster of citys all bumping right up against each other, has never made the mistake of voting for republicans for president. we have more dems per capital than any other state.
DEMOCRATS COME IN ALL SHAPES AND SIZES, AND SO DOES SAN FRANCISCO.
san francisco bay area, is a stronghold of democracy, and we come in all flavors as you move out of the city itself, and even in the city there has been MILLIONS SPENT,on hillarys campaign…
MOST PEOPLE IN THE BAY AREA, ARE NOT FAR LEFT LIBERALS…
there are strongholds for them, but mostly, just moderate honest dems…
Ted seems to be in the “I’m for a woman president, just not this woman” camp.
Sorry, but I am so fed up with these men who have been in the Senate for, in his case, 45 years (!!), and suddenly want “change!”
50k for someone with only a high school education and who started as a file clerk for me 10 yrs ago is pretty dam good imo. Remember, I am the one bringing the money in depending on whether I win or lose in court. I represent people injured by the negligence of others, or by doctors committing malpractice, or businesses putting profit ahead of safety. Tort reform is just another code word for protecting negligent doctors and big business from liability. In my 20 yrs of practice (the last 11 as a solo practitioner here in S.Fla) I have fought for working class people and consistently vote against my own economic interests.
The fact I live in an affluent community(which supports Hillary!!!) should not be held against me. You see, unlike some AA’s who think we owe it to them, I greww up poor, with my father dying at age 4. I was raised by a working mom who taught me to work hard and that good things will come. Unlike Obama, I did not get angry, I got an educastion and made something of myself. I think Hillary speaks for all people, rich or poor, who ewhom seek to make this contry a better place.
SIGH. This sight is too addictive. That’s why I have beeen trying not to post and only read 10 minutes worth. BTW, have Idunn or Hawk posted lately? (Maybe they are trying to break their addiction, too.) Gotta.
Woops, I meant this SITE.
Emmy -
jbstonesfan has proven herself to be a decisive stereotyping closet-Republican; she says really obnoxious things about the Clinton campaign, is not at all positive about her prospects, and just keeps on going on posting inflammatory post after inflammatory post. It’s posts like hers that make “politico” and “something awful” insult and demean this awesome site!
I left out he went into his like Jack routine. JFK has to be rolling over in his grave. If Papa Joe were alive he’d be smacking the piss out of Teddy.
Fascinating. Please, DO tell me more about your profession, jbstonesfan. Don’t skimp on the details!
Does anyone know if Hill’s appearance on Leno will be up online??
@Emmy, it looks like Rezko is going to really bubble to the surface now. I mean, the fact that the governor is likely to be indicated has “got” to be news. And Obama has a direct connection to someone who acting as a middle-man for one of Rezko’s schemes. I’m going to re-read that article so I can get familiar with all these new names popping up.
This stuff is fun to think about – but tomorrow I will be phoning PA. That’s where the focus needs to be.
You know, Obama nevers interviews with any of the LGBT papers. hill always does. She’s vocal in her support of LGBT issues. I thought young people were supposed to be for those issues. I frankly, don’t understand why she’s not attracting more youth. As Chelsea says, she’s the most progressive candidate in the race.
I happen to be a “he” and you could not be farther from the truth. I will be glad to leave when/if the administrator requests I do so. No wonder our party is so messed up…It’s called freedom of expression, and I would not be typing here at 11:41 PM if I did not deeply care about Hillary and this campaign. I am disappo0inted that others here, with the same devotion to Hillary, have to question me repeatedly.
?The fact I live in an affluent community(which supports Hillary!!!) should not be held against me. You see, unlike some AA’s who think we owe it to them, I greww up poor, with my father dying at age 4. I was raised by a working mom who taught me to work hard and that good things will come. Unlike Obama, I did not get angry, I got an educastion and made something of myself. I think Hillary speaks for all people, rich or poor, who ewhom seek to make this contry a better place.
Oh fuck! This guy is a real asshole. AA do not think anything is owed them. What the hell is this?
If this guy is a Democrat, what the hell am I?
This is what I’m talking about. These conservative Dems are changing the face of the Democratic Party.
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=25831&page=112&cp=1#hec184520
coulters is getting the blogs going trashing about obama.
BEN>..but you have rezkowatch with over 80,000 who is paying attention …he cant say
and why we shouldn’t look at his involvement in it.
he will be called on it for sure..lol
Win4hill,
I did not get that impression about jbstonesfan, (But I haven’t read everything). S/he sounds like a true Hillary-supporter, sometimes critical, trying to be a realist.
I gotta go to bed. have fun!
These moderate democrats are voting overwhelmingly for Hillary.
jbs, I don’t think you’re moderate. I think you’re a typical blue-dog Dem that I met in TX.
You’re of the Jane Harman variety. Which is not “moderate.”
win4hill, please let me know what you consider inflammatory. Is it okay to still mention the latest news on Rezko, like we used to?
Thank you Emmy….I have done more for the democratic party, and in particular , the Clintons, for a so called “closet republican”. Disagreeing on a few issues within a party is called democracy…I do not have to tow the party line on every item. In fact,it was Hillary’s authorization to use force(which at the time was absolutely correct) that has cost her with the extremist in our party…
Hey – don’t feel bad jbstonesfan – This site can be very “cliquish” – they (some) can be great at ignoring. Actually, to me better now because some are mysteriously absent (?) due to “extenuating” circumstances. For a while, felt like Court TV. 95% are true blue Hillary. Other 5%? Well, it’s like anything else in life – Jekyll and Hydes, pretenders until they are caught red-handedon other sites showing their true colors – oops, don’t want to be labeled racist.
OH AND JONESFAN,
check the stats, and see what cities in the bay area went for who, cause, i dont think you got your facts straight…
OH AND BY THE WAY, I DONT GIVE A F*CK HOW LIBERAL SAN FRANCISCO IS…
IT IS ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL, AND POPULAR CITIES OF THE WORLD, THEY ARE COLORFUL, FLAMBOYANT, SMART AND HIP, AND WE LOVE EM…
AND SO DOES MOST OF THE REST OF THE WORLD…
i love it when people get me pissed off…
Emmy: (But I haven’t read everything).
That’s the key.
So Ben, you think saying thngs like “unlike AA’s who think we owe it to them” isn’t inflammatory?
What is this about AA? If BO were not in the race, 90% would be voting for Hill. I’m proudly liberal.
I hate how these surrogates always compare BO to some Dem President. Hill’s not a man. There is no mold for her.
I think it’s really sad that this primary campaign, which was supposed to be ‘post-racial’, has become indentity politics (thanks to the OB people).
Wel, that’s better than a closet republican, so thanks…anyway, it’s late and I really don’t want an adversarial r/s with anyone as I have enough of that in my everyday life. I apologize to anyone I have offended, but it is very offensive to me as next to my family and dog, the Clintons have been a source of great joy/happiness in my life. Have any of you made two(2) trips to Little Rock to see the library? I recommend you stay at the Peabody.
filbertsf Says:
April 3rd, 2008 at 11:53 pm
So Ben, you think saying thngs like “unlike AA’s who think we owe it to them” isn’t inflammatory?
That’s a digusting thing to say. WTH?
Tonights show will not be online until tomorrow.
Indy Ben – of course Rezko is fine! We can NEVER have enough of that guy
I just thought that some language was bringing down some of the discourse here, and I don’t mean to be policing the site or anything, but it’s not like it was doing us any favors, ya know??
We SHOULD NOT generalize about people. We all intellectually know this, but I’m afraid all of us err. It’s human nature, unfortunately. It’s humbling to me if I do so and then catch myself.
here is hillary ON jay
rjk, how was she?
skmf12 Says:
SAN FRANCISCO IS…
IT IS ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL, AND POPULAR CITIES OF THE WORLD, THEY ARE COLORFUL, FLAMBOYANT, SMART AND HIP, AND WE LOVE EM…
AND SO DOES MOST OF THE REST OF THE WORLD…
Indeed it is. Although, parts of FL is surreal. I especially like driving to Key West. It’s like driving on water.
Well, I don’t know why we have to obsess about all these labels. I guess you might call me a closet Republican too – but I’ve been firmly in the Democrat corner since Bill Clinton in 1992. I’m a retired veteran, and national secrutiy and veterans issues are important to me; however, I was against the Iraq war from the beginning. I agree with all of Hillary’s positions, and I feel she is also strong on national security – which is a good thing (Democrats seems to always lose on that issue to the repubs). But Hillary knew she would need national security credibility in order to be the first viable female candidate. She has a great relationship with the military – and she has really earned it.
