Hillary Clinton In The Lion’s Den – Tim Russert, Barack Obama, John Edwards, Dodd, Biden, Kucinich, Richardson

Live webstream on MSNBC — HERE.

Hillary Clinton will be center stage. The order on the stage from left to right will be Dodd, Biden, Edwards, Hillary, Obama, Kucinich, Richardson.

MSNBC:

Sen. Hillary Clinton was preparing Tuesday to fight off a gang assault from the rest of the Democratic presidential field, led by her closest rival, who was closely studying the playbook of the master — Clinton’s husband, the former president.

Clinton, D-N.Y., and most of the other major Democratic contenders gathered in Philadelphia for a two-hour debate at 9 p.m. ET, which will be telecast on MSNBC and streamed live on msnbc.com. Brian Williams, managing editor and anchor of “NBC Nightly News,” will moderate.

Also on stage at Drexel University will be Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., former Sen. John Edwards of North Carolina, Sen. Chris Dodd of Connecticut, Sen. Joe Biden of Delaware, New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson and Rep. Dennis Kucinich of Ohio. NBC News and the Democratic National Committee excluded former Sen. Mike Gravel of Alaska on grounds that he did not meet fundraising and polling thresholds.

Advisers to Obama, who trails Clinton by a wide margin in national polls, told NBC News that Obama was reviewing tapes of Bill Clinton’s debate performances in his victorious 1992 campaign for clues to how to ratchet up his attacks on the senator without sacrificing his likability.

Obama’s camp adopted the same strategy being used by other Democratic contenders seeking to chip away at Clinton’s growing lead: It declared her to be incapable of winning the general election.

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Here we go:

Williams: You gave an interview saying Clinton was sounding Republican in foreign policy issues.  What issues has she sounded like a Republican. 

Obama: This has been hyped.  We have big challenges like health care and global challenges.  The way to change is have sharp contrasts with the other party.  We have to be honest.  It does not mean changing positions.  Clinton has been for NAFTA, Iraq, and now is against.  We need honesty.  That is how I am running my campaign. 

Clinton: I am the topic of great consternation because I want to stop the Iraq war and prevent a rush to war with Iran, stop global warming.

Russert: You said Americans do not deserve double talk.  What did you mean?

Edwards: President Bush has destroyed the trust relationship with Americans.  Americans need to know who is honest and has integrity.  Senator Clinton says she is for change but she defends a corrupt system.  Says she is against the war but will keep combat troops.  Says she is against an Iran war but voted to help Bush attack Iran.  And she said she is against any changes to Social Security but privately she says something different.  Americans deserve someone who will be honest. 

Clinton: Americans know my record.  I fought for health care.  I fight the Republicans on Social Security and I take on the special interests.  On specific issues I have specific plans.  On Social Security my position is for fiscal responsibility.  I am not going to balance Social Security on the backs of seniors.  Lets get Halliburton to pay taxes before we tax seniors. 

Russert: You voted for Kyl-Lieberman.  Webb said it can be interpreted as a declaration of war.  Why did you vote for K-L.

Clinton: I was the first person, in February, to say Bush has no authority to wage war against Iran.  But Iran wants nuclear weapons.  I prefer vigorous diplomacy.  We used it for North Korea.  This was an expression of support for diplomacy.  Senator Durbin agrees with me.  We can argue about a non-binding sense of the Senate resolution or stop George Bush from attacking Iran.  We reject Bush attacking Iran. 

Dodd: This issue will come back to haunt us.  This administration used a similar resolution to attack Iraq.  It is a dangerous move.  Dick Lugar and others voted against that resolution.  Bush will wave that resolution as justification to attack Iran.  We have a lot of problems confronting the next president.  That was a wrong resolution.

Biden: We have a problem in the Senate.  75 other Senators voted with Hillary.  After that resolution oil went up to $90 a barrel.  We emboldened Bush.  This has consequences for Pakistan and Afghanistan.  This puts those presidents in jeopardy.  All the resolution has done is hurt us.  Big nations can’t bluff.

Williams: What is your “red line” for attacking Iran?

Obama: We should not attack Iran.  The president has been talking about World War III.  We should be reaching out to our allies and talking to our enemies.  We have not made serious attempts.  This resolution does not send the right signal.  There may come a point but we should not discuss those now.

Clinton: We have to try diplomacy.  The resolution starts diplomacy.  Joe is right.  Bush can do this without a resolution.  That is why we need to pass something immediately.  What we are trying to do is push forward on vigorous diplomacy.  But we need both carrots and sticks.  The Revolutionary Guard needs to see the potential stick.  We all agree that Bush has made a total mess out of Iran. 

Williams: Do you have a threshold?

Clinton: We need diplomacy.  But we should not do nothing.  A full court press on this issue.

Edwards: Clinton says that she wants diplomacy.  But this resolution looks like it was written by neo-cons.  This is like Iraq.  The way to put pressure on this administration is to say no.  This is an important issue.  We are not going to allow this.

———————————

Williams: Would you talk with Iran without preconditions?

Richardson: I am the only one here who has negotiated with Iran.  There are moderate elements in Iran.  We can achieve a compromise on the nuclear issue.  Carrots and sticks.  The problem is we saber rattle.  I do believe we need to talk with these countries.  We have to engage them, potentially with sanctions.  Russia and Iran are now embracing each other. 

Kucinich: We reject war with Iran.  We have enablers in the Democrats who enable Bush.  These policies of preemption are illegal.  Bush has violated international law.  When will the Democratic congress stand up to Bush and impeach him?  We need to challenge him on this war.  Time to stand up for the constitution.

Russert: Will you pledge that Iran will not develop a nuclear bomb?

Clinton: Yes.  I have pledged.

Edwards: Yes.

Obama: All of us have pledged not to have Iran get nuclear weapons.  But we are being governed by fear.  It is important to say we will not be governed by fear.  We cannot operate as if we are the weakest nation on earth.  We need to talk about civil liberties and our world reputation.

Biden: I will pledge to keep us safe.  Pakistan has a lot of enriched uranium. Presidents make informed decisions by the situation in the world.  Pakistan is more dangerous with all its uranium than Iran.

Dodd: There is a lot of danger, which one of us has more experience.  I agree with Joe.  Pakistan is more dangerous.  Results matter.  Experience matters.  I suggest Joe is right.  I negotiated in Latin America to bring about reduced violence.

Richardson:  I will make the pledge and through diplomacy.  Fissionable materials are the danger.  We need an international agreement.  It is going to take leadership.  I went head to head with Saddam Hussein.  I’ve done it.  I have the most international experience here. 

Kucinich: The media has to be careful how they frame these questions.  I urge restraint.  I would go to Iran.  I would urge them to give up nuclear weapons and nuclear power.  It is time the U.S. government enforce the non-proliferation treaty. 

———————–

Williams: One of your supporters has said she has never heard you oppose the war in Iraq. 

