The Coming Obama Whine

Before the Obama crackup when voting begins in the primaries – there will be the Obama whine.

The Obama whine will come soon – the moment the Chicago sleepyheads put down their mud buckets, read a newspaper, and realize the calendar is moving, like a great wall of clouds, against their inept and inexperienced campaign.

Back in June 23, 2007, almost 2 months ago, and even earlier on May 29, 2007 we ridiculed Obama’s strategy of having his wife call him a lunkhead as well as the strategy of holding ostentatiously huge rallies. Eventually the Obama Chicago dullards realized Michelle should stop the lunkhead talk; and the rallies, either by decision or by voter disinterest, have also ceased.

In the second of those articles, the one called Nader Fader we underlined the failed strategy of the Obama ‘superrallies’ and traced them to Obama’s spiritual mentor – Lord Ralph Nader the Sainted and Pure – Enabler and Creator of the Bush II Presidency. In the first article cited Let’s Help Richardson, Edwards, Obama, Day we noted that Obama needed to retool his campaign. Obama did not listen to our good advice and the results have been as bad as we expected.

What is the situation today and what is the Coming Obama Whine?

Today’s Boston Globe summarizes the shifting and still very fluid situation regarding the primary schedule which will select the Democratic nominee.

Michigan appears poised to crash the party of early states seeking to influence the 2008 presidential nominating process, leapfrogging the other interlopers, Florida and South Carolina, and further scrambling the electoral calendar.

If leaders of Michigan’s political parties reach agreement, as early as tomorrow, on joint Jan. 15 primaries, New Hampshire and Iowa, the traditional leadoff states, would be forced to set earlier contests to preserve their coveted status.

New Hampshire’s first-in-the-nation primary would be moved to Jan. 8 at the latest because state law says that Secretary of State William M. Gardner must set the contest at least seven days ahead of the next primary.

New Hampshire is determined to keep its place as the first primary state.

An earlier Granite State contest would then push Iowa, the first caucus state, into early January or even December.

State law there requires at least eight days between its contest and New Hampshire primary, but Iowa Secretary of State Michael A. Mauro said yesterday that his state could waive that required interval to avoid holding caucuses on New Year’s Eve or earlier, during this year’s holiday season.

Iowa “will do whatever it takes to maintain our status and keep it in January, if at all possible,” he told the Globe in a telephone interview.

Hillary is prepared for whatever happens with the primary calendar. Because Hillary is popular with the Democratic base she has support in every segment and in every geographic area of Iowa and New Hampshire. In Iowa Hillary has support throughout the state with all Iowans.

And here comes the whine. Obama, and to a lesser extent Edwards, has built his failing campaign under the delusion that students will support Obama at the polls. To that end Obama held his super-rallies geared to a youth audience and in some cases solely with the college networking site Facebook subscribers as the rally organizers. The Obama strategy is in conflict with the current primary calendar. If the primary schedule keeps moving earlier and earlier the universities and colleges of Iowa and New Hampshire will be on vacation when the voting takes place.  

None of this can come as a surprise to the Obama campaign. But they have been silent on the issues relating to the calendar. We suspect that as their campaign collapses they will find in the calendar the ready excuse they will need. They will whine that the calendar robbed them of their organizers and voters. In Iowa, they will yelp that there is no way to caucus absentee.

Depending on how the calendar finally settles students will have to decide whether to return early to or stay late in the icy Jack Frost states of Iowa and New Hampshire. Obama of course thinks he is the sun to the youth vote. The likelihood is that Cancun and Daytona will be a more seductive destination for winter break than canvassing for a lusterless former fad candidate.


119 thoughts on “The Coming Obama Whine

  1. Check out CNN today, speaking of Obama whining. Obama said on the trail today that he admits it’s a “stretch” to see him a President(!!!). Yes, that’s what we’ve all been thinking, Barack, but when you admit it publicly, it sure doesn’t inspire much confidence.

  2. This is how the “stretch” article ends. Looking at the polls and how voters see Hillary as experience and change combined, it sounds like Obama is pronouncing a death sentence on himself:

    “I want to make sure that during the course of these next four or five months we talk about experience and judgment, not just in the ways that Washington has defined it but in the ways the people outside Washington understand it,” Obama said.

    That assumes he can wrestle control of the campaign narrative from Clinton and his other battle-tested rivals – quite a stretch.

    “If we’re able to do that,” he said, “then we will win.”

    If he can’t, he won’t.

  3. This is slightly off-subject but I wanted to reprint this section of a post today from Taylor Marsh’s Web site, on the whole electability “issue”:

    “Clinton is surprising a lot of people with her campaign. No one was more surprised than me when I saw her at the health care forum earlier this year. She blew her opponents off the stage. She’s been doing it ever since, except when she’s holding steady, which gets no comment at all, except that somebody else ‘wins.’ However, now that her campaign skills have been proven and her ability to woo voters tallying up, the corporate hack pack doesn’t know quite how to react. So they need an anti-Hillary, someone who can take her down and Obama is the closest guy they’ve got right now, because Gore isn’t running. Chris Matthew said it succinctly recently. To paraphrase, I cover politics so I want this race close. In Iowa, it’s a three-way dead heat. But nationally it is not. In New Hampshire, it is not. South Carolina, Obama is up. However, in California and Florida there’s only Clinton. But Obama has a lot of support and money, so just maybe he can do it. Maybe he can, but he’s going to need some help.

    The truth is that no one suspected that Hillary Clinton would be this good at campaigning, working hard, reaching people and revealing to voters that she knows what she’s talking about, least of all the corporate hack pack. Most suspected her Iraq vote would sink her. But when she stood up and said she would not apologize and if that’s what you need vote for someone else suddenly the dynamic changed. There will always be people she cannot convince, but there are others who can be, plus more who believe she’s actually got the goods. The campaigning, making her case, her debate prowess, but also the personality of the woman who has been caricatured by the wingnuts as a political Leona Helmsley (may she rest in peace) is surprising a lot of people. She’s defying the wingnuts carefully crafted image, so Karl Rove has to drive it home one more time with feeling and through his favorite medium: Rush radio. Too bad for him that Hillary’s turned out to have a jaw of clay, not glass.

  4. With Hillary’s poll numbers in double digits, I think Obama and the others are starting to realize their destiny is to start supporting Hillary. You can’t run a campaign ‘hoping’ you’re going to win.

  5. BTW, I was just reading Jo Stewart’s comments to the left there. Are people really trying to get her WH papers, lol? I hadn’t heard that.

  6. One thing about Obama’s MS and GA math.

    I think he should move to one of those states and start a campaign to run for the Gov or Senator from one of those states.

    That way we can get an additional Democratic gov or senator from those states who currently have some hardcored elected repugs!!!

  7. God, Daily Nuts are saying Obama will win Alabama and the South, and so he’s electable. The nut cases are at it again….!

  8. Hi everybody,

    It’s a pleasant surprise that talkingpointsmemo has suddently decided to chase down M.O’s ‘controversial’ comments. They’ve been puttint out two separate diaries on this.


