O + O = 0

Update: Paul Krugman has a response to Obama’s latest “false claims” and “quotes out of context” attack. First Krugman reprints the full quote which Obama selectively edited. Then Krugman writes:

And I was prepared to leave it at that — Obama’s plan was weaker than his rivals’ because it wasn’t universal, but I hoped that he would fix that in practice.

But then Obama started attacking his rivals from the right, denouncing their proposals using exactly the same false claims that conservatives will use to try to derail reform in the future.

And now, having been caught out on the facts, the Obama people respond with a personal attack, lifting quotes out of context to pretend that I never had problems with the plan. Something is very wrong here.

—————————————-

Maybe Oprah will forego doling out cars today and instead pay the health care costs of the 15 million Americans Obama abandons as uninsured in his NOT universal healthcare plan.

And make no mistake, Obama abandons 15 million Americans to the land of the uninsured. For the arguments substantiating this claim read HERE, HERE, HERE, and HERE.

But Obama is persisting in his deceptions. Once again, typical for the Chicago crowd, Obama is attacking the critics of his healthcare plan instead of fixing his plan (link HERE to Obama’s website attack on Paul Krugman). And, Obama is once again using selected quotes and distortions to slime legitimate arguments.

Taylor Marsh has the play by play on Obama’s attack on Paul Krugman:

Since when do presidential candidates do “then” and “now” comparisons on columnist’s writings? Like I said, very weird and also a bit defensive, especially since the quotes are truncated so badly as to totally misrepresent the column Krugman wrote.

Take this snippet:

THE PLAN

KRUGMAN THEN: Obama’s Health Care Plan “Is Smart And Serious, Put Together By People Who Know What They’re Doing.” Paul Krugman wrote, “The Obama plan is smart and serious, put together by people who know what they’re doing…So there’s a lot to commend the Obama plan.” [New York Times, 6/4/07]

KRUGMAN NOW: “The Fundamental Weakness Of The Obama Plan Was Apparent From The Beginning.” Paul Krugman wrote, “The fundamental weakness of the Obama plan was apparent from the beginning.” [New York Times, 11/30/07]

In the “then” section above there is another point completely left out of Obama’s (ahem) “Fact Check” item:

Now for the bad news. Although Mr. Obama says he has a plan for universal health care, he actually doesn’t — a point Mr. Edwards made in last night’s debate. The Obama plan doesn’t mandate insurance for adults. So some people would take their chances — and then end up receiving treatment at other people’s expense when they ended up in emergency rooms. In that regard it’s actually weaker than the Schwarzenegger plan.I asked David Cutler, a Harvard economist who helped put together the Obama plan, about this omission. His answer was that Mr. Obama is reluctant to impose a mandate that might not be enforceable, and that he hopes — based, to be fair, on some estimates by Mr. Cutler and others — that a combination of subsidies and outreach can get all but a tiny fraction of the population insured without a mandate. Call it the timidity of hope. … ..

There is no “then” and “now” with Krugman. Referring to Obama’s health care plan as the “timidity of hope” is hardly positive. Krugman has been consistent throughout. However, you sure won’t get that from Obama’s “Fact Check” page.

Marsh explains why Obama is targeting Paul Krugman for attack:

But why is Obama targeting Krugman on his website? Krugman believes mandates are critical in order to get everyone insured. Without mandates, which must include adults to be successful, you simply aren’t going to get universal health coverage.

Maybe Obama’s worried that the word will get out that his plan falls short of universal coverage. That would be because it does. Or maybe it’s because he doesn’t believe we can get to universal coverage and isn’t even going to try. That would be more trouble for him in the primaries.

Ezra Klein, who remains silent on Chris Matthews’ Mudball show when Hillary is attacked unfairly, comes to the defense of Krugman in blogworld:

Something’s really gone off the rails when the Obama campaign decides to release an oppo document on Paul Krugman. It’s not only the actual attacks that are weak (most of them rely on misinterpreting one comment, then misinterpreting the next, then pretending there’s a contradiction), but, seriously, it’s Paul Krugman. Arguably the most progressive voice in American media. When I argued that the campaign should take the gloves off, I really didn’t expect their target, in this document and in the health care fight more generally, would be progressivism. What in hell is going on over there?

Update: To say a bit more on this, the campaign’s attack on Krugman raises the question they don’t want to answer: What changed? When Obama’s plan came out, Krugman, and me, and Jon Cohn, and all the usual suspects criticized it for lacking an individual mandate, but said that, on the overall, it was pretty good, and Obama had passed the bar. Suddenly, we’re all up in arms. Why?

Well, it was one thing when Obama simply didn’t have a mechanism to achieve universality. It became a whole other when he began criticizing mechanisms to achieve universality. Previously, he’d gotten some flack for buying into the conservative argument that Social Security was in crisis. Now he was constructing a conservative argument against far-reaching reform proposals. And he kept doing it. And now his campaign is misrepresenting Krugman’s comments in order to imply contradiction. But Krugman hasn’t contradicted himself. Where his original comments focused on Obama’s plan, his newer arguments are attempting to beat back Obama’s rhetoric. And Obama’s rhetoric has become much, much worse than his plan. That it’s ended with him having to go on the offensive against the most forthrightly progressive voice in major American media is evidence of that fact.

Krugman has explained why Obama’s rhetoric is dangerous to true progressives and Democrats who want reform:

Why I get mad at Obama about Social Security

So I just spent a fairly unpleasant 15 minutes on right-wing talk radio. And the host said — this is rough, not a verified quote —

“Look, everyone knows that Social Security is going bust, and we’d all be better off if we could put out money in 401(k)s. Even Barack Obama says so!”

Increasingly, true progressives are begining to speak out against Obama’s false hopes. Ellen Goodman is the latest who understands the difference between flowery talk and action:

There’s still a difference between being an icon of change and an agent of change. And there is a difference as well between being a fine philosopher king and a strong presidential challenger.

It’s easy to understand why Obama hopes the woman who sold America James Frey’s A Million Little Lies Pieces will help sell Obama’s 15 Million Lies.

But the rest of us, especially Americans without health insurance, know that Obama Is Never There When You Need Him.

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226 thoughts on “O + O = 0

  1. I have been thinking about what must be going on in Obama’s campaign. I am willing to bet that Obama, in his hands off “I don’t want to be involved” manner, has told David Axelrod that he can do whatever it takes, as long as Obama doesn’t have to know about it.

    I know that it’s a bumpy ride, but I simply am convinced that no matter what happens, Hillary is going to be the nominee. I would prefer that Iowa go for her, but if she doesn’t win there, she is going to recover. This is going to happen.

  2. Jerome Armstrong lays maneuver at BO’s doorstep:

    Every 4 years in December, Robert Gibbs, Obama’s communications director, seems to morph into some sort of a zombie that turns on progressives… or maybe he’s always that way. During the last Presidential cycle at this time, Robert Gibbs was the face and spokesperson for the front group that attacked Howard Dean in Iowa with one of the most dispicable TV ads of our times. This cycle, he’s out trashing the credibility of Paul Krugman on behalf of Barack Obama.

    mydd.com/story/2007/12/7/22374/8663

  3. somebody watch for me…don’t think i can stomach it.

    LIVE: Sen. Barack Obama with Oprah Winfrey in Iowa
    Airs: Today from 4:30pm ET to 5:30pm ET on C-SPAN

  4. Has anyone noticed that BO seems just as touchy and petulant as Bush ? Point out the holes in his policy arguments or anything else and he doesn’t address them. He gets all petulant and indignant with a “how dare you” attitude.

    Same goes for his supporters too, really.

  5. CSPAN isn’t going to do every Oprah event are they?

    I think they have to miss one to cover the Pope’s Christmas mass.

  6. Has anyone noticed that BO seems just as touchy and petulant as Bush ?

    Of course. It started with his blunder of agreeing to hold an immediate personal summit with Chavez, Castro, Kim Il Jong, and Ahmadeinejhad. His campaign offered a a “clarification”, but Obama — being the stubborn ass that he is — insisted that his blunder was really a piece of foreign policy brilliance and that everyone else in the history of foreign policy was too much of an idiot to appreciate his brilliance.

  7. dt

    as a hillary supporter, i do not get petulant or indignant when someone disses her, i just punch them in the head…:)

  8. hillfans, rass’s numbers this morning is trending back up. hillary rhodam clinton back up to 36% to 25%. this is national numbers.

  9. Does anyone remember how Rass works? I know it’s like a 4 day average or something. I just can’t totally remember.

  10. im not watchin oprah worshipfest with bawak hussein obama. she better go and clean up that child abuse school in south africa first. YUCK!!!!!

  11. I saw that Terrondt. Good. I suspect the numbers are gonna bounch back some on that poll.

    I spent last night with some local democrats at a local fundraising party. I listened closely to a couple of guys, one of whom is a Hillary supporter, another who is leanin’ (I think). I do think we have to keep our core support, so I appreciate the efforts this weekend that target women, but I would really like to see more of the effort to reach out to men. One person told me he didn’t feel “included”. I think was perfectly honest. Though women have felt like this for years about candidates, we need to advertise specifically to those men who want to vote for Hillary but are gettin’ the message (maybe from their own subconscious that she’s not the guy’s candidate). Any chance for a sustained visibility of prominent men campaiging with Hillary…I know Wesley Clark, and RFK, jr., have done this. Will this continue and will more follow? Anybody else have thoughts on this?

