Sunshine State Latino Forum with Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, John Edwards…

The Sunshine State Latino forum with the Democratic Presidential Candidates will be held tonight.

Tonight’s forum will be streamed on the web as well as broadcast on television. Check local listings for the Univision channel in your area.

Univision and the University of Miami
Sunday, September 9, 2007
7:00 p.m. (EST)


Our apologies for the use of the word “illegals”  typing “undocumented workers” proved to difficult. 


Jorge and Maria are introducing.  Rules: no opening or closing statements.  No interaction between candidates.  Spanish questions, English answers.  Biden not attending. 


To Obama: Why did you attend this forum to the Latino community. 

Obama: I was a community organizer.  I understand the importance of the latino community and I want to bring the country today. 

Hillary: I am very proud to represent a vibrant Latino community and I hope as president to represent everyone.  I am very happy to be here and I thank Univision for this opportunity.

Gravel:  For the same reasons as stated.  I want to take my time to talk about an latino fighting in Iraq who can be thrown out of the country. 

Edwards: It’s a great honor.  I grew up in a small town and my father was a mill worker just like many latino families now living in North Carolina.  There are great obstacles for immigrants.  I recently was on a poverty tour and know the problems. 

Jorge: Bilingual families? Spanish as a second language in the U.S.

Kucinich: I was a Mayor of Cleveland I know the problems.  I am not new to this community. 

Dodd: There are many who think we should only speak English.  But we need full particpation and a second language is a good thing.

Richardson: Can I answer in Spanish?  I am proud to be the first latino running for president.  Latinos care not only about immigration but about health care and other issues.  I thought Spanish would be permitted in this debate.  I want to show that one of their own is running for president. 

Jorge:  The rules are you must speak in English.

Maria: Pew poll shows Americans want out of Iraq what do you think. 

Kuchinch: Remember, I am the only one who has voted 100% to get out of Iraq.  I have a plan.  Bring the troops home now. 

Maria: When is the Mission accomplished?

Obama: I spoke out against the war years ago.  There is no military solution. 


Jorge: If Petreus says the surge is working will you still want all U.S. troops out?

Edwards: Yes.  The overriding need is for a political solution between the Sunnis and Shites.  The Iraqi Parliament is on vacation.  The congress must get us out.

Clinton: I was against the surge and nothing Petreus says is going to solve the problems we have in Iraq.  We need to get out.  Our troops have acted heroically and they have done the job they were sent to do.  The Iraqi government has not achieved a political solution. 

Richardson: I said at the last debate that I will not leave troops in Iraq like Obama, Clinton and Edwards.  They need to all get out.


Maria: what would you do to capture Bin Laden that has not been done?

Gravel: there is no war on terror.  Terror has been with us always.  We need access to Interpol files.

Maria: what to do, not what was done wrong?

Dodd: Terrorism is now growing in Iraq because of our presence.  We need a stronger presence in Afghanistan and revitalize the coalition there.

Maria: Immigration.  None of the 9/11 terrorists came in from the Mexican border, why is there no attention to the Canadian border but a wall with Mexico?

Obama: I have always supported immigration.  My father came from a small village in Kenya.  We need to bring immigrants into the political process.  I have led on that in Congress.  We can’t lose control of our borders. 

Clinton:  I favor more border security in all our borders.  I have been a leader in securing our borders but also in bringing immigrants into legality.  We need to verify status with employers.

Dodd: Mexico is our friend.  We need to discuss what motivates people to cross borders and bring up the standard of living in Mexico.  We need to punish the employers.



Jorge: When will you start working on immigration reform?  First year of presidency?

Kuchinch: No human being is illegal.  We need to go back to trade based on workers rights. 

Richardson: Yes.  Look at the Statue of Liberty and what it represents.  We are a nation of immigrants.  We will have border security but we also have to have a path to legalization.  A 12 foot wall leads to 13 foot ladders. 

Edwards: yes.  The president has a responsibility to address this issue and the 40 million Americans affected by this.  [Edwards does a dumb Blockbuster analogy]

Gravel:  Immediately.  But the immigration issue is a false one.  We have enough policy failures and the idea of a wall embarrases me.  People come here for opportunity.

Clinton: Absolutely.  There are 3 aspects to this.  Congress has to pass legislation like the one I have proposed to keep families together.  An intensive effort to work together with our southern neighbors.  Finally immigration today is just as important as when immigrants arrived at Ellis Island.

Dodd:  Immigration is being used as a fear factor.  We allow Hugo Chavez to get the better of us when we do not invest here but rather in Iraq.

Obama: I have already agreed to do that.  We need to begin to go forward.  We need border security and a path to legalization.  We need to fix a broken immigration system which is also broken for legal immigrants too. 