How was who?
Is it inflamatory when in S. Carolina Obama says they are giving us the “old okie dokie” and trying to “bambozzle us”? One of the problems of this campaign is that political correctness has gone to the extreme. Ferrero was 100% correct and was called a racist for gods sake….Now, as far as my “owing it” comment, yes, that was a poor generalization, and if their was an edit button, I would have removed it. However, I can tell you that some people, black and white, are not proud of this country and seemingly feel it is someone elses fault for their plight. I never have and never will buy into that philosophy.
If you are refering to Hillary she is pretty much giving Jay her round table talk
rjk- I think mj was asking about Hill on Leno.
When she talks about issues one on one she connects and she is doing it right now on nationwide tv.
IndependentBen, you are a man of honor, integrity, and reason. I thank you for you service to our country. It’s great to see veterans support a strong woman like Hillary!!! God Bless!
Independent Ben – Totally understand your statement. It doesn’t apply to all, just like any other stereotype may not. But, depends on your personal experiences. Demographics in this country, by and large, dictate perceptions of different peoples. I live around lots of rednecks which isdisgusting, but also many with the “gangsta mentality” here in this part of Texas – and I see the same attitude quite a bit (entitlement without merit). It gets really old fast. Personally, I think that’s why BO does so well in all White areas. That demographic has NO IDEA about the racism displayed toward white populations for no good reason. It’s the anti-America crap. Students who won’t recite the pledge, nor place their hand on their heart. Talk during momentof silence. If you say anything – you’re “violating their rights”. Let’s hear it for public education. My, haven’t we comea long way, baby? Like you, I’m not trying to be inflammatory, either. But like Gerri – I just tell the truth. What a novel thought.
About Obama and Rezko/possible corruption links:
”
This corruption, should it become an issue in the campaign, could cause problems for Obama when people start to wonder how he could have made it through “the combine” without getting involved in the overlapping networks of patronage and influence. Peraica, for one, argues that he didn’t.
“Senator Barack Obama is an integral part and a product of this corrupt system,” Peraica says. “Senator Obama has endorsed Todd Stroger for Cook County board president, Mayor [Richard M.] Daley for mayor of Chicago, Dorothy Tillman for re-election as an alderman, and other epitomes of bad government throughout his career in order to promote himself politically, at the expense of, I would argue, principles and morals and good government.”
Obama’s relationship with Allison Davis — the alleged go-between in Rezko’s scheme to shake down Tom Rosenberg — could pose another problem for him. Obama worked for Davis at the law firm of Davis Miner Barnhill. Later, when Obama sat on the board of a charity called the Woods Fund, he voted to invest $1 million in a partnership operated by Davis, according to the Chicago Sun-Times.
Levine’s testimony in the Rezko trial puts Davis in the middle of an attempted quid pro quo, making him yet another associate Obama might be pressured to disown. And the trial could stretch well into May, at which point a Rezko conviction could lead to even more headaches for the candidate. If Rezko is looking at a long prison sentence and decides to start talking, who knows what he might say?”
mj, well I wouldn’t agree with that statement, but I would maybe try to understand why it was said. I think the majority of the AA community are supporting Obama because they are proud of his success. Unfortunately, I think Obama is cynically using their support for his own personal gain.
Oh, good, rjk, she was good?
anyways guys, I stand firm to the belief that if the FBI gets the right people to squeal and testify, there will not be a nominee Obama. He has tons of baggage which the Republicans would simply be itching to run commercials on.
Many people facing long prison terms tell prosecutors what they want to hear.
Hillary looks fabulous…she is connecting right on nationwide tv..you are right..issues is it..one on one rjk…she is so sincere.
This is the FOURTH time I have logged onto this board in the past week or so and seen win4Hill accusing a different person of being a troll or a plant.
You need to chill. Should I now start accusing YOU of being a plant/troll, just trying to stir up fights here? I don’t think you’d appreciate it if I started jumping on everything you say with suspicion in that way.
If you disagree with someone, say so. Argue with them if you’d like. But everyone who thinks differently, or is more moderate/liberal/conservative then yourself is not a troll, and it doesn’t mean they don’t support Hillary. Hillary attracts a broad spectrum of Democrats and Indies and some Republicans.
I know we DO get genuine trolls on here, and that has to be addressed. But geez, everytime I come on lately, win4hill, you are throwing that word around at anyone you get into a disagreement with.
She is still on and looks more relaxed as the show goes on.
The truth is that Rezko is very damaging to democrats in Illinois. Our Governor, Blagojevich is a democrat and may very well get indicted. Barack Obama will certainly face these problems if/when he comes back to the state for any re-election. Mayor Daley is going to be pulverized for this, though his family has a history of not being very clean to begin with…so I have no idea how that will affect his tenure as city mayor in Chicago.
The fact, however, is that many big name democrats across the state are going to start facing attacks by Republicans.
is she being her usual witty self on Leno?
one last thing stones fan,
THAT 50,000 YOU SO PROUDLY BRAGG ABOUT,
IS LOWER INCOME IN SAN FRANSICO, SO DUDE EVERYTHING IS RELATIVE…
And it is beyond offensive to someone new, like me, who thought he fond a site where our differences are far out weighed by our love and support of Hillary!!!!
“# HillaryforTexas Says:
April 4th, 2008 at 12:10 am
This is the FOURTH time I have logged onto this board in the past week or so and seen win4Hill accusing a different person of being a troll or a plant.
You need to chill. Should I now start accusing YOU of being a plant/troll, just trying to stir up fights here? I don’t think you’d appreciate it if I started jumping on everything you say with suspicion in that way.
If you disagree with someone, say so. Argue with them if you’d like. But everyone who thinks differently, or is more moderate/liberal/conservative then yourself is not a troll, and it doesn’t mean they don’t support Hillary. Hillary attracts a broad spectrum of Democrats and Indies and some Republicans.
I know we DO get genuine trolls on here, and that has to be addressed. But geez, everytime I come on lately, win4hill, you are throwing that word around at anyone you get into a disagreement with.”
Troll!
Just kidding. “-)
South Florida is not San Fransisco dude….50k for a single person, no children, and no college degree is fairly good down here.
curiosityhasme
Yes, I certainly understand the demographics of this race. The only whites that Obama seems to do well with are the kids, and the more upscale whites – the so-called latte liberals. His problem is with the blue collar, more down scale swing voters, who are an important part of the base.
did anyone watch the pregnant man on orca?
She only made one slip saying that the SD have been around for 35 years or so. That will get played up in the press tomorrow.
Stedman is pregnant?
hillary will get them seated..she ahs determined to do it…and the applause for it.the audience was well with her..and got obama for saying NO.
MJS, I was just saying that up thread. Rezko is really bubbling to the surface right now – and Fitzgerald is a pretty aggressive prosecutor. I think a big Rezko blow up might sink BHO for good. Unless, of course, he could pull off some big “speech” on Chicago corruption. Heh.
The real issue is did she come off likeable? That seems to be the missing elemnet among those who don’t know her. Obama , for whatever reason, makes people feel he is likeable-as long as you don’t want a pic with
Independent, i highly doubt Obama can explain away the corruption if he’s in the muck of it! It’ll make him look like a preaching hypocrite.
LOOK STONESFAN,
CHILL…
IF YOUR TOO EMOTIONAL AND SENSITIVE, YOU’LL GET YOURSELF ALL WORKED UP…
YOU ARE WELCOME HERE… TOTALLY…
think of it as your baptism into the site…
its good to have some good back and forth…
stand up for what you believe, call people on what they say, and dont be afraid to apologize once in awhile…
oh and have a sense of humor…..:)
BY THE WAY, CONGRATS ON YOUR 50 GRAND….
Huh? The SD? What do you mean?
She was very likeable and funny.
It’s not my 50k grand!!! It is my office managers!!! I make around 1 million a year, which, I know by San Francisco standards, is middle class…fortunately, I live in Boca/Delray…which come to think of it, a million a yr is also quite middle class………..:)
rjk: who is the guy after hillary on leno?
jbstonesfan, I’ve always thought Hillary was likeable . . . and I think she did a great job on Leno. She cracked a joke about sniper gate and got a big laugh from the crowd. And she got big applause when she was talking about Michigan and Florida.