  12. Molly, that is why Wes Clark and BC will be in Iowa all month. Also, a bunch of male surrogates have been hitting the trail for Hill, including the NJ Governor, Gov. Corzine.

  13. As talk icon Oprah Winfrey begins a swing through early-primary states to promote Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois, Clinton is countering with a move she has resisted: having her mother join the campaign trail.

    Dorothy Rodham’s appearances at a series of rallies around the state today are just the start of the effort to move women, a group the campaign has long viewed as its core constituency.

    Kathleen Kennedy Townsend and former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright will come to Iowa to vouch for her “strength and experience,” which her advisers view as her main asset.

    Nearly a dozen women — including elected officials such as Sen. Barbara Mikulski, D-Md., activists such as Ellen Malcolm of Emily’s List, and Betsy Ebeling, Clinton’s best friend from childhood — are scheduled to appear on her behalf.

    Last week, Townsend, the former Maryland lieutenant governor, and Kerry Kennedy introduced Clinton at a major appearance in northern Iowa. Ruth Harkin, wife of Sen. Tom Harkin, D-Iowa, has remained virtually attached to Clinton for much of the race.

    chron.com/disp/story.mpl/politics/5362216.html

  14. MJ, tracking polls are rolling interviews. let’s say a poll of 750 likely voters for the dem primary. i believe 4 days of 200 to 250 interviews? then the next day it is posted on the website. i think each day the oldest day is dropped and the newest is add on wich makes a tracking poll bounce up and down. it is a double edge sword, if you are a poll lover like myself it is golden. if you don’t like the bouncing of the polls you hate it.

  15. i think bill clinton should rent a apartment and LIVE in iowa for the rest of the month. now you hear the msm claiming it is a negative for bill to campaign for hillary. lordy, bill as a 85% approval rating for dems and they call that a negative?

  16. I haven’t seen this posted here;

    US ex-ambassadors vouch for Clinton’s experience

    23 hours ago

    WASHINGTON (AFP) — An honor roll of 32 former US diplomats and ambassadors on Friday put their names to a letter vouching for Democratic White House front-runner Hillary Clinton’s foreign policy expertise.

    The letter was the latest shot by the former first lady’s campaign in a battle over experience with her top party rival Barack Obama, just 27 days before the leadoff Iowa caucuses nominating contests.

    Democratic foreign policy sages including Richard Holbrooke, who brokered the Dayton peace accords which ended the war in the former Yugoslavia, and former vice president Walter Mondale signed the letter.

    Joseph Wilson, the former US ambassador who saw his wife’s cover as a CIA spy blown after he criticized the Bush administration over the war in Iraq, was also on the list.

    Senator Clinton “is the candidate with the strength and experience to restore America’s standing in the world and to return the United States to a position of global leadership,” the letter said.”

    The rest of the article can be found here;

    http://www.afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5g4SXF8IUSneBjHTp7BwyyVSn6wwg

  17. I love that Chelsea is coming out to campaign. I hope she will speak.

    They should send her to a college in Iowa, eat out of Obamas core supporters, the youth!!

    It’s getting close to Christmas, and bringing out the family will be a good image to send to people. I think this will be good, and god knows the media will be watching!!

  18. Personally, I think Obama is targeting the voters who WOULD game the system. I think that’s the whole point. He’s trying to get the votes of people who don’t want to pay for their healthcare until they absolutely need it. Why else have this plan? Is there any upside to it that you know of? Well, if you’re a smarter-than-everybody-else 24 yr. old, who doesn’t want to pay even $50 a month for healthcare, Obama is now your guy.

    The people who make enough money to pay for health insurance, but refuse to, are exactly the kind of voters Obama’s been targeting with his smirking campaign.

  19. Also, the Obama campaign attacks on Krugman are ridiculous. Can you imagine if Hillary’s people responded to every unfavorable column written about her? They’d never get anything else done.

  20. Des Moines Register article on Hillary, Chelsea and Mrs. Rodham:

    Oddly enough, many of the Iowans who came to Saturday morning breakfast at Palmer’s Deli on Ingersoll Avenue in Des Moines brought their digital cameras, and wore “Hillary” buttons.

    All the local precinct captains were tipped off about Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton’s breakfast stop, including Debbie Noe of West Des Moines.

    Noe and her 3 1/2-year-old son, Caleb, and her husband, Lance, ate French toast before the arrival of the Clinton, her 27-year-old daughter, Chelsea, and her 88-year-old mother, Dorothy Rodham.

    “Who’s going to be the next president?” Noe asked her son.

    “Mitt Romney,” the little boy answered.

    His parents’ jaws literally dropped, then they laughed.

    “Can I have my (business) card back?” said Noe, who later chatted with the Clintons as they strolled through the deli.

    Cheryl Haimann had only a cell phone to shoot pictures – she was caught by surprise by the unofficial campaign stop.

    “My husband hates crowds,” said Haimann, who works in circulation at The Des Moines Register. “He went down to Caribou (Coffee) and said, ‘Tell me when it’s over.’ He’s also a Republican.”

    As the candidate, her mother, and her daughter slowly moved around the restaurant, shaking hands and posing for photos, a horde of reporters and photographers clustered around them.

    “Maybe we could hire some of these guys to help bring food out,” said Palmer’s assistant manager Jim Pollak, a 31-year-old who intends to caucus for Republican Mike Huckabee.

    Pollak said other candidates have stopped by this Palmer’s – but without any media. Staff shut down the store one evening for an event for Democrat Barack Obama. Republican John McCain was there on a quiet weekday morning with staff. Democrat Bill Richardson stopped by to grab a bite a few weeks ago. And Pollak heard Republican Fred Thompson came by, too.
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    Lorraine Smith, a 49-year-old IRS worker who lives in Des Moines, commented on the attractive appearance of Chelsea, with her long, straight blonde hair.

    “She’s got such a lean, mature face,” Smith said. “She’s turning into a classy broad like her mother.”

    Smith, who is one of Clinton’s precinct captains, added: “Unfortunately, Hillary has people who either love her or who dislike her intensely. Having her mother and daughter here helps fill in that middle ground.”

    The Clinton crew eventually sat down to eat: Hillary Clinton ordered a “Good Ol’ Iowa” omelet with ham and bacon, Chelsea Clinton ordered an egg white omelet with vegetables and no toast, and Rodham asked for two pancakes with syrup.

    They departed for their 11 a.m. Winterset stop at about 10:30 a.m.

  21. Obama doesn’t stand up to Republican attacks. First he ducks them, then he joins them.

    Obama only excluded the mandate because he didn’t think it could survive Republican attacks/distortions. Now he is joining in those very same attacks on universal healthcare.

    And Hillary should not let him campaign on universal healthcare when he’s not willing to take the heat to achieve universal healthcare. If he’s not ready to fight fight for it, he can’t campaign on it.

    But why give up on on universal healthcare without a fight? We’re talking about a bill you send to Congress. If you can’t get the votes in Congress, you take out the mandate and submit the weaker bill. It happens all the time. This is not about passing a law in his first term. This is about Obama ducking Republican heat now — in the Presidential campaign. His strategy is: “Let Hillary take the heat on real universal healthcare. I’ll use ‘universal healthcare’ as a campaign soundbite while I actually propose a watered-down non-universal healthcare bill that Rush Limbaugh/Andrew Sullivan won’t complain about.”

    There goes Obama–out the kitchen door because he can’t take the heat.

    The truly vile thing is this: the only reason ‘universal healthcare’ is such a good soundbite today is Hillary took the heat by pioneering the idea fifteen years ago.

  22. I thought the article was decent; BTW, one of the anti-Hillary commenters called it a fluff piece, lol.

    Anyway, this one in the N.Y. Times is definitely better. It also has an audio link of Chelsea talking to an undecided voter:

    DES MOINES – With Oprah Winfrey headed here on Saturday to campaign for Senator Barack Obama, Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton brought a surprise guest of her own: Chelsea Clinton.

    It was Ms. Clinton’s debut on the presidential campaign trail, smiling broadly as she walked into Palmer’s Deli a few steps behind her mother for a breakfast photo opportunity. She shed her coat and immediately began shaking hands and mingling with Iowa supporters who were seated among the diners.
    AudioChelsea Speaks to Voters (mp3) At Palmer’s Deli in Des Moines on Saturday, The Times’s Jeff Zeleny listens as Chelsea Clinton talks to Darlene Dols, an undecided voter.

    “Chelsea, delighted to meet you,” said Julia Martinusen, 49, who signed up as a Clinton supporter in recent weeks. “I was just wondering where you’d been.”

    “I’m happy to be here,” Ms. Clinton replied.

    The Clinton family was fully deployed on Saturday, with former President Bill Clinton campaigning in South Carolina and the rest of the family in Iowa. The senator’s mother, Dorothy Rodham, also made her first appearance, taking a seat here at the crowded restaurant as her daughter and granddaughter shook hands and posed for pictures before joining her for breakfast.