Maria: More than 50 million children of illegal immigrants separated from their parents, would you suspend this?

Gravel: Yes. 


Richardson: Yes I would stop them.  These separations are ineffective and inhumane.  Why do we not focus on latinos fighting for this country in Iraq?  We need comprehensive immigration reform not separation of families.

Jorge: Another email question, are illegal immigrants necessary because they do difficult jobs for little pay that no one else wants?

Edwards: It would be difficult to find someone to take these jobs.  The illegal immigrants help our economy.  Those working for 10 hours a day in difficult weather deserve worker protection.

Kuchinich: Many corporations encouraged illegals because they took low pay. 

Maria:  The country is polarized and there is a hint of racism in the immigration debate.  How do we alleviate this?

Clinton: I know many latinos, they work in my campaign.  We need to fight attempts to criminalize immigrants, like the House tried to do. 

Obama: We need to pay attention to these immigrant workers and stop racist attitudes like in the time of Cesar Chavez and Martin Luther King.

Edwards: We need to unite the country.  Bush divides us.  The Democratic Party is best when it speaks for the poor. 

Jorge: Is anti-americanism in Latin America a danger?

Richardson: I would pay attention to Latin America.  Get rid of the Cuban embargo.  Like John Kennedy I would pay attention to Latin America.  Latin America is a key to our future.

Dodd: We spend a fraction in Latin America of what we spend in Iraq.  We need a dialogue.  I was in the peace corps.  We should not be losing the public relations battle with Hugo Chavez.

Maria:  Is Hugo Chavez a dictator?  Would you stop buying oil from Venezuela, break relations with Venezuela?

Edwards: We need a plan to deal with Latin America not improvise.  We need to be a force for good, fight disease, help with finances, the economy, that’s how you fight Chavez.

Gravel: I would extend my hand.  The CIA tried to depose him.  We caused the problem.  Same with Castro.


Jorge: What will happen in post Castro Cuba?

Clinton: We do not know what will happen but let’s work with other countries, in South America and Europe to make it a good transition.  When Bill Clinton was president Castro was the only president in Latin America hostile to the U.S.  Now there are many because of bad Bush policies.

Dodd: The embargo is a failure.  25 years of failure.  I would end the embargo.  We need a dialogue with all of Latin America.  The aspirations of the Cuban people are important. 

Maria: Polls show the importance of education and the high drop out rate of latinos.  What would you do?

Kuchinich: We need to promote education.

Obama: This is a crisis for all not just the latino community.  Dennis mentioned how we have to have children ready to go to school.  Some of our schools are falling apart.  We need school construction. 

Jorge: Will bilingual education help?

Richardson: Yes.  We need science and math teaching.  We need federal involvement in education.  We need to encourage universal education and financing for college. 



Maria: Why is is so difficult to get healthcare?

Obama: My mother died of ovarian cancer.  I have a healthcare plan.  You should have healthcare as good as I do.  As president I will do this.

Richardson: I would pass it the first year, and take a few years to implement the full plan.  We need mandated care.  We need prevention and start early with children.  We need physical education, we need to start early.

Dodd: Healthcare is a basic right.  We have many plans but we need a leader to get the job done.  I’ve been in the Senate for 25 years, I can get the job done.

Jorge: What did you learn the first time you had a plan?

Clinton: I am proud we tried.  I will present my healthcare plan next week.  We need universal healthcare.  Even the insured cannot get medical care.  I just helped a mother whose child could not get the operation the child needed even though they had healthcare. 

Gravel: The insurance companies should compete not decide your treatment. 


Jorge: Do we need to raise taxes to pay for healthcare?

Edwards:  We need to fight the lobbyists and special interests and use market forces to pay for healthcare.

Kuchinch: This is a false debate because these candidates want to preserve the current system.  We need a single payer system without insurance and drug companies involved. 

Jorge:  1 our of 12 latinos will lose their houses.  What is the federal role in bankruptcy/housing?

Clinton: This is an important question.  We need federal intervention.  Chris Dodd is looking for answers as head of the Housing committee and I support him.  We need to make sure that millions of people do not lose their houses.

Obama: We need to work to get more regulation in this field.  Subprime lenders are responsible for this.  This is a failure.  We need to help homeowners refinance.

Maria:  What is the major contribution to America by Latinos?

Richardson:  We are the heart.  Praise for Henry Cisneros. We need to decide not only what is good for latinos but what is good for all Americans.  Latinos are growing populations in many states and latinos are fighting for the nation in the military.

Dodd: Many.  Each latino contributes according to their talents.  We need to provide the opportunity to achieve dreams. 

Gravel: Culture.  They come to this country and they give us an appreciation for the diversity of the human race. 