    Be prepared for netnuts’ Hillary ‘surge working’ frenzy. LOL.

  9. mj,

    You have been worried too much. …

    A funny Iowa state fair corn poll has come out. Hillary is on top. This poll is said to have pretty good track record!

    With the end of the Iowa State Fair comes the close of the “Cast Your Kernel” vote.

    Fair-goers cast their kernels for their favorite presidential candidate. More then 35,000 people voted in the past eleven days.

    The poll, while quirky and not at all scientific, interestingly shows similar results to the most recent Zogby poll out of Iowa.

    Clinton 33%
    Edwards 28%
    Obama 22%
    Richardson 13%

  10. Oh ##%%&&…I was just on Daily Nuts and got TR’d to death by Hillary Attackers and lost my TU status. They are out in force today talking about how the CNN article where Obama said it’s a stretch for him to be President…they are saying it shows his humility! There’s this real nutjob name Sic something or other….I hate those nuts..they are really in the land of delusion. I am done…Had to come back to reality here.

  11. kitforhill,

    I usually just post diaries to declare some devastating poll numbers to them, but never join their bickering. It’s a waste of time. But they blocked my privilege to post dairies.

    Can you please diary this latest Iowa poll number, I guess they need another dose of shock-and-awe!

    Those nuts just need to be defeated.

  12. guys i heard about the obama allready whining about the college kids not being around to vote for him. but remember these early states may be so bunched up what ever momentum edwards and obama hope to have will be gone if one guys win somthing but loses the very next couple of this only helps hillary. these states are doing hillary a favor and giving the others fits.

  13. kostner, you are right. you can’t get into a pissing contest with them about the polls. the are irrational.

  14. Kostner…You are correct, it’s better not to get sucked into those nuts. I DID just put a diary up about the Iowa Zogby poll…This is the first diary I did, and kept it simple…GO Hillary!!! I am so impressed about Hillary’s campaign in Iowa, Edwards basically lived there for 2 years, and Hillary just starts campaigning and voila!

  15. hi folks,

    What’s wrong with talkingpointsmeo? LOL. I’m positively surprised. Another ‘hit’ piece on Obama is up running. I bet Obama must have pissed off talkingpoints, anyone wants to guess why? Maybe they owed talking some ads money!

    Obama Says He Can Flip Deep South States. But Can He Really?

    Barack Obama has been making an interesting claim on the stump: That his candidacy can drive a higher African-American turnout, shifting the safely Republican states of the Deep South over to the Democratic column.

    “If we just got African-Americans in Mississippi to vote their percentage of the population, Mississippi is suddenly a Democratic state,” Obama is quoted in the Associated Press, with the report saying he also mentioned Georgia and South Carolina as states where a better black turnout could put the Dems over the top.

    But does this claim hold up when you look at the actual numbers? It doesn’t really seem like it can. Take a look at the 2004 exit polls of those three states, plus the 2000 Census data:

    % Black
    Population % Black
    Voters Bush Margin
    of Victory
    Georgia 29.2 25 17
    Mississippi 36.6 34 20
    South Carolina 29.9 30 17

    Analysis after the jump.

    As the chart shows, in these three states, the percentage of black voters as compared to the overall black population either matches or only lags by a few points. Thus the steep Democratic defeats in these states come not from any insufficient black turnout, but from an overwhelming percentage of white voters for Bush: 76% in Georgia, 85% in Mississippi, and 78% in South Carolina.

    In Mississippi, with the highest percentage of black voters, Bush won an even wider margin among the white majority, boosting him to a 20-point edge over Kerry.

    In short, the sole difference between a Democratic victory or defeat is not a higher black turnout. Rather, that’s only the starting point. Instead, Democrats in the Deep South can only win by getting both a high black turnout and a respectable share of the white vote — between 25 and 35 percent, depending on the state.

    For Obama’s prescription to work out without a significant jump in the Dems’ share of the white vote, the black turnouts would not just have to increase significantly. They would have to double. That strikes us as a far-fetched possibility — especially when you consider that a majority of the voting-age population already turned out in these same states in 2004, so a doubling might not even be mathematically possible.

    So while the black population in the South is a strong minority, it is still a minority, and a larger turnout will only get a candidate so far. The question, then, is this: If a Democratic candidate entertains any hope of winning these states, how will they not only boost the African-American turnout, but more importantly how will they increase their share of the white vote? And is that something that an African-American candidate like Obama is likely to achieve in the Deep South?

  16. Update: Media Matters
    has this: Summary: In articles on Sen. Hillary Clinton’s speech to the Veterans of Foreign Wars, several media outlets reported that Clinton said the Bush administration’s so-called “surge” policy is “working.” Clinton actually said: “We’ve begun to change tactics in Iraq, and in some areas — particularly in Al Anbar Province — it’s working. We’re just years too late changing our tactics.”

    During an August 20 speech to the Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-NY) said, according to The New York Times in an August 21 article, “We’ve begun to change tactics in Iraq, and in some areas, particularly in Al Anbar Province, it’s working. … We’re just years too late changing our tactics. We can’t ever let that happen again.” The Times also reported that “[a]ides to Mrs. Clinton said her remarks that military tactics in Iraq are ‘working’ referred specifically to reports of increased cooperation from Sunnis leading to greater success against insurgents in Al Anbar Province.” Several other media outlets, however, have claimed that Clinton said the Bush administration’s so-called “surge” policy is “working”:

    Edwards and Obama on the “surge”.
    Typical for Edwards he attacks Hillary while acknowledging her limited statement is correct. First the misquote “Senator Hillary Clinton’s view that the president’s Iraq policy is ‘working’ is another instance of a Washington politician trying to have it both ways,” said Rep. David Bonior, Edwards’ campaign manager.” David Bonior of all people attacking “Washington politician” is disonant with his history as a very big former Washington insider.

    First Read notes how Edwards basically is in agreement with Hillary’s “surge” comment. “The Edwards campaign did acknowledge progress in Al-Anbar in the statement….”

    Obama at First Read pretty much says the same thing as Hillary, but with a lot more adjectives and words:

    “After Hillary Clinton yesterday said the troop surge is working, but it’s too late and Democrat Brian Baird came out and also said the surge is working, First Read asked Obama what he thinks during a conference call with reporters to announce the endorsement of Rep. Patrick Murphy (D-PA).

    Obama noted that he hadn’t seen a transcript of exactly what Clinton said yesterday about the troop surge during her speech at the VFW, but added, “My assessment is that if we put an additional 30,000 of our outstanding troops into Baghdad, that that’s going to quell some of the violence, short term. I don’t think that there’s ever been any doubt about that. And I don’t think that there’s any doubt that as long as US troops are present, that, you know, they are going to be doing outstanding work.

    “It doesn’t change the underlying assessment, which is that there’s not a military solution to the problem in Iraq, and that the political dynamic in Iraq has not changed. The only thing that the Iraqi legislature appears to have agreed to, as the surge took place, was a motion to adjourn and go on vacation.”