I’m glad hillayr is hitting shows like Leno
next, she should do Colbert, and then hit up Ellen, Tyra, and do Larry king too
Take care all, as I have a early morning hearing….I trust some of you will be here in case we(you) get that 3:00 AM phone call….
WELL THEN STONES,
WE NEED YOU FOR OUR NEXT MONEY BOMB….
Just out of curiosity Indie Ben and Stone…
Are you guys pro-choice, for Affirmative Action, and for gay marriage?
MJS, yeah I was being sarcastic when I said Obama might have to make a speech about corruption. I think a big Rezko blow-up would sink him right now. And although his staunch supporters don’t think Wright is a big deal, you know that people are going to be studying the exit polls from PA, looking for the Wright effect.
I’m really curious as to why a lot of young predominantly male guys/kids dislike Hillary when they were, like what, 10 when she was on the national scene?
That applause and everyone watching at home,and Mi and florida love her to pieces….she is always likable in big states….gosh jbstones everyone knows hillary around the world
people dont care about it. if they like her or not…but her smartness is scary and we need it,thats why she was elected in New YOrk…its the smartness is to get us somewhere out of a mess..even if ya don’t like her..people know she is a fighter too even all repubs know it and so does John mccain.
MJS, their parents probably don’t like Hillary and it just gets passed along.
dedfg
I have no idea, I turned it off when Hillary was finished.
IndepBen, I don’t think Rezko would sink him with his solid core base. It would certainly demoralize them. Instead, it would sink him with the fence-sitters and undecideds/leaning-obama people. There are some crazy-blind Obama fans that resemble groupies more and more each day.
The damage Rezko will do, though, is destroy any lingering clean image Obama has with superdelegates as well as increase the fear that by nominating Obama, democrats will be sending a lamb out to slaughter for the REpublicans.
mjs: exactly….I find the young me are getting worse as far as sexism goes. But when you think about it, what’s on tv, music? Most is degrading to women.
Obama and King
By JUAN WILLIAMS
April 4, 2008
Martin Luther King Jr. died at age 39; today, the 40th anniversary of his death, is the first time he has been gone longer than he lived.
Figures such as Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton have tried to claim his place on the American stage. But at most they have achieved fame and wealth. What separated King from any would-be successor was his moral authority. He towered above the high walls of racial suspicion by speaking truth to all sides.
Now comes Barack Obama, a black man and a plausible national leader, who appeals across racial lines. But to his black and white supporters, Mr. Obama increasingly represents different things.
The initial base of support for Mr. Obama’s presidential campaign came from young whites – who saw in him the ability to take the nation to a place where, to quote from King’s “I Have A Dream” speech, “we shall be able to transform the jangling discords of our nation into a beautiful symphony of brotherhood.”
Black voters rallied to Mr. Obama after whites in Iowa and New Hampshire showed they were willing to vote for him. Mr. Obama spoke directly to charges that he was not “black enough,” that he was not a child of the civil rights movement because he grew up in Hawaii and has an Ivy League education, that he is too young, it is not his time, and even that his campaign is too risky because white racists might kill him.
Mr. Obama, his wife Michelle and supporters such as Oprah Winfrey make the case to black voters that he is the fruit of the struggles of King and others. They argue that this generation of black Americans does not have to wait for their turn to reach for the ultimate political power of the presidency.
Mr. Obama has carried a message of pride and self-sufficiency to black voters nationwide, who have rewarded him with support reaching 80% and higher. His candidacy has become, as the headline on Ebony magazine put it, a matter of having a black man as president “In Our Lifetime.”
Among his white supporters, race is coincidental, not central, to his political identity. Mr. Obama is to them the candidate who personifies the promise of equal opportunity for all. But as black support has become central to his victories, this idealistic view has been increasingly at war with the portrayal, crafted by the senator to win black support, of him as the black candidate. The terrible tension between these racially distinct views now surrounds and threatens his campaign.
So far, Mr. Obama has been content to let black people have their vision of him while white people hold to a separate, segregated reality. He is a politician and, unlike King, his goal is winning votes, not changing hearts. Still, it is a key break from the King tradition to sell different messages to different audiences based on race, and to fail to challenge racial divisions in the nation.
Mr. Obama’s major speech on race last month was forced from him only after a political crisis erupted: It became widely known that he’d sat for 20 years in the pews of a church where Rev. Jeremiah Wright lashed out at white people. The minister cursed America as worthy of damnation, made lewd suggestions about the nature of President Clinton’s relationship with black voters, and embraced the paranoid idea that the white government was spreading AIDS among black people.
Here is where the racial tension at the heart of Mr. Obama’s campaign flared into view. He either shared these beliefs or, lacking good judgment, decided it politically expedient for an ambitious young black politician trying to prove his solidarity with all things black, to be associated with these rants. His judgment and leadership on the critical issue of race is in question.
While speaking to black people, King never condescended to offer Rev. Wright-style diatribes or conspiracy theories. He did not paint black people as victims. To the contrary, he spoke about black people as American patriots who believed in the democratic ideals of the country, in nonviolence and the Judeo-Christian ethic, even as they overcame slavery, discrimination and disadvantage. King challenged white America to do the same, to live up to their ideals and create racial unity. He challenged white Christians, asking them how they could treat their fellow black Christians as anything but brothers in Christ.
When King spoke about the racist past, he gloried in black people beating the odds to win equal rights by arming “ourselves with dignity and self-respect.” He expressed regret that some black leaders reveled in grievance, malice and self-indulgent anger in place of a focus on strong families, education and love of God. Even in the days before Congress passed civil rights laws, King spoke to black Americans about the pride that comes from “assuming primary responsibility” for achieving “first class citizenship.”
Last March in Selma, Ala., Mr. Obama appeared on the verge of breaking away from the merchants of black grievance and victimization. At a commemoration of the 1965 Selma-to-Montgomery march for voting rights, he spoke in a King-like voice. He focused on traditions of black sacrifice, idealism and the need for taking personal responsibility for building strong black families and communities. He said black people should never “deny that its gotten better,” even as the movement goes on to improve schools and provide good health care for all Americans. He then challenged black America, by saying that “government alone can’t solve all those problems . . . it is not enough just to ask what the government can do for us — it’s important for us to ask what we can do for ourselves.”
Mr. Obama added that better education for black students begins with black parents visiting their children’s teachers, as well as turning off the television so children can focus on homework. He expressed alarm over the lack of appreciation for education in the black community: “I don’t know who taught them that reading and writing and conjugating your verbs were something white. We’ve got to get over that mentality.” King, he added later, believed that black America has to first “transform ourselves in order to transform the world.”
But as his campaign made headway with black voters, Mr. Obama no longer spoke about the responsibility and the power of black America to appeal to the conscience and highest ideals of the nation. He no longer asks black people to let go of the grievance culture to transcend racial arguments and transform the world.
He has stopped all mention of government’s inability to create strong black families, while the black community accepts a 70% out-of-wedlock birth rate. Half of black and Hispanic children drop out of high school, but he no longer touches on the need for parents to convey a love of learning to their children. There is no mention in his speeches of the history of expensive but ineffective government programs that encourage dependency. He fails to point out the failures of too many poverty programs, given the 25% poverty rate in black America.
And he chooses not to confront the poisonous “thug life” culture in rap music that glorifies drug use and crime.
Instead the senator, in a full political pander, is busy excusing Rev. Wright’s racial attacks as the right of the Rev.-Wright generation of black Americans to define the nation’s future by their past. He stretches compassion to the breaking point by equating his white grandmother’s private concerns about black men on the street with Rev. Wright’s public stirring of racial division.
And he wasted time in his Philadelphia speech on race by saying he can’t “disown” Rev. Wright any more than he could “disown the black community.” No one has asked him to disown Rev. Wright. Only in a later appearance on “The View” television show did he say that he would have left the church if Rev. Wright had not retired and not acknowledged his offensive language.
As the nation tries to recall the meaning of Martin Luther King today, Mr. Obama’s campaign has become a mirror reflecting where we are on race 40 years after the assassination. Mr. Obama’s success has moved forward the story of American race relations; King would have been thrilled with his political triumphs.