    For weeks, anticipation has been building for Ms. Winfrey’s appearance, with thousands of people expected for rallies in Des Moines and Cedar Rapids for Mr. Obama. Fearful of being overshadowed in the critical closing stretch of the Democratic presidential nominating contest, the Clinton campaign chose Saturday to introduce Chelsea Clinton to Iowa voters in four separate cities.

    Trailed by more than a dozen photographers, Ms. Clinton talked to young children – pausing for a moment to chant B-I-N-G-O with a little boy – and made her way through a line of prospective supporters.

    “I hope you’ll support my mother,” she said again and again. When Darlene Dols confessed being undecided about which candidate she should support, Ms. Clinton said: “Is there anything we can talk about that would push you over the edge for my Mom?”

    Finally, they made their way to the breakfast counter. Mrs. Clinton ordered the “Good Ol Iowa” omelette, a house specialty that includes cured ham, applewood bacon and shredded cheddar cheese. “Do you have any hot tea?” she asked. Ms. Clinton opted for an egg white omelette, with Mrs. Rodham having pancakes with a side of bacon. (And yes, an aide pointed out, the Clintons left a tip.)

    While political activists in Iowa have had plenty opportunities to see Senator Clinton, the arrival of Chelsea Clinton created a stir. Years ago, she visited Iowa with her father, an aide said, but not as an adult.

    “Oh, Chelsea, you’ve grown up,” one woman wearing a Hillary button exclaimed. “You’re so beautiful.”

    “Oh, thank you very much,” she replied softly. Asked how long she would be in the state, she said: “Just with my mom today, then I’ll be back.”

  23. Petulant is the right expressionn for Obama; he actaully scowls – yes that face that sullivan lauds scOwls when he does not get his way!

    Mollyj: you are right about including men as well; this point also applies to some “older” wome who only think men can lead; case in point – I mentioed that Warren buffet is going to have a fundraiser here in SF next week, well my nieghbors ears perked up. She loves Buffet and at first could not uderstand how he could support Buffet. And now she is at least talking about Hillary! She is still considering Biden (not Obama thank goddess!) but I see that she might come around if Biden does not have a chance.

    So I agree, include more men! Wesley Clark, etc

  24. Oops..i mean Warren Buffet having a fundraiser for Hillary..
    …my keyboard has occasional problem with ‘n’!

  25. mj, You should listen to the audio, too. Go to google news and type in chelsea and iowa and zelezny, and the article, with audio link, comes right up.

  26. Politico’s Ben Smith on the Clinton women. Love the quote from the little girl, lol.

    WINTERSET, Iowa – Hillary Clinton brought her 88-year old mother and 27-year old daughter to snowy Iowa this weekend, an apparent response to Barack Obama’s heavily-promoted three-state swing with talk-show host Oprah Winfrey.

    Dorothy Rodham stood on stage a Des Moines high school Friday night without speaking, and she was joined by her silent granddaughter in a frigid airplane hanger in Winterset on Saturday.

    But their presence on the trail was as exotic as Oprah’s – and guaranteed Clinton coverage on what was to be Obama’s day in the Iowa media – because neither has made more than a passing appearance during Clinton’s eight years in electoral politics.

    “I also brought two other people who I’m thrilled are here with me. One is my mother, Dorothy Rodham, who is traveling with me today and the other is my daughter Chelsea Clinton,” said the senator from New York, who then acted as though this was a campaign event like any other.

    “The reason I am so happy they are both here is because I’m running for president to make the kind of changes America needs – and these are changes people need no matter what age we are.”

    The Clintons began Saturday with breakfast at Palmer’s Deli and Market in Des Moines, where they ate their omelets amid a scrum of video cameras and hovering reporters. A flat screen television over their heads carried the latest CNN headline: OPRAHOBAMA.

    Chelsea Clinton, moving carefully through the cloud and speaking with enunciated clarity, tried to talk a retired legal secretary, Carlene Doll, into backing Sen. Clinton.

    “Is there anything I could say that would push you over the edge for my mom?” she asked.

    The breakfast atmosphere loosened up a bit when a boy and his little sister approached the table.

    “Girls rule, boys drool,” the girl declared.

    “I am agreeing with the first half of the statement,” Chelsea replied, laughing.

    Rodham, a spry and cheerful 88, lives with her daughter and son-in-law, former President Bill Clinton, in Washington, D.C., but shuns the media.

    Her last interview came in 2004, when she appeared with Hillary on a key stop on daytime television: The Oprah Winfrey Show.

    There, she told Oprah a family story about her daughter, then four years old, one that is iconic in Clinton lore.

    “We moved into this new house, new neighborhood, and she would come in crying and screaming about the fact that she’d been set upon by a group of children, mostly her age, and this one girl who was exactly her age, Suzy, across the street,” Rodham recalled.

    “She came in one day, and I said, ‘You know, this is just about enough, Hillary. You have to face things and show them you’re not afraid.’”

    Rodham concluded: “Anyway, I said, ‘Just go out there and show them that you’re not afraid, and if she does hit you again – which she kept doing – hit her back.’”

    It was a lesson Clinton seems to be keeping in mind as the presidential campaign turns into a tooth-and-nail scrap in Iowa.

  27. Oh-oh, I am so very happy to see Chelsea finally out there. Chelsea is so charismatic!! I can cheer at something finally!! Anyways, guys please prepare your post-oprah analysis and how it went. I want to hear it straight from the horses mouth. I cannot stomach anymore media spins.

  28. Taylor has an excellent article written on “The Progressive Cannabalism of Obama”. Please digg it and spotlight it in as many places as possible. It is an excellent piece and it shows absolute lack of political compass for Obama. It is a must read and Taylor wants readers to digg it as much as possible.

  29. Oprah event starting–slogan of the day “Change we can Believe in” (on all the signs). LOL–Michelle saying that Oprah represents the “broad and deep support of her husband”

  30. taylor marsh is right. obama gets the free passes-oprah doesnt permit unions in her set-but oh well free pass. oprah hosts obama event in union disputed stadium-afl gives him a free pass-takes him at hs word. sad. naral give him a free pass on missing key choice votes. the institutions of the dems are permiting a free ride here. its shameful. glad bill is following oprah events in sc to set the record straight. see he actually did things for the community-not oprah. bill is more popular and respected than oprah in sc. with chelsea out today hillary will be in the news cycle

  31. Thanks ra1029. The Taylor Marsh article is good. She calls Obama “The Flim Flam Man”.

    http://www.taylormarsh.com/archives_view.php?id=26671

    Excerpts:

    It didn’t start with Paul Krugman, though Obama’s voracious appetite for anti progressive attacks reached its crescendo with it. Obama’s audacity of a smear against a leading progressive shows no political conscience whatsoever. This comes as no surprise to me. Skipping out and not being counted where it matters on the issues is what Obama’s been doing all year. Obama not being an ideologue explains so much, not only his Krugman attack, but also his revelation that Social Security is in “crisis,” giving the Republicans the bone they’ve wanted for so long. Mr. Obama’s ability to cannibalize the very essence of progressive policy by going to the right of our Democratic party foundation knows no bounds.


    “Market-based ideas,” hmmm, wonder what Mr. Obama is talking about? It’s obvious. It’s also a warning. Putting Social Security on the table, especially after progressives won that battle during the Bush era, is something no Democrat should swallow. It goes beyond not being an ideologue. It reveals that Obama doesn’t care at all about anything Democratic, including one of the most important aspects of what makes us Democrats, Social Security. So, of course, Mr. Obama has no compunction of going after the leading progressive economist, Paul Krugman, because Obama’s loyalty is not to Democratic principles, but to his own agenda, which at it’s core can be summed up in four words: Let’s Make a Deal. Just look at the campaign’s attack “Facts Page” on Krugman.

    It’s like Obama’s Donnie McClurkin politics of convenience. It didn’t matter that the reverend believes in “conversion” therapy for gays and lesbians. Obama can simply make a statement about his support for the gay and lesbian community. Actions don’t matter. After all, Obama needs to get elected and he will stand with anyone who can help him do it.

    —-
    It helps that the traditional press is blindly swallowing Obama’s spiel. What do they care? It’s not the Dmeocratic and progressive agenda at stake for them. But make no mistake about it, it is for us.

  32. Oprah starts off mocking the pundits who have made fun of her. Says it’s the first time she felt compelled to speak out politically. She says Obama “knows who we are” and that she has personal convictions in regards to him. She says she’s not there for partisan reason. She says Obama will bring “statesmanship to the white house”. He will focus on what we can all do together. Lots of flowery talk that echos Obama.

    We “need a new way of doing business in Washington DC”. Says Obama has “Ear of eloquance and a tongue dipped in the unvarnished truth” (or words to that effect).

    Slamming Hillary though not by name–talking about not taking responsibility for past judgement and actions. “Experience in Washington not as important as experience in the hallways of life” Says experience outside of DC more important. Goes over Obamas political history. Sounds like stuff right off of his website.

    She’s now saying he stood against the war in Iraq.