  17. Edwards is a complete loser. His only existence is to split Obama’s votes. LOL.

    There is ZERO chance he can win this thing. If Obama falters in early states, most African American voters will likely go to Clinton’s side. A recent SC poll shows Edwards was polling at 1% among black voters, which is pathetic considering he actually won this state in 2004.

    Edwards has no money, no natural consituency, he is a dead man walking.

  18. Edwards has no money

    Perhaps Coulter will say something nasty last week of Sept to help him out. What a pathetic fundraising source.

  19. Hey people, I wanted to post a link to a youtube clip from Hardball on Aug. 8, just saw it now, where Chris had two men on discussing whether Hillary is a Hawk of a Dove, in and of itself rather silly if you ask me.

    But I found it interesting since John Solz from defending Hillary did such a great job! And the attacking guy, as typical, went on ranting basically ‘nothing’ and came out looking just plain dumb. Great fun, and we should all thank this man standing by HRC in an impressive way, on the offense not the defense! 🙂

  20. bottom line. no democrat including our hillary is not going to win states like mississippi, south carolina, north carolina, alabama, ect…. maybe if a strong 3rd party candidate like bloomberg may splite the vote and the dem nominee might win 5 to 6 southern and border states. but no way. obama is just blowin smoke.

  21. Clinton raked in huge cash in Arkansas. Very impressive. USA today reports:

    She also brought in more Arkansas campaign money in a single day than former Ark. governor Mike Huckabee, a Republican contender, had raised in the state in the first half of the year.

    USA TODAY ON POLITICS: No taking Ark. for granted

    Clinton surpassed all presidential rivals in fundraising in the state by bringing in $650,000 in contributions Monday, her campaign said Tuesday.

    The Democratic senator from New York’s campaign said she raised $400,000 at a fundraiser at the Little Rock home of Kaki Hockersmith and Max Hehlburger Monday and earlier raised $200,000 at the Fayetteville home of Jim Hatfield and Suzie Stephens. Clinton also raised about $50,000 at a fundraiser at the Little Rock Zoo.

    Clinton’s one-day tally exceeds the $552,287 that Huckabee had raised from January through June. Clinton led her Democratic rivals in fundraising in the state but had trailed Huckabee.

    “It actually exceeds expectations,” said Robert McLarty, a political consultant and spokesman for Clinton’s campaign in Arkansas, who added the campaign initially had expected to raise $500,000 with the events. “We had goals and this went beyond them. All three events were completely packed with people and were spilling outside as well. It was a great response from Arkansans.”

  22. What is going on in Hillarys California
    campaign? Check this out from the
    San Fransico Chronicle.

    They call themselves “HillStars,” and they are part of a dedicated campaign army – the “HillCorps.”

    And with just more than five months until California’s Feb. 5 presidential primary, the effort by the campaign of New York Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton to organize trained volunteers – 1,000 strong across the state – suggests it is no coincidence that she has amassed a 30-point lead in California over her closest Democratic rival, Illinois Sen. Barack Obama.

    The Democratic front-runner’s California grassroots organizing effort has been dubbed by Clinton campaign strategists as the “1,000-20-200” plan. And it will use “the power of the Internet with traditional field methods to create millions of voter contacts leading up to the Feb. 5 primary,” according to a 27-page “HillStar” campaign manual obtained by The Chronicle.

    The Clinton campaign strategy in California is noteworthy for its scope and for its target – to help her secure the votes of potentially millions of absentee voters in California’s rich delegate field before Democratic voters in Iowa and New Hampshire ever weigh in at the polls.

    “Politics is about the bottom line,” said Averill “Ace” Smith, Clinton’s California campaign manager, who noted that in 2008, “the largest number of votes cast at a relatively early stage” will be in California.

    Beginning Jan. 7 – when voters can begin to cast absentee ballots in the state – “we have a 29-day election” that starts before the current Jan. 14 schedule for the Iowa caucus and the Jan. 22 New Hampshire primary, Smith said.

    That calls for unprecedented organization and innovation in California to get those voters to the polls, Clinton senior adviser Ann Lewis said in an interview Monday in San Francisco.

    For the first serious female presidential candidate, Lewis said, “the power of networks, the growth of social networks, will be the strength of this campaign.”

    Presidential candidates are lavishing the lion’s share of money and attention on early primary states such as Iowa, New Hampshire and South Carolina, and some political strategists suggested the efforts by the Clinton campaign to build, train and organize a California bank of 20,000 volunteers is a savvy move. That could help Clinton guard her front-runner status and construct a crucial firewall against Democratic rivals such as Obama and former North Carolina Sen. John Edwards – regardless of the results in Iowa and New Hampshire.

    “This is classic front-runner’s strategy – pushed to a whole new level,” said GOP consultant Dan Schnur.

    Schnur said the late Lee Atwater pursued a similar strategy in 1988 for then-Vice President George H.W. Bush, intended to establish a grassroots network to send a message of overpowering strength – and inevitability – to his rivals.

    “An organization like this doesn’t build her lead. It’s designed to protect it,” Schnur said.

    Clinton faces challenges in Iowa and New Hampshire from Obama and Edwards, in the weeks before California and other states vote on Feb. 5, and he said such an effort is “a matter of logistics.”

    “If enough absentees are cast (in California) before Iowa and New Hampshire, she’s protected against an upset in one of those states,” Schnur said.

    The Clinton “1,000-20-200” plan takes its name from the campaign’s ambitious goal in California: training 1,000 “HillStar” corps members to then train and manage 20 other “Hillary Corps” campaign volunteers each, who in turn will be “contacting 200 voters in their social networks and convincing those people to vote for Sen. Clinton,” according to the campaign manual.

    “We give them a tool box and different approaches,” Smith said.

    The most active volunteers will marshal forces with the help of house parties – there were 47 statewide for Clinton last week – as well as one-on-one efforts to meet and talk to voters at schools, homes, coffee shops and, increasingly, by e-mail and in online conversations.

    “We need to create millions of conversations with voters, and that doesn’t cost millions,” Smith said.

    The campaign’s target is 4 million contacts with state voters through events like “bring your own phone” parties – in which cell phone-wielding volunteers get together and create their own roving phone banks, talking to voters at night and on weekends, when call times are free.

    The Clinton campaign said it is targeting a still largely overlooked factor in the 2008 presidential race: the crucial role of early primary voters in the nation’s most populous state.

    With the use of absentee ballots continuing to grow, it is estimated that as many as half of the state’s 6.7 million registered Democrats could be absentee voters in the 2008 presidential primary.

    The “HillStar” campaign manual notes that “up to half a million votes will be cast in California in the week before the Iowa caucus … (so) for the first time, the California campaign will be in the vanguard of the presidential nomination process.”

    Mark DiCamillo, director of the Field Poll, said the permanent absentee voting in California “is becoming one of the big megatrends,” and a closer look at California’s growing numbers could explain why Clinton’s campaign has targeted those absentee voters.