But when Barack Obama, arguably the best of this generation of black or white leaders, finds it easy to sit in Rev. Wright’s pews and nod along with wacky and bitterly divisive racial rhetoric, it does call his judgment into question. And it reveals a continuing crisis in racial leadership.
What would Jesus do? There is no question he would have left that church.
online.wsj.com/article/SB120726732176388295.html?mod=opinion_main_commentaries
My last post :
I use to be for affirmative action, but no longer.
1)I am pro choice
2)I am for gay marriage
3)I am for federal funded stem cell research
4)I am for universal health care
5)I believe in global warming
6) I am all for taxing the rich and corporations at higher rates
7)I am for reinstating the death tax after 2010
9) My wife and I have both maxed out on campaign contributions attending several “meet and greets: with Prez Clinton.
filbertsf,
Is this a litmus test for the site? I would say Yes, Yes, and Civil Unions, which is exactly what Hill’s position is.
yeah mjs is the tv in chicago all about rezko blago obama..i know downstate they will not vote for him
they seen wright rezko before there eyes and are
to afraid to even vote for him if he wins the nom for the gen ele..you think chicago will turn on him..
Indie Ben, yeah, it’s a litmus. Knock yourself out.
And regarding the whole liberal left, versus moderate/conservative left argument, I look at the democratic party in this way.
Liberal-Far Left:
Obama
Kennedy
That one guy from Wisconsin…forget his name though…
Moderate Left:
Hillary and Bill Clinton
Kerry (shudders)
Wesley Clark?
Conservative Left:
Casey
Reid
etc
Moderate Left simply means that they are very progressive in some terms, but can be willing to negotiate. The moderate Left is also more for the working class americans. The Far left is more for democratic ideology, and ideology only.
filbertsf, I don’t think you like to me too much. But I’ve never had a problem with anybody on this site.
STONES FAN,
MY LAST COMMENT TO YOU, keep your info on the downlo…
better for you….
RJK, what did you mean about SD?
MJS
Obama – liberal far left? But who knows with him? I know that the radical black liberation theology he has been immersed in is close to Marxism.
How would you guys explain to someone about FL and MI if they said:
“The Florida/Michigan thing irks me no end.
I’m so tired of Clinton harping on how SHE doesn’t want to disenfranchise voters in those states. Of course she doesn’t – not when she “won” those “no-compete” contests. She didn’t care too much about disenfranchising those voters when she AGREED (with all of the other candidates) to abide by Dean’s “no campaigning, these contests won’t count” position in the first place. She’s so fake.
Hill was excellent on Leno;
Jay clearly briefed by NBC’s Tonight Show political director, what a joke.
Hammered Randi Rhodes on her message board (respectfully, at least a lot more so than she was to Hill) and so they ban you from even viewing the board. Another (very) bad joke.
defdg: Both men AND women are to blame for this. Who the heck are the hookers who allow themselves to be pole-dancing and skirting around as hoes in music videos???? And somehow, it plants the idea that this is what the finest women should be doing (bathing in champagne and throwing themselves at men)
CJ: The coverage is moderate to light. I think Axelrod has a strong grip on the local coverage here too, but newspapers are reporting it. The only problem is that while down south voters might be turned off to Obama, Cook County is still largely in his corner and when Cook County is behind someone, that person usually wins.
Ben, do you know what the opposite of love is?
It’s indifference. That’s how I feel about people online. I don’t know you from Adam. Why should I expend any emotion: love or hate?
If Hillary supporters are going to try and censor other Hillary supporters on this site, then maybe I’ll go somewhere else. Geez.
When?
I would also put Edwards as moderate left democrat.
Obama is ranked the most liberal senator in the United States. In the Illinois Senate he voted liberally. Also, he seems to be more intent on “some” democratic ideals (i doubt he’s for gay marriage or abortion..in my suspicions) but not exactly for the working people and that’s the biggest different. far-left democrats usually focus on accomplishing ideology, while kinda just taking the Working Class Americans’ plight for granted.
filbertsf
If you’re indifferent, then why would you be concerned about what my position is on choice, or any other issue? Just curious. Anyways, you can have this site all to yourself, for all I care.
Independent, don’t listen to filbertsf. Don’t let one poster make you leave this site. It’s healthy to have discussion and disagreement. If you don’t like his words, you don’t have to reply to them. just ignore.
i call it, selective reading
Right On, Ann. Speaking of the Rev. Wright racist rants, where is he? Speaking of missing, where is Michelle Obama? Are they attending the Teresa Heinz Kerry secret Academy for foot-in-mouth-removal indoctrination? They both appear to be on double-secret probation.
this was on the blog.
CJ says yeah where is michello..proud of her country for the first time since being an adult..
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=25831&page=3#c1
people are asking to send this to all of your contacts the article by coulter..to every democrat for hillary or every republican ..independent..andto former obots.
mjs: didn’t say I blamed men…said they were getting worse.
But we still the good old boys club alive and well in this race.
MJS, I hate to break it to you, but Edwards is actually moderate conservative. His Senate record.
After the failed 2004 bid, Edwards had 3 years to re-make himself into a Populist. Which is why he’s been labeled a phony. I don’t know whether he’s real or not, but smells of political expediency.
some people are too sensitive. so this wonderful site is now “my site” and it “censors” people.
Your posts are still here. You’re still here and you think you’re being “censored”
Hell, I curse like a trucker and Admin has kicked me off.
CJ, Michelle is back on the trail, so we should stand by for lots of new gaffes, and lots of the Obama camp saying “What Michelle Really Meant”
INDEPENDENT,
CRIPES….
ben, can you just try and have a good time, think of it as a debate class…
everybody fights with everyone sooner or later on this site, trust me…
Anyways, on abortion, I am definitely pro-choice, but at the same time, I want more rigorous sexual/health education to prevent unwanted pregnancies amongst the young as well as stem the number of underage sex/rape incidents. It’s kind of a mix of both sides as Republicans want heavy education and programs to combat unwanted pregnancies while Democrats are open to abortion. I say, why not have both? Abortion should be a last resort and last resort only.
On Affirmative Action, I think it seriously depends. As a high school-er in predominantly upper-class area, i think it is unfair that students who are simply african-american, but wealthy in stature can still be favored by this policy. I think affirmative action should only apply to lower-class or middle-class students. There were, in previous years, students from my school who came from very well off minority families that managed to get in despite obvious GPA differences and SAT disparities. I say, give affirmative action to the poorest and the ones who need it the most. Don’t give it to any african american or hispanic student…check their backgrounds in terms of privilege. If they alreayd are from welathy families, I doubt they need the extra boost to fit a racial quota.
On gay marriage, i am pro civil union only because I think calling it marriage right now would be a little difficult to achieve in most of Ameriac. Step-by step, we will generally achieve marriage, but to get the people who WANT to be together, their rights and equality now, civil unions would be the quickest way to do it.
I know my stance on affirmative action might seem a little wrong, but if you think about it, racial quotas shouldn’t be the way we accept and hire people in America. It should be based on how much they have overcome. A hispanic student living in a million dollar mansion going to a private school, in my opinion, should not be given an advantage simply based on race over a caucasian student who comes from a single-parent home in an apartment who worked hard on his own to get from the ground up.
Anyways, on abortion, I am definitely pro-choice, but at the same time, I want more rigorous sexual/health education to prevent unwanted pregnancies amongst the young as well as stem the number of underage sex/rape incidents. It’s kind of a mix of both sides as Republicans want heavy education and programs to combat unwanted pregnancies while Democrats are open to abortion. I say, why not have both? Abortion should be a last resort and last resort only.
Yeah. Liberals just love abortions. I heard Pelosi wanted to broadcast an abortion procedures to convince young women to get one. We also eat babies, too.
MJS, I’m sorry, but you don’t know what you’re talking about.
GOP have been fighting to get rid of sex education. They want abstinence only teaching. It’s those damn liberals who want to prevent unwanted pregnancies by educating students.
My other favorite Hillary quote is: abortion should be legal, safe and rare.
filbertsf, I understand that, but I talk to some very liberal people who believe that things like live-birth abortion, and universal abortion rights to all ages, etc, should be available and kinda squirm when I mention more education.
mj,
I AM WITH YOU ON THAT, I THINK INCOME SHOULD DEFINITELY BE THE DECIDING FACTOR IN ‘BRINGING PEOPLE UP’ IN AMERICA.
in fact, applications should be color blind, and not ask you for nationality.