  33. oh, wow, he’s got oprah trying to help him make up the experience gap? she’s talking about his experience in illinois state senate and bipartisanship and tax cuts and in the senate, helping veterans and breaking our addiction to oil and standing with clarity against the war in iraq. um.. i don’t watch oprah but since when is she knowledgeable about these things? it’s odd

  34. “We need a president who cares about our relationship with our friends as well as our enemies” “We should treasure diversity”. “We need a President that can bring us all together” (talking about red states/blue states, political and religious divides).

    Says Obama “Loves mercy and does justice” (bible quote). Those who say he should wait his turn–“We must respond to the forces of history when the moment strikes. I believe that moment is now”.

  35. Is Oprah mentioning McClurkin?


    In the 2004 election cycle there was a fun satiric group called “Billionaires for Bush”. Maybe Oprah will start “Billionaires for Barack”.

  36. of course it’s off his website – she’s got a written text.
    “these are dangerous times.. we need a leader who can show us how to hope again in america as a force for peace”

    i guess what is weird is i ask myself since when did oprah care about these specific issues or express any interest in them (i honestly don’t know) but now she says we need obama to solve them. i have no idea how any of this will play out but i think it’s strange is all.

  37. Obama praising Oprah over and over and over.

    I thought Oprah’s speech sounded like it was something written by his campaign. The “Ear for Eloquence” quote sounded like it was hers…the rest was nothing new (at least to me).

  38. I only could watch a small part of the beginning before I lost interest (not that I actually had that much to begin with). I did notice though that the crowd was not that enthusiastic during her speech…mild hand claps mostly. Plus, there were only a couple of those ‘CHANGE’ signs floating around. Oh, and this was the first time I heard MO speak…her voice is a little weird.

  39. this is really really strange. he sounded like a bad standup act before he got to the podium and launched into his usual stump speech. just my immediate impression. he has a strange way of repeating the negative things people have said about him.

  40. Oh, and did anyone notice the applause that came when she said “the great state of Illinois” by any chance?

  41. another reader: I agree it was odd to hear Oprah giving a political speech. As has been pointed out, she has had many opportunities to use her celebrity for political causes but never had done so until now.

  42. i didn’t expect her to get that political. i wondered how they would use her speech to make this an effective case and not have her overshadow obama but i don’t think this was the way. yes? he is saying the same he’s always said, but “oprah gets political” – that is new news.

    i think it would have been better for oprah to actually go out there and stick to the ways she usually connects with her audience and use them to connect to obama. don’t bring up experience and terrorism and dangerous times, what does she know about that.

    oh hell no, he did not just joke about oprah as vp. hahaha.

  43. Obama saying he is a “proud Democrat”. Saying this over and over. Also says Republicans support him.

    Hitting Hillary saying Democrats lead best by “conviction on calculation”, “principles not polls”.

    Shouting now (too much).

  44. Ben Smith at Politico has more on Obama attacking Krugman and the reaction this has engendered.

    http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1207/Krugman_fires_back_Something_is_very_wrong_here.html

    “Paul Krugman is a bit of a hero to elements of the intellectual left, seen as somebody who sounded a loud, correctly partisan alarm against George W. Bush when much of the liberal establishment saw him on his own terms as a compassionate conservative or a wartime leader.”

    “Underlying this is a real rift, a disagreement between Obama and elements of the left over the meaning and importance of partisanship, and the question of whether the divisions in America are matters of leadership, as Obama suggests, or of substance. The root of it is an argument over whether Obama, in his criticism of mandates, is buying into conservative critiques of government-backed universal health-care.”

  45. Obama saying when he is the nominee of the Democratic party they won’t be able to say he supported the saber rattling and war. He will bring troops home in 16 months.

    I haven’t heard alot of Obama’s speeches but he has said the word Democrat, Democratic party and Democratic nominee several times. Does he usually do that or is it in response to the criticism he has been getting that he won’t stand up for Democratic ideals?

    He is saying “the moment is now”. Doesn’t want to “pit blue American against red America”. Wants to be president of the whole US.

    Mentioning the kindergarten flap–says he didn’t have a long standing plan to be president (Hillary hit).

  46. Probably. There’s a donation to a WI Republican in ’88, Susan Engeleiter.

    Here’s an interesting bit about that campaign:

    Engeleiter’s victory allowed her to face Democrat Herb Kohl, former chairman of the state Democratic Party, in the November general election.

    Engeleiter drew attention for a campaign rally during which, while referring to Kohl, she waved a fruitcake, considered by many to have been an antagonistic and opportunistic reference to questions regarding Kohl’s, a lifelong bachelor’s, sexuality.

  47. Oprah is a closet republican. Anyways, here she is parroting another republican mole Obama. Cannot stand the two!!

  48. The Obamabots have gone Messianic on us. So-called progressives are now claiming on Krugman’s blog that electing Obama is more important than universal healthcare and the entire progressive agenda.

  49. CNN covered the event–I don’t know if they showed any of it live. Don’t know about the other networks. Of course, they describe it as THE event of the campaign.

  50. Any analysis of how Oprah event went? You guys? Besides all the hype -was there anything substantial that happened in the event that was a turning point? That is what I am interested in – look for all the Oprah events and see if there is a moment that appears to be a turning point!!

  51. secret

    i know you were concerned about this OO thing. as you can see, there is nothing to worry about. oprah reading scripted-canned-crap with an occasional shot across hillary’s bow. gee, i bet HRC is really-scared-now!!! what a joke. did you notice people leaving after opie’s speech? and yes, the great round of applause in reference to the “great state of illinois”…must have been half the crowd.

  52. I think it is a wonderful idea Hillary’s mom and daughter are campaigning in Iowa for her. I’m sure Iowans will see the significance of the generational togetherness with these strong ladies as well.

    Rather than a BIG SPASH Party candidate like Obama campaigning with the Bush voting Oprah!

    Obama and Oprah get along so well because they are both closet Republicans.

    Mrs. S.

  53. I wonder if Oprah will use that line in SC. I can garauntee most of that audience wiill not have voted Repub as often as they have Dem. Secret, you really shouldn’t be so worried. I think this was a mistake for Obama.

  54. I know that this is a really long URL and I’ve cut it up in pieces (remove [space] plus spaces), but here is a passage I found in a Google book (paragraph 40) that carries the “ear for eloquence” phrase. It is definitely borrowed.

    books.google.com/books?id=fYYY4leJu94C&pg= [space]
    PA135&lpg=PA135&dq=%22ear+for+eloquence% [space]
    22&source=web&ots=Nghaofebvx&sig=
    [space] qw2aFLgqJUQKyDsud5aaybI7w-s

  55. Oprah said at one point -“I’m not telling you what to think. I’m telling you TO think.” but then went on to say “We NEED……” over and over to make the case for Obama.

    I’m not sure Oprah telling us what “we need” will go over well either…

  56. for some real campaigning, check out the pics on hillaryclinton.com flickr.com. great shots of HRC, her mom and chelsea. also love the pics of iowa landscape with the hillary signs embedded in the snow..

  57. Lynn Sweet commented that Oprah seemed to not only be reading from notes but also using some of MO’s material.

    blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2007/12/sweet_oprahobama_iowa_5_oprah.html

  58. Alcina,
    Again, thanks for the reassurance. It is very annoying when I cannot see the event for myself and only thing I watch is media hype!!

  59. es, telling people to “think”. Are these folks alright? Do they really think those of us who support another candidate just are not thinking?

  60. Hillary should come back with her own quote since Oprah’s “tongue dipped in the unvarnished truth” is getting around the ‘net.

    How about “Dip your tongue in wisdom, then give counsel” Old Bulgarian proverb

    thinkexist.com/quotes/with/keyword/dip/

    “Ear for Eloquence” seems to be a phrased used before in literature–not a complete original

  61. Because it makes him less serious, IMO. The whole thing feels strange. Oprah is considered nonpartisan and this was an overtly partisan speech. Also, if he doesn’t get a big bounce out of this, the storyline will be, you know, why didn’t Oprah help? I just think this was a risky move and I don’t think it will pay off. If nothing else, I’m unconcerned.

  62. mj,
    You watched the event have you? I mean, if you have watched it and feel unconcerned then, I have nothing to worry!!

    Again, what does ““Ear for Eloquence” means??

  63. in general, the crowd was unenthusiastic. appeared bored. i think they were really disappointed when they realized this wasn’t the “oprah winfrey show”.

  64. One should question Oprah’s judgment in character. I remember watching Bill Moyers Journal a few months ago in an expose called “Rush to War.” Oprah Winfrey was one of the people in the media who contributed to that rush by devoting one of her shows to showcase the need to go to war. She even featured Judith Miller.

    There’s a youtube clip of that show. Just type in “Can You Trust Oprah”

    Then there’s the James Frey incident; and her selection of teachers at the South African school; and the latest was the plastic surgeon involved in the death of Kanye West’s mother’s death. The man wasn’t even board certified.

    I like Oprah as an entertainer. But her judgment in character is deeply flawed.

  65. No, I didn’t watch the speech. I actually can’t stomach Obama. However, I followed along with AmericanGal’s live blogging. If it is any comfort, on WaPo and NYTimes Chelsea’s surprise visit to Iowa had the bigger headline.