Edwards: In many ways.  It’s an error to just say one.  Diversity, culture, music.  They made it a better place.  I started from nothing to much and I want to give the opportunity to others.

Kuchinich: This forum reflects the power of unity.  The expression of culture and the reminder of where we are from.  Cesar Chavez said Yes We Can, that is the power I want to bring to the White House.

Obama: Right now it is the belief in the future and in this country.  I see citizen induction ceremonies and latinos with American flags, no group shows this more than latinos.  Thanks Univision and thanks latin community.

Clinton: There are many latino families that have been here before the United States was a country.  We are all varied in our values and our families.  I see in the latino community leaders in all parts of the society.  I am very proud to have worked with many latinos to make this country what it should be.  Thank you and I hope I get your support and vote. 

Jorge and Maria:  Thank you.  Register to vote.  We invite Republicans to also participate in a forum.  Good bye.



140 thoughts on “Sunshine State Latino Forum with Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, John Edwards…

  1. For TV viewers the forum is supposed to have SAP capacity, which means if you have SAP you can hear the whole thing in English.

  2. Jeeezuz, that’s a lot of people to stand in front of! All of these candidates are impressive, I have stage fright.

  3. Oh god….this will be difficult to understand behind the translation. Hopefully they don’t have a woman to translate for Hillary, her woman voice will be easier to separate from this translator guy

  4. terrondt,

    it’s painful for us. Did you read admin…

    For TV viewers the forum is supposed to have SAP capacity, which means if you have SAP you can hear the whole thing in English.

    I hope you get the luck!

  5. in a small way i feel bad for dodd and richardson. they speak fluent spanish but to be fair to the others they banned it.

  6. Haha, that Richardson, he knew he couldn’t respond in spanish, yet he wanted to make sure everyone knew he spoke it! Cheap shot, but a reasoned one, hehe

  7. Does Hillary speak slowly tonight? There is a translation so she doesn’t need to speak slowly for them to understand, although that is considerate. 🙂

  8. Break! Alright, this is a bit difficult with the Spanish voice over, but I manage to listen when Hillary speaks, which matters the most.

    The audience laughed at one point at Obama, he looks awkward when waiting for the translation, hehe.

  9. real tough for a english audience but then again to be fair it is a geared towards a spanish speaking audience.

  10. Well it resembles kostner, what do you mean?

    Hopefully this will help the latino/hispanic voters come out and vote.

  11. Richardson pulled a fast one, but kudos to him, he did what he had to do. When will Dodd do the same thing?

    It’s a bit confusing though that’s for sure.

  12. Gorto,

    I mean, it’s more like a forum. I am happy since they won’t gang up on our girl. It’s a bit boring though.

  13. ok, yeah, I agree, it’s kind of hard to debate when there is a translation process going on tho… Our girl is safe and sound tho, although I believe she would do well in a fight, she gives as good as she takes, just another good reason to support her. You can count on her fighting back.

  14. Yeah, Obama and Edwards are once again forced to try some sleazy sneak attacks which in most cases can make people feel negatively towards them in return, so by that standard, please bring on the sleaze edwards/obama…

  15. Hillary I notice has brightened her lip color and clothing for tonight. I think that plays to the Hispanic/Latino viewers a bit, she needs to project more warmth. No matter how good answers are, the affect means something, too. Dodd went with a blue shirt which is also good, but his answers seem non-commital and sort of a cop out no matter how much he knows. Obama looks flat and off message. Almost pained like he has hemorrhoids. Richardson looks very Hispanic tonight. He brought his hair down and wore a bright tie and blue suit. Good. He also seems to understand the issues and doing a good job of not pandering too much. Kucinich as always is a hoot. Edwards is still the same with no new material in his bag of tricks. Yawn.

  16. Is it just me or does DK look like he’d be at home in the mall at Xmas dressed as an elf? Those ears, the pointy eyebrows and that tiny head….

  17. Obama is so detached.. He is a typical elitist, has no connection with ordinary voters whatsoever. All his answers are so flat.

  18. Good analysis Atty, remember the second debate on CNN, how everyone thought she looked kind of hot during that debate? Great make by a woman who got a lot of press.
    I read that she had talked to Hillary about a few advices her makeup assistant could use, but she told her she didn’t have a makeup assistant with her. Well, even tho that woman was a republican, she should have hired her on the spot!

    She looks good in general, but she really shone through the screens in those cnn debates!

  19. on this link I see it as wmp, I’m using firefox, and it works great, have to refresh a few times as the image freezes sometimes.

  20. Why does Edwards blink so often when he answers questions? Is it a sign of nervousness, or does it mean he is playing fast and loose with the truth?

  21. Blinking is usually a sign of lying…or so is what I have heard and read.

    I stand corrected, it was about castro…

  22. wbboei,

    Edwards and Obama are very weak on national security questions. They are big wafflers! They do not talk tough!