    Field Poll studies show that in March 2007, there were 4 million permanent absentee voters in California – nearly 60 percent of them women, he said.

    “Women are a bigger segment, and that makes sense,” he said. “Permanent absentees tend to be older, and there are a lot more older women than older men.”

    The Clinton 2008 effort in California underscores how “the campaigns go after their own targeted segments, and they contribute to the (absentee ballot) movement,” he said. “That’s why it’s growing – because the campaigns encourage it among their supporters.”

    The Clinton campaign has set a daunting task for its Democratic rivals in California. Already, Clinton’s campaign, with a larger campaign staff, has opened offices in San Francisco and Los Angeles and has rounded up scores of big-name endorsements, including San Francisco Mayor Gavin Newsom, Los Angeles Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa, Assembly Speaker Fabian Núñez and U.S. Sen. Dianne Feinstein.

    But Ben LaBolt, a spokesman for Obama, said he soon will open a campaign office in California and that the campaign hasn’t slowed its own volunteer efforts in the Golden State.

    “Hundreds of Californians have attended our ‘Camp Obama’ training sessions in Los Angeles and San Francisco,” LaBolt said, adding that “more than 100,000 Californians have signed up to join our campaign,” which has representatives in 40 of the state’s 53 congressional districts.

    But Mather Martin, 25, the Northern California field director for the “HillStar” campaign, said Monday that 500 “HillStar” leaders already are signed up, and more are on deck.

    “We hear from women who say this is the time,” she said. “It’s never been a question that we couldn’t do this.”

  23. what’s wrong with kos? Is he on Hillary dope today…

    He just published a set of pro-Hillary polls on the front page. I can’t believe my eyes.

    Alabama. 9 Electoral Votes. Bush won 2004 by 26%. (7/16 results)

    Clinton 44 (39)
    Giuliani 50 (54)

    Clinton 47 (41)
    Thompson 49 (55)

    Clinton 48 (44)
    Romney 46 (49)

    Kentucky. 8 Electoral Votes. Bush won 2004 by 20%. (6/11 results)

    Clinton 49 (44)
    Giuliani 44 (47)

    Clinton 51 (49)
    Thompson 44 (45)

    Clinton 53 (51)
    Romney 41 (42)

    Virginia. 13 Electoral Votes. Bush won 2004 by 8%. (6/11 results)

    Clinton 49 (44)
    Giuliani 46 (48)

    Clinton 51 (50)
    Thompson 42 (45)

    Clinton 53 (51)
    Romney 39 (40)

  24. Survey USA. Go to dailykos front page. I’m shocked the most anti-Hillary kos would put this on his front page. Inevitable? LOL.

  25. i wish connecticuit would adopt no excuse absentee voting. i have voted absentee in the presidential election since 1992. i had to fib a little to get anyway the wife and i voted absentee the past mid-term election in 2006. we are going to do it again next feb 5th in out presidential primary in connecticuit. i’ts convienent and gives you plenty of time to study the ballot and not be rushed.

  26. yeah kostner, i think you mentioned the fact kos have not posted polls in a long time i think. maybe he is reading this

  27. terrondt,

    He did not forget the chance to dig Hillary ‘as possibly our weakest candidate in the red states’ while putting out this poll.

    Anyway, I think he’s smelling a winner. KOS has backed countless losers in the past, I’m sure there’s always a limit in life. He must be tired of backing another loser although his heart might be still with Obama or Edwards.

  28. Kostner: After I read your comment about Markos not publishing polls, I went over to an open thread and called him out about it. Maybe this is your handiwork indirectly.

  29. DCDemocrat,

    Kos is not an idiot. My feeling is that he held high hope on Obama from the beginning, but got cold considerably over the past two months. He’s definitely warming up to Hillary, not because of ideology, but because of her savvy political skills.

    He does not want to offend either Edwards or Obama since he needs their nutty supporters to keep the traffic of his site.

    But the site is out of control for the past two days, and has been abuzzed with all the stupid Karl Rove mind-reading non-sense. Kos hates Karl Rove and believes he’s an overrated strategist. I guess that’s his reason to unexpectedly put up this poll to subtley remind his followers enough is enough. In order to remain a ‘fair and balanced’ image, he had to include that ‘she’s the weakest candidate’ B.S.

    KOS knows political campaign pretty well, he understands Hillary is the strongest general election candidate, but he does not want to tell those sheep because he and those nuts are still obsessed with Obama or Edwards.

  30. Ok, Kostner, I’m willing to believe MO didn’t mean Hillary and the wrods were taken out of context. I’m totally willing to buy that. I buy it. But I wonder if I would buy if it wasn’t going over so poorly for the poor dear. Hahahaha

  31. Having Karl Rove attack Hillary has been fantastic for her campaign, as it helps rally the hardcore lefty activists (read: Kossacks) to her defense. Hillary’s been gaining supporters on the prog-blogs the last few weeks, and her campaign has been pushing the Rove story, big-time.

  32. Berkeley,

    kosnuts are still nuts. We just need to get them under control. Big polling numbers are usually good to calm them down for at least a short period of time.

  33. Kegs:

    California is definitely gearing up for Hillary. I live near San Francisco and this evening I attended their training session with guest Speaker Ann Lewis. It is exciting! I was surprised to see well over a 100 people there for this evening. When they opened their SF office, we had over 400 people there during one the debates 5 weeks ago. It was great to see men and women at this session, young and old and many different ethnic representation.

    And they are planning are Club44 event on September 30th – an outdoor fundraiser with just $20 ticket; kids under 18 free…..Hillary will be attending…..My first “live conversation” with Hillary will take place then.

    I have convinced my sister, two nieces, and my brother and his wife to back Hillary…… and I am working hard to convince my neighbour and other sister who has never voted for anybody in her life.

    so anybody who can come should then…SF is great, especially in Sep!

  34. Hey all
    Can’t stand all the mind-reading of Karl Rove and his attack on Hill. I mean the news channels seem to suggest his attack on Hillary is some great strategy of him. I was thinking at this rate they will say even if Karl Rove sits at his toilet to take a dump -that is part of some strategy! Karl rove is one of the most over rated guys around like Kostner says. I mean Kerry was a loser who didn’t have the backbone to stand up for himself that is no credit to Karl Rove. Give me a break!
    Karl Rove’s days are so over!!!

  35. mp,

    Karl Rove is gone. Unfortunately he still has a remote control over those spineless PINOs’ mindset.

  36. Kostner,
    PINO’s are utterly pathetic. They want a bogey man like Karl Rove. They want him there so they can exist and thrive. Sad don’t you think? Today the dairy has some article about Bush’s advisors who predicted that Bill Clinton will emerge from the crowded 1992 primaries – has now “predicted” it will be Obama who will win! What the F**K? Who gives a damn about what Bush’s advisors think? PINOs have to flaunt that as an evidence for Obama! Pathetic! They all must just jump off their ass and die!

  37. Hi Everyone,

    I always make it a point to drop in on Talking Points Memo’s political page. It’s filled with O-Bomb-A cheerleaders who start buzzing like heat-maddened flies whenever anyone challenges their O-Bomb-A-think.