  66. filbertsf,
    You are spot on. There was a woman in Oprah’s audience then, who was skeptical about going to war and Oprah shamed her and shut her up and she was enthusiastic about waging war. Here, she is with her double talk!!
    If media has any guts whatsoever, they should take oprah head on. It was Oprah who chose to be so political and partisan, so media should normally follow up and see what the facts are. What Oprah then believed in and now what she is claiming to be for.

  67. Secret, I think it means that a person has the touch for phrasing words in an eloquent manner–in Obama’s case using flowery words that seem appealing

  68. i guess i don’t mind whatever oprah wants to say on her show, but why is she getting involved in a democratic primary when she’s not even a democrat, runs a non union show – which is why it’s still on during the writers’ strike – and now obama is OK with throwing labor under the bus to get a big arena for oprah in new hampshire.

  69. “Ear for eloquence” means Oprah likes flowery words. Think James Frey and A Million Little Lies, er, Pieces.

  70. Basically “ear for eloquence” means can mean that Obama:

    A.) Has a way with words.
    B.) Knows how to say what people want to hear.

    Plus, what admin said!

  71. NBC described the Oprah/Obama duo as an “odd mixture” and that Oprah was standing next to her latest “favorite thing”.

    The reporter was actually talking about if the event will have any impact. They interviewed a middle aged Oprah fan who said she wouldn’t vote for someone just because of Oprah but might pay more attention.

    Not a lot about Hillary and her family (just a mention). Talk about the race tightening.

  72. I’m still hoping for a win-win. Everyone and their uncle will be polling for the ‘Oprah effect.’ One of two things will happen.

    1. Oprah bounce — Obama gets pegged as the Oprah candidate.
    2. Oprah flat — she gets taken down a peg.

  73. Will CNN and C-Span be covering the NH and South Carolina events, too? Seems quite unfair to the other candidates that the media is lavishing so much attention to O/O.

  74. Rah Roh.

    ABC World News just reported that lots of folks got up and LEFT after Oprah introduced Obama and he started talking.

    OUCH !

  75. May be they all thought they will get a car or some giveaway from Oprah and realized she was speaking crap and left after that!!

  76. Oh, I bet all their events will be covered by MSM exhaustively this weekend. In a way, it is good – give them the attention and get it over with! Two zeros!!

  77. jfriday

    i also noticed that. people leaving, obviously disappointed. you could almost hear the collective letdown when they realized what they had been drawn into. they obviously felt a fierce urgency to leave!

  78. Just like with the debates, it’s not the actual debate that will have an effect. It’s the post-Oprah event discussion that more people will hear about it; and when most people start to form opinions – positive or negative.

  79. she (oprah) said. “He’s a man who knows who we are and knows who we can be.”

    i hope this oprah quote backfires with any/all thinking women of today. how dare she.

  80. usually “ear for” anything refers to a writer’s dialog.

    as in: He has an ear for the way people really talk.

    an ear for eloquence would mean that he writes well-spoken characters.

    If it is meant to convey that his speeches are good, he has an ‘ear for eloquence’ is a long-winded way of saying: “he is eloquent” and I think ends up saying he recognizes eloquence when he hears it.

  81. From the LA Times;

    For Kim Kayne and Donia Freese, the draw was all Oprah. The two women work together in downtown Des Moines as actuaries, usually vote for Democratic candidates and were leaning toward Obama. But as they stood inside the HyVee Center waiting to enter the cavernous hall, they said they didn’t plan to take part in next month’s caucuses. But they did want to see Winfrey.

    Freese, a 37-year-old mother of two, said that although Winfrey’s endorsements of books often inspired her to read them, she didn’t believe that Winfrey’s political endorsement carried the same weight. “We just want to see Oprah,” she said. “She wouldn’t make us vote for a candidate.”

    “I’d want to research myself,” agreed Kayne, 40, also a mother of two. “I’m not just going to go on her vote solely.”

    http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-oprah9dec09,1,500517.story?coll=la-headlines-nation&track=crosspromo

  82. i am still thinking about the union thing. throw progressives under the bus for barack! social security. health care. vote ‘present’ on right to choose. now the unions.

    i hate to say this but i feel like he really is the elitist candidate this time. i know i am an elite in this country because i am privileged to have a college education, but i also know what it is like to be in a tough situation and find out this country has no social safety net for you. hillary might have not succeeded at passing universal health care in 1993, but it sure wasn’t because she was willing to compromise away the key points to the republicans before she even got started.

  83. Drudge is at it again. He has a screaming read headlline about a quote by Andrew Young regarding Bill Clinton that has actually been around the net for a few days I think. Is this the Obama campaign at work with another smear?

  84. I listened to a minute or so of Obama’s speech. He was promising that the minimum wage would not be raised every 10 (or 20, I don’t remember) years, but he would raise it every year.

    Considering the difficulty Dems have in ever raising it — considering that some years there is high unemployment and sometimes a depression and sometimes deflation and always business opposition, I wondered if this was a great idea. But one minute is almost the max I can listen to him because I start yelling, How? How?? How will you do this?? How will you make this a bipartisan idea?

    He keeps implying that he has ideas that others haven’t thought of and that they will see the wisdom of his ideas and support them.

    The crowd seemed to be paying attention and Oprah was sitting next to him on stage.

  85. BTW, CNN did broadcast at least part of Obama’s speech live today. I couldn’t bear to watch for than a few seconds, so I don’t know if they aired the whole thing.

  86. freckles,
    That was the most descriptive meaning I have heard about ear for eloquence. I thought ‘he speaks with eloquence’ is better – I was confused by the he has a ear for part. Now, I understand what that means!!

  87. There is no chance in hell that Obama will be able to pass minimum wage increases every year.

    The Democrats, despite being in the majority, had a hell of a time passing one this year, and it was tacked onto a war funding bill.

    What is he thinking making those promises?

  88. filbersf:

    There is no chance in hell Obama will be president. So he does not have to worry about fulfilling that promise.

  89. The funny thing is that last year when dems were fighting for minimum wage increase Hillary was in the front lines fighting for it. I did not hear a word from Obama about it.

  90. it’s the little things..

    while driving to work friday AM noticed two huge 4X8 hillary signs posted on RT93 south heading toward the hooksett tolls. what a beautiful sight.

  91. Obama’s decision to launch an unprincipled attack on Paul Krugman for pointing out the shortcomings in his health care proposal and to attack Hillary’s proposal with Ripublican talking points does not mean that he has abandoned the politics of hope. . . .

    It simply means that he has supplemented it with the politics of another Chicago celebrity who observed “you get more with a kind word and a gun, than just a kind word”–Al Capone.

  92. Check out these posts from a really wacky Obama supporter on mydd:

    “Today Bill Clinton made a campaign stop on behalf of his wife at an ALL BLACK sorority fishing for votes. If any other candidates spouse visited an ALL WHITE sorority fishing for votes, there would be a major problem with that. For Hillary supporters to attack Obama because he did not bring his mother on the campaign trail is disgusting. Obama’s mother DIED of cancer when she was 53 years old. Obama’s sister campaigns for him and so does his wife. His daughters are too young to campaign. Why did Hillary decide this weekend to drag her 83 year old mother and 27 year old daughter on the campaign trail? For politcal purposes only, she knew Obama was planning an appearance with Oprah so she wanted to try and steal some of the headlines. She only does things for political purposes.”

    and…

    “Bill Clinton visited an ALL BLACK organization in South Carolina. Hillary is stooping to new lows in order to get votes, including the black racist vote. Obamas campaigned WITH his wife………Hillary and her husband are seperated. What family are you talking about?”

  93. filbertsf – they’re off-the-wall-nuts. they make no sense whatsoever. is this what mydd and dkos are about? no wonder i stay away from that junk.

  94. Hey all. I am back from the HRC event in Williamsburg. It went very well. Dorothy Rodham and Chelsea Clinton were also there. It was awesome. We had to add extra chairs when more than expected people began to arrive. Hillary answered questions from the audience for as long as her speech was, if not longer, and the weather turned bad, only after the event. There is an ice storm blowing through. It was at an elementary school and we had so much fun. Now for Bill on monday.

  95. celiff:

    How many people turned up? Again, what was crowd demographics? Old/middle aged/young.. male/female…

    Were they already converted (Hillary stickers, pins etc..) or were many of them undecided?

  96. c-liff

    a balmy 24 degrees with about a foot of snow on the ground, which is much better than you folks have been dealing with.

    i am jealous, but happy you got to see HRC and family. it’s always great when she rolls into town.

  97. celiff, Did you get to meet Chelsea? I heard she mingled with the crowd in Winterset.

    BTW, that Obama supporter is insane. When did Hillary supporters ever criticize Obama for not campaigning with his mother? Talk about making shit up.

  98. Oh, there were so many undecided people there. There were people who were just driving by and asked if Hillary was coming and decided to show up. I did get to see Chelsea and Dorothy, but could not meet them because I was seating folks. There were many older women, and middle aged women, with young daughters. There were also some machinists there. They mingled afterwards, but I was trying to get folks to sign supporter cards (aka pledge cards). I am jealous alcina about the weather. It is 14 degrees here with an ice storm. We were driving back to Iowa City from Williamsburg on I-80 and our windshield was freezing over right after we pulled over and scraped it. We had to pull over and scrape it 3 times.