Just saw Hillary on Leno. I thought she came off well, striking the right balance between lighthearted chitchat and addressing the issues.
Going back to the earlier discussion here about the different types of Dems… For the record, I am low income, very well-educated, and an independent/centrist. My skin color is “typical.”
Someone mentioned how well-educated liberals react differently to the Wright stuff compared to the Jacksonians. I can’t speak for everyone, but for me it’s true to a certain extent. The Wright stuff neither surprised nor shocked me because I’ve been hearing that kind of talk for as long as I can remember, both in an academic setting and in the real world. I also expected the Obamas were involved with black nationalists once I heard about how MO was proud to be an American for the first time. So Wright’s rhetoric didn’t freak me out the way it freaked out some of my “typical” brothers and sisters who aren’t used to hearing that kind of talk. At the same time, I have seen right here in Detroit what happens when black nationalism dominates the political scene, and it’s not something we’d want on a national level. While I don’t believe that Obama’s views are as extreme as Wright’s, I do think he espouses SOME of those views. Otherwise, he wouldn’t have gone to that church for twenty years. It’s enough to make me question what sort of worldview Obama would be bringing into the White House, what kinds of people would be advising him, and how all of this would inform his decision-making.
Going back further in this thread to Obama’s cousin in Kenya… Pat Robertson and the 700 Club would probably run a story about it, if they haven’t done so already. So would similar-minded radio talk show hosts. OK yeah, I know what some of y’all are thinking. It’s bad enough that Hillary supporters have had to cozy up to the likes of Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh, but Pat Robertson????
filbertsf Says:
April 4th, 2008 at 12:39 am
How would you guys explain to someone about FL and MI if they said:
“The Florida/Michigan thing irks me no end.
————————
I am assuming this is a serious question. I would try to tell them, it is not about Clinton or Obama. It is about the Dem party doing the right thing. When they made those rules, they did not anticipate such a close race. They thought they would have a clear-cut case of a nomination without those states and the nominee would quietly seat them. That is not how it is working out. Since if we ignore those states now, we will lose them in November. That should be the ultimate consideration and the party officials must do some face saving with the rules to count the votes. If Dean had any leadership, he would force Obama to do the right thing by accepting a count or revote. He could concoct a good explanation about the rules as being unimportant when considering winning them in Nov. If Obama had any of the new politics in him that he lectures all of us about, he would do the right thing. Right now he is focussed on winning the nomination by hook or crook because he is just a dirty old politician.
what the hell is “live-birth abortion?” and “all ages?”
What if a 12-year-old girl is being molested by her fucking uncle or father… should she be forced to give birth?
Should she have to ask for her father’s written consent?
Think about it!
BTW, I don’t believe the “very liberal” people you spoke to “squirmed” when you mentioned education.
I believe that statement as much as I believe Bush is a competent president.
exactly skfm.
When I put “asian american” on my application, it doesn’t matter that I’m a first generation Chinese who basically had to teach himself English and struggle to adapt.
All they will see is that I’m part of the group that is disproportionately high in colleges.
pm, it is a serious question. Someone posted that statement on another forum. It’s not a political forum, but they do talk about politics there.
skmf12,
I haven’t been arguing with anybody. I just didn’t think it was fair that a couple of people were labeling jbstones (an obvious staunch Hillary supporter who is new) as a troll, or a closet-Republican. I mean, there’s so few places Hillary supporters can go online, and many have been banned from Kos, MyDD, HuffPo, and other places.
FEC Nomination Impasse Stalls Disclosure of Bundling Data
Agency Cannot Set New Rules for Fundraising by Lobbyists
By Paul Kane
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, April 4, 2008; A21
The stalemate over the Federal Election Commission’s nominating process, which already has crippled the agency’s ability to uphold existing campaign laws, is indefinitely delaying the implementation of a new rule designed to shine more light on fundraising by lobbyists for members of Congress and presidential candidates.
Under last year’s ethics and lobbying law revisions, campaign and political action committees affiliated with lawmakers should have completed their first quarter of tracking and identifying the lobbyists who raised large amounts of money by “bundling” smaller contributions.
But the new disclosure requirement cannot take effect without publication of final rules by the FEC, whose work ground to a halt late last year in a congressional showdown over the six-member commission’s makeup.
Currently there are two commissioners and four vacancies, leaving the FEC unable to function because it does not have the four members required for a quorum. No one is sure when a resolution of the dispute will allow the disclosure rule to take effect.
“We are unable to issue regulations on any topic. Because of the way the statute is written . . . this does mean that no lobbyist bundling reporting will be required in July,” David M. Mason, one of the two commissioners, said. “The effective date will continue to recede into the future until the commission regains a quorum.”
Bundling allows lobbyists to increase their influence with politicians by collecting campaign checks from clients and lumping them with their own contributions. Under current rules, the name of the bundler, who is often a lobbyist, is not revealed.
Congressional watchdogs are stunned that the FEC standoff continues. Because of the impasse, questions remain about whether Republican Sen. John McCain’s presidential campaign properly opted out of the public financing system for the primary campaign, leaving his fundraising operation in legal limbo.
And while the FEC staff can start work on investigations, for example, into the alleged embezzlement of possibly as much as $1 million from the National Republican Congressional Committee, no formal steps can be taken in such investigations.
“This is an absurd situation to be in. If another country was doing this, we’d call them a banana republic,” said Fred Wertheimer, president of Democracy 21, one of the leading watchdogs.
The delay on the bundling provision is the latest collateral damage. With the FEC originally scheduled to have finalized its new disclosure rule last month, mid-July finance reports would have revealed, for the first time, the lobbyists who raised at least $15,000 for presidential and congressional candidates and PACs affiliated with members of Congress.
The collapse of bundling disclosure is particularly awkward for Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.), who was the main backer of that provision. On the presidential campaign trail he regularly touts his work on the campaign law revisions as his greatest legislative achievement, and last year, in a joint statement with Sen. Russell Feingold (D-Wis.), predicted that the bundling disclosure requirement would “go farther than any other provision in the lobbying reform bill to shine a spotlight on the dangerous connection between money and legislation.”
But Obama also is leading Democratic objections to the FEC nomination of a controversial former Justice Department lawyer, Hans A. von Spakovsky, whom Democrats accuse of exerting political influence over voter fraud and election law decisions. A recent inspector general’s report cleared von Spakovsky and other Justice officials of censoring a bipartisan commission’s examination of intimidation of minority voters, but Democrats remain steadfastly opposed to his FEC nomination.
Senate Majority Leader Harry M. Reid (D-Nev.) is willing to hold separate votes on von Spakovsky — who Democrats believe would lose — and the three other nominees. But Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) has refused to agree, saying that traditionally the bipartisan commission’s nominees have been selected as a bloc, thus avoiding giving the two parties the power to reject opposition nominees. Three members are Republican, three Democratic.
Since New Year’s Day, after the expiration of the terms of the other commissioners, Mason and Ellen L. Weintraub have been the only members of the FEC.
Aides to both Reid and McConnell indicated this week that there are no signs of an imminent breakthrough. Reid has asked President Bush to withdraw von Spakovsky’s name and submit a new nominee.
“We may not see any bundling information for the entire election year of 2008,” Wertheimer said.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/03/AR2008040304314_pf.html
MJS, no pro-choicer would squirm at sex education. That just makes absolutely no sense.
On Edwards, he’s from a conservative state. It’s a big country. People think differently in different parts of the country. It doesn’t mean he wasn’t more liberal than the constiuents he represented, but when you represent a conservative state, then you are going to have a more coservative voting record.
On abortion rights, there are some pro-choicers who have said in my opinion, some silly things. Like Hillary gave a speech where she talked about reducing abortion through education, access to birth control, access to medical help for expectant mothers, aide for poor new parents, and expanded adoption choices. And, there were people who harshly criticized her for that. That I do not agree with. I think the true pro-choice position is to make it possible for women to realistically really choose.
mj and filbert, keep in mind that these are high school students I’m talking to, and Health Class wasn’t exactly fun…or anything anyone would like to repeat again. lol
Re: How to respond to people who are “irked” about Michigan and Florida…
I think pm’s answer works well. Also, ask the people who are irked how they would feel if they were from Michigan or Florida and had voted in their state’s election. At the time, there was NO talk of a do-over; those January primaries were the only ones that voters believed they would get to participate in. Even now, those January primaries still might be the only chance Michigan and Florida voters will have to determine who gets the Dem nomination. However one may feel about the powers-that-be who set the early primary dates in Michigan and Florida, why should the VOTERS bear the brunt of the punishment?
btw, this week is like girl power week.