  23. When I was taking political comm classes in college, one are awe researched was physical presentation. You have to adjust your dress, makeup, jewelry, hair and mannerisms depending on the audience and the medium. Kennedy understood that very early on in his debates with Nixon. Hillary, et al understand that and work towards the portion of the demographic they want. In this setting, BR has a nature advantage due to heritage, Hillary does too in a strange way bc although most L/H homes are considered patriarchal, they are in fact matriarchal due to property rights. Women yield a lot of power. She is appealing to them and to young men without large families- middle class demographic. Richardson- the whole spectrum. BO wants the Cuban vote- more monied, more towards triangulating the FL vote- his look is Miami-ish. JE doesn’t know what he wants. His staff poorly prepared him or he is just fighting for his political life. Can’t figure out which yet Dodd just does his thing and always does it well.

    My earlier point about Richardson doing a good job not pandering too much is important. He’s not treating the L/H vote as if it is in the bag.

  24. Richardson struggles tho with how he looks when he is not answering and the camera shows him. He seems to kinds always look constipated and uneasy. His hair is better tonight tho. 🙂

  25. I am a Latino, and she is much more popular among us because she has actually proven herself with our issues, Richardson has not.

  26. I feel your pain mj. 🙂 hehe, it’s not that interesting tho, I just read and write here, and jump back when I hear that familiar sound of Clinton.

  27. Gorto, BR thinned out his hair on his last haircut. You can tell from the back of the crown. Hew does have some gorgeous hair.

    The crowd responds best to Hillary and then Dk’s one-liners. I don’t think Dodd’s peace corp stuff was so great of an answer. Many L/H’s have poor views about the PC.

  28. to be honest molly, I haven’t got a CLUE, barely catching Hillarys answers.
    Edwards seems to have a bad mic on top of all else which is bad about his debate tonight. Is it just me or is he the most anonymous?

  29. Celiff, has Hillary’s work with children and poverty issues been that helpful? And as for my point, I’m just speaking about dress and mannerisms. Scientific research shows certain colors, and stuff to work better in certain situations. FI, folks with more symmetrical faces are deemed more appealing, smarter even. Makeup can help hide imperfections and make folks more attractive to others. That can be broken down further on gender, dress, speech cadence. It seems small but it appeals to the subconscious. Issues are a wholly different matter. 😉

  30. celiff,

    But I believe that stupid Reno(?? is that the correct spelling?) actually did cause Al Gore to lose Cuban American voters in FL….

  31. Kostner, I liked Janet Reno, as do most Democrats and certainly most floridians. I believe she toyed with running for Governor.

  32. So far, not so well. I am not saying this as a hillary supporter, but as a latino. He has no track record on our issues. He panders so much just trying to get some votes in florida. Hill has actually done things for us. I am at the University of Iowa and I was talking to my counselor, and she is a latina, and she was talking about the election and she said she couldn’t decide between Hill and John Edwards. In 1 minute I convinced her and she wanted one of my Hillary buttons. She didn’t even mention Obama. He is of no substance.

  33. It won’t work for me. It’s so frustrating. I have no idea why. When I go the link, the video box just stays black.

  34. Okie I am with you all the way, the way things are perceived as almost as important as what the facts actually are.

    mj, here is a link to a video of Hillary yesterday I think, bad video but it shows what she is wearing/looking like tonight, just a different top under her jacket, but same color from what I can tell.

    God that translator woman shouts!

  35. She was instrumental in passing SCHIP, which covers most Latino kids, in fact I was covered under it up until I was in college. She has Patti Solis Doyle as a campaign manager, a great step forward in equality. She voted against CAFTA, she voted to raise the minimum wage, she has the support of Robert Menendez, Dolores Huerta, she was cochair of the senate democratic Hispanic task force, where she achieved so much for us. She also has been outspoken on election reform.

  36. 🙂 a great site I go there many times a day for updates on our girl, not a blog tho, enough of those I think, hehe.

    I gotta say about Dennis, that he is a crazy loon sometimes, but I love how he says thank you after every answer he gives, very polite and a great smile!

  37. Ok, oddly, I was able to download a small bit, she looks great. I noticed this more relaxed speaking style in the aarp thing, I think it is quite effective.

  38. Hillary really came off a genuine and sweet on her last answer, and a great applause and cheering, too bad I didn’t catch what she actually said, is it over all ready?
    She was great when she relaxed a bit more and leaned at the podium, made her seem a bit laid back and friendlier.

    So it’s over, did Dodd just kiss her on the cheek? 🙂 They seem like good friends.

  39. over!! i guess even though i watched most of it but in reality i missed most of it. oh well i think what little i did understood hillary did well. subtitles would have been nice.