  99. c-liff

    i also find many elderly women and young girls at hillary events. HRC tends to gravitate towards them. i just love watching the interaction. there is so much pride and, dare i say, hope in their eyes.

  100. It’s incredible the spin that is still going on with Obama. There is an article out there that documents one Iowa co-chair leaving Hillary for Obama and that is somehow being morphed into proof of mass defections from her campaign. This is an individual that the Clinton campaign says stopped contacting them back in October. It’s not even a newsworthy event.

  101. The older women love when Hillary talks about running to be the first woman president, and then says she is not running because of that. She is the most experienced and qualified person to hit the ground running. I ove watching her say this and then hearing the massive applause it gets afterwards.

  102. celiff:

    I have to give it you guys for working in such bad weather. I believe if it snows so badly on Jan 3rd, the turnout is going to be low because the caucus is at night. Elderly voters might need some help to get out of their homes and go and caucus for Hillary.

    Are you usually successful in getting like 1 in 5 to sign the pledge?

  103. I’ve been reading on various websites tonight and based on the numerous comments I saw I think that the issue of Obama not being a true progressive is one that may take hold and stick. Either that or a large number of previously silent Obama doubters have suddenly been motivated to post their views online.

  104. hwc:

    I haven’t seen such dishonest reporting and ganging up by the media in the last month and a half on a single candidate in my life. I don’t have any trust in objectivity of either NYTimes, washingtonpost, Newsweek, Time or cable outlets like MSNBC/NBC. They keep churning out one hit piece after another every day all the while worshipping at the altar of Obama.

  105. ra1029:

    It’s exactly what Mark Penn has been talking about. The elites are consumed by personality in politics. Rank and file Americans are driven by issues that impact their lives. The disconnection between the two is so strong that the media can no longer even comprehend, let alone cover, politics. And, the average American can no longer comprehend what passes for political coverage.

    That’s why we can have two thousand debates (both Democratic and Republican) with no questions about health care, but plenty of time for questions about the Yankees. What baseball teams the candidates root for (and whether they have nefarious motives for picking their team) is more important to Timmie Russert and the Georgetown Social Club than questions about the top two or three issues to American voters.

  106. BTW, the NYTIMES profile isn’t really a hit piece. It’s just the same tired psychobabble the Times has published over and over and over.

  107. my latest mydd post – send this around – no one is talking about this –
    ————————————————–

    Is Oprah Anti Union? Will Obama Say a Word? Add to Hotlist

    by Seymour Glass, Sat Dec 08, 2007 at 03:01:59 PM EST

    Obama and Oprah are appearing this weekend in Mancheser, NH at a non-union venue that is normally picketed by local unions.

    Though they seem to have fanangled a waver from the NH AFL-CIO late friday , and Obama and Oprah will not be crossing a formal picket line, the Verizon Cener is always picketed at all other events by the stagehand workers union for being a 100% non union house.

    Oh the perks of being audacious and appearing with a beloved billionaire!

    The NH AFL CIO gave the waver because Obama promises to speak about the plight of the Stagehand union. Im sure he will talk heroicly about how unfair it is that they are being locked out by the Verizon Center in NH – but will he even mention that the same union is being treated exactly the same way by Oprah’s Harpo studios back in Chicago?

    The truth is, back in Chicago, Oprah herself also runs a 100% non-union shop. Both her show and her magazine are 100% union free.

    As to the writers strike, that has shut down all the networks, Leno, Letterman, the Daily Show, Colbert…

    it hasn’t shutdown Oprah. The reason her show is not shutting down is because she employs only non-union writers.

    From the anti-union website – The HR Capitalist: http://www.hrcapitalist.com/2007/11/opra h—working.html

    Oprah – Union-Free, Working You OT, and Proud of It…..

    By now, you’ve probably heard about the 2007 Writer’s Guild of America Strike against the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers. The AMPTP represents the interests of the producers and the film industry.

    The strike began on Nov. 5. AMPTP and WGA then halted negotiations after WGA began its strike.

    Me? I’m interested in the issues, but more interested in the winners and losers during the strike.

    Losers – Probably the writers long term, since the network will jam thousands of hours of reality TV down our throats as an alternative and never come to the table.

    Winners – As usual, Oprah Winfrey. I kid you not. “The Oprah Winfrey Show” doesn’t employ union writers and will continue uninterrupted. I gave Oprah a hard time a few months ago for being a taskmaster and working her PA an average of 87 hours per week one quarter.

    Regardless of the work-life balance at the show, it’s good to know Oprah runs a union-free shop.

    From Digby:
    http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/

    In the case of Oprah, she belongs to three different craft unions herself (as a performer), yet refuses to allow union representation of any sort inside the doors of her studio, instead paying substandard wages and benefits to non-union crews.

    It is a travesty that Oprah feels no responsibility to those who helped her create her billions in profit, but that’s the way things are and it’s part of the reason union representation is so vital in this industry.

    Some Democratic politicians have been playing both sides of this issue for a long time now.
    Democrats have to start drawing some bright lines on this issue.

    Unions are fundamental.

    What say you Obama?

    Will you ask Oprah to unionize her Harpo empire. Will you walk the walk with trade unionists or do you just talk the talk?

    Part of his deal with the NH AFL CIO to get the waver to speak at today’s usually picketed hall was that Obama talk about the local being locked out of working at the Verizon Center. So we know that today, Obama will be talking the talk.

    Today sounds like a fine time for a teaching moment. But Will Obama – Walk the Walk?

    Will he ask Oprah why she also locks out the Stagehands Local and all other Unions from her studios back in Chicago. Will he speak truth to power or will he just talk, talk, talk – say the right words about how the NH Stagehands Union is unfairly being kept from decent wages and a better life by the Verizon Center and just ignore that his BILLIONAIRE pal Oprah- sitting right next to him – does EXACTLY THE SAME THING to workers in Chicago!?

    Let me guess.

    ———

    For a Billionaire, I’m sure Oprah’s a very NICE PERSON.

    But just how much money does she NEED!?

    Theres the old simple, but conclusive, union question –

    “Which Side Are You On?”

    Well, she wants into our debate – she should have to answer that question.

    ———

    Update: In Iowa, Oprah announces at rally in Des Moines, that “I am not here for partisan beliefs. Over the years I have voted for as many Republicans as I have Democrats.”

    Nah… looking at how nicely Oprah treated Bush in 2000 in and how she treats her employees now – who’d a thunk that?

    Who’d of guessed that Oprah wasn’t a Democrat?

    I bet the local stagehand union and the writers union and the other broadcast unions in Chicago had a clue!

    Send this diary to friends. Post it on other boards. {can someone please post this at kos?}It’s important that this info gets out. The media wont touch it. They love and fear Oprah. They don’t give a damn about Unions and working Americans. Theyd rather gawk at and applaud the Billionaire.

    I will update this as info becomes available.
    Note: would this new info on Oprah’s voting past indicate that she actually was one of those infamous “Billionaire for Bush”? Who knew?

  108. hwc:

    I just read it and you are right. It is a psychobabble where they interview every ,dick and harry to come up with a story that fits their pre-existing narrative. Bill likes being with people while Hillary does not and on and on….It is always about personality for them..

    Nothing in this about the issues that matter to voters. It is called tabloid journalism.

  109. Is Oprah Anti Union? Will Obama Say a Word? Add to Hotlist

    by Seymour Glass, Sat Dec 08, 2007 at 03:01:59 PM EST

    Obama and Oprah are appearing this weekend in Mancheser, NH at a non-union venue that is normally picketed by local unions.

    Though they seem to have fanangled a waver from the NH AFL-CIO late friday , and Obama and Oprah will not be crossing a formal picket line, the Verizon Cener is always picketed at all other events by the stagehand workers union for being a 100% non union house.

    Oh the perks of being audacious and appearing with a beloved billionaire!

    The NH AFL CIO gave the waver because Obama promises to speak about the plight of the Stagehand union. Im sure he will talk heroicly about how unfair it is that they are being locked out by the Verizon Center in NH – but will he even mention that the same union is being treated exactly the same way by Oprah’s Harpo studios back in Chicago?

    The truth is, back in Chicago, Oprah herself also runs a 100% non-union shop. Both her show and her magazine are 100% union free.

    As to the writers strike, that has shut down all the networks, Leno, Letterman, the Daily Show, Colbert…

    it hasn’t shutdown Oprah. The reason her show is not shutting down is because she employs only non-union writers.

    From the anti-union website – The HR Capitalist: http://www.hrcapitalist.com/2007/11/opra h—working.html

    Oprah – Union-Free, Working You OT, and Proud of It…..

    By now, you’ve probably heard about the 2007 Writer’s Guild of America Strike against the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers. The AMPTP represents the interests of the producers and the film industry.

    The strike began on Nov. 5. AMPTP and WGA then halted negotiations after WGA began its strike.

    Me? I’m interested in the issues, but more interested in the winners and losers during the strike.

    Losers – Probably the writers long term, since the network will jam thousands of hours of reality TV down our throats as an alternative and never come to the table.