Mariah toppled Elvis’ 17 #1 record with her 18th #1 in America.
Madonna toppled Elvis’ 36 Top ten hit singles with her 37th top 10 in America.
So these are now high school students and not “some very liberal people who believe that things like live-birth abortion, and universal abortion rights to all ages, etc, should be available and kinda squirm when I mention more education.”
You told Stone to ignore me. I will take your advice and start ignoring you because, quite frankly, I don’t believe a word you say.
wow filbertsf, so apparently, high school students can’t be extremely liberal people? you’re ignorant.
and yeah, I frankly don’t give a crap what spews outta your mouth. You like to pick on people’s opinions and assume random things a lot.
Filbert, she agreed not to campaign there but she NEVER ageed the votes didn’t count. All three campaigns ran vigorous campaigns through surrogates, and there was plenty of media coverage of the candidates, and Obama ran national ad’s the last week. 40% of Dem’s turned out to vote. That’s a real election. Also, in plenty of primaries candidates don’t compete in every state. Same is true for GE’s, so this is a moot and silly point. Hillary didn’t campaign in several of the small red states where Obama won. he choose to take his name off the ballot in MI to pre-emptively deligitimize the vote. His surrogates ran a vigorous campaign there. These voters voted. hence a real election. Further, hill recieved 200k votes more than McCain in Fl. And, in MI she got almost as many votes as Romney. Those were competitive contests, and Dem’s were clearly engaged when you look at how many came out to vote. Not seeing a candidate first hand is typical and common place for most voters.
hey PM, I think your reply. I think I’m going to copy and paste your response. That woman who wrote it really irked me.
Also, the DNC has a rule (which it waived for most if not all of the first four states) to deal with ealry primaries. Seat half the delegates. Donna Brazile decided to take away all the delegates. I believe the not campaigning there was something Iowans and NH activists demanded and Hill was the last to agree to.
this is so cool! They have an official “hillary-is-44-tini” for results-watching on the Penn Primary
:
“Come watch the Pennsylvania results roll in and discuss the analysis with fellow Hillary Clinton supporters! Join us for Hillary-themed drink specials, such as the “HillaryIs44-tini” or the “Hill-Liberty Bell-tini”. We are working hard for Hillary to win Pennsylvania, and deserve a great party to cheer on her results! The Spot has valet parking to make things easy for you too!”
MJS Says:
April 4th, 2008 at 1:16 am
btw, this week is like girl power week.
Mariah toppled Elvis’ 17 #1 record with her 18th #1 in America.
Im a huged fan!!!isnt that sweet!!!yi yi yi
Mariah’s amazing
I also like the new singer from Great Britain: Leona Lewis? 
yep she is good too very good.but Mc definetely freakin amazing !!!
Excellent commentary. I check the site daily, but just registered today. I have blogged at Huffpo trying to defend our candidate, but it’s gotten vicious over there. Just about everyone I picked as a favorite blogger has disappeared from the boards since the middle of March. I figure they left for more friendly pastures, so I did, too.
This is frightening. This book by BHO needs to be held in starker light than anything else in this bizarre campaign. His own confused words need to be heard by every American. He is an imposter who needs to be revealed in full, each sentence out of his mouth and pen brought brilliantly out of the darkness of leftist naivité. I ask of the wind blowing through my thinning hair: Am I having a bad dream, or do 50% of Americans actually want him to be our President? 50%?? VERY,VERY frightening indeed.
there gonna take him out before penn…oohh i cant wait for it..
ac6tually CJ, considering 50% of the US is democrats and 50% of democrats want him (prbbly even less now) roughly 1/4 of americans want him as president while 3/4 reject him.
filbertf: if the question is why do they support obama then I agree with you. The question I was responding to was why do they hate Hillary, and that started before Obama showed up on the scene. I still think it is because she is a change agent. The change they fear varies by individual. In some cases it a change in gender roles, in other cases it is a fear of higher taxes, sometimes it is a common societal response to prominent women in a period of challenges, and basement angel had some good explanations too. So what do you think about that question.
i hope 100% reject him
Not a word of this is a surprise to me. I cannot in my wildest dreams figure out how the American People have allowed this to go on like this. It’s insane. Worst thing here is that STILL NO ONE IS GOING TO DO ANYTHING ABOUT THIS. The news Media in this Country is electing a President. What will we do with him after he is elected? Who will run the country? Rev. Wright ???
One of us, a few hours ago said and I quote, (and hope this is a teachable moment…)
Agreed ….we need a victory in Penn by at least 10% or more. Off coure, BO is closing the once double digit gap, as he is out spending her by million. I imagine Hillary is waiting for the final week
*to use whatever resources she has left*
to regain some distance. What is unsettling to me, however, is that the
Dontcha think that the phrase
*to use her resources intelligently*
could be used instead?
Geezze
skmf12
I agree about the brillohead junk…totally uncouth.
Course, I have greasy skank hair myself.
hillbilly: this weekend we have the legislative caucus here in King County (Seatte, Washington), I am a delegate and will be part of the legal team. Immediately thereafter I want to write a draft of the superdeleagate letter and get some reaction to it. But I do not want to post it here because of trolls until after it is sent. If your site is secure then perhaps I could forward it to you and have people from this site who are signed up with you give their reaction. Would that be okay? I need to get this out before I head to Pennsylvania.
hi hillfans. im late but i heard rhandi rhodes was suspended from air america.
Wow, the rare straight news story….
(Not thrilled with headline but can’t have everything)
Clinton veers to dark side in speeches
Candidate rejects lofty prose in favor of gritty tales culled from the trail
By Anne E. Kornblut
The Washington Post
updated 12:19 a.m. ET, Fri., April. 4, 2008
It almost always comes when the audience least expects it: the moment Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton brings a roaring crowd to a hush with a heart-rending anecdote.
“I remember listening to a story about a young woman in a small town along the Ohio River, in Meigs County, who worked in a pizza parlor,” the Democratic presidential candidate said during a stop in Cleveland, beginning a particularly grim tale.
“She got pregnant, she started having problems. There’s no hospital left in Meigs County, so she had to go to a neighboring county. She showed up, and the hospital said, ‘You know, you’ve got to give us $100 before we can see you.’ She didn’t have $100,” Clinton said.
“So the young woman went back home,” she continued. “The next time she went back, she was in an ambulance. It turned out she lost the baby. She was airlifted to Columbus.”
She paused before concluding: “And after heroic efforts at the medical center, she died.” The audience, as always, gasped.
The story has become a staple of Clinton’s stump speech, a prime example of how, in a campaign year in which lofty phrases have taken center stage, she has rejected sweeping oratory — “just words,” as her campaign likes to accuse Democratic rival Barack Obama of offering — in favor of a dramatic speaking style all her own.
Hand-picked hard tales
In hushed tones, sometimes with palpable sadness in her voice, Clinton tells dark, difficult anecdotes picked up on the campaign trail. They often relate to health matters, culled from her conversations with voters, and are designed to illustrate a policy point.
Presidential candidates across the decades, from Ronald Reagan to Bill Clinton to George W. Bush, have honed the art of picking out stories to bolster a policy position in particularly human terms. Former senator John Edwards (N.C.), who left the Democratic race this year, often cited the stories of people he defended as a trial lawyer. For all of his grandeur, Obama can turn serious as well; at least once, in an effort to demonstrate how fleeting life can be, he detoured from his speech to tell the story of a woman he had recently met who, moments later, found out that her child had been killed in a car accident.
For Clinton, the approach seems to bring together her best skills, especially her ability to listen to voters she meets. In speeches that sometimes wear on and sometimes derail into deadening policy, sharing bleak stories can focus the audience’s attention.
It also allows Clinton, who has only recently grown more comfortable talking about herself, to show that she understands how people live and how her policies would affect them. The story of the pregnant woman, which the candidate heard from a deputy sheriff in Ohio, provides a chance for her to talk about health care. At a town-hall meeting in Hanging Rock, Ohio, where the story drew audible gulps of horror, she ended by saying: “It’s a real indictment of our health-care system. That shouldn’t happen in America.”