    The O-Bomb-A campaign claims of the upcoming opening of a campaign office in CA is also malarky. Sure, maybe they’ll open a store front with some literature and baloons, but they’re really hoping for some early wins to gin up a volumteer base. That’s misguided thinking. They really don’t have what it takes to operate the sort of full court press that CA requires.

    In large part, the O-Bomb-A campaign is just what you see: (1) big mouth Barry and trash-talking Michelle (She’s No Jackie!) clamoring for as much reporter’s ink as possible, combined with (2) the online cheerleaders, (3) an occasional endorsement and (4) radio and tv spots. On the ground, they’re trying to come up to speed in Iowa and New Hampshire, with focus in So. Carolina and Nevada, too, but the ground game is virtually non-existent everywhere else.

    As Admin noted above, O-Bomb-A is trying to switch the narrative to his judgment thing. He has not been successful with this line for most all of this year. There’s little to suggest that will change.

  38. Los Angeles Democrat ,
    Yes, O-Bomb-A is indeed trying to say he has the judgement and that is more important than experience. But, his judgements are extremely bad. I mean under his poor judgement he thought he was ready to run of President – with 2 1/2 years under his belt? What made him think he is ready? What did he base his judgement on? How does he know what it takes to be a Commander in Chief? So – that is a failing argument to say I have judgement – that is extremely subjective!

    Also note that Hillary today has said “you don’t have to choose between Experience and change – you can choose both as I offer them in a package!” So – good that she is blocking this argument of Experience Vs Change. She isn’t validating that. So, Obama really has no room at all. It’s time he packs up!!

  39. Secret I love this line of yours: “I mean under his poor judgement he thought he was ready to run of President – with 2 1/2 years under his belt?”
    It sums it up for me.

    It seems to me the Hillary camp found a new ‘slogan’ ‘phrase’ with what Richardson said during the debate on ABC, change AND experience…
    But that’s fine, we see both Edwards and Obama have stolen from Hillary too.

  40. Obama’s campaign is doing a 180.. Rove is all over BO’s campaign.. The new strategy is, they are trying to get past the arrogance meme Obama unconvincingly created for himself, “To know me is to Love me..” Rove is trying to erase the ‘arrogance’ meme with a new one.. floating the humility ploy. Example: “I know you think this is a ‘stretch’..but..” not said, but implied by the listener finishing the thought, “I may be able to convince you by the end of 08″…

    Someone has to change the dynamic by reversing the balance back to old spin ‘The Audacity of Arrogance’… calling him to account for lacking experience?, backing coal exploration?, (coal miner’s disaster) Rezko?..

    I hope our team isn’t falling for this old/new slick Obama…simply because, it ain’t happening and it ain’t so..keep this thing going…never let this rat up for air…the minute you do, he’s in control!

    Rove is just getting started. He’s setting up for an attack…mark my words on that!

    Mrs. S.

  41. Im glad to start posting here! I first want to praise kostner, areyouready and the many others here who every day fight for hillary against the spin on mydd etc.. I read your posts many times per dayand try and recommend them all-of course I have a different user name on these other sites-but Im there.

    Im very angry at some folks who keep calling those who support Hillary as low info voters. This really pisses me off and Ive had enough. if u click on the link below there is a michael 4 edwards who has a huge misleading post about hillary and the vfw. inthis post he remarks how only the truly smart guys are backing edwards etc.. and we low informed shlubs arebacking hillary because we just dont know any better. after a hiatus on posting much on the blogs after the 04 election mess which I extensively covered, I just had to jump back in today to fight such an insult. the blue collars,the middle classand those who maybe dont have the greatest educations are the backbone ofthe dem party. not the ivory towers. I cannot wait until we low informed dems take iowa for hillaryand show these people what the heart of this party really is!…

    here is my retort post on mydd-
    We Are Not “Low Informed”……. (none / 0)

    I saw a piece on olbermann tonight on this clinton/vfw quote. they ran the fullquote from her speech and she said what little sucesses there may have been from the surge, its too little to late.
    **also-it is becomming rather offensive to refer to those who support hillary as “low informed voters.” my family, all union members, work hard days and back hillary. they are not low informed at all. they are all too well informed about health insurance, failed pensions etc and they connect with hillary when she speaks. they may not be academics or highly educated,but these folks are politically attuned. but–what do I know! Im just a stupid low informed blue collar dem. cut it out with that language.

  42. Can someone please chime in on this issue which is getting a lot of coverage, in Hillarys speech to the VFW she said this:

    “… .. We can’t be fighting the last war; we have to be preparing to fight the new war.”

    I didn’t see the speech, but it seemed way hawkish and odd, and many bloggers are jumping on it, saying Hillary is a hawk and wants to start another war….
    Can someone provide the context of what she really meant with this?

  43. Good to see you texan4hillary and welcome, this is a nice place to be, and nice to know that yet another is out there defending our girl in the blogosphere.

  44. cool admin-its easy to see how desperate edwrds and obama are right now. they are willing to use some half quote from hillary’s thoguhtful speech to bash her.and ofcourse they cant even respond effectively with edwards agreeing with hillary in his critique!

  45. Thanks admin, and another thanks for posting the youtube videos up that I only post a link to. 🙂
    However I would say that your post covers what Hillary said regarding the surge is “working” comment that most people have jumped on.

    My thoughts were specifically regarding Hillarys comment:“… .. We can’t be fighting the last war; we have to be preparing to fight the new war.”

    Taylor marsh has a post up on this issue, and someone put that quote up on youtube, of course editing the video to (in my opinion) look like the 1984 video in terms of color and sound, making her comments seem ‘scary’, I just wondered what she meant by it. heres the link, but no reason to put the video up here, as I do not like the editing of it and it’s insinuations.

  46. Thanks Gorto for the link to the video and the Taylor March comments. We think Taylor March fell into a trap by not reading Hillary’s comments and instead quoting one sentence out of context.

    Hillary’s remarks are very pedestrian. She is addressing a military audience and makes the common sense argument that we need to fight the next war not the last war. Hillary was NOT referring to Iraq. The military audience knows full well that many generals make the mistake of fighting the last war and very little time preparing for the next war. Think Billy Mitchell and his fight and court martial for daring to extol the need for Air Power and a functioning American Air Force. At the time Billy Mitchell was roundly laughed at because none of the military staff thought an airplane could sink a battleship.

    As our earlier post points out Hillary never says the surge is working, she is referring to other tactics. Note that in the text of what Hillary said she says “We can’t EVER let that happen again.” She is not referring to Iraq Hillary is referring to military preparedness and what military planners should be doing. Hopefully there will never be a need for military intervention or more wars but if we do not eliminate military conflict forever and ever then the best thing is to be prepared and not fight with outdated tactics.

    Here is our hasty transcript of the video you link to:

    “We’ve begun to change tactics in Iraq and in some areas particularly in Al Anbar province it’s working. We are just years too late changing our tactics. We can’t ever let that ever happen again. We can’t be fighting the last war. We have to be preparing to fight the new war.”