    Winners – As usual, Oprah Winfrey. I kid you not. “The Oprah Winfrey Show” doesn’t employ union writers and will continue uninterrupted. I gave Oprah a hard time a few months ago for being a taskmaster and working her PA an average of 87 hours per week one quarter.

    Regardless of the work-life balance at the show, it’s good to know Oprah runs a union-free shop.

    From Digby:
    http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/

    In the case of Oprah, she belongs to three different craft unions herself (as a performer), yet refuses to allow union representation of any sort inside the doors of her studio, instead paying substandard wages and benefits to non-union crews.

    It is a travesty that Oprah feels no responsibility to those who helped her create her billions in profit, but that’s the way things are and it’s part of the reason union representation is so vital in this industry.

    Some Democratic politicians have been playing both sides of this issue for a long time now.
    Democrats have to start drawing some bright lines on this issue.

    Unions are fundamental.

    What say you Obama?

    Will you ask Oprah to unionize her Harpo empire. Will you walk the walk with trade unionists or do you just talk the talk?

    Part of his deal with the NH AFL CIO to get the waver to speak at today’s usually picketed hall was that Obama talk about the local being locked out of working at the Verizon Center. So we know that today, Obama will be talking the talk.

    Today sounds like a fine time for a teaching moment. But Will Obama – Walk the Walk?

    Will he ask Oprah why she also locks out the Stagehands Local and all other Unions from her studios back in Chicago. Will he speak truth to power or will he just talk, talk, talk – say the right words about how the NH Stagehands Union is unfairly being kept from decent wages and a better life by the Verizon Center and just ignore that his BILLIONAIRE pal Oprah- sitting right next to him – does EXACTLY THE SAME THING to workers in Chicago!?

    Let me guess.

    ———

    For a Billionaire, I’m sure Oprah’s a very NICE PERSON.

    But just how much money does she NEED!?

    Theres the old simple, but conclusive, union question –

    “Which Side Are You On?”

    Well, she wants into our debate – she should have to answer that question.

    ———

    Update: In Iowa, Oprah announces at rally in Des Moines, that “I am not here for partisan beliefs. Over the years I have voted for as many Republicans as I have Democrats.”

    Nah… looking at how nicely Oprah treated Bush in 2000 in and how she treats her employees now – who’d a thunk that?

    Who’d of guessed that Oprah wasn’t a Democrat?

    I bet the local stagehand union and the writers union and the other broadcast unions in Chicago had a clue!

    Send this diary to friends. Post it on other boards. {can someone please post this at kos?}It’s important that this info gets out. The media wont touch it. They love and fear Oprah. They don’t give a damn about Unions and working Americans. Theyd rather gawk at and applaud the Billionaire.

    I will update this as info becomes available.
    Note: would this new info on Oprah’s voting past indicate that she actually was one of those infamous “Billionaire for Bush”? Who knew?

  110. mark penn is right. i read his microtrends book recently.. what impressed me about it was that he had a lot of respect for the voters and insisted that regular people are in fact voting on issues and are a lot smarter than elite media gives them credit for. in fact he showed stats on income gap showing that lower income people more likely to vote on bread and butter issues while the higher income much more likely to vote on character.

  111. Edwards is at it again blaming the Clintons for NAFTA. I want Kucinich to go Edwards full bore in the next debate over his China vote in 1998. This guy fits a dictionary definition of a hypocrite. If Hillary wins I hope she sends Edwards to Guantanomo and will postpone all anti-torture laws for a month.

  112. I can’t figure out Edwards strategy right now to save my life. Obama is his real threat, not Clinton.

    Obama and Edwards are playing the semi-final match in Iowa to see who goes on to the 2-person race against Clinton. Unless he is gambling that Clinton will be knocked out of the race in Iowa.

  113. edwards is in teens. he will be in single digits soon. when i posted that edwards would be in teens in iowa if he continues “hillary is the cause of all evil” line of campaigning a few weeks ago on dkos, i was banned. i see some of our bloggers disappointed about dkos. for them, here is a clue. VERY FEW of dkos members are real democrats. others are all naderites who did not know where to go after nader ditched them, and because repubs wont accept them, they joined democrats by default. they want democratic party to be totally anti-business. if you want to get a clue, go there and bash nader, you will be banned in NO TIME :).

  114. Clinton’s last stop in Washington, IA got a good turnout under bad weather according to AP…

    Clinton closed her campaign swing with a town hall-style meeting in Washington, Iowa, before about 450 people jammed into the local fire station. Under questioning, she vowed to toughen laws governing labeling of food.

    “I’m in favor of mandatory labeling on food — genetically modified and country of origin,” said Clinton. Clinton was heading back to Washington, D.C., late Saturday after battling an ice storm in her latest trip.

  115. Politico reported that one of the women who attended Oprah’s event today was deciding between Obama and Rudy.. What an odd choice to pick between? On second thought may be not..

  116. Civil Rights Icon Andrew Young wants Obama to be President . . . . in 20016.

    He feels that Obama has not attained “the level of maturity” which the job of President requires.

    He says Hillary has a “protective network to back her up including her husband”, whereas Obama does not.

    He says Hillary and Bill have more black people they rely on than Obama does.

    He says “to put a brother in there by himself is to set him up for a crucification”.

    Young is a former UN Ambassador, Mayor of Atlanta, and Lieutenant to Martin Luther King.

    As such, this article may be of interest to primary voters, especially in South Carolina.

    http://apnews.myway.com/article/20071208/D8TDI1B00.html

  117. ra1029,

    Don’t read those tea leaves…

    One Iowan woman only makes my blood boil after reading NYT’s blog. She said Oprah is going to be John the Baptist, who will lead Obama to victory…

    She still claims to be undecided between Obama and Clinton…

    Women are their own worst enemy, especially in Iowa…

  118. hey, guys. Quit yer bitching about her being in IA or NH or CA. She’s never in OK. We’d love to have her and we’d make sure to have plenty of carrot sticks for Bill. 🙂

  119. Yeah, right. I’m sure she’s “undecided”. What an ass. You know, most of the time, these people end up being Obama supporters.

  120. I agree MJ. I read that stuff earlier today. Blech.

    It was even on the local news a few minutes ago. I yelled a bad word about Ofrah (what my hubby calls her).

    Well, off to Wal-Mart to stock up on supplies prior to our own version of the ice storms of IA, et al..

  121. Looks like this whole week Washington Post is going to do a profile of a few leading candidates on both sides. Sunday is all Clinton. There are a couple of articles about her on the front page. Here is their schedule.

    12/10 :Romney
    12/11 Edwards
    12/12 Thompson
    12/13 McCain
    12/14 Obama
    12/15 Huckabee
    12/16 Rudy

  122. Recent comments by civil rights icon Andrew Young may be helpful to Hillary in South Carolina.

    He said Obama is too young, has not achieved the level of maturity needed, and lacks the support network required. Thus, he wants Obama to be president in 2016.

    He then added that Hillary has that network including her husband and than she and Bill rely on more black people.

  123. Edwards is welcome to make an issue of it…as far as I’m concerned. Lord knows, he usually expresses no shortage of self-righteous ambulance-chasing shyster indignation about everything else!

  124. Obama boot licker Frank “I need to sell my books on Oprah” Rich’s opinion piece tomorrow reads

    Republicans found their Obama.

    Gee! What a sycophant!!

  125. Suppose you are watching a football game between two teams you have never heard of before. If you sit there for more than three minutes, you will find yourself rooting for one team or the other. It is simply impossible to maintain that perfect state of equipoise where you just can’t decide. Yet when it comes to this election that is precisely what some people tell us, and today we were debating the why of it.

    In doing so, we came to the unscientific conclusion that a prospective voter may be undecided at this point for one or more of the following reasons: i) procrastination, ii) fear of disagreement, iii) unsure who will win, iv) no confidence in their own judgment.

    The last group is most susceptible to the entreaties of a celebrity like Oprah. The antecdote is to use our own celebrity Bill Clinton. And when they complain about cognitive dissonance, ask them which celebritity knows more about the job of president.

  126. go to her site…message boards..lol..i went there earlier i was wondering if some would post there,about this event crap

  127. complaining about this event ,and that she should have had every canidiate on her show,before she endorsed.and she is not gonna tell them who to vote for.

  128. Wal-Mart ended up being a nightmare, but because of the longlines I was able to look at “O” magazine (Oprah’s own sychophantic New Age mumbo jumbo print rag). I wanted to know if Bwak was in it. Didn’t see anything in the expected places. At least I didn’t have to buy the damn thing.

    I did talk to the AA gentleman in line behind me. I mentioned I couldn’t stand Ofrah. He agreed she was full of herself. He also agreed Briney Spears will prolly die like Elvis. Fat, bloated, chock full of pills on her toilet.

    Ah, the holidays. Can’t you feel the warmth? 😉

  129. lol…your right..okieatty,i cant stand her either,full of herself…yep one day is diet show the next day is chocolate show..real infromative …and britnewy spears..lol

  130. Now to change the subject to something slightly more jolly… Hot Damn! Tebow won the Heisman.

    Tim-mah!!!

    I think it would be lovely if Tim Tebow endorsed Hillary and after the GE started dating Chelsea. They’d have the most superest kids in the world.