  40. Hehe, agree terrondt!

    Thanks admin for the transcript of her last answer, since she asked for their vote and what I heard was a lot of cheering, this seems good!

  41. Just read through our talk while the debate was on. I am reminding how much Richard Nixon used to blink and most especially during the Nixon-Kennedy debates. Blink and squint. Usually not a good thing.

  42. Yup, that’s right molly, I have a hobby of reading how to catch when people are lying, the typical signs, and this is so interesting with politicians as they if need to be, are quite good liars. I’m always calmed down when I see politicians who can’t act. Hillary is fairly good, good enough so it isn’t painful to watch, but still bad enough so you have confidence she will not lie too much and get away with it. (come on, we all know they lie from time to time, comes with the profession, hehe)

  43. Yes Celiff, one vote at a time.

    This format really protected Hillary from attack.

    This is yet another forum, now in September, that no one has laid a glove on her.

    That AARP forum is going to be very pro Hillary because Obama won’t be there and Edwards’ attacks on lobbyists will not play well.

    Hillary has appeared in venues which favored either Obama or Edwards (YearlyKooks, Howard University, Chicago, South Carolina). When do we get a women’s forum or a forum in a big state like New York or California where Hillary is the favored candidate or the hometown favorite?

  44. Just now saw that Huffpo has some transcript from this forum, just caught the last line now:

    – 8:33 pm: Hilary has the best closing statement, more feeling and warmth and the most applause. And she got the last word!

    hihi, good!

  45. I just read through the transcript above. Hillary giving Dodd credit on housing is the absloutely right thing to do. A front-runner has to share the spotlight once in a while.

  46. Was Edwards angry tonight? He sometimes looked at Kucinich as a curiosity. Sometimes it looked like he would stick his tongue out at Kucinich.

  47. Yes admin I would LOVE to see a debate from New York, and a women centered debate, she would SOOO steal the spotlight, deservedly of course. 🙂 She has done greatly on the others turf, I doubt they would as much on her turf.

  48. haha, good one admin, Edwards always seem kind of angry in this primary, odd, people say he has a great smile(obviously doesn’t work for me), he should use it more. No matter who you are, a smile is always effective.

  49. Hehe, check this one out, from huffpo, someone was obviously in the audience, as I didn’t see this.

    — 7:40 pm: Interesting break!! Hillary and Edwards left the stage during the 2 minute break to be powdered beyond prying eyes. Obviously being powdered on TV is the last thing Edwards needs. Obama and the rest were proudly re-powdered in front of all of us! Elizabeth Edwards, who’s been exchanging looks and hand signals with her husband, used the 2 minutes to walk around and shake hands.

  50. Whatever happened to Biden? He missed the “gay” debate, he missed the AARP convention, now this. Who does he think he is, Obama?

    Rumors have been around that Biden is going to drop out. Absences do not help squelch the rumors.

  51. Visually, Hillary was awesome, as several of you have noted. The colorful outfit, the poise, the gestures, the smiles and the cadences really worked, and set her apart once more from the others on the stage. Also, she had the last word.

    I cannot comment on the content until I see the transcript. At this point the only thing I can say for sure is that Gravel makes more sense to me in a language I do not speak, than he does in English. Let us at least hope he has stopped beating up on Democrats.

  52. I agree wbboei, and too bad about Gravel, but true.

    Admin I hope Biden doesn’t drop out, he’s my favorite after Hillary, and he has always been very respectful of Hillary. And he just came back from Iraq after his 8!! visit, seems an odd time to drop out. Maybe why he hasn’t been to AARP, altho the LGBT debate and this one is a bit odd. Although he made the media round after his Iraq return, maybe that’s why.

  53. OkieAttorney, very perceptive analysis of styles vs. target audiences.

    As Obama reaches out to the Cuban community, he may find that his earlier remarks about meeting with Fidel without preconditions come back to haunt him, particularly with older members of that group, notwithstanding his subsequent plea to open up trade relations. (Interestingly, Dr. Brezevniski made the latter suggestion in a book he wrote 15 years ago the name of which escapes me, which may indicate who is calling some of the plays here).

  54. Just question. who’s paying the travel, accomodation and other expenses of each candidate for these countless formula, debate? Do you guys believe the host pays it?

    I doubt vanity candidates such as Kucinich & Gravel will hop from one place to another if they have to pay out of their own pockets? any thought?

  55. Gorto, I agree with you about Biden on both counts. I think what we like about him is he is grounded in reality, and rebuts the idealistic notions of Edwards, Obama and Kuccinich with the cold hard facts, whether the issue is lobbying, public financing, draw down of troops, partition, you name it he is there. In that sense, he is one of the adults. What he has not done however is articulate a clear cogent and convincing message that he is a credible change agent. Only Hillary has succeeded in doing that.