  47. Ok, I may be a bit slow right now, I’ll blame this to me being rather tired.
    But, what is the NEW WAR? That she is talking about? Is the last war Iraq? Is she talking about terrorism as a new war or…? This just has my head in a bit of a spin right now.

    Any clarification will be appreciated!

    As for her standing before a military crowd, I don’t really think she need to pander anymore. I really believe she has established her credentials in this area.
    People want to see her more ‘human’ ‘personal’ side, they’ve seen her toughness and trust her(in my opinion), she shouldn’t go too far to the right in order too please centrists, yet, she still needs to hold on to the left in order to get the nomination.
    This could lead to people being turned off from her again, now that she really started to get them on her side. Not that I don’t think she is honest or serious, but some pandering does happen from all politicians.

  48. Kostner: Your analysis is correct. Markos is a complete Democratic partisan, and more than anything, he want the Democrats to win. If he sees Hillary as the vehicle to do that, he will go with her. He figures that getting the Democrats in is first, and winnowing them to progressive Democrats is a long-term project.

  49. good morning hillfans. i had a good night at work but im annoyed. i think i lost my hillary 08′ button off my bookbag. AUGH!!! i think i better order my hillaryis44 bbutton

  50. Gorto, that comment was akwardly worded but if you heard the whole speech she was talking about leaving Iraq, and mostly taking care of our Vets. It certainly wasn’t a speech that made you think she was looking to put ground troops in new wars.

  51. California Democrats have a strategy on the Ripublican electoral vote effort:,1,3104403.story?ctrack=5&cset=true
    Democrats on Tuesday proposed putting on a 2008 ballot an initiative aimed at having California join the movement to elect presidents by popular vote.

    The initiative, if successful, also would head off a Republican effort to get some of California’s electoral votes.

    GOP consultants have proposed a separate initiative to change California’s winner-take-all system of awarding its 55 electoral votes. Under this measure, electoral votes would be awarded by how congressional districts vote, which could benefit the Republican nominee in this state with more registered Democrats.


    The national drive toward a popular vote would not scrap the electoral college system, but would require states to award their electoral votes to whichever candidate wins the most actual votes nationally. It would take effect only if states representing a majority of the electoral votes agree to the change.

  52. Hillary makes me believe that some women are far better than men. Not only equal mind you, but a lot better.

  53. Speaking of who is the change agent, I forgot about this quote from Matt Cooper during ‘Meet the Press’:

    “You know, look, I think Obama’s made this argument that she doesn’t really represent change and that he does. I think that might be compelling to a sliver of the Democratic Party. But I think Hillary Clinton is so different from George Bush, it’s hard to make the argument that a Clinton presidency would be a continuation of the Bush presidency. So I think this argument he’s gotten into is, is just not one that he’s going to win in the end.”

    Another Obama campaign strategy that has come up empty.

  54. New Rasmussen SC poll:

    Clinton 38
    Obama 30

    SC probabaly won’t matter much in the end even if Obama wins.

  55. Good quote from Matt Cooper which gets to the fact that the average Dem voter sees Hillary as an experienced big change agent .

    And the SC poll with Hillary in the lead is after Obama spending on paid media for ads. Axelrod and his useless money wasting ads strike again.

  56. Good Morning, all! 🙂

    Wow! Hillary polling better than GOP presidential candidates in Redstates. Awesome!

    Can we say “Pop goes the Rovian ‘unelectable’ bubble?”

    I didn’t expect the latest Rovian Fantasy to burst so soon. 😉

    Fanciful castle built on shaky foundation has a tendency to collapse sooner or later.

    In the meanwhile the Clinton campaign, built on solid foundation, is growing in strength day-by-day, as more and more people get to know Senator Clinton better.

    I love the picture of Hillary on’s front page today. She looks great, and oh, so Presidential! 🙂

    Admin, may I have some Cheese to go with the Whine? 😉

  57. good morning guys. i just woke up after a few hours for my polling fix and found hillary leading in the new gallup poll by 21 points nationally and 8 points in south carolina. look at the internals in south carolina. african-americans evenly splite neck and neck with obama!!! WHOOP!!!!!

  58. Gallup has Clinton 48, Obama 25 w/o Gore.
    Clinton 42, Obama 21 w/ Gore.

    Why do they continue to poll for Gore? He’s not a candidate.

  59. hillarylandrocks, i have been asking that all year. until the guy anounces or make real moves, don’t include him in the trial heats. hell if he sneezes the nutroots get crazy. talk about desperation.

  60. BTW, Gorto, I wouldn’t worry about that “new war” comment. I didn’t think she was pandering; I figured she was referring to making sure that military tactics don’t get outmoded. She would say that in a debate if asked, too.

    As for the Gallup poll, it’s incredible that she’s closing in on 50 percent in an eight-candidate field, and that’s with Big Media and the blogosphere still pumping up Obama. I also agree with what Matt Cooper said. That’s been my point as well; any Dem would be vastly different from Bush, so Obama running as the change candidate isn’t going to get him far.

  61. terrondt — the nutroots are still looking for someone to save them from a Hillary nomination. It’s comical, really — I do enjoy reading the two blogs (most of the active posters seem to be the same) for their latest “theories.”

    Example: this morning, in response to the SC poll, some Edwards supporters are claiming that Edwards can win when black voters in SC realize that he is their best “anti-Hillary” option. How can anyone rational assume that black voters in SC echo the nutroots?

    My absolute favorite is a poster named desmoinesdem. I believe she has posted at least 1000 times that Hillary will place fourth (or third, if she’s really, really lucky) in IA. Her claim to fame is that she is a precinct captain somewhere in Des Moines, IA and is not able to find a single Hillary supporter in her neighborhood. On the menu is a big, steaming slice of humble pie, along with a side of crow.

  62. Hi everybody,

    Thanks for the reminder, I just checked the gallup numbers. They are incredible. Gallup also rolls out an article thoroughly debunking Karl Rove’s smear on Hillary based on some Gallup data. I hope one of you guys will diary that article on dailykos.
    Check it out. Here’s the conclusion of that article.

    A review of Gallup poll data suggests that Hillary Clinton’s current high unfavorable ratings are not unprecedented. Other candidates have had similarly high unfavorable ratings at various points in presidential election campaigns in previous years. Two of these candidates — George W. Bush in 2004 and Bill Clinton in 1992 — went on to win the election.

    Additionally, Rove’s assumptions that Hillary Clinton’s candidacy is “fatally flawed” run counter to the historical finding that candidates’ images often change, sometimes dramatically, as the campaign progresses. In other words, Clinton’s ultimate electability will likely be determined more by what happens in the next 15 months while she campaigns than by what Americans think of her now. It is clear that Americans have been willing to revise their opinions of Clinton over time in response to current events, just as they have of other presidential candidates historically.