    You know, now that I think of it- Hillary and Tebow have a lot in common: they both can take a lot of hits and still stay in the game, they’re both the best leaders on their respective fields, they both have a love of family, a devotion to their faith, passion, discipline and humility. Hoo-yay!

  131. You know, Ofrah (I should really spell it Oafrah since she’s sorta an oaf), suffers from that dread disease of many completely overpaid, successful celebrities, etc.- she has nothing else to achieve so she compensates for her lack of external strife by focusing on her soulless being.

    Bono, Clooney (and I love me some Clooney), etc. start on the whole yoga, feel good shallow attempts at fulfilling their emotional needs. Check out Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs. They meet the first four steps- physiological, safety, love/belonging and esteem and move on to self actualization. I’ve seen some articles about celebrities and this whole fake-do gooder complex. Thing is- they might be sincere but they come across as pushy and know-it-all-ish. A real turn off for the rank and file of us out in the world.

    Obama has overshot this. I can’t wait for him to be lampooned on South Park.

  132. CJ,

    Just got done looking at Oprah’s Message Boards and there are a lot of nasty comments about her and BO. It is kind of shocking. Oh, and apparently some people who are leaving really nasty messages are having their messages removed.

  133. And with regards to above- if you think about the demographic of Bwak supporters- college educated, well paid, etc…. they have that flaw as well. Through in a bunch of bourgeoisie guilt and “voila!” You have a recipe for disaster in candidacy. It’s been called the limousine liberal, etc. (think Hart, Bradley, Tsongas, Kerrey….) but it fits. They just always fail to see there are more folks out there who haven’t met the first 4 needs and need a leader who can help them in that regard.

  134. i hear ya what your saying,but her complex,with esteem is backwards,its actually is fakedo,and now she can push all that,might be sincere but if its for show its all about money..turns me of instantly,and lotts more out there to.

  135. My favorite post:

    “‘Obama is a fake, he is only posing, always in such control choosing his words with care to say just the right thing..and now Oprah is buying into this…!’

    I have the same impression, though I wouldn’t be able to prove this. Maybe it’s nonsense, but I always get the feeling he is ‘phoney’, and that I don’t get to see the ‘real’ Obama. But I get the same feeling with Oprah too; often I think the ‘real’ Oprah is not the persona she with care has created. I thought here to be much more authentic before the ‘transformation’. It was of course healthy to loose all these pounds, but she gained a bit of egoweight in the same process, I’m afraid.”

    Tee hee. That’s funny and well said.

  136. thats what i thought also kostner and terrondt..

    i think some of them are from that rally,in desmoines,

    but this lady here says it all for me

    I wouldn’t say she is a traitor that is a strong word, but I do feel that she is going against all woman now after she got what she wanted from all of us. She talks about empowering woman, the school in Africa , the talk about abuse and how woman need stronger voices and we need to be heard and yet she has a chance to help us elect the FIRST WOMAN PRESIDENT of THE USA and she doesn’t do this. I don’t understand it. I have lost respect for her and her meaningless words, for that is all they were, just empty words..

  137. if ya starts losing people who had great admiration towards you,then you might see alott of empty seats on her show.

  138. i think part of the problem is, after the james frey thing (and maybe “the secret” though i don’t really know) even oprah’s biggest fans know for sure she can have bad judgment sometimes.

  139. Naw, CJ. Free sheets, frozen hot chocolate and Krispy Kremes will keep those seats full of slightly unfulfilled, overweight, middle-aged housewives getting their drunk on with their church groups in Chicago.

    I actually lost a lot of respect for Oafrah when she went after James Frey. It was bad enough she got duped but to pressure him to come back on, open him up to litigation and emasculate him like she did was overboard and designed to save her ego. I had already suspected she was another Bono, but that proved it. Made me sad actually.

  140. yeah i thought that was awful. i don’t watch oprah and don’t like frey’s writing but who cares if his book was 100% accurate, he’s not running for public office.

  141. okieatty..keep them seats a little larger lol…

    another reader..yeah thats the thing we need a good solid president.and one who lived in the US all there life.

  142. I just spent some time over at Daily Kos. My gosh, has the rhetoric changed over there. There is a diary critical of Obama, written by Alegre, at the TOP of the rec list. I never thought it would happen. Post after post with people talking about how they could never vote for him.

  143. hey hillfans, i just got home from work from the 2nd shift today. im glad i missed that idiot bawak hussien obama and pro war oprah. i saw that video for first time of her shooting down that poor girl for question the rush for war. that video should be spread out to the msm on how such a anti-war candidate like to pump his just on supporting the war from the start getting support from warmonger, molestation school owner oprah.

  144. yeah the press is going to spin this “wow look at obama and the big celebrity! how many people will vote for obama because a talk show host told them to?” but i think most people really do get offended at celebrities getting this involved in the process. i like stupid celebrity gossip and bad tv as much as anyone but i don’t expect to decide who the president should be based on that. someone at ny times blog said there were oprah for vp buttons for sale in the lobby.. hahaha. that about sums it up. it just diminishes the candidate and the seriousness of this election.

  145. im am not surprized by the negative reaction against malestation school owner oprah is getting on her message boards. i believe the majority of her viewers are pro hillary. she will lose most of them and watch her ratings go down. maybe she can build more tarnished schools in other countries. BE CAREFUL PARENTS!!!

  146. basement angel are you serious. on daily kos obama is god. one bad word about him, you swear he is jesus himself. i’d be lynched.

  147. Terrondt, Big Media will spin but people are not as dumb as generally thought. You are right – The out and out backlash on the Oprah boards demonstrates Oprah will have a harder time to sell Obama than she did selling gelatto.

  148. Wow, /Just got back from Alegre’s diary on DK. Did y’all see where Hillary’s being moved up as a 2nd choice for many Edwards folks or Obama is being moved down because of the Krugman flap? Some of those folks are pissed.

    Talk about a ham-handed attack on Krugman. Don’t go after a favorite Progressive son who works for the paper of record and screw it up by quoting out of context and lying about what the columnist wrote. Jesus H Christ. That’s like hitting Mother Teresa in the mouth at Christmas Mass at St. Peters. Dumbasses.

    Well, my dog is forlorn right now bc my laptop is taking his place on my lap. Night all. I have some cuddling to do.

  149. hillfans, when this is over with on feb 5th, it will be all the more sweeter watching obama and edwards supporters cry in their beer or wine. and don’t need worrying about needing their support in the fall becuase most ogf them were never dems in the first place. nothing but a bunch of nader loving idiots. they will look for 3rd party losers like ron paul, nader, and maybe bloomberg. maybe not him. too big buisness and corperate for their tasts.

  150. yep the krugmangate debacal may have legs. i forward around this kind of obama slip up syuff all the time to dems etc.. i hope u guys do this with this one. this goes to the root of the worry over obama i think-he will toss liberals and throw away everything . obama is not to me a dem-he is an independant who will have lieberman in his cabinet . he holds an event in a stadium picketed? comeon dems get with it. he tosses unions, he tosses krugman, he tosses ss to the right. we need a dem in 08

  151. This is interesting. Jeralyn Merritt at Talk Left writes that BO gave out about 23,000 FREE tickets to the OO Show in Des Moines and reported that about 18,500 attended. If true, that means about 4,500 folks were no shows.

    However, the NYT (as Merritt repeats) says about 10,000 “screaming” fans showed up. It true, that means about 13,000 folks were no shows.

    Now it’ll be interesting to see how many folks show up to fill those 80,000 seats in S.C. that the OO Show just had to have since the smaller 18,000 venue was too tiny.

    It’s supposed to be a sunny 40+/- degrees here today in N.H. However, the OO Show is slated for the evening, not such a great time of day, as the temp will have dropped by 20 or so degrees by then.

    Also, kids have to go to school and folks to work in the morning. It’s the last day of the 3 weekends before Christmas. My best guess is that the majority of attendees won’t be from N.H. and will have a ways to travel to go home. We’ll see just how much folks want to see Oprah … for FREE, of course. If tickets cost even so much as a $5 donation, I doubt there would have been as many in Iowa.

    talkleft.com/story/2007/12/8/18016/6535

  152. I don’t think the tickets were ever intended as for sale.

    4500 no shows is no biggie b/c the weather was bad. In fact, one article I read mentioned that a ticketholder stopped at the Hillary event instead b/c it was closer to her, and the driving conditions were not so good.

    I read that temps in SC will be in 70s today, so expect max crowd there.

    I personally doubt that Oprah has any intention of actively supporting the Dem nominee if not Obama. I think that was made pretty clear today.

  153. I was basing my N.H. estimate on yesterday’s A.M. weather report but now it looks like it won’t get any higher than mid 20s and will be quite cold by evening. That will influence the decision whether to go or not for some but not all.

    However, another factor may well be the impact of the news cycle from yesterday and this afternoon on whether folks show up in droves here in N.H. and may influence the turnout in S.C., as well. If any had the delusion that there were going to be the usual Oprah gifts and goodies, they now should realize that that’s not going to happen and have already heard what both of them will have to say … or not say.

    Fox Snooze wondered whether the S.C. stadium will fill up to the 80,000 mark. Me, too.

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