Painful encounters retold
To emphasize her work on mental-health care for veterans, Clinton regularly describes meeting an Iraq war veteran whose wedding ring melted into his hand during an attack, and who also suffered a brain injury that forced him to rely on his wife for basic directions.
She routinely quotes the young man as asking: “Where do I go to get my brain back?”
“He said, ‘You know, I went to West Point. Nobody had to take care of me before,’ ” Clinton said as she told the tale in Huntington, W.Va., on March 19. ” ‘Now every morning my wife has to give me a list about where I’m supposed to go and what I’m supposed to do.’ ”
In another story, retold recently in Youngstown, Ohio, she describes a “young woman who lost her husband in Iraq, a lovely young woman who had a daughter.”
“Here’s what happened to her,” Clinton said. “She was given $6,000. She was told to leave the [military] base within 90 days. She was told her daughter was no longer eligible for Army medical care. She was basically on her own. So I said, ‘That’s not right.’ So we began to work to change what was really cruel — you lose your husband, you lose your wife, you lose your mom or your dad, and you’re out, and nobody seemed to care.”
Shortly before the Texas primary, Clinton spoke of a mother whose daughter collapsed in the crowd at a Houston rally and who, upon receiving a bottle of water from the candidate, whispered in her ear that she could not get her daughter medical treatment.
“She said, ‘I don’t have any health insurance — I can’t take her anywhere,’ ” Clinton recalled a few stops later. She said it was people like that who need for her to be president. “I’m not asking you to vote for me so much as I’m asking you to vote for yourselves,” she said.
Perhaps the most shocking story Clinton has conveyed in recent months happened on Feb. 22, when a Dallas police officer was killed in an accident while escorting her motorcade. Late that night, in front of a riled-up crowd in Toledo that seemed only vaguely aware of what had happened, she described an “accident that resulted in his death, and it was just an incredibly sad loss, not only for his family — he was a wonderful man; I visited the hospital and got a chance to express my sympathy to his family — but to the police department.”
Even though it was past 10:30 on a Friday night, she seemed determined to hush the crowd with a solemn message, saying: “It was really a reminder of the extraordinary work that our law enforcement officials do for us.”
Returning to a theme
But it is the story of the pregnant pizza worker to which Clinton comes back repeatedly. At a Democratic dinner on March 2, she recounted it in full. She told it at a late-night rally in Cleveland just two days before the Ohio primary March 4, bringing the noisy audience to near-silence. She told it again in Charleston, W.Va, last month. Even her daughter, Chelsea, who was with her mother in Ohio when she heard the story, repeated it at a campaign stop in Pennsylvania last week. Clinton was told the story by Bryan Holman, the Meigs County deputy sheriff, who said the deceased woman was Trina Bachtel, whom campaign officials had been unable to identify.
Bachtel, Holman said, had been turned away from the hospital not only for lack of $100 but also because she had unpaid bills — a detail that Clinton has not mentioned. Public records show that Bachtel of Pomeroy, Ohio, died on Aug. 15, 2007, at age 35. She previously had thousands of dollars in hospital debt, but it was paid off by 2005.
“It was a really terrible story,” said Holman, who said he voted for Clinton in the Ohio primary. He said he is grateful that she has taken Bachtel’s story to heart. “That is what we wanted.”
Sure wbboei . thebuzz at politwix.com
Did anyone notice that in the top 5 on that Time Magazine 100 Most Influential –
that Perez Hilton and Stephen Colbert top Nelson Mandela?
ARE YOU KIDDING?
C’mon – this is the top 100 for people ages 11 to 25.
I hope they publish this…Time Magazine will be a laughing stock.
I was at the Beverly Hills fundraiser for Clinton, and right behind me was the traveling press corp – and one guy right behind me was WaPo press – and totally in the tank for BO – when me and a couple foreign press and this guy started talking about FL and MI – he said, they broke the rules, and the “rules are the rules.”
The foreign press (2 women) were pretty outraged at the bias in the media, that even in Europe, all the panelists on the media are pro Obama, and 1 would be pro-Clinton. They said it was reflecting what was happening here in the U.S..
The WaPo guy kept snickering when Clinton would answer questions about No Child Left Behind or Healthcare – shows me even though the press corp is writing stories and listening to her speak daily – I’m not sure that some of them are listening or evolving at all – they’re personal points of references seem very inflexible.
hillary and finances-she is chnging her website, rising 2 mil w/elton john-but its brutal. brutal.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/03/AR2008040300407.html
philly enquirer-obama says hillary running neg campaign, but reporter catches him. confronts obama on the issue. this reporter says team obama begs media to write nasty stories on hillary.
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/politics/Obama_defends_his_spin_team.html
texan4hillary, i think big media does not need and prodding by obama to write nasty stories on hillary. they started that for over a year ago themselves. the media did in gore and kerry. they tried with bill clinton in 1992, 1996, and in 1998(monica) but he beat them at every turn. if hillary loses this year big media will finnally say they beat a clinton. sad.
Conan O’Brien doing spoof on 3 am phone call – seems that this ad has gotten lots of mileage, now on its way to being part of pop culture.
terrondt – re: press writing nasty stories – i still believe she’s going to beat them all, but in the remote chance that she does not, I think the press has still lost. have we ever after Bill Clinton, Gore, Kerry, or even the “Weapons of Mass Destruction” meme, EVER been this hyperaware of media bias and manipulation? at the very least, I think women will be up in arms against the media, and there will many many many books written about this election and the fourth estate.
filbertsf: I got called away to see Hillary on Leno (she was great) but did want to complete the thought at 1:23.
Hillary haters are ignorant people. By ignorant I do not mean stupid because many of them are not that. Rather, they are uninformed and thus manipulable. By the same token, when they actually meet Hillary they are often impressed by her charm, wit and remarkable intellect. They sense her great love of this country,her commitment to help people as she has always done, and her great moral courage. The effect of this is amazing. At first they are perplexed, then they question their old assumptions and eventually they become supporters and defenders. I fully expect RM Scaife is there right now.
I was born in the middle of the Truman Presidency, and have seen alot of presidents come and go. And I have known my share of politicans. Those that I have known were honest politicans in the sense that they stayed bought and that is about the best you can say about them. Barack is very much of that mold. He is different than Hillary in that he would do the bidding of elites just as he has done throughout his career whereas Hillary would represent ordinary perople as she has always done
“Do Americans see more prejudice against a woman than an African-American? More likely, they see more negative feelings about this woman than about this African-American. Because it’s true. More people have an unfavorable opinion of Hillary Clinton than of Barack Obama,” Schneider said.
THIS IS CNN NEW US POLL SHOWING AMERICA READY FOR A BLACK PRESIDENT! GO FIGURE! IM READY ALSO FOR A BLACK PRESIDENT BUT NOT THIS ONE!