    Typically, a winning presidential candidate’s favorable rating is only slightly more positive than negative on the eve of the election. Clinton would only need to boost her positives a few points to achieve that position

  63. hillarylandrocks, some idiot on mydd says obama should get 75% of the black vote in sc. wtf, are they forgeting the history both bill and hillary have with the aa community? as an african american i find it offensive that these nutkooks assume we all think alike like robots. i perdict if hillary don’t outright win or split the black vote she will take a huge chunk in sc and nationally.

  64. Morning y’all…It sure is good to see that south carolina poll. In addition to posting on the blogs out there, I notice in the evening that some real nutjobs get on the blogs on and post some real twisted stuff. There are exceptions, but what I want to encourage folks to do…if you haven’t registered over there, please do. I know this site hillary44 isn’t affiliated with her campaign, but on the site that is, there is good blogging and then there is crazy shit. I’ve begun to notice the crazy shit at night. I don’t know whether to refute it or just let it go. THere are also some really good blogs over there, that bear comments. One great one last night on the subject was Rove….showing his numbers about negatives are a bunch of hooey. ‘nother red herring to get people off their focus. more later, Mollyj

  65. By the way…i heard via email from an old friend yesterday…she’s totally bought into the hillary isn’t electable stuff…and seems to just have taken sort of a netnutroot position on Hillary for ways that defy logic. do we try to convince people like that or focus on getting other people who are for Hillary in action? I was really intrigued with what Sandy reported (I think it was Sandy) about the Hill campaign in California). I am going to start doing that even though I am not from California. I am sending out a new Hillary letter to friends today and seeing what I can do about encouraging them to get into action. We got to keep our eye on the prize. I do have an account now with Daily Kos. I have never written a diary before but sooner or later I got to get up the nerve and do it. — mollyj

  66. mollyrichards, i post on the blog all the time and find a nutkook or rightwinger on there once in a while but not much.

  67. terrondt — I think the only chance Obama has for 75% of the black vote in SC is if he’s the clear leader after IA, NH.

    The netnuts are extremely annoying when it comes to pontificating on the black vote. I expect population centers w/ a high concentration of African immigrants to lean Obama. I think he does well in CA where black voters are seriously outnumbered by Hispanics, so there’s more cohesion in urban centers like Oakland, LA. In the south, the Clintons do well because they identify. The Clintons also have a good number of allies in leadership (did you see that Cleaver in MO endorsed yesterday?) because they opened up so many positions in govt to blacks during the Clinton admin. Personally, I believe that the Clintons have a stronger commitment to diversity than Obama does — his rewarding of conservatives/Federalist society types after attaining the law review editorship makes me nervous — and this is a factor in my support for Hillary.

    There are two netnut memes as far as “the black vote” is concerned. 1) black voters should support Edwards b/c of his poverty tours 2) black loyalty to Clinton is misplaced due to welfare reform and the crime bill. They’ve completely missed that most black voters are middle class and actually considered welfare reform to be a white issue at the time. Second, I’d like to hear if Obama is in favor of repealing ‘3 strikes,’ etc. All of these arguments miss the fundamental point that black voters are just as likely to be concerned w/ crime, law & order when push comes to shove — but from a netnut point of view, black voters are all sitting in section8 housing.

    That’s not to dismiss the obvious disparities in sentencing and the massive drop-off of the bottom 20% in income — something that Clinton has acknowledged as in need of attention. But the idea that “anybody but Clinton” will wholesale repeal welfare reform/crime legislation put in place by Evil Bill is another episode from Netnut Mystery Theater.

  68. mollyrichards, i run into my co-workers all the time on the ant-hillary thing. they fall into 2 lines. 1. they are ripukes whom hate everything hillary or anyother dem stands for.2. they are leftwing nutkooks. i don’t you love this bs”i don’t know anybody that supports hillary”. like if they don’t know hillary supporters in there area so the there are not ANY support for her. f’ing unbelievable.

  69. Terrondt: I have seen your posts and they are great. Travel to the blogs section right now, if you have time…Not the featured blogs which are always good. But to the ones that site registrants put up. There are about 5 by somebody who calls himself TRUEAMERICAN. Trueamerican needs to be committed I’m afraid. It’s all confused hatespeak. But it’s just sitting there. I could report it because i think it violates the personal attacks policy in some instances. –mollyj

  70. molly, i could not find that username on the blog. are you sure it’s not on a unofficial anti-hillary blog pretending to be official. i can’t find him plus i check every day on hillary’s official website and i have not noticed that username.

  71. molly, i stopped posting on daily kos becuase it is a losing battle there. mydd is better NOW. i still have an account with daily kos but i can’t stand it there. the slings and arrows will be aimed at u the first post u put up. wear body

  72. Hey Terrondt: He’s still there. Username:TRUEAMERICAN. There is another nutjob that just posted a blog about Hillary’s brothers gettting money for pardons in the Clinton administration. I got to go get some work done now, but will go over to the site later today. Take care y’all. –mollyj

  73. Gorto, Admin and all, if have been preocuppied
    the last 24 hours so I’m joining this discussion
    a little late.

    The common theme of the military is figure
    out what you did wrong in the last war
    and make sure you don’t make the same
    mistake over again. Since WWII the military
    has been playing catch up every time there
    is a military action.

    Rumsfelt said it best we went to war with the men and equipment we had at the time and don’t wait for the right stuff. Well Hillary is saying know
    you enemy before you commit and understand
    what it is that you are trying to achieve.
    Bush and the neocons wanted to make geo
    and political change in the Arab world. This
    was the updated version of the Vietnam era
    “domino” theory.

    Hillary doesn’t subscribe to that theory but
    since Bush made such a mess of things the
    nexus between an unstable Iraq, Iran and
    Syria do pose a threat to disstablize the
    entire region. As I see it, Hillary’s military
    policy will center on Ben Laden and his group.
    A military presence in the area for containment
    purposes and an effort to limit a post iraq war
    chaos. This will require “new thinking” of the
    excersive of military power. Not a retreat
    from the world but a smarter use of power
    and influence.

    A resurgent Russia and military growth of China requires that we do not get bogged down
    in Iraq for decades. So Hillary’s goals will
    be to get Ben Laden, contain the damage the
    Iraq war has done to American prestige.
    Create a new foreign policy dynamic to repair
    the damage of the Bush era.

  74. This is bad for Obama. He is taking dictator’s propaganda’ bait…
    Cuba’s foreign minister backs Obama on embargo

    BRASILIA (Reuters) – Cuba’s foreign minister on Wednesday said he welcomed a call by U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama to ease the U.S. embargo on the communist-ruled island.

    In an opinion piece on Tuesday in The Miami Herald newspaper, the Illinois senator and top rival to front-runner Hillary Clinton proposed easing restrictions for Cuban exiles to travel to the island nation or send money home.

    “These declarations appear to express the sentiment of the majority of the United States,” Cuban Foreign Minister Felipe Perez Roque said when asked to comment on Obama’s proposal.

    Measures by the Bush administration to tighten the decades-old blockade were barbaric and an effort to “try to force our people to surrender through hunger and illness,” Roque told reporters at a conference in Brazil’s capital.