  56. Hillary was her usual greatness.. She came out of the gate a little stiff but easily relaxed into a comfortable stride. She peaked perfectly, having the last word ending the forum to a resounding triumphant applause.

    What is it with the Edwards blinking tick? Very difficult watching him answer questions, too distracting! O’vamanos was as exciting as “stinky” day old fish wrap sitting in the hot Miami sun. No matter what metaphorical personal experiences he applied to himself, BO cannot manufacture “gravitas”, that is what is sorely lacking in his ‘pie in the sky’ presidential platform…

    ps…I told you Oprah would make this a race issue… a fatal error or her part.

    Mrs. S.

  57. Kostner, when it comes to those two I think reimbursement should follow the same principle as a maritime salvage agreement: no cure no pay. That is one way to narrow the field, and elevate the discussion at the same time. But who’s to do it?

  58. Sorry, missed a keystroke…

    As I was saying, it’s Hillary and the Seven Dwarves.

    Obama- Stinky
    Edwards- Blinky
    Kucinich- Twinky
    Biden- Fighty
    Dodd- Whitey
    Gravel- Crotchety
    Richardson- Botchety

    As for the comment about Hillary being stiff, yes, in the beginning, but she relaxed towards the end. I’m glad she remembered to ask for votes. There is nothing more important to a group of voters in any forum and of any persuasion than to be respected and asked for their vote rather than being taken for granted.

    Yes, DK is a gentleman and I suspect quite mischievous. Biden has been in Iraq so that he can beat Patraeus with an ugly stick at the upcoming hearing. Dodd deserves respect. He has been a fantastic senator. I wish I had him instead of Coburn and Inhofe. He can read and his superior knowledge about housing and banking should never be at issue. Hillary is right to give him deference but not rip off his ideas ala Stinky or treat him as superior. One reason I support Hillary for POTUS is bc we need Biden and Dodd to lead a new super majority in the Senate.

  59. Celiff, great summary above the tangible things Hillary has done for the Hispanic community. I can understand how you were able to persuade your counsellor to support Hillary.

    By the way, did my eyes deceive me or was that EE who rushed up on the stage to shake hands with Hillary right after the debate concluded?

  60. Maybe JE wears contacts or was just having an allergy. I like John Edwards. I think we can all agree the country would be in a much better place if her were VP right now. I think he was blinking because of an allergy or the powder that put on them.

  61. The “Blinky” thing has gone on for years. Anytime I have seen him, even going back to ’03, he blinked. It’s not allergies. His eyes would be watering too. Or at least red. It may be a light sensitivity, but if so, he may have health problems he’s not speaking about. I doubt it. My guess is it is a nervous tick or a tell.

  62. New Yorker….

    When I brought up Edwards’s attacks on Clintonism as timid and tactical, she became more animated. She threw her head back and slapped the desk, clanking her watch on the surface. She rejected the idea that she is simply running for a third Clinton term, but she had a warning for an opponent who thinks he can defeat her by taking on her husband: “Any Democrat who rejects the only two-term Democratic President we’ve had since Franklin Roosevelt is rejecting an important part of how we are in a position to be able to run and win in the 2008 election. There was a lot of business taken care of in the nineties—you know, Democrats can be good stewards of the economy. In fact, given Bush and Cheney, better stewards than Republicans. Democrats don’t take a back seat to anybody on crime and national security. Democrats have the biggest expansion of health care, with the Children’s Health Insurance Program, since Lyndon Johnson. So why would we want to reject what we’ve accomplished? If I were not named Clinton, I would be saying, ‘Good for us!’ ” She paused and added, “But, you know, that was then. This is now.”

  63. Great quote Kostner ( This should serve as a warning to the Big Bloggers who have outright suggested attacks on Bill Clinton. Hooray for Hillary:

    “Any Democrat who rejects the only two-term Democratic President we’ve had since Franklin Roosevelt is rejecting an important part of how we are in a position to be able to run and win in the 2008 election. There was a lot of business taken care of in the nineties—you know, Democrats can be good stewards of the economy. In fact, given Bush and Cheney, better stewards than Republicans. Democrats don’t take a back seat to anybody on crime and national security. Democrats have the biggest expansion of health care, with the Children’s Health Insurance Program, since Lyndon Johnson. So why would we want to reject what we’ve accomplished? If I were not named Clinton, I would be saying, ‘Good for us!’ ” She paused and added, “But, you know, that was then. This is now.”

    BTW, here is a link to some debate video”

  64. edwards is so full of it. in 2004 he was so pro-war in iraq. now he is one of the most dovish of the candidates. the nutkooks love him now.