By Stephen Spruiell Chicago, Illinois — After the Reverend Jeremiah Wright’s now-notorious sermons gained a significant amount of national media attention, Illinois Senator Barack Obama felt compelled to explain his relationship with Wright in a major speech on race relations in America. Now that the governor of Illinois has been implicated in the schemes of Obama’s friend Tony Rezko, it might be time for Obama to explain his relationship with Rezko in a major speech on the endemic political corruption that afflicts his home state of Illinois. Rezko’s trial has lifted the veil on Illinois’s infernally corrupt political establishment, and a government witness named Stuart Levine has taken the part of a meth-snorting, double-dealing Virgil, guiding the public through it. Levine is a broken man, testifying for the government in order to avoid spending the rest of his life in prison. Over seven days of direct examination, he has described an astonishingly broad network of fraud, extortion, and bribery, culminating in Wednesday’s revelation that Illinois Governor Rod Blagojevich allegedly knew about at least one such scheme. Levine used his positions on various state boards to steal as much money as he could from people with business before those boards. One of those people was a Hollywood producer and financier named Tom Rosenberg. Rosenberg was a principal at a firm called Capri Capital. Capri managed over a billion dollars for the Illinois Teachers Retirement System, of which Levine was a trustee. Through a variety of corrupt means, including allowing TRS executive director Jon Bauman to write his own (glowing) evaluations, Levine wielded a disproportionate amount of influence over TRS investment decisions. Levine used this influence to steer TRS contracts to whomever would pay him and his associates the biggest “finder’s fees.” Levine decided that Rosenberg was getting far too much TRS business and paying far too little in the form of kickbacks to him and his cronies — an arrangement that Levine saw an opportunity to amend when Capri sought a new contract from TRS in early 2004. According to his testimony, Levine and an associate named Bill Cellini (both Republicans) conspired with two of Governor Blagojevich’s top fundraisers and advisers — Tony Rezko and a roofing contractor named Chris Kelly (both Democrats) — to offer Rosenberg a choice: Either pay a $2 million bribe or raise $1.5 million for Blagojevich’s re-election campaign. Rosenberg was to be made to understand that all of his business with TRS was at stake. Levine testified that Allison Davis, a lawyer friend of Rosenberg’s, was the go-between. Davis allegedly approached Rezko on behalf of Rosenberg to ask about Capri’s business with TRS, and he told Rezko that Rosenberg would be willing to do some fundraising for Blagojevich if that would speed things along. Rezko told Davis that Rosenberg should “call Stuart Levine.” When Rosenberg realized he was the target of such a massive shakedown, he was furious. In a recorded phone call between Cellini and Levine that prosecutors played for the jury, Cellini quoted Rosenberg’s reaction: “ ‘If [Tony Rezko and Chris Kelly are] going to do this to me and think they’re going to blackmail me, I’m going to take them down.’ ” Rosenberg’s threat convinced the alleged conspirators to back off, and — in the biggest bombshell to emerge during the trial so far — Levine testified that Rezko told him that Governor Blagojevich had been informed of the situation. Prosecutors also played a recorded conversation between Cellini and Levine that appeared to confirm Levine’s testimony. In it, they discussed how “the big guy” had implied that Rosenberg should not get any further business from the state. Blagojevich’s office issued a statement last night essentially accusing Levine of “not telling the truth” — an accusation that is by no means baseless. Levine has major credibility problems. For one thing, he is testifying as part of a plea deal. For another, he testified on Monday that his drug of choice from the late ‘80s until his arrest in 2004 was a cocktail of crystal meth and the animal tranquilizer ketamine, known on the street as “Special K.” But much of his testimony is nonetheless backed up by phone conversations that were recorded without his knowledge, in which he was speaking freely and had little incentive to lie. If Levine’s testimony regarding Blagojevich is true, then such nakedly corrupt behavior at such a high level is bound to attract greater scrutiny from the national media to the problem of corruption in the state of Illinois. To illustrate the gravity of the issue, three of the last seven governors elected in the state of Illinois have ended up in jail. If Blagojevich is indicted, tried and convicted, that will make four out of seven. Cook County Commissioner Tony Peraica, a Republican who is running for Cook County state’s attorney, calls an indictment of Governor Blagojevich “inevitable.” “What we have,” Peraica says, “is a level of corruption that is integrated both vertically and horizontally across all layers of government: city, municipal, county, and state.” To him, the Rezko case illustrates that corruption in Illinois is a bipartisan problem. “We have a corrupt political combine, where the members of the two parties… have come together, not pursuant to a public interest, but to pursue their own financial interests, which they have done with great zeal and ingenuity.” This corruption, should it become an issue in the campaign, could cause problems for Obama when people start to wonder how he could have made it through “the combine” without getting involved in the overlapping networks of patronage and influence. Peraica, for one, argues that he didn’t. “Senator Barack Obama is an integral part and a product of this corrupt system,” Peraica says. “Senator Obama has endorsed Todd Stroger for Cook County board president, Mayor [Richard M.] Daley for mayor of Chicago, Dorothy Tillman for re-election as an alderman, and other epitomes of bad government throughout his career in order to promote himself politically, at the expense of, I would argue, principles and morals and good government.” Obama’s relationship with Allison Davis — the alleged go-between in Rezko’s scheme to shake down Tom Rosenberg — could pose another problem for him. Obama worked for Davis at the law firm of Davis Miner Barnhill. Later, when Obama sat on the board of a charity called the Woods Fund, he voted to invest $1 million in a partnership operated by Davis, according to the Chicago Sun-Times. Levine’s testimony in the Rezko trial puts Davis in the middle of an attempted quid pro quo, making him yet another associate Obama might be pressured to disown. And the trial could stretch well into May, at which point a Rezko conviction could lead to even more headaches for the candidate. If Rezko is looking at a long prison sentence and decides to start talking, who knows what he might say? All the more reason that Obama might be tempted to try to address this metastasizing problem with a single bold gesture. Obama made a big speech about race to distract from his ties to one unsavory Chicago character, but distancing himself from an entire network of them might prove to be a tougher task. After all, Obama was able to claim the middle ground in his defense of Wright, denouncing Wright’s most radical views while excusing his run-of-the-mill resentments as being a not-atypical part of the black experience.
But America will have a harder time swallowing excuses for corruption as being a run-of-the-mill aspect of the Illinois political experience — particularly not from a candidate that has promised a new kind of politics. To succeed, Obama would have to denounce the behavior of some of his closest allies and demonstrate a candor about his own experience in state government that’s been missing from his campaign thus far. In the Rezko trial, Obama might have finally encountered a problem that a speech alone won’t solve.
… when is someone going to talk about Obama financial campaign chairman – Penny Pritzker, that cost the Federal Government – taxpayers one billion dollars when Superior Bank failed, and 450 million dollars still owed to the FDIC – and they gave her 15 years to pay back – no interest, if Obama get elected is he going to waive this money owed, all the people the work so hard for there money Obama talks about, hundreds of them, lost there money at Superior Bank, Ms. Pritzker is the only one that made out on that deal.
For those who do not know, “billionaire business mogul” Penny Pritzker was named in January 2007 as Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.)’s national finance chairman. She was also on the finance committee for Obama’s 2004 campaign for the U.S. Senate. In August 2001, Penny, Thomas, and Nicholas Pritzker were described as “struggling with a complicated legacy”—”a vast real estate and Hyatt hotel empire”—left to them by its founder, Jay Pritzker, the New York Times reported. In 2005, Forbes counted Penny Pritzer among The 100 Most Powerful Women, as well as a member of the Forbes 400.
John Ashcroft calling Obama, Osama
abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=4585172&affil=wpvi
Wow, from comments at TM
Randy Rhodes event was organized by the Obama campaign
nashvilleistalking.com/node/31505
AmericanGal: yes, it’s the ‘new’ politics
(I know I keep making that remark, I am living in the delusion that the more I say it maybe the media would admit it)
would = will
Just saw the Ashcroft blip. In DEFENSE of Ashcroft, and as someone who had to learn dozens of strangely spelled, made-up fabricated names which had no comparison as to spelling or pronounciation, and I’m not talking about clearly foreign names which have few English equivalents as in Japanese, Chinese and many Arabic names, I’m talking about the absurd phoentically incorrect often ebonic spellings of urban childrens names, it is OUTRAGEOUS for all Americans to be expected to get everyone’s name right all the time or face being LABELED as racist.
I’m sorry but Osama DOES sound like OBAMA – just substitute S for B – and this is some friggin” CARDINAL sin??????? And what’s amazing is the entire press corp KNOWS that by thier standards (and we KNOW what those are) so politically incorrect it’s gonna cause a STIR? just one more example of OSama-speak, I mean, Obama-speak, censorship and Big Brother. I notice the same wasn’t done to Randi Rhodes. The race card again. And now we can add Ashcroft to the long list of white Americans who have slandered and insulted poor righteous BO, from Geraldine. to Bill Clinton, to HRC, to Achcroft. PULLLEEZZE. it was obviously an innocent slip of the tongue. nothing Fresudian about it. As one fo 9 children, i distinctly remember my mother running down the entire list of my siblings names when she was yelling at someone before she landed on the right one. this is SO fascist! (IMHO)
Forgot to add,
FWIW,
I’t not MY fault, or anyone else’s, if He whose name shall not be spoken’s parents named him osama, probably with all good intentions, and that just happened to be the first name of one of the most powerful terrorists in recent history, and the two names sound so similar that it’s easy to mistake one for the other, and yet it’s some FRIGGIN’ SIN when the Neo-GOD’S name is misspoken?????? Axelrod and crew have infiltrated everywhere. The gasping and oohing of the so-called press-corp in that clip proves it, and poor Ashcroft (of whom I’m NOT a fan) immediately trying to correct it, like he was TERRIFIED of what would happen . . .