    The vote of Cuban exiles has been considered key for U.S. presidential candidates to win Florida. The community is deeply divided over the trade embargo enforced by Washington since 1962.

    “The blockade has to be dismantled and the rights of Cuba respected,” Roque said.

    In the race to contest the U.S. presidential election in November 2008, Obama trails Clinton with 26 percent support versus her 48 percent among Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents, a USA Today/Gallup poll showed on August 7.

    Cuba’s ailing leader Fidel Castro, age 81, handed over power to his brother Raul last year after undergoing emergency intestinal surgery.

  75. kostner, an endoresment by castro’s foriegn minister is the kiss of death. obama is sinking faster than i thought.

  76. Kegs, thanks for weighing in.

    I will say tho what mj said: that it was awkwardly worded.

    She should be careful with how she(and her campaign) says things, people are not above taking things out of context and using it against her. Politics at it’s best! 

    The M.Obama thing is raging tho, I blasted her here, then read somewhere an ‘explanation’ and thought I had been wrong. But then a lot of different people stick with it being an intended insult.
    Pundits on news shows seem to think it was a hidden ‘poke’.

    I don’t know how to read it anymore, but I have seen on youtube that she has said the same thing on different occasions. And I keep getting this bad feeling when she says it, I guess I am still taking it as an insult, a disguised insult, but an insult non the less.

  77. admin…good work on “next war”…not “new war”….

    Hillarys wants us to stay strong on overall terror war, and also address China/Russia and other military powers gearing up.

  78. Gorto, her phrase was purposefully vague.
    It had to be; consider her audience. They
    above all else know about miscalculation
    of others including military brass and civilian
    authority. She didn’t want to rub it in.

    Hillary now can refine her thoughts in other
    venues. I give her a lot of credit. She was
    not playing to a “peace” group per se. She
    was talking to a group desiring peace to war but not afraid of the latter. Don’t forget they are a
    contempory generation, not an under 40s
    age group.

  79. Totally disagree on Cuba because I think most americans think the embargo is outdated. I think she took the wrong position here. It’s common knowledge that our Cuba policy will change when Castro dies, so I think she’s playing ti safe. But I think she should have backed easing restrictions for families.

  80. Totally disagree on Cuba because I think most americans think the embargo is outdated.

    Obama is just using this as a wedge. He knows he has no chance in the FL Dem primary b/c it’s winner-take-all for the delegates. He pens this op-ed because his goal is to tie Hillary to continuation of Bush-Cheney. She’s not going to rock the boat on the older Cuban-American voters in FL, a swing state, b/c they are still more likely to vote than the younger generations who are more relaxed on this issue. Around 65% supported Bush (and his anti-Castro policies) in 2004.

    Hillary’s response is an election year response to a wedge, more than anything else.

  81. I understand the need to alter your words depending on whom you speak to. However, in this day and age with internet and pretty much everything being recorded in some way and spread like wildfire.

    One shouldn’t do that too much, as it will be even more obvious now then just a few years back in time. This is one of the reasons I think it will be easier to beat the republicans, as they are masters of lying and deceit, they will have to struggle to fight back with all the video evidence out there. Although most republicans don’t care much for integrity, only a tough dumb ass spewing hate speech!
    Now only democrats have to be tough enough to actually fight and use the material out there, another good reason to back Hillary, as she knows a thing or two of fighting back, and winning.
    You said she was being purposefully vague, that may be so, and I will put my faith in Hillary(and you ) and trust that she and her campaign people know what they are doing.

  82. Gorto, I wouldn’t worry about the speech. It sounded to me as though she said it’s a tough decision to leave in the eye of some success w/some tactics but I will make that tough decision and withdraw. Sort of turns the whole staying the course thing on it’s head. Also, she highlighted the need for education/economic oppportunities as our best tools to combat extremism. She also talked about intelligence gathering and police work. It’s a nuanced speech. Once it gets analyized beyond the sound bites, I think she’ll come out ahead.

  83. A new round of SurveyUSA polls shows Hillary clinton ahead of the top three Republican candidates in three states that President Bush won in 2004, though in some cases it’s close. The polls were conducted from August 10-12.

    Clinton 47%, Giuliani 46%
    Clinton 48%, Thompson 46%
    Clinton 49%, Romney 43%

    New Mexico:
    Clinton 49%, Giuliani 43%
    Clinton 52%, Thompson 40%
    Clinton 53%, Romney 38%

    Clinton 48%, Giuliani 45%
    Clinton 50%, Thompson 43%
    Clinton 51%, Romney 40%

  84. love those numbers. missouri a little to close for comfort. seems that state has been trending gop for some years now. by the way i hear bloomberg has really closed the door on a independent run next year. you guys believe him?

  85. terrondt, As for people saying, “I don’t know anyone who supports Hillary,” I think much of her support is kind of under the radar, though it obviously shows up in polls. I suspect many don’t voice their support because they’re afraid of provoking incredulity, lol.

  86. And mollyj, as for the unelectable argument, just tell your friend that she’s already running at least even with Rudy in the polls, and his negatives are half what hers are; they’ll only rise should he get the nomination.

  87. Also, mollyj she has an 81% approval rating in NY. 19% higher than Schumer. That’s mega popular for a Senator, and it’s because she has rural republican support.

  88. From the, a new poll.

    Clinton the favorite neighbor for older set
    Well, here’s a new way to measure the popularity of presidential candidates: Which candidate would you most like as a next-door neighbor?

    ERA Real Estate asked that question as part of its fourth annual survey of people 50 and older across the country.

    Among the 1,002 people questioned in March and August, Senator Hillary Clinton was the pick of 21 percent, former Tennessee Senator Fred Thompson (who has not officially declared) was chosen by 13 percent, and former North Carolina Senator John Edwards and Illinois Senator Barack Obama were selected by 12 percent each.

  89. amen paula. the silent supporters. not like us hillfans who wear the buttons and the hillary bumper stickers on our cars. tommorrow is payday so i will buy my first hillaryis44 button. by the way im going to buy sirrius radio tommorrow. my boss let me borrow his and i love it. does anybody else have sirrius or xm radio here? i love listening to progressive talk radio but i can’t get air america radio or ed shultz. give me a review hillfans.

  90. I never thought I would recommend an article from Fox news, but this one is worth taking a look at. In it the writer of it also goes after Huffingtonpost and slams their cherry picking lines from HRC’s speech.

    Kegs I read Hillarys response, and I liked it, this part: “We need to stop refereeing the war, and start getting out now.” was great!.

    And the fox thing here also cleared things up a bit, surprisingly I know!!,2933,294142,00.html

  91. Gorto, I think Susan Estrich favors Hillary, like most rational Democrat’s. She’s a Dem. I can not believe Edwards, Richardson. What losers! They knew that speech was mischaracterized. Nice piece, though, Gorto, thanks.

  92. terrondt, I don’t have Sirius radio, but I’ve good things from people who do. Don’t know if that helps, lol.

Comments are closed.