  65. Good morning folks,

    I watched the debate. Hillary did great as usual! 🙂

    I was sleepy and posted the following message on the wrong thread. Y’all may not have seen it. I’m reposting it below:

    I have posted a diary at myDD:

    The Iraq Debate — The Most Important Question

    Please help recommend it and if you have time to help fend off the freepers as I have to go to work.

    Thank you! 🙂

  66. It seems more people thought Hillary did well, for once it really shows in an online poll, although only 141 people have voted so far. I’ll post it.

    Who fared the best in the Democratic debate?
    New York Sen. Hillary Clinton 67
    Illinois Sen. Barak Obama 39
    Former North Carolina Sen. John Edwards 3
    U.S. Rep. Dennis Kucinich 6
    Connecticut Sen. Chris Dodd 6
    New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson 17
    Alaska Sen. Mike Gravel 3
    Total Votes: 141

  67. Four months away, can you feel it yet? It doesn’t look like much has changed, and if it does it probably won’t until about four months from now anyway. Here’s the latest national poll numbers from Gallup:

    Clinton 45 (48)
    Obama 24 (25)
    Edwards 16 (13)
    Biden 3 (1)
    Richardson 2 (2)
    Kucinich 2 (2)
    Dodd 1 (1)
    Gravel 1 (1)

    In a head-to-head race, Democrats favor Clinton over Obama by 31 points, 63%-32%, the biggest margin to date.

  68. It seems Obama is related to Bush and Cheney…..

    “….it’s worth noting that President Truman is Obama’s fourth cousin four times removed, and Obama and the current President Bush are 11th cousins, sharing the same great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandparents in 17th century Massachusetts. Obama and Cheney have a common ancestor who migrated from France in the 17th century.”

  69. Isn’t Gore also related to Bush?!! I think I read that somewhere too a while back.

    Hillary isn’t related to anyone I believe, would have been out there by now I think. She is just married to Clinton, so I do feel this dynasty crap is unsubstantiated. She also handled that question in the CNN YouTube debate really well!!!

  70. Gorto, Kerry is also distant cousins with Bush, that is probably what you remember.

    I liked that article from the New Yorker. Hillary sounds exactly where the country is. If she plans to govern from that position, incomporating the best parts of the Clinton admin. with more populist polices like fair trade and UHC, well, that’s just what we need.

  71. kostner, That article is linked on, so they obviously have no problem it.

    I assume this quote in the article is from an Edwards flack, and listen to how idiotic it is:

    “The whole race is going to end up there,” a spokesman for one of Hillary’s rivals told me. “It has to, because that’s what she’s running on. She’s running on Bill Clinton. If she were running on her Senate record or some new ideas for the future, rather than the nineties, it would be different. But her biggest strength is Bill Clinton, so the only way to attack her is to take that head on.”

    I hope they take on Bill Clinton. That’s nothing but a recipe for disaster for her rivals.

  72. No mj, I remember it being Gore, Kerry is as well, it can almost get a bit spooky with the bone & skulls thing they both belonged to. ugh!

  73. Hillary is back at 43% in the rasmussen daily tracking poll, obama down 1 to 22% and edwards at 16% up 3. Looking at the overview it is at least rather stable.

    When/if can we see a ‘bump’ (or hopefully fall) by this whole Oprah endorsement thing? Or has it already played out, since she first announced on Larry King in May was it?

  74. There’s no doubt Hillary’s presidency will be built upon the success of her husband’s white house years in 1990s. But elections are always about future, not just the past. So the vexing question is what lessons Hillary has learned from Bill Clinton’s presidency, and how she will handle her presidency differently?

    The Newsweek interview allowed us to catch a glimpse of what’s on her mind,

    and the latest article from `The New Yorker’ gives us some further hint…

    The Legacy Problem 09/17/070917fa_fact_lizza?currentPage=3

    On lesson she learned from the failed healthcare plan…

    Its failure set back the cause of universal health care and probably cost the Democrats control of Congress in 1994. Now she uses what happened as a parable about hubris and lessons learned–a reminder that, more than any other candidate, she understands the limits of the American political system’s capacity for sweeping change. “We came in and, largely propelled by a lot of the stories from back-yard meetings and living-room gatherings in New Hampshire, determined to do something about health care,” she told a gathering of voters in Concord. “But we didn’t have a good enough grasp of how to get it done. And if we had known then what we know now it would have been a lot different.”

    Now she talked about being “flexible” in working with the House and the Senate and about respecting the “prerogatives that the Congress wants to claim,” and she scoffed at what she sees as the naïveté of her Democratic rivals. “When my colleagues who are running against me, who are all wonderful people, say things like `We’re going to make it happen!’–well, we’ve got to get the vote, and we’ve got to be able to make the persuasion. And that very often means you’ve got to compromise, which is not a word that people in a Democratic primary want to hear, because we all want to think that we can go in and do exactly what we believe in and make it happen. The fact is you can’t. And I think we learned that as well. When Bill passed the deficit-reduction act, it was with one vote. And I’m glad he passed it with one vote, but it sort of set up a lot of the political problems to come.”