Clinton: I oppose the war.  I will bring the troops home because Bush has made it clear that he won’t.  That is why I have been pressing the Pentagon to prepare plans.  They have thus far refused to do so.  Bush relies on a small group of people.  I would bring in a lot of our best people to fix things.  I agree with Joe on Pakistan.  We need to do more than just send out our young men and women. 

Williams: Is Clinton being consistent?

Obama: No.  This is a rationale for what we are doing in Iraq.  I would convene a meeting of Muslim leaders.  The real key for the next president is not to be a co-author of the Iraq war.  I opposed the war from the beginning. 

Edwards: I want to make certain voters know they have very clear choices.  If you want combat troops in Iraq and no timetable then Clinton is your choice.  I don’t.  I will end combat missions in my first year.  There is a clear choice.  We need to learn from the past.  We cannot trust this president.  Are we going to hear “If I only knew now what we knew then”.  Clinton says she is in general election mode.

Clinton: I don’t know where to start to rebut this.  Most of us agree that we will take out combat troops but we will pursue Al Queda.  For that we need combat troops.  I have been explaining that to the American people but I also want to be responsible.  Our troops will guard our embassy, train troops and pursue Al Queda. 

———————————

Williams: Electability.  What experience does she have? Rudy asked.

Clinton: The Ripublicans idea of experience is one we don’t need.  My experience on health care and children’s health care and my experience in the Senate is the right one.  The Ripublicans and their constant obsession with me, we need to turn the page, throw out the whole Ripublican book.  We need to end the war in Iraq, ….

Russert:  Will you allow the National Archives to release your papers?

Clinton: The Archives has 20 million papers and moving as fast as they moved.  The papers on health care are already available. 

Russert: But Bill Clinton wrote a letter stopping that release?

Clinton: The archives will do what they can.

Obama: This is part of the problem.  This administration is very secretive.  Hillary needs to stop the secrecy.  You took my ‘turning the page’ phrase.  The Ripubicans are comfortable attacking you.  That is why we need a change.  We don’t need another 8 years of bickering. 

Edwards: The Republicans may want to run against you.  Our system is broken.  We need to tell the truth about that.  Too much influence from Washington lobbyists.  The candidate that has raised the most money from the defense industry, healthcare industry, Wall Street, that is Clinton. 

Clinton: We were making progress in the 1990s.  The Supreme Court handed the election to George Bush.  I have laid out specific plans.  I will take 10 billion from these industries.  Change is just a word if you don’t have the experience to make it happen.

Williams:  What experience do you have to be president?

Obama: My experience is legislative.  I worked with both sides in the state house.  I worked with Dick Lugar.  That is critical experience.  I am the only person who has passed tough ethics legislation.  We need someone who will stand up when it is not easy.  Principled leadership.

Williams: Is your contention that the top 3 frontrunners are less qualified than you.

Richardson: I am bothered by these personal attacks against Senator Clinton.  It is close to personal.  I have differences with her.  But it is important that we save the ammunition against the Republicans.  The reality is the last senator election was JFK.  Governors get elected.  Who can govern.  I am the only CEO.  I prepared budgets and negotiated with other countries.  But we need to stay positive.  I trust Clinton. 

Williams: Electability, what is your point?

Dodd: Electability is important and a critical question.  50% say they will not vote for her.  We need to take that into consideration.  I don’t like situational ethics.  Edwards condemns taking money from lobbyists but he takes money from other interests.  We need to elect a Democrat. 

—————————————————

Williams: Situational ethics?

Edwards: No one is perfect.  I disagree with Bill.  Do we believe this system works?  The power should reside with the people not with the rich and the powerful.  I am guilty as charged. 

Williams: Why are you smiling?

Kucinich: I smile because someone who takes money from hedge funds attacks another for taking money from hedge funds.  I am for single payer health care.  I will cancel NAFTA.  We need to talk about peoples aspirations.

Williams: Are you infering Clinton is less qualified than you?

Biden: I am not running against Hillary, I am running for president.  Guiliani is not qualified to be president.  Rudy has been silent.  This man is not qualified to be president.  I negotiated with Brezhnev and Bosnia.  I am running to be leader of this country. 

Russert:  Senator Clinton, on the issue of credibility,  you were asked at the AARP about raising taxes on Social Security.  You have denied being against it but you were overheard saying you were for it?

Clinton: I do not want to balance Social Security on the backs of seniors.  I am for fiscal responsibility.  In the 1990s we fought to have the resources to pay for Social Security.  The Ripublicans want to destroy Social Security.  I am not going to repeat Ripublican talking points.  I have laid out what I do believe.  Social Security is not in crisis, that is a Ripublican talking point. 

Russert:  Bill Clinton in 1998 said Social Security was in crisis?

Clinton: But he acted to get the resources for Social Security. 

Russert:  Obama, you said everything is on the table?  Now you are saying not everything is on the table. 

Obama: Let’s talk straight.  Social Security is a sound system but it has a problem.  We have more retirees than workers.  What I have said is that the best option is to lift the cap on the Social Security tax.  We cannot give convoluted answers and say we don’t want to repeat Republican talking points.

Russert: You told the NYTimes Clinton is not telling the truth?

Obama: We have an actuarial gap that is not going to vanish.  We need a serious conversation.

Clinton: I don’t see a difference.  The best way to handle this is like in 1993.  A bi-partisan commission.  I don’t want these decisions to be made in a vacume.  We need fiscal responsibility. 

Williams:  Are you fearful of confusion on the basis of name and religion?

Obama: I don’t care about what Romney says, this week which might be different from what he says next week.  The way to respond to swiftboating is to respond truthfully and rapidly. 

———————–

Williams: $100 barrel oil.  Are Americans doomed to pay high oil prices, what can be done on energy?

Dodd: Invest in alternative energy.  Low income energy assistance.  For longer term stop borrowing a billion dollars a day to buy oil.

Biden: Risk.  People are betting on bad news.  Provide for emergency fuel assistance.

Edwards: My Justice Department will enforce the law.  We can’t continue to promise everything.  We have to sacrifice and conserve.  Alter our behavior.

Clinton: I agree with everything said.  We need to overcome the Ripubican opposition and possibly look at the oil reserve.  We also need to conserve.

Obama: As Joe said 30% of that price is risk.  All these suggestions are sound.  Fuel efficiency standards. 

Kucinich: Everyone knows the war in Iraq was about oil.  Saber ratling is driving up the price of oil. Enforce the constitution.  Impeach Bush and Cheney.

Richardson: We need an Apollo program on energy.  50 miles per gallon.  30% renewable resources in heating.  Reduce consumtion.  65% of our oil is imported. 

Williams: Dodd, water, are you prepared to lead on the environment.

Dodd: I have called for a corporate carbon tax.  Price is most important.  Consumers cannot afford more expensive fuels. 

Williams: Should we pay for people who live in disaster zones?

Edwards: Natural disasters call for a response from the national community.  New Orleans is heartbreaking.  The government failed but not the people. 

Williams: Unlimited federal dollars?

Edwards: Smart but our government has to be there.

Russert: Charles Rangel wants to repeal the alternative minimum tax.  You were in Harlem with Rangel.  Bill agrees with Rangel.

Clinton: I admire Charlie Rangel.  I don’t know all the details of what Charlie is proposing.  I agree with the goals.  My husband is expressing what a lot of wealty people think.  Bush wants to give more tax cuts to the rich.  We are not comfortable with that.  We need to provide money for things like college loans.  Charlie is being courageous on the AMT. 

Russert: So you are in favor of a 4% tax increase.

Clinton: No, I like the goals but there are a lot of moving pieces here.  I will not commit to a specific plan until I see the details?

Russert: Do you agree with the Rangel plan?

Obama: I do not know the details.  Many Americans need help.  The tax code has many corporate tax loopholes.  I have a specific plan to offset taxes for the poor.  Progressive tax steps.  Roll back the Bush tax cuts. 

Russert: Hedge funds.  At the top these managers make many millions.  Reid said ‘we will not change it this year.’

Kucinich: Our party will not stand up.  My candidacy will protect Main Street.  We redistribute the wealth upwards. 

Russert: You worked for a hedge fund.  Why won’t the Democratic Party act on this. 

Edwards: The system is corrupt.  Hedge fund lobbyists stopped reform.  Politically connected people make millions while our young people don’t.  Our system does not work. 

Williams: 30 second round.  Overseas students go 193 days to school.  Do you believe we need to extend the school day/year?

Richardson: yes.  We are 29th in science and math.  Competitiveness gap.  Hire more well paid teachers. 

Kucinich: We need to be for peace.  Cut the Pentagon budget 50% and put it in education. 

Obama: More instruction in the classroom.  Increase research grants.  Our long-term national security. 

Clinton: Start to help our families.  Nurse visitation, child care.  An overall innovation agenda. 

Edwards:  2 systems.  One for the affluent and another for the poor.  A national teaching university.  Incentive pay.  Second chance schools.  College.

Biden: I proposed it in 1987.  Minimum 16 years of education.  Help minorities. 

Dodd: The single most important issue.  Tuition free college.

———————————————–

Williams: Attracting people to medical field, how?

Dodd: Solve medical malpractice issue. 

Biden: Help them pay off education bills.

Edwards: Universal health care that gets doctors out of the insurance business.  We need to help nurses. 

Clinton: I agree with all.  We give the health insurance companies an ultimatum: they need to insure all.  We need to clean up Medicare/Medicade.

Obama: Prevention in a universal health care plan.  Expand national service.

Kucinich: Establish medicare for all.  Insurance companies have to be taken on. 

Richardson: Give students incentive by providing national service for education.  Get rid of student loans.

Williams: Commercial aviation system.  What would you do?

Obama: Deregulation got airlines into trouble.  They are sacrificing service for solvency.

Russert: Clinton, Governor Spitzer on licenses for “illegal aliens”.  You said you agree?

Clinton: There are millions driving without a license.  Spitzer is trying to fill the vacume.  We need immigration reform.

Dodd: This is a privilege.  This is troubling.  A license is a privilege.

Clinton: I did not say I was for it, but I said I understand what Spitzer is trying to do.   Spitzer is now going to have 3 different licenses.

Russert: Do you support Spitzer on giving licenses?

Clinton: This is gotcha.  I understand Spitzer is trying to make an honest effort.  We should have passed immigration reform. 

Williams: Government guidelines on internet content?

Edwards: Yes.  Senator Clinton said 2 different things in 2 minutes.  We need honesty not doubletalk. 

Obama: I am confused with Senator Clinton’s answer.  I do not know if she is for or against it.  Let’s be honest. 

Russert: Are you for or against it?

Obama: For. 

Russert: Kucinich, did you see a UFO?

Kucinich: Yes, it was unidentified.  I am moving my campaign office to Roswell New Mexico.  Jimmy Carter saw a UFO. 

Russert: 14% of Americans say they saw a UFO. 

Obama: There is life here on earth.  I will attend to us first.

Williams: Are you willing to be the president who fights cancer as the biggest killer of Americans?

Clinton: Yes.  Bush has cut the National Institutes of Health.  I will fund the research.  Do everything we can.

Russert: Dodd, you want to decriminalize marijuana?

Edwards: I am against it. The Children.

Dodd: We are sending too many to jail. 

[Note Hillary raised her arm to decriminalize]

Williams: China

Biden: Shut down all the imports

Williams: Halloween costume?

Obama: I will wear a Mitt Romney mask which has 2 sides to it.

IT’S OVER 

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234 thoughts on “Hillary Clinton In The Lion’s Den – Tim Russert, Barack Obama, John Edwards, Dodd, Biden, Kucinich, Richardson

  1. I can’t believe that the first two questions have been against her. Are you kidding me?? I HATE Tim Russert.

  2. Oh guys live streaming is not working for me – this goddamn comp!!
    Cannot believe the first 2 questions have been against her.

  3. Constant attacks on her and she is actually talking about the issues and policy, not BS talking points of attacks.

  4. Stand up to the President?! Is that why you CO sponsered the bankrupcy bill and the Iraq war resolution!!! Give me a break john!

  5. All the other men are like a bunch of wimps on this Iran issue. I think pundits will like Hillary’s aggressive standing.

  6. I can’t believe Obama is going to bring up how he won’t stand for fear and civil liberties. I would stay as far apart from civil liberties as I could if I were Obama tonight, given his fiasco gospel tour over the weekend.

  7. Check out Drudge’s Headline “Scorn: As the Men Gang Up.” Bunch of damn Highwaymen the whole lot of them.

  8. She is clearly made a decision that she is not going to attack back, though she is rebutting errors.

  9. Loved the combat troops answer and the part where the Republicans have not gotten the message that she is acting like a Ripublican.

    Obama was given his attack line opportunity from the very beginning and blew his chance.

  10. okay, i can tell you right now, if feel good about hilary, she’s not going to lose it, she will not choke, she’ll just tell it like it is…

    for her supporters, they will say she lost nothing.

    BUt where this iran thing came in, you can already hear mathews spinning this after the debate.

  11. Is Brian Williams just an idiot? What does he think Guiliani is going to say about Hillary, and why is williams framing questions about hillary based on what an opponent said?

  12. okay the whole change thing is too much piling on, its going to back fire on them. its going to really p— some poeple off.
    ok barack what experience does he have? okay good, he works well with others… wrong!

  13. Here we go again with obama’s generalities about the Illinois state legislature and his “ability to bring together”. War….stand up…..bring together…..blah…

  14. yeah… hurray for richards, hes sticking up for her….v.p.

    HURRAY FOR THE GUTS RICHARDS, HE SAID IT LIKE IT IS, THEY ARE NOT POSITIVE… HE TRUSTS CLINTON…

  15. Hey Williams, is the fact that she is TROUNCING everyone in the polls germane to the quesiton of her electability?

  16. dodds, says no one will elect her…

    thats it im voting republican, these democrats make me ashamed i have them on my side…

  17. crap! I just woke up and realized I’ve missed the first hour! grrrrrrr!!

    Just joining in and Edwards seems angry!!!!
    And did he just say he believed in santa clause and the tooth fairy?!!!
    He messed up his attack line on Hillary! 😀

  18. united 12, I know what u mean about the Dems. They’re much worse than Repubs when it comes to attacking their own.

  19. I kind of sadistically like how they have every camera angle ready to just squeeze in Hillary in the view. hehe.

    Joe Biden just had a great answer and good attack on rudy!

  20. here it comes russert and what she secretly said to the guy about the social security.
    okay now they are talking about swift boating,,, okay can you say russert and swiftboat in the same sentence

  21. Russert and Obama were clobbered by Hillary on Social Security. Russert tried to intimidate Hillary by waving that Bill Clinton letter. Hillary kicked his ass.

  22. And loved the Kucinich line, about one person who takes hedge fund money accusing another one for taking hedge fund money.

  23. oh and by the way, this has not been the democratic debate, this is officialy, the tar and feathering of one woman called hillary clinton, or is it witch hunt?

  24. Edwards sure says “heres the truth….” someone who claims he speaks the truth as much as Edwards does, is usually covering up the fact that they are NOT!

  25. i hope to hell hillary remembers what these republicrats, are doing to her when she becomes president… they are treacherous…

  26. Edwards and Obama are so selfrightious when they “answer” a question quickly then says stuff like: ‘the really issue is this….’ ‘let’s broaden the horizon here….’ ‘but but…..I want to change the subject!’

  27. I really wished tim and brian had pushed more on obama and if he has the kind of experience to be president, you saw him froze not sure where to hide, and he side stepped the question as soon as he could. They should have pushed him on it.

  28. secret,

    She’s extremely strong in the first 1:15 hrs. It’s now getting really boring now. Nobody except Russert attacks her anymore after warning from Richardson.

    Overall, she dominates the debate so far.

  29. Big losers are Russert, who looked angry when Hillary slapped him again. Obama/Waldo has disappeared. Edwards looking for Mill work.

  30. I would not want to see either Williams or Russert as questioners for the actual Presidential debates. They don’t allow people to answer (Hillary) and then don’t follow up with the others. If they can’t be evenhanded and fair they shouldn’t be asking the questions

  31. I wish they would ask all the candidates about what dennis proposes: impeachment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    At least hear from all of them: if not, why not?
    I don’t like that the media just turns a blind eye deaf ear, the ipinion polls shows that there is support for impeachment!

  32. hillary’s moment tonight was when she set obama straight on social security. she told obama its a trap to say ss is in serious trouble. why? bc the repubs will use that and try and kill it thru “reforms.” hillary gets the gop, obama doesnt and instead tries to defend his view that ss is introuble! she wont cede one bit to the boys. there is something about 7 men bashing the only woman on stage i think which may backfire in the comming days in polling!

  33. Gorto, While there is support for impeachment, it would be used to paint any Democrat as an extremist, and an attempt to accommodate the far-left by Republicans.

  34. perhaps, but it should be an obligation to our children to clean up after our mistakes, bush belongs to our generation not our childrens.

    Hillary now taking heat from Dodd, interesting exchange, and I liked that Hillary mentioned the gotcha thing

  35. Ridiculous attack on Dennis, also according to his own poll numbers there, ridiculing 14% of americans, by the way those 14% were said to be people who say they had seen ufo’s, it didn’t include people who hasn’t but might believe in them. just silly to bring up.

  36. Matthews and company are cackling at Kucinich. Nasty people.

    Unbelievable that we got a question on a Halloween costume.

  37. Huh? Wasn’t it the opposite? I agree with decriminalization, but I’m pretty sure Hillary does not. it hink the hand raisers disagreed with Dodd, no?

  38. first round review from CNN panel. They praised Clinton’s performance, nobody has landed a punch on her.

    Obama bland, Edwards too negative, may not play well with Iowans.

    Feel free to fill in.

  39. I do agree, admin, I am just furious with Russert’s behavior. You don’t have to belittle a candidate; But I am sick to death of these guys ganging up on Hillary because as a career woman I can recognize the sexist tactics and nobody calls the freakin’ game. And the
    audicity of ignoring the whole gay issue with boma and electing to ask Dennis about aliens. For gods sake people. The mods set up bomba and johnny and the rest of the guys like they were hyping the gall dern superbowl. She did great, as usual, but I am pissed with the aidin’ and abettin’ of the system. Of course, I would never expect more from BO and JE.

  40. Absolutely, Kostner. Begala and Gergin with great commentary. And I don’t think Obama and JE picked up any points. Not that a few points would have helped them.

  41. good news kostner, please everybody keep bringing updates from what the newsmedia is saying as to who ‘won’ or ‘lost’ etc, especillay on how Hillary did.

    I’m watching a tape of the beginning of the debate, since I missed it. You know, whenever russert was asking a question to Hill and she was smiling through it, he got a red angry face. He really doesn’t like her does he? haha,

  42. she didnt double speak in the last answer, i think men are dense! (no disrespect intended).

    first she said she supported what the gov or mayor or whoever said about licenses, she specifically said she understand his issue.

    she never said she would do it…

  43. good point molly, pisses me off as well that talking about ufo’s , and by the way Dennis has courage saying the truth knowing he will be labels as a nut, talking of ufo’s and NOT about Obamas gay bashing…..just shows that we the people are not just up against the bush admin and republicans, but seemingly the media as well.

  44. Is anybody watching the Chris Matthews post debate show. The Hillary bash continues. They are interviewing some of the candidates. Everything is still all negative on Hillary. Matthews is hung up on the driver’s license question.

    A “who won” poll coming up….

  45. Russert the big bloated red faced Pumpkin just want to kill Hillary. Edwards looked like a jerk, and Obama kept getting lost in his verbage…I think he forgets what the point is all the time. He didn’t score any points here. He’s totally lame. Iowa doesn’t like personal attacking so that may not work for him. Hilary stood up to the onslaught. Ya, this was go after the woman, show her who’s boss. Dodd is a tool too, he reminds me of the old style pol from the 50s with the white boufant hair, and the stiff presentation. Now Mathews is continuing to pummel Hillary, as Stephanie Miller said he’s a right wing tool. He has Dolt Andrea Mitchell on who never has anything to contribute. As CNN sums up – the race didn’t change. I think Obama is over.

  46. They are trying to get Hillary on the driver’s license question. I thought she was quite clear…she said she understood the Gov’s position, and that we need to have a good immigration policy.

  47. Matthews wants to push the license issue. But when he showed the tape of Hillary’s answer it contradicted what he was saying. Hillary said she understands what Spitzer is trying to do and agrees that something must be done because we can’t have drivers driving illegally and without insurance and licenses.

    She did not say she necessarily supports Spitzer’s proposal but understands because of the failure of immigration reform in the congress. After seeing the tape the license mania has subsided.

  48. What exactly happened on the marijuana question? Edwards was the only one who spoke out against decriminalization. There was a question on which the candidates raised their hands. We heard the question to be “who supports decriminalization?”. Hillary raised her hand.

    Any ideas on what actually happened? Did Hillary raise her hands for decriminalization or against decriminalization? What was the question?

  49. Will always treasure the memory of Russert holding the Bill Clinton letter as if that would scare Hillary. No wonder he hates her. She stands up to him and mocks him and Russert is not used to being mocked – to his face.

  50. Sorry, admin, the decriminalization question just went by too fast for me. I think this whole debate was a “drive by.” Obama got quite a bit of help in terms of the time factor. I think the tapes will show that Hillary only went overtime once. Obama and Edwards both took all the time they wanted and the commentators let them. History will show that they lost despite their most favored candidate status.

  51. On marijuana decriminalization: Dodd had said he was for it on the Bill Maher show. Russert asked who is for decriminalization, raise your hands? Edwards objected and was allowed to speak on his view of the issue. The other candidates raised their hands.

    mj saw it differently. mj might be right. what in blazes happened? this raise your hand business should be stopped. the candidates should start to refuse to answer raise your hand type questions.

  52. Matthews is getting a lesson from Fatah on the license issue. Congressman Bob Brady is also in agreement with Hillary. Matthews is not happy.

  53. I hate the raise your hand questions. But I don’t think Hillary is likely to weigh in in the affirmative on such a drive-by type question.

  54. good point admin, russert holding up that letter, is so typically a scare tactic. He should have learned so far that if anything, that sort of thing will only ignite Hill to fight back harder.

    Did you people catch Edwards as he stated he believed in santa clause and the tooth fairy? A slip of the tounge! Certainly ruins that chance of his to use that brilliantly phrased attack on her.

    I’m glad to hear the attacking over drivers license die down. Russert must have heard his own wishful word in his head rather than what Hillary actually said. It looked like many of the candidates walked off the stage thinking they had something on her with regards to drivers license but will get disappointed again. Something about a woman being more capable of keeping several thoughts in the head at the same time. 🙂

  55. mj, you are probably right on marijuana decriminalization. We found an obscure blog that heard it like you did. Will get the final answer some day.

  56. Sheesh, the upcoming poll on the Matthews show is via text message. Odd choice to record results for a poll don’t you think? Only a small section of viewers would be responding (this seems to me set up to favor Obama). We’ll see…

  57. He talked about how she was tough throughout the debate and she held her ground. “She never got rattled” and since no one got a “knockout” she didn’t get hurt.

  58. Matthews’ poll has Obama winning. That is a laugh. Obama blew it.

    Craig Crawford thinks Hillary won especially due to the gang up effect.

    Chuck Todd thinks he saw Hillary cracking.

    Crawford thinks the policy arguments won’t work against Hillary.

    Matthews still pushing the license issue.

    Matthews does admit Hillary stood tough and held her ground. Crawford says she did not look rattled and therefore its a Hillary win.

    Chuck Todd thinks Edwards did well but maybe too negative.

  59. See, but I think she did better than that. She articulated herself well on Iraq and Iran, and she did great on Social Security. There just were not any sound bites. And, Biden did hold her back some. He was very good tonight.

  60. mj,

    Anybody who watched the debate would give a win to Hillary. The only little stumble was the driver license question but it could be easily smoothed since it’s a local issue.

    I think women voters will rally to her side after this debate.

  61. Kostner, she’s right about the licenses. It’s an issue here in MA too. None of these governors want to give DL’s to undocumented workers, however they want to make sure people are insured. So, they are doing what they can. There is no optimal answer until the fed’s pass immigration reform. I can’t believe Obama and Edwards piled on for the gotcha. Typical.

  62. Admin,
    “Michelle’s fingers must be worn out from all the text messaging”
    When I read that – I LMAO
    Thank you!!

  63. Obama bombed again. He did not do what he needed to do. Before the debate all the comments were he needed a clear win. Instead Obama got a clear loss.

    The big big loser was Russert. He looked angry every time he tried to gotcha Hillary and she waved off his attacks. Russert tried everything. Russert’s attacks on Hillary were blatant.

    Not one question on McClurkin but Kucinich got to speak about UFOs. Obama’s best moment was his UFO answer.

    Edwards tried to do what he does with juries but it did not work. With a jury you have time to convince and repeat your points. Tonight, Edwards tried and punched hard, but his attacks fell flat.

    Kucinich gets much sympathy due to Russert’s ugly smearing.

    After the UFO question, Brian Williams appeared embarrased by Russert. Notice how Russert did not do any post debate interview. The saucers got him.

  64. Hi Everyone – please post the MSM – verdict on the debate – once they are out. I don’t care fdor Sleaze ball Matthew’s comments. No matter what – he is vehemently anti-Hillary. I think Republicans are kinder to Hillary than Chris Matthews!!!

  65. so i missed the whole marijuana thing because the house started shaking like crazy, and i was trying to hear what they were saying, but the house wouldnt stop swaying…
    so there i was, debate or earthquake?

    hmmmm i live in san francisco so i ended up running outside to call my son…
    which really turned out to be good cause i was really ticked off at this whole debate…
    wish i missed the aftershow as well… cause that got my blood pressure up…LOL

  66. No stumble. It was an awesome answer laying blame with Congress for no immigration reform. Tweetie needs a hearing aid and a good sexual harassment lawyer based on how he talks to women on his show….

  67. wish i missed the aftershow as well… cause that got my blood pressure up

    Hahahahahahah – I may then give the aftershow a miss!!!

  68. Begala and Gergin had the most salient comments of anybody I saw. With Mathews it is hard to see past the hysteria and frothing at the mouth. Hillary did great. The pressure of having an entire panel gang up on you and have to nonetheless answer questions clearly and very quickly is something that most of us can’t even fathom. The guys just can’t handle it–or match it. You don’t have to bring somebody else down if your ideas – and ability to express them – are better.

  69. I just have one comment on the debate:

    Thank god Hillary Clinton will be the nominee because otherwise the Democrats would lose to the Republicans…again! I’ve never seen such a brain-dead group of politicians in my life. These guys are why I’m a registered independent.

    PS: The marijuana question was, “Does anyone disagree with Dodd’s position?” Clinton raised her hand to show that she is not in favor of decriminalizing marijuna. Smart politics. The last thing the Democrats need in the general election is to be painted as favoring drug use.

  70. HWC, Taylor Marsh thinks Repub’s are going to go after Hillary for sympathizing with Spitzer on the DL illegal immigrat issue, what do you think?

  71. BTW, for Obama to barely beat Clinton in a text message poll (with the strong bias towards kids for texting), means that Clinton clobbered the field among the MSNBC viewers.

    BTW2: The Democratic candidates need to issue a challenge to the media to ask better questions. 30 second lightning round on health care? Give me a break. Notice that our girl had the political sense to get her trademarked “American Health Choices” frame into her answer before the buzzer.

  72. Of course the Republicans will go after her. They go after her on every issue…just like the Democrats. I think she handled the drivers license question fine. The real issue is the failure of the federal government to do anything. The notion of at least finding out who these 12 million people are is an idea that makes some sense. Lord knows, the feds have dumped it in the states’ laps, just like everything else.

    BTW, this issue will be a finesse issue in the general election. The Republicans may be willing to kiss off the Latino/a vote. Hillary’s not that stupid.

  73. Can somebody round up pundits’ commentary?

    The fix from Washington Post:

    New York Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton came under withering attack from her rivals for the Democratic presidential nomination tonight in Philadelphia on topics ranging from Iran to electability to immigration, emerging largely unscathed despite the near-relentless focus on her during the two-hour long debate.

  74. Adam Nagourney of the NY Times paints the debate as an all-out two hour attack on Clinton.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/31/us/politics/31debate.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

    —————

    Mrs. Clinton walked into the debate expecting to be the target of attacks but as the night went on, she appeared surprised by the intensity as she was challenged not only by her opponents but by Tim Russert of NBC, a questioner. She even found herself listening to an attack on her experience that had been voiced by Rudolph W. Giuliani, a Republican opponent, which was read by the other moderator, NBC’s Brian Williams.

    ——————-

  75. Obama attacked Clinton for not answering the question and then, when asked for his view, gave the same answer that Clinton did. That Spitzer’s idea made some sense but the real issue was the failure of the feds to address the problem of illegal immigration.

  76. Oh, you have to be kidding me. How typical. But, you know, sadly, there are some Dem’s who get riled up about the immigration issue. It’s very complex and most people don’t really get it. What do you think the Repubs going after her on this will do?

  77. hwc,

    i have a feeling racist candidate edwards will use this driver license issue to subtly drums up anti-immigration sentiment in Iowa. I read among Iowa demos, especially small town farmers, prejudice towards latino is deep.

    I hope Clinton Team will get on the phone with influential latino group within democratic party to preemptively squash him.

    The reason why I feel he’s going to push this is simple. He always did a similar pounch on Clinton’s fundraising activities among Asian Americans. Only when Asian American groups within the democratic party gave him a stern warning, Edwards’ campaign stopped harping on it.

    Edwards is an implicit racist and sexist through and through.

  78. she needs to play the film back, make it plain, that she sympathized with the mayors problem, and supports him, but never said she would make that choice… why? its too complicated to make a dicision about… GEE WHIZ PEOPLE !

  79. Not sure if the Washington Post is right in their assessment. Hillary was under attack but it was hardly “withering”. Obama at one point was attacking her, turned to face Hillary, noticed Hillary was looking at him, and Obama quickly turned away. Obama seems genuinely scared of Hillary. Hillary did emerge “unscathed” from the “near-relentless” attacks, but the attacks were scattered and for long boring stretches there were no attacks.

    Russert was the big attacker. He failed to gotcha Hillary.

    Hillary was under constant attack but Obama missed opportunities. Edwards was tiresome.

  80. Matthews must be angry because neither Hillary, Obama nor Edwards went on his show. Russert was crying in the toilet because his UFO question made DK sympathetic and Russert pathetic. Also Russert used all his tricks, again a Bill Clinton quote, but Hillary slapped him down.

  81. Review in on Hillary site:

    The Reviews Are In: ‘Strong,’ ‘Sharp,’ ‘You Won’t See Her Losing Her Cool’
    TALKING POINTS MEMO’S JOSHUA MICHA MARSHALL — HILLARY GAVE A ‘GOOD ANSWER’ ON IRAN. “Hillary ‘I will do everything I can’ to prevent Iran from getting a nuclear weapon. Good answer.” [Talking Points Memo, Joshua Micah Marshall 10/30/07 ]

    HUFFINGTON POST’S GLYNNIS MACNICOL — ‘HILLARY IS SO SHARP TONIGHT.’ “Hillary is so sharp tonight.” [Huffington Post, 10/30/07 ]

    ABC NEWS’ RICK KLEIN — HILLARY IS ‘STRONG, CONCISE, AND SHARP TONIGHT.’ “Clinton is strong, concise, and sharp tonight. She is finding ways to contrast herself with the Bush administration even while defending herself. That’s not easy, particularly given the advanced publicity surrounding all the aggressiveness we’re expecting.” [ABC News Political Radar, 10/30/07 ]

    NEWSWEEK’S HOWARD FINEMAN — ‘YOU WON’T SEE HER LOSING HER COOL.’ [MSNBC, 10/30/07]

    CARL CAMERON: ‘OVERALL SHE CAME IN THE FRONTRUNNER…SHE LEAVES THE FRONTRUNNER.’ “Overall she came in the frontrunner, fully aware her rivals were gunning for her. She stumbled at the end but otherwise performed well under fire. Obama and Edwards did not land any knock out blows to change their own situations. She leaves the frontrunner.” [Fox News, 10/30/07 ]

    NATIONAL REVIEW’S RICH LOWRY — HILLARY ‘COMES OFF STRONGER THAN ALL THE GUYS ON THE STAGE PUT TOGETHER.’ Hillary’s answer on Iran “was simple and direct. She comes off stronger than all the guys on the stage put together.” [National Review Online 10/30/07 ]

  82. “I will convene a meeting of Muslim leaders upon taking office” Barack Obama

    That should go over really well…

  83. NYTimes called it a withering 2 hour attack, too.

    “Mrs. Clinton walked into the debate expecting to be the target of attacks but as the night went on, she appeared surprised by the intensity as she was challenged not only by her opponents but by the moderators, Brian Williams and Tim Russert of NBC.”

    As I cruise around the internets, the storyline of this debate is a pack of guys, including the moderators, ganging up on Senator Clinton, who took some punches but lasted the full fifteen rounds without a knockdown. My prediction: women are going to start getting angry about the attacks.

  84. Well, I am. And, now, after she aquited herself so well on Iran and Iraq, suprise, suprise, they focus on the NY DL for undocumented worker non-issue. Pathetic.

  85. Right wingers love Hillary. i wouldn’t mind though. LOL. From National review’s rave reviews…

    A Woman Among Boys [Rich Lowry]

    Hillary won. She was authoritative, as usual, and fended off all the attacks from Edwards, Obama, and Williams/Russert. This was a full-on assault from all quarters and she handled herself ably. On Iran, she was persuasive, emphasizing the need for sanctions as part of the diplomacy. In general, she’s far and away the most serious Democrat on national security. But she attacks Bush and Cheney just as harshly as any of the other Democrats, which makes it difficult for anyone to make the “not liberal enough” or “trying to act Republican” charge to stick.

    Obama was tentative and long-winded; he’s not comfortable with landing punches. Edwards was crisper and more effective, but doesn’t have a lot of credibility. And to the extent he gains, it hurts Obama and helps Hillary who benefits from a divided opposition.

    Hillary’s weaknesses were on two fronts. One is likeability. She didn’t bring any of her practiced charm tonight. But that needn’t matter as long as she’s confidence-inspiring, as she is—unflappable and well-informed. The other is flip-flopping/dodginess. She never really answered this charge even though it came up repeatedly, and in fact she fueled it. She had to come back a couple of times and say, “No, that’s not what I meant” because she was delivering answers so finely crafted to avoid committing herself to anything controversial. Of course, with her driver’s license answer, she ended on an extremely dodgy note.

    All this means there will be enough anti-Hillary storylines out of the debate to please Edwards and Obama, but neither of them seemed to be in her league much of the night. A Republican strategist watching would have been heartened by the naive liberalism on display tonight—heartened, at least, as long as he didn’t focus on the fact that the one adult on the stage is the one who’s probably going to win

  86. Anecdotal evidence from what we have seen is a lot of viceral anger from women. Lots of men also astounded at the concentrated attacks on her.

    Most readers of political blogs expected the assault on Hillary. Most viewers of the debate probably were shocked by what they saw.

    Our anecdotal evidence came from non blog readers – the majority of Americans.

  87. I didn’t spend much time viewing this “debate.” It was too much
    for me in light of the passing of my wife of 33 years. I did
    observe that Hillary remained cool and was able to deflect
    much of the criticism. What struck me was the vetern Tim
    Russert visibly shaking while asking Hillary questions. Check
    out the rerun.

    Hillary can openly move to a general election mode. The dwarfs
    don’t offer a true challenge to her.

  88. The Realist,

    Politico has been tracking the story of Ripublicans sending secret emails calling Obama a secret Muslim. Expect the meeting Obama talked about tonight to be added to those emails.

    BTW, didn’t Obama seem surprised by his own answer on this? It seems that after he mentioned he would hold a meeting with Muslim leaders as soon as he became President that Obama stopped talking for a second. Obama seemed surprised that sentence out of his own mouth.

    Has Obama ever proposed this Muslim leaders meeting before? We can’t find any evidence of this ever mentioned before.

  89. admin,

    lol, i’m encouraged by your anecdotal evidence!! I anticipated this and I hope it’s going to be the storyline tomorrow!

  90. Kegs, our sympathy and best wishes go out to you. You wrote us that your wife was a big Hillary supporter; we lost out that she has not been able to join us. 33 years builds a great many mystic bonds. Again, our best to you.

  91. Can anyone tell me what benefit BO derived from viewing
    past Bill clinton debates? I didn’t any improvement, perhaps
    some one else saw something I didn’t.

  92. kegs,

    our best wishes go out to you. I think it’s a great comfort for you that Hillary did well tonight despite the vicious attacks.

  93. Kegs, my heart goes out to you. I know that it must be very tough times. We are all supporting you.

    Sometimes things work out the way they do for a reason. My mother had a massive stroke and lived for ten years afterwards, but I know she would have prefered to have gone quickly than to have spent years in a nursing home paralyzed and unable to speak.

    Hang in there.

  94. I was at a debate party with about 25 people……most people agreed shed did great…….they thought obama was so-so; edwards was being booed and concerned about his flutterin eyes…

    they thought Biden did well as well…

  95. Oh, BTW:

    I tried drinking everytime Dodd said “here” again tonight. Same damn thing. By the halfway point, they had to send the ambulance to take me to the emergency room to get my stomach pumped.

    The man sounds so much like a Senator, they really shouldn’t allow him out in public.

    How would you like to sit through dinner with Dodd and Kennedy? Sheesh.

  96. For what it’s worth, Hillary did not get tripped up on the drivers license for illegals question. She said it “makes sense” as a means of identification and safety, but does not “endorse it” because the issue must be resolved at the federal level. Both statements are true, and they are not contradictory, despite what John Edwards would have you believe. I will leave it at that.

  97. HWC, I’m still nervous about the DL issue. It was nothing to me but I’m hearing some rumblings and there is an anti-immigration undercurrent even among some Dem’s. What do you think of this? Still, funny that everyone is talking DL’s, what happened to Iran and Iraq? Wasn’t she supposed to get burned by Obama/Edwards on those?

  98. A comment on the moderators. When you come to Philly, you
    need to take in the University City complex which, Penn and
    Drexell as major components. The basic question I heard were
    not urban relevent. When the debates were in Iowa, corn for
    ethonol was promonent. Nothing like that for Philly. The lack
    of that debate eliminates more than 30 million american who
    live and work in major cities and their subarbs.

  99. hwc,

    I agree with you. There’s a reason people do not elect senators. Except Hillary(she’s hardly just a senator), all those folks on stage are so unappealing. Often long-winded answers with little substance…
    No sense of commanding the audience. These intangible attributes are extremely important for ordinary voters.

    I think if Warner was in the race, it should be much more interesting that this.

    Senators really are unelectable under most circumstances, that’s why GOPers got elected and reelected to the white house no matter how bad they are.

  100. Where Hillary’s position on social security was an issue for Obama before, the way she knocked Russert’s “two positions”, question out of the park, including the throw-away line, “I’m not going to stand here repeating REPUBLICAN TALKING POINTS”, Obama will be hard-pressed to make this an issue any more. Just brilliant, and subtle as a snake.

    I really missed Mike Gravel. Without his, “Grumpy”, there simply aren’t enough dwarves to complete the picture…

  101. The real reason senators don’t win the nomination is they are
    perochial. There message is narrowed to “in my state” or “district”.
    this doesn’t translate to a national view of issue.
    Govenors transcend that problem because they have the trappings
    of an executive. Whether capable or not.

  102. mj:

    The illegal immigrant issue will be poison for every candidate in both parties this year, thanks to Rove fanning the flames of racism for the last decade.

    Nobody is going to come out of this issue unscathed.

    You cannot get worked up over every Republican talking point against Hillary for the next year.

  103. I’m not. I thought nothing of it. But have now read some reaction to it online, as though this was going to take her down for not committing.

    I think the real telling thing coming out of this is she acquitted herself on Iran and Iraq. I think that the news cycle won’t be “Hillary got burned by her competitors on Iran/Iraq” is a real win for her.

  104. mj,

    I think Clinton has left enough room for her to spin it in general election. Obama had the worst answer to that question, he said ‘I agree'(with spitzer).

  105. Hey wb, Thanks for clarifying that driver’s license question. I did not think she contradicted herself. I think that some of her opponents have difficulty following her because they aren’t as quick or bright as she is. She explains complex concepts very well, and thinks on her feet very well. But sometimes opponents simply can’t follow her or they intentionally distort her positions, just as Edwards did after the driver’s license question. She clearly explained the 3 types of licenses and stated her view, but Edwards jumped in and did his best to confuse everything to throw his punch. As the commentators made clear tonight, however, this was much sound and fury signifyin’ nothin’. mollyj

  106. Mollyj, they do this: “intentionally distort her positions” about 99% of the time. Pretty pathetic actually. These guys are all running on not being Hillary. How totally sad that Dodd of all people played the electability card. Who is he kidding? (Though truth be told, he’d be my scond choice)

  107. Kegs, earlier in the day hwc made some good points regarding why Obama was watching the Bill Clinton debate tapes. We jokingly replied that we doubted Obama’s campaign was competent enough to locate last Sunday’s newspaper, let alone a decades old videotape.

    Your guess is as good as any regarding any benefit Obama derived out of watching those old tapes. Watching Bill in debate probably just made Obama feel more incompetent.

    The Realist, the entire Social Security section was great. Hillary deflated Russert and took on Obama and hit all the right notes. We cheered when she said she was not going to repeat Ripubican talking points. All Social Security advocates should jump up for joy on how she handled that issue.

  108. I agree that Hillary’s response to Social Security crisis question was effective. In fact, she turned Russert’s little trap back on him. As for the reference to repeating Republican talking points, I hope people picked up on who she was referring to. As for Mike Gravel, I understand that the space ship Dennis saw returned to earth, and took Mike back to their planet for further study. Personally, I think Matthews, Rusert would have been better subjects, and unlike Mike would not be missed.

  109. MJ: You are right about the distortion. It was disappointed in Dodd. I am of the opinion that this kind of talk is all counterproductive. Admin: That’s interesting about the response of women to the debate. I am not at all surprised. I think the guys are underestimatin’ the intensity of the reaction and they are in for a big surprise. mollyj

  110. hwc, you make good points on immigration. “unscathed” is right. there are so many crosscurrent on immigration and drivers’ licenses that no one will be safe. It might help with Southwestern latinos (national latinos?) but might hurt with border states.

    If, and we still doubt that is possible, Rudy gets the Ripublican nomination the issue might be moot since Rudy declared NYC a ‘sanctuary city’.

  111. You know, I’m stunned they didn’t bring up McClurkin. That’s inappropriate. That should have been addressed.

  112. wbboei, Russert thinks he is a Social Security expert. We thought he would team up with Obama to try to get Hillary trapped. Obama deflected however and Russert was left alone to fight Hillary. After Hillary slapped Russert, Obama got a clue and came in to rescue Russert but it was too late.

    We hope like you do that viewers got the Hillary elbow right at Obama’s neck with the Ripublican talking points remark. Obama clearly got it.

    Russert did not like being called a Ripublican talking point parrot. There won’t be a liquor bottle left untouched in Russert’s house tonight.

  113. I doubt that Obama even knows that Social Security insolvency is a Republican talking point. Clinton runs circles around him when it comes to understanding the “dog whistles” of the political landscape.

    Based on his “present” votes in the Illinois statehouse, I’m not sure that he even knows “pro-life” is a Republican talking point.

  114. Admin, I did think it was sleezy the way Russert dealt with Social Security..tellin’ Hillary and AP reporter overheard you sayin’ …. Was that gotcha or what? Why can’t he just ask a question? Is this journalism or is he one of those entertainers rather than journalists? The line sure is gettin’ blurred in my mind? mollyj

  115. The AP reporter didn’t overhear jack s–t. The “Iowa voter” whose question Clinton answered was an Obama supporter who ran to the AP reporter with what he interpreted as a “gotcha”. The “Iowa voter” introduced Obama at a rally yesterday.

  116. Admin, you are right. Two reactions. First, the good guy-bad guy routine tends to flop when the designated good guy misses the que. Second, when the bad guy doubles down to cover for him, and our girl gives a terrific answer that makes him look inadequate, watch how fast his head goes down and he moves to another question or
    candidate. To me he looks foolish, especially alongside Brian Williams who is a professional.

  117. WB and Admin, They should’ve practiced their lil skit before takin’ it on the road! It definately wasn’t ready for prime time. mollyj

  118. Undecided Democratic voters do not like it when candidates beat each other up. That’s one thing I know for sure. Nothing turns undecided Democrats into decided Democrats faster than the kind of behavior I saw on that stage tonight. If they try that shit again, it’s all over for ’em.

    A young guy we work with was over tonight – 24 years old and a recent college graduate from a small Missouri town. I asked him what he thought and he said that he saw a whole bunch of men go after Hillary and she was still standing when it was all over. He was impressed.

    I’ve like John Edwards quite a bit up until tonight. He’s been my second choice. I’ve now realized I’m not buying him on foreign policy. He, like Hillary, is great on domestic policy but when he starts talking statecraft, I stop regarding him as credible. Tonight, he lost points with me. And Obama – well, i’ve never thought well of him, but I genuinely resent him exploiting the torture issue. Hillary’s statements are as consistent as anyones, and I don’t think anybody who hopes to be perceived as a decent human being has any right playing partisans games on that subject.

  119. Can someone explain Edwards’ statement. It went like this. Hillary said X (I dont remember but it might have been her Iran vote) because she is already giving her answers not for the primary but for the general election. He then went on to say she should tell the truth and not say one thing here and another thing there.

    That makes no sense to me at all. If she is saying or voting in the primaries because she will say that in the general election, he just accused her of saying the same thing in both!

  120. here what i think of edwards,

    remember when joe lieberman, was running for vice president?
    when al gore and jo didnt get into office, joe seamed to be more pissed off about it than al was. shortly there after, you saw liberman getting cozy with bush on everything. it was like he had that almost tast of power, and he would do anything to get it back again, he literally sold his soul to try and climb the ladder…

    well thats john edwards all over again. he was so close to being the president, and the taste of it was just to enticing for him. he has sold his soul and will sell his wifes, to fulfill his dirty little dream…
    thats how i see edwards.

  121. *********************************************************
    I have been twraling through the news papers to see the winner of the debate. I cannot find anything on that. Could you guys please link to any analysis of how Hillary was able to face the relentless attack. Gee – to me it looked incredible that when everyone attacked she looked like a pillar of strength and was so solid – I was so proud of her!!
    *********************************************************

  122. The 1.4 million-member American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees (AFSCME) just sent out word that it will make a “major political announcement” at 1:30 p.m. ET.

    Last week, Newsweek’s Howard Fineman wrote that he had been told by “labor sources” that the announcement would be an endorsement by the influential labor union of Democratic Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton’s presidential bid. Presciently, Fineman said that the news could be a “pick-me-up” for Clinton if she had a rough time at the MSNBC debate in Philadelphia.”
    You just KNOW she’s got it! Another brilliantly timed endorsement.

    But yesterday, The New York Times’ blog The Caucus speculated that AFSCME might decide to mimic the Service Employees International Union and opt not to make a national endorsement — and instead let state chapters go their own ways.

    In the 2004 campaign, both AFSCME and SEIU endorsed

  123. kostner, On that Quinnipiac poll: It’s a little mixed. She’s increased her lead over Obama but has gone from being 3 up on Rudy to 2 down. I think the attacks from the Repubs and Dems have made a difference, though I doubt it’s nothing that can’t be reversed.

    admin, You talked about anecdotal evidence of women being angry at how Hillary was attacked during the debate. Where is that from? I’m just curious. I’m a strong Hillary supporter, of course, but that sure was my reaction.

  124. HWC..I agree on Dodd and his “here” at the end of every bloody sentence..God this guy looks like the classic old time BS Senator. He also came a bit unhinged last night. He kept repeating his resume, since no one knows a thing about him. Mathews who I hate, did ask him a good question the other day..”I don’t get it, why are you in this race?”. That sums it up for me. Obama sucked as usual. This guy looks like he’s 22 – no way he’s going to get the nod.

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