    Hillary has been ridiculed by the right and the left as too rigid, but she does have evolving or different positions (from her husband) on trade, NAFTA, deficit etc…

    At a conference of liberal bloggers in Chicago last month, someone brought up four of Bill Clinton’s policies and asked Hillary if she would renounce her support for them: welfare reform, NAFTA, the Defense of Marriage Act (which barred the federal government from recognizing same-sex marriage), and the 1996 Telecommunications Act (which weakened restrictions on media consolidation). She said that the positive aspects of welfare reform outweighed the negative; repudiated parts of the marriage act; distanced herself from NAFTA; and, on the telecom law, said, “You’ll have to ask Al Gore,” who championed it. Most pointedly, she has moved away from her husband’s pro-free-trade rhetoric, making it clear that Edwards’s attempts to distinguish himself will be difficult. “A trade policy without labor and environmental standards that are enforceable is just no longer feasible,” she told me. Asked if NAFTA, which Bill Clinton cites as one of his most significant achievements, was a mistake, she replied, matter-of-factly, “I think that NAFTA didn’t realize the benefits that were advertised.” She added, “Well, you know, you don’t remain static–you have to continue to evaluate what was and wasn’t done.” On the deficit, Hillary did not sound as hawkish as her husband. Is it necessary to get the deficit to zero? She wants it on a “declining trajectory,” she said, but quickly noted the importance of her health-care and energy plans.

    In the end, Hillary Clinton’s presidency won’t be an `insurgent’ presidency advocated by Edwards-like. She is very clear she’s proud of many things her husband’s administration had achieved. She is going to build her own legacy upon Mr. Clinton’s success. She is absolutely adamant in defending Clinton’s record.

    When I brought up Edwards’s attacks on Clintonism as timid and tactical, she became more animated. She threw her head back and slapped the desk, clanking her watch on the surface. She rejected the idea that she is simply running for a third Clinton term, but she had a warning for an opponent who thinks he can defeat her by taking on her husband: “Any Democrat who rejects the only two-term Democratic President we’ve had since Franklin Roosevelt is rejecting an important part of how we are in a position to be able to run and win in the 2008 election. There was a lot of business taken care of in the nineties–you know, Democrats can be good stewards of the economy. In fact, given Bush and Cheney, better stewards than Republicans. Democrats don’t take a back seat to anybody on crime and national security. Democrats have the biggest expansion of health care, with the Children’s Health Insurance Program, since Lyndon Johnson. So why would we want to reject what we’ve accomplished? If I were not named Clinton, I would be saying, `Good for us!’ ” She paused and added, “But, you know, that was then. This is now.

  75. the nutkooks on mydudd are already touting there stock response to the new gallup poll”natonal polls don’t matter.” rassmussen confirms the HUGE LEAD. GO HILLARY GO!!!!!

  76. Hey, how funny is this huh? :

    Presidential hopeful Barack Obama plans to make a major policy speech on Iraq when he comes to Clinton, Iowa, Wednesday.

    Do you think they thought that would be a funny coincidence?
    A great extra punch headed Hillarys way?
    Or not aware it was in a place called Clinton?
    Or just had no fricking clue?

  77. Gorto, ofcourse it’s on purpose. Sounds like another advisor written speech coming our way. That’s one of the things that makes me most skeptical of Obama. He leans way too much on advisors. Even Edwards doesn’t seem to do that.

  78. Sept. 9, 2007 – On the campaign trail, presidential candidates meet thousands of Americans and answer numerous questions from voters and reporters. But most Americans never get a chance to speak directly with the major candidates.

    Sen. Hillary Clinton has agreed to take questions from NEWSWEEK readers in this exclusive Web forum. Now is your opportunity to ask about the Democratic frontrunner’s views on Iraq, the economy, health care or any other issue. Submit your queries through noon, ET, on Friday, Sept. 14. Clinton will answer selected questions, to be published on Wednesday, Sept. 19.

  79. Yeah mj, he really seems to consist of advisor’s and aides and supporters, he basically comes across as a spokesperson for all of them, instead of THE candidate leading the way.



    That’s Spanish for success — the buzz within the country’s Hispanic community when Nielsen Media Research released the ratings of Sunday’s historic presidential debate. Aired on Univision, the largest Spanish-language network in the U.S. and the first largest overall, some 4.6 million people watched the debate. This year previous debates broadcasted on MSNBC and CNN, among others, averaged 4.3 